Do you believe in Frederik Andersen? Would you re-sign?

[ShaneFalco]

When the pressure is on Freddy is not a guy I trust at all

 

[JT AM da real deal]

When the pressure is on Freddy is not a guy I trust at all

No one does ... he can't hold fort for a few minutes/period when a team falters ... like Price on Saturday night ... he held fort in first 25 minutes of game until Habs found their game ... if game was already 3-0 it was goodnight Irene see ya ... but he kept it to 1-0 and made 3 10 bellers ... teams feed off of that and it fuels a comeback ... Freddy everyone is like OMG we are screwed here so bad - down 3-0

 

[LFCTML]

100%. I'd be ecstatic if we give him another 4-5 years.

 

[RogerR]

100%. I'd be ecstatic if we give him another 4-5 years.

oh boy... Let's give a.901 goalie 5 more years...

 

[Gallagbi]

That's the question.
My answer is if we are gambling on kuemper being a starter, I would rather bet on Andersen bouncing back. If we are taking getting rid of Andersen and platooning with say kuemper and Campbell, closer bet but I still would feel better that Andersen bounces back.
I would be all good with seeing if Campbell could handle more games with Freddie on a short leash moving towards a platoon or eventual replacement

Bouncing back to what though? At his best he was a good, albeit inconsistent Goalie who struggles in Big Games.

 

[Confucius]

100%. I'd be ecstatic if we give him another 4-5 years.

We are always being trolled by you guys..

 

[Gallagbi]

Here are some of the savable goals Freddy has given up in series-deciding games. I've only listed back-breaking goals where he was essentially at fault for giving up an easy goal.

1. Johannssen's tying goal because he didn't cover the post (Washington Game 6 2017)
2. Krug tying goal from the point (Boston Game 7 2018)
3. Debrusk game-winner through the five-hole ( Boston Game 7 2018)
4. Nordstrom squeaker from the side (Boston Game 7 2019)
5. Kuraly shot from long distance (Boston Game 7 2019)
6. Foudy squeaker from the side (Columbus Game 5 2020)

It's almost guaranteed he'll give up 1-2 back-breaking goals during a knockout game causing everyone to deflate around him.

This guy is a straight-up choker. It's ridiculous at this point. Also, if you go back through the highlights, you'll notice he starts flopping on his back and stomach more in deciding games. You rarely see him do it in regular-season games because he's calm.

Personally I'd add his struggles in Game 3 vs. CLB too. He was a huge issue in that game, it was a better, but similar version to what we saw the other day vs. Ottawa and him being off his angles and small in net.

Would have been interesting to take a 2-1 series lead off 2 solid performances last year.

 

[Teeder Keon]

I’d be happy with Fred and Jack and Fred getting 4.5-5 mil

 

[Not My Tempo]

So I guess you'll have to get used to being angry at whoever is in the net since it seems the players aren't all that interested in cutting down on the odd-man rushes, breakaways, and poor penalty-killing to help their team goals-against.

By almost every defensive metric we are better this year than year's past. We are allowing less shots against, less expected goals against and less high danger chances.

Meanwhile Andersen's numbers are getting worse than they have been in year's past.

He's declining, and that's fine, most NHL player's do, especially once they pass 30, but the narrative that this is due to the team in front of him is so dumb. The team is doing more than they have ever done to help him, which I know is not exactly a high bar, but he isn't the goalie that he used to be.

 

[Bomber0104]

By almost every defensive metric we are better this year than year's past. We are allowing less shots against, less expected goals against and less high danger chances.

Meanwhile Andersen's numbers are getting worse than they have been in year's past.

He's declining, and that's fine, most NHL player's do, especially once they pass 30, but the narrative that this is due to the team in front of him is so dumb. The team is doing more than they have ever done to help him, which I know is not exactly a high bar, but he isn't the goalie that he used to be.

Ultimately I don't put much value on meaningless blog stats that not a single NHL team uses in any capacity (what you call "defensive metrics") but either way my original point still stands.

If you're expecting to find a better, younger, playoff-tested starting goalie for cheaper than Andersen at his current cap-hit, good luck.

You'll be back here next year in the new "Do you believe in (insert new goalie's name)?" thread repeating the same stuff.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Why would Freddy want to resign here? He's not appreciated.

Nor should he be. He blows every time there's pressure and sometimes when there's none.

 

[saltming]

Bouncing back to what though? At his best he was a good, albeit inconsistent Goalie who struggles in Big Games.

That is an opinion.
Up to now he's been an above average goalie that's consistently faced the most shots while playing 50+ games
Remember league average is .910%

 

[Gallagbi]

That is an opinion.
Up to now he's been an above average goalie that's consistently faced the most shots while playing 50+ games
Remember league average is .910%

Above average = good, no? His inconsistencies are well documented.

I guess you could argue he hasn't struggled in big Games, but then you'd have to look at those goals quotes in critical moments quotes earlier and excuse most if not all.

 

[ItalianLeaf]

ship him out!!!

 

[saltming]

Above average = good, no? His inconsistencies are well documented.

I guess you could argue he hasn't struggled in big Games, but then you'd have to look at those goals quotes in critical moments quotes earlier and excuse most if not all.

You could argue that every single goalie has inconsistencies. That's why sv% is a good measure of their overall performance.
Winning is a team effort. Yes a goalie can lose a game or save a game but a goalie cannot, despite popular rhetoric, win a game

 

[Not My Tempo]

If you're expecting to find a better, younger, playoff-tested starting goalie for cheaper than Andersen at his current cap-hit, good luck.

Nope I'm not expecting to find that at all, at least not for next season. I am however, expecting Andersen to continue this downward trajectory we've seen over the last two years and I'd rather the Leafs not be on the hook for whatever they decide to sign him to, for however long they decide to sign him for.

 

[Bomber0104]

Nope I'm not expecting to find that at all, at least not for next season. I am however, expecting Andersen to continue this downward trajectory we've seen over the last two years and I'd rather the Leafs not be on the hook for whatever they decide to sign him to, for however long they decide to sign him for.

I'm indifferent either way.

A new goalie might better mask some of the junior-level defensive lapses and lower the goals against or it won't and it'll finally reveal where the real problems on this team are.

 

[Gallagbi]

You could argue that every single goalie has inconsistencies. That's why sv% is a good measure of their overall performance.
Winning is a team effort. Yes a goalie can lose a game or save a game but a goalie cannot, despite popular rhetoric, win a game

Like I said, Fred's inconsistencies are well documented. Not every goalie will post a .900-.920 save% nightly, but most aren't as predictably inconsistent as Fred either where you can on an October slump followed by late Winter slump.

And you're right on a goalie not winning games, but that isn't the request. It's to prevent that second goal from CLB going in during Game 5, to not allow the huge (and terrible) back breakers vs. Boston b2b - noted above. It's to make at least the expected saves vs. CLB in Game 3 instead of being off your angle and setting up to the man instead of the puck for the comeback.

And here's the thing, it happens to all goalies. It doesn't happen every year to all goalies though - at least not normally.

Which is when I go back to my original question - what form is he returning to? The good regular season starter who breaks on key games?

 

[saltming]

Like I said, Fred's inconsistencies are well documented. Not every goalie will post a .900-.920 save% nightly, but most aren't as predictably inconsistent as Fred either where you can on an October slump followed by late Winter slump.

And you're right on a goalie not winning games, but that isn't the request. It's to prevent that second goal from CLB going in during Game 5, to not allow the huge (and terrible) back breakers vs. Boston b2b - noted above. It's to make at least the expected saves vs. CLB in Game 3 instead of being off your angle and setting up to the man instead of the puck for the comeback.

And here's the thing, it happens to all goalies. It doesn't happen every year to all goalies though - at least not normally.

Which is when I go back to my original question - what form is he returning to? The good regular season starter who breaks on key games?

But it does happen to every goalie. We are partial because we see Andersen regularly and our hopes and dreams die with this team. I'm sure every fan base has crap to say about their goalie. Iirc the bruins fans hated Rask.
Realistically only 1 team, 1 goalie wins the cup, so technically 30 others chocked and a big moment a few time on the way

 

[Gallagbi]

But it does happen to every goalie. We are partial because we see Andersen regularly and our hopes and dreams die with this team. I'm sure every fan base has crap to say about their goalie. Iirc the bruins fans hated Rask.
Realistically only 1 team, 1 goalie wins the cup, so technically 30 others chocked and a big moment a few time on the way

Which goalie has given up the quality of goals against that Fred did in his last 3 winner moves on games? Hell narrow that down and just ask who allowed the downlow goals he did the past two years. I'd have to look at the CLB one again, but he put the Boston one on his own damn net.

You're right that Bruins fans hated Rask...in a series where he didnt break as much as Fred in critical games, then bounced back the following year where Fred (again) broke in Game 7.

It's not the fact any of these have happened, it's the fact they're consistently happening year over year in critical situations

 

[saltming]

Which goalie has given up the quality of goals against that Fred did in his last 3 winner moves on games? Hell narrow that down and just ask who allowed the downlow goals he did the past two years. I'd have to look at the CLB one again, but he put the Boston one on his own damn net.

You're right that Bruins fans hated Rask...in a series where he didnt break as much as Fred in critical games, then bounced back the following year where Fred (again) broke in Game 7.

It's not the fact any of these have happened, it's the fact they're consistently happening year over year in critical situations

I understand what you're saying I just feel that we magnify what happens with Andersen because we are emotionally attached to the team and when we lose it hurts, at least for me it does, I hate it when we lose.
That's why I try to just remember that 30 teams don't win and 30 goalies let in a goal that eliminates their team and to those fans they might see them as stinkers and sinkers.
I also remember having horrible goaltending for a long time. Then we upgraded to, Imo, inconsistent goaltending, the Reimer and Bernier years.
Compared to those 2 Andersen is a rock.
I prefer to judge a goalie in their overall performance. If they usually give your team a chance to win, that's pretty good.

That said, if we get an elite goalie, I'm in, but Andersen is not as bad as some are saying

 

[Gallagbi]

I understand what you're saying I just feel that we magnify what happens with Andersen because we are emotionally attached to the team and when we lose it hurts, at least for me it does, I hate it when we lose.
That's why I try to just remember that 30 teams don't win and 30 goalies let in a goal that eliminates their team and to those fans they might see them as stinkers and sinkers.
I also remember having horrible goaltending for a long time. Then we upgraded to, Imo, inconsistent goaltending, the Reimer and Bernier years.
Compared to those 2 Andersen is a rock.
I prefer to judge a goalie in their overall performance. If they usually give your team a chance to win, that's pretty good.

That said, if we get an elite goalie, I'm in, but Andersen is not as bad as some are saying

I'd rather upgrade than settle for anything above Reimer/Bernier and truthfully Reimer gave a better playoff performance than Andy.

It's not about magnifying the losses, it's about objectively reviewing the series. Fred simply allowed key, back breaking goals in all 3 (some would argue 4 series losses). You can look back at the last truly critical games where the season was on the line for both teams and ask yourself which goalie allowed the worst goal each game? It was Fred. Ask yourself who stopped higher quality chances. It was the other guys.

 

[saltming]

I'd rather upgrade than settle for anything above Reimer/Bernier and truthfully Reimer gave a better playoff performance than Andy.

It's not about magnifying the losses, it's about objectively reviewing the series. Fred simply allowed key, back breaking goals in all 3 (some would argue 4 series losses). You can look back at the last truly critical games where the season was on the line for both teams and ask yourself which goalie allowed the worst goal each game? It was Fred. Ask yourself who stopped higher quality chances. It was the other guys.

Reimer was just as bad or worse in that series against Boston.
Wasn't it 4-1 in the 3rd?
This is where my bias and yours differ. To me it was Reimer that choked continually. Soft goals all the time. Letting in back breakers. Scrambling like mad. That's the problem with bias, you literally see what you are thinking.
While I understand your views, we are obviously at that agree to disagree point.

 

[Gallagbi]

Reimer was just as bad or worse in that series against Boston.
Wasn't it 4-1 in the 3rd?
This is where my bias and yours differ. To me it was Reimer that choked continually. Soft goals all the time. Letting in back breakers. Scrambling like mad. That's the problem with bias, you literally see what you are thinking.
While I understand your views, we are obviously at that agree to disagree point.

Which goal that Reimer allowed was as bad as the goal line goal last game 5? How about as bad as the shot going wide in Game 7 vs. Boston the year prior that Andy put in his own net or the unscreened wrist shot from the top of Blueline by a 4th liner? Both put us in a huge hole. If anything Reimers performance was similar to Andy's first Game 7, which is the best Andy's looked in a Game 5/7 oddly enough

And keep in mind, you're comparing him to a goalie who never regained starter status in the league after his implosion and you're going to have trouble arguing our current goalie was steadier.

 

[saltming]

Which goal that Reimer allowed was as bad as the goal line goal last game 5? How about as bad as the shot going wide in Game 7 vs. Boston the year prior that Andy put in his own net or the unscreened wrist shot from the top of Blueline by a 4th liner? Both put us in a huge hole. If anything Reimers performance was similar to Andy's first Game 7, which is the best Andy's looked in a Game 5/7 oddly enough

And keep in mind, you're comparing him to a goalie who never regained starter status in the league after his implosion and you're going to have trouble arguing our current goalie was steadier.

Reimer was horrible on the last 2 goals to tie it. Completely moved himself out of position and over reacted to the plays.
For me it's not even close. Andie everyday all day over Reimer
Again this is a great example of bias and I will evaluate the goalie via stats, starts, sv%, shots faced etc
Trying to evaluate on what is a soft goal leaves too much room for interpretation and thus will be tainted by bias