Do the Canucks make the playoffs in the 2019-2020 season? (#383)

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

'We thought the team needed to be rebuilt but we acted against the best interests of the fans and franchise so two old players could continue trying to make the playoffs for a few more years' is the most irresponsible, idiotic, pathetic statement possibly uttered by any management team in any sport. It's unheard-of. It's just a complete and utter abdication of responsibility.

How do people not see how ridiculous this is?

Especially after seeing Detroit and NYR rebuild rebuild with their old Swedish stars still in place.

Especially knowing that the Sedins were pure class and would have embraced a rebuild if asked to.

Especially knowing that the team Benning 'built to compete for the Sedins' was accidentally so bad it out-tanked teams intentionally trying to lose.

It's absolutely gutless, especially because it's basically blaming the Sedins for their poor planning and management rather than taking responsibility for it and owning it.

Sedins would have embraced a 'rebuild'..?...and how do you know this?...(insider information?)..I'm sure that when they signed that extension in 2013,that wasn't part of the plan.

Practically every interview the Sedins did..they talked about the 'playoffs'...or getting into the playoffs (anything can happen)

What NYR,TOR,DET did...didnt happen here...and wasn't going to happen here.

Nobody is 'blaming' the Sedins for anything (although some posters seem to be blaming them because they didn't get the rebuild they wanted in 2014)...From when they were drafted ,until the were retired..Most of that time, the Canucks were a playoff team.

 

[Jyrki21]

You still haven't answered the question: once it was painfully obvious they weren't a playoff team, what advantage was there in continuing to be bad, with veterans, instead of rebuilding? Why would this be any better for the Sedins?

 

[racerjoe]

You still haven't answered the question: once it was painfully obvious they weren't a playoff team, what advantage was there in continuing to be bad, with veterans, instead of rebuilding? Why would this be any better for the Sedins?

Shocked by this...

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

You still haven't answered the question: once it was painfully obvious they weren't a playoff team, what advantage was there in continuing to be bad, with veterans, instead of rebuilding? Why would this be any better for the Sedins?

There's no argument from me on that..After the 2015 playoffs ,it was freaking obvious the team was old and slow..and some of the 'compete now' moves in the following 1.5 years are baffling to say the least (Eriksson).

Trevor Lindens comments (we owe it to the Sedins etc..2016) spell that out...The rapid deterioration of the Sedins play basically made the decision up for everybody.

 

[FroshaugFan2]

Sedins would have embraced a 'rebuild'..?...and how do you know this?...(insider information?)..I'm sure that when they signed that extension in 2013,that wasn't part of the plan.

Practically every interview the Sedins did..they talked about the 'playoffs'...or getting into the playoffs (anything can happen)

What NYR,TOR,DET did...didnt happen here...and wasn't going to happen here.

Nobody is 'blaming' the Sedins for anything (although some posters seem to be blaming them because they didn't get the rebuild they wanted in 2014)...From when they were drafted ,until the were retired..Most of that time, the Canucks were a playoff team.

The Sedins aren't dumb. All players want to win games and make the playoffs, even players on basement teams. But they knew the Canucks needed to rebuild and their role at the end was to support the young guys.

Daniel
We always believe in our team, but we’re not dumb. We understand how the NHL works and what it takes to be a Cup contending team. Every club has to go through periods when they aren’t playing their best and changes need to be made. We weren’t expected to make the playoffs in 2015 but we did, and we should have played better against Calgary.
We know that anything can happen in hockey, and that feeling brings us back to the rink every day. The team we have heading into this year is young, and they’re going to be a lot of fun to play with. That’s why our focus right now is simple. We’re going to take this year to work hard and build something special with the young guys around us. And when it ends, we’ll see where we’re at and what we want to do.
Henrik
If we’re going to win a Cup, we only want it to be with Vancouver – that will never change. And if the moment has come and passed already, then so be it. This is my home. This is our home. This is our family’s home. Vancouver has given us so much and we’ve tried to give everything we have in return. So we will do our best to teach this new generation of young guys.

Dear Vancouver | By Henrik Sedin and Daniel Sedin

As Jyrki21 keeps pointing out, the team sucked and wasn't going to be a contender. Eriksson and Gudbranson weren't going to change that. So what favour was it to the Sedins to lose a lot of games with overpriced veterans on the team? Rather than losing games with a young team going through a proper rebuild?

 

[MS]

Sedins would have embraced a 'rebuild'..?...and how do you know this?...(insider information?)..I'm sure that when they signed that extension in 2013,that wasn't part of the plan.

Practically every interview the Sedins did..they talked about the 'playoffs'...or getting into the playoffs (anything can happen)

What NYR,TOR,DET did...didnt happen here...and wasn't going to happen here.

Nobody is 'blaming' the Sedins for anything (although some posters seem to be blaming them because they didn't get the rebuild they wanted in 2014)...From when they were drafted ,until the were retired..Most of that time, the Canucks were a playoff team.

Sedins were pure class who always put the organization ahead of themselves. Of course they wanted to make the playoffs, but I highly doubt they would have had tantrums or been organizational cancers if management had gone a different direction. And as it turned out, they were class acts from start to finish when the team Benning built accidentally stunk.

What NYR. Toronto, and Detroit did not happening here had nothing to do with the Sedins and everything to do with bad ownership and terrible management.

Benning and Linden blaming the Sedins for delaying a rebuild they apparently wanted to make is either :

1) completely and utterly gutless, horrible management and a failure to put the interests of the team ahead of two old players.
2) completely and utterly gutless management where they're attempting to pin their failures on the two classiest people ever involved in the organization.

It's a terrible look, and an embarrassment.

 

[FroshaugFan2]

No..they dont pout and sulk...but in 2014,they were still productive ,and had just signed a four year extension (for X gazillion $) a year earlier (obviously under the understanding that the team would still try and compete while they still had gas in the tank)....

Approaching them with a 'rebuild ' was never going to happen...and was not in the cards with the ownership,President or GM.

Why do the Sedins need to be approached about a rebuild anyway? The Sedins don't make moves, the GM does.

What is your big fear that the Sedins were going to do if the Canucks rebuilt? If the Canucks don't sign Eriksson and don't trade for Gudbranson do you think the Sedins callout management in public? Demand a trade? Refuse to play? Refuse to pass to Boeser?

All the Sedins ever talked about was how much they appreciated Vancouver and wanted to give back to the community.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

The Sedins aren't dumb. All players want to win games and make the playoffs, even players on basement teams. But they knew the Canucks needed to rebuild and their role at the end was to support the young guys.



Dear Vancouver | By Henrik Sedin and Daniel Sedin

As Jyrki21 keeps pointing out, the team sucked and wasn't going to be a contender. Eriksson and Gudbranson weren't going to change that. So what favour was it to the Sedins to lose a lot of games with overpriced veterans on the team? Rather than losing games with a young team going through a proper rebuild?

Correct...The Sedins were resigned to their fate that the team would no longer be a playoff team in their last year,(they would be role models) ..but that wasn't the case 2014-17....

Once again..there was not going to be a rebuild in 2014..They were going to compete right up until the Sedins were done..There was never any talk of 'losing games'...

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Sedins were pure class who always put the organization ahead of themselves. Of course they wanted to make the playoffs, but I highly doubt they would have had tantrums or been organizational cancers if management had gone a different direction. And as it turned out, they were class acts from start to finish when the team Benning built accidentally stunk.

What NYR. Toronto, and Detroit did not happening here had nothing to do with the Sedins and everything to do with bad ownership and terrible management.

Benning and Linden blaming the Sedins for delaying a rebuild they apparently wanted to make is either :

1) completely and utterly gutless, horrible management and a failure to put the interests of the team ahead of two old players.
2) completely and utterly gutless management where they're attempting to pin their failures on the two classiest people ever involved in the organization.

It's a terrible look, and an embarrassment.

The Sedins did not re-sign to have the team go into a rebuild mode (2013)..and for you to say they would would have been fine with losing games /rebuilding is pure speculation.

Benning and Linden did not blame the Sedins (you're creating a narrative..again)...On the contrary, they were overly committed to them.. (obviously to a fault)

 

[timw33]

Correct...The Sedins were resigned to their fate that the team would no longer be a playoff team in their last year,(they would be role models) ..but that wasn't the case 2014-17....

Yeah, they thought that by being surrounded with known good players like Larsen, Bartkowski, Granlund Pedan, Pouliout, Vey, Sutter, Eriksson, Gudbranson, Nilsson, Gagner, Del Zotto, there would absolutely be hope for the playoffs.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Why do the Sedins need to be approached about a rebuild anyway? The Sedins don't make moves, the GM does.

What is your big fear that the Sedins were going to do if the Canucks rebuilt? If the Canucks don't sign Eriksson and don't trade for Gudbranson do you think the Sedins callout management in public? Demand a trade? Refuse to play? Refuse to pass to Boeser?

All the Sedins ever talked about was how much they appreciated Vancouver and wanted to give back to the community.

The GM makes the moves, but he also follows the mandate set out for him by his boss ..the president.....who then answers to his boss..ownership.

Why are you asking me?...I'm agreeing with you ..Canucks should have stripped the team down completely after the playoff loss to the Flames.

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Love the hot take that we don't know how the Sedins would've reacted to being on a bad rebuilding team but somehow they were perfectly fine with being on a bad, non-rebuilding team.

 

[FroshaugFan2]

The GM makes the moves, but he also follows the mandate set out for him by his boss ..the president.....who then answers to his boss..ownership.

Why are you asking me?...I'm agreeing with you ..Canucks should have stripped the team down completely after the playoff loss to the Flames.

Because you're the one claiming it was impossible to rebuild with the Sedins on the team.

So I'm asking what would have been the consequences if the Canucks rebuilt with the Sedins.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Because you're the one claiming it was impossible to rebuild with the Sedins on the team.

So I'm asking what would have been the consequences if the Canucks rebuilt with the Sedins.

I never said it was impossible to rebuild with Sedins on the team..of course it was possible to rebuild...What I am saying is that Ownership/President/GM/Sedins did not want to do a classic 'rebuild'.

Dont shoot the messenger.

 

[MS]

The Sedins did not re-sign to have the team go into a rebuild mode (2013)..and for you to say they would would have been fine with losing games /rebuilding is pure speculation.

Benning and Linden did not blame the Sedins (you're creating a narrative..again)...On the contrary, they were overly committed to them.. (obviously to a fault)

That take on the Sedins isn't speculation because we saw how they acted for 3 years when the team was accidentally the worst in the NHL. Worse than teams that were rebuilding. Nothing but total class, as usual. All about the team.

And who cares what they were told when they signed by a different administration in 2013? If in 2015 or 2016, you think this team needs a rebuild, that's what you do. That's what every other sports team does, ever. I'm sure Lundqvist thought he'd be competing when he signed his contract. So what? There isn't a 'compete clause' in the contract. They're getting the money owed to them and if they don't like the direction of the team, they can ask to be moved. Or stick around and be part of the solution.

They didn't 'blame' the Sedins in so many words, but saying 'Well, we wanted to rebuild, but the Sedins!' is essentially passing the buck on your mistakes and not owning them, and painting the two classiest guys around as the reason the team made awful decisions. It's gutless. Own your shit.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

That take on the Sedins isn't speculation because we saw how they acted for 3 years when the team was accidentally the worst in the NHL. Worse than teams that were rebuilding. Nothing but total class, as usual. All about the team.

And who cares what they were told when they signed by a different administration in 2013? If in 2015 or 2016, you think this team needs a rebuild, that's what you do. That's what every other sports team does, ever. I'm sure Lundqvist thought he'd be competing when he signed his contract. So what? There isn't a 'compete clause' in the contract. They're getting the money owed to them and if they don't like the direction of the team, they can ask to be moved. Or stick around and be part of the solution.

They didn't 'blame' the Sedins in so many words, but saying 'Well, we wanted to rebuild, but the Sedins!' is essentially passing the buck on your mistakes and not owning them, and painting the two classiest guys around as the reason the team made awful decisions. It's gutless. Own your ****.

No doubt they were classy...but still,even in radio interviews (to just before their last year) they were saying 'we have to make the playoffs'.

The rest about administration needing/and recognizing time to a rebuild (regardless of the Sedins) is your take...which I actually agree with.

Again,I dont buy the 'passing the buck' on the Sedins thing..They were committed to them (to a fault)..well past their expiry date.

 

[MS]

No doubt they were classy...but still,even in radio interviews (to just before their last year) they were saying 'we have to make the playoffs'.

The rest about administration needing/and recognizing time to a rebuild (regardless of the Sedins) is your take...which I actually agree with.

Again,I dont buy the 'passing the buck' on the Sedins thing..They were committed to them (to a fault)..well past their expiry date.

Of course they wanted to win. Everyone does. If their first priority as players was to rebuild and lose more games, that would be ... highly questionable. But deciding team direction wasn't their job.

Based on what we saw from these guys over 20 years, including 3 years when they were the worst team in the NHL, they would have done the right thing and been absolute class acts in helping the rebuild along. As they were with Boeser in 17-18.

Even if you were committed to them as a fault, you don't essentially blame them when what happens happened. It was their decision and their mistake. Own it. "We legitimately thought the team could compete, and we got that wrong and made the wrong moves to make that happen. We've learned from those mistakes going forward' isn't so hard to say. And it's a hell of a lot better than 'Well, we wanted to do the right thing but we just couldn't! Because of the Sedins!' which is absolutely gutless.

 

[racerjoe]

The Sedins did not re-sign to have the team go into a rebuild mode (2013)..and for you to say they would would have been fine with losing games /rebuilding is pure speculation.

Benning and Linden did not blame the Sedins (you're creating a narrative..again)...On the contrary, they were overly committed to them.. (obviously to a fault)

Doesn't it still make the management team look worst?

They tried to build a winner but instead built a team that was so bad it was actually the worst in the NHL?

I just don't understand your argument... in like anyway. Its bad no matter what you think.

 

[nucksflailtogether]

Doesn't it still make the management team look worst?

They tried to build a winner but instead built a team that was so bad it was actually the worst in the NHL?

I just don't understand your argument... in like anyway. Its bad no matter what you think.

Yes. They sucked. And we got top picks out of it. Cest la vie. Playoffs talk?

 

[Hockey Rush]

If you compare Calgary's lineup to the Canucks with all the team's new additions. I can't but help think the team is as good if not better. The only strength Calgary would have over Vancouver would be its defence. With Benn, Myers, and Hughes added tho I think they are a lot closer then we think. Especially if Tanev can remain healthy for a long stretch.

Calgary's noticeable forwards:
JOHNNY GAUDREAU
SEAN MONAHAN
ELIAS LINDHOLM
MATTHEW TKACHUK

Vancouver's noticeable forwards:
ELIAS PETTERSSON
BROCK BOESER
BO HORVAT
J.T. MILLER

You could argue Calgary's 4th best player is better than Vancouver's but I believe the combination of the Canucks best 3 is equal or better to that of Calgary's. If Pettersson can continue his production down the stretch this team's top line could be deadly. Last season Pettersson and Boeser had all sorts of different wingers. Add a legit top 6 forward to their wing and let's see what they can do. I would give the Canucks the advantage in goaltending so that would help medigate any lapse on defence. All I am trying is say is I think the teams are a lot closer in overall skill and composition. If Calgary is lets say a 95 pt team I don't think Vancouver is far off. I hope the Canucks can earn a pacific division spot over a wildcard seed.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

If you compare Calgary's lineup to the Canucks with all the team's new additions. I can't but help think the team is as good if not better. The only strength Calgary would have over Vancouver would be its defence. With Benn, Myers, and Hughes added tho I think they are a lot closer then we think. Especially if Tanev can remain healthy for a long stretch.

Calgary's noticeable forwards:
JOHNNY GAUDREAU
SEAN MONAHAN
ELIAS LINDHOLM
MATTHEW TKACHUK

Vancouver's noticeable forwards:
ELIAS PETTERSSON
BROCK BOESER
BO HORVAT
J.T. MILLER

You could argue Calgary's 4th best player is better than Vancouver's but I believe the combination of the Canucks best 3 is equal or better to that of Calgary's. If Pettersson can continue his production down the stretch this team's top line could be deadly. Last season Pettersson and Boeser had all sorts of different wingers. Add a legit top 6 forward to their wing and let's see what they can do. I would give the Canucks the advantage in goaltending so that would help medigate any lapse on defence. All I am trying is say is I think the teams are a lot closer in overall skill and composition. If Calgary is lets say a 95 pt team I don't think Vancouver is far off. I hope the Canucks can earn a pacific division spot over a wildcard seed.

Not to mention the achilles heel of the Calgary Flames....goaltending...

 

[VanillaCoke]

I take Pettersson and Horvat over Monahan and lindholm 10 times out of 10.

Actually in order:
Gaudreau
Pettersson
Tkachuk
Horvat
Lindholm
Boeser
Monahan
Miller

 

[FroshaugFan2]

Calgary had 5 players outscore Pettersson last season. Giving the Canucks the advantage in high end scoring is pretty generous.

 

[rypper]

There's always the possibility this is the year Giordano's game falls off, but I have to think Calgary's defense gets the edge over ours.

 

[DL44]

Jumping into the conversation based on the last few CGY posts.. (so apologies if I'm being redundant)....

Cgy had at least 6 players have careers yrs last yr... and they were big years.

I see zero chance of them matching that production next yr.