Did ANA make a mistake starting Bernier tonight?

ThirdManIn

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Absolutely not. If your goalie isn't 100% then you play the guy who give you the better chance to win. Period. If Carlyle thought Gibson at 70 or 80 or whatever percent gave his team a worse chance of winning, he made the right move playing Bernier. What happens if Gibson plays and gets lit up for 5 goals? Are people asking if Carlyle should be torched for playing the injured goalie?

Listen, I dislike Carlyle a lot. He should be critiqued for any number of things. This isn't one of them.
 

Semantics

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The goals weren't atrocious, so this thread is a little overboard, on top of there being absolutely nothing (zero, zilch) to support the OPs premise of there being any chance that Gibson could have played.

They don't have to be atrocious, 4 is simply way too many to let in on 16 shots.

For some reason people also don't want to acknowledge that Bernier is tiny compared to Gibson, and most other NHL starters. A good number of the "no chance" goals he lets in would just be simple positional saves for a larger man. For a little guy like Bernier, he has to make insane saves regularly to compensate for his stature.
 

WhiskeyYerTheDevils

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They don't have to be atrocious, 4 is simply way too many to let in on 16 shots.

For some reason people also don't want to acknowledge that Bernier is tiny compared to Gibson, and most other NHL starters. A good number of the "no chance" goals he lets in would just be simple positional saves for a larger man. For a little guy like Bernier, he has to make insane saves regularly to compensate for his stature.

So 4 goals on 16 breakaways would be too much? Context matters. There was nothing he could do on the 1st and 4th goals and the other two were from a wide open shot in the slot and a net front scramble where his defense allowed Nashville to bang away at rebounds.
 

NickLidstrom

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Ducks made a huge mistake keeping Gibson in the first place. Should have traded Gibson for huge return and kept Andersen. Better goalie and they would have had a huge return on a (generational) label goalie that Gibson has.

Any evidence to support either claim?
 

BackToTheBrierePatch

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He's suppose to be in the same category as Price...I'm not even kidding...dead serious...that was the hype on him

who said that?
Jesus Christ this board sometimes is crazy with the hyperbole ******** and so goddamn quick to throw young players and goaltenders into bust and overrated category.
23 years old and this was his first year as the true #1. He is a really good young goalie who hasnt reached his potential yet.
 

Seanaconda

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who said that?
Jesus Christ this board sometimes is crazy with the hyperbole ******** and so goddamn quick to throw young players and goaltenders into bust and overrated category.
23 years old and this was his first year as the true #1. He is a really good young goalie who hasnt reached his potential yet.

Price kind of sucked his first couple years too and hasn't exactly done anything great in the playoffs yet
 

Alexei Yashvalev

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Why did Carlyle pull him with what like 2:30 in an elimination game down one goal?

That was really stupid. I know it's become trendy to pull goalies with more and more time left over the years but it's one goal in a crazy game. I would've waited until the last minute!

It doesn't always work, but I've heard teams have done their research on how statistically likely a win is when you pull your goalie with X minutes left.

For some reason people also don't want to acknowledge that Bernier is tiny compared to Gibson, and most other NHL starters. A good number of the "no chance" goals he lets in would just be simple positional saves for a larger man. For a little guy like Bernier, he has to make insane saves regularly to compensate for his stature.

I find it hilarious we live in a world where a man who's 6'0" is called tiny and little.
 

Red Piller

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They don't have to be atrocious, 4 is simply way too many to let in on 16 shots.

For some reason people also don't want to acknowledge that Bernier is tiny compared to Gibson, and most other NHL starters. A good number of the "no chance" goals he lets in would just be simple positional saves for a larger man. For a little guy like Bernier, he has to make insane saves regularly to compensate for his stature.

I heard them say that between periods too.
 

SmoggyTwinkles

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It doesn't always work, but I've heard teams have done their research on how statistically likely a win is when you pull your goalie with X minutes left.



I find it hilarious we live in a world where a man who's 6'0" is called tiny and little.

Two and a half minutes left in an elimination game when your team made a comeback and are down one goal.

It was over right there and the results show it, didn't end by one goal.

Probably the most amazing/lucky empty netter I've ever seen but seriously whatever stats support pulling the goalie with over 1:20 left to play in this situation what does that even do?

A one goal elimination game in the conference finals with 2:30 left to play and your team has been coming back all night...there's a better play there IMO but whatever.

Anaheims problem tonight was Rinne and I hope they win the cup.
 

vipera1960

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Yes and no. If Gibson could have gone, he would have, so starting Bernier tonight was probably the right move. On the other hand, they probably could have gotten Miller relatively cheaply at the trade deadline.
 

The Duck Knight

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who said that?
Jesus Christ this board sometimes is crazy with the hyperbole ******** and so goddamn quick to throw young players and goaltenders into bust and overrated category.
23 years old and this was his first year as the true #1. He is a really good young goalie who hasnt reached his potential yet.

There are people in the Ducks forum that compare him to Price. He's elite at making initial stops when he doesn't have to move. You get him moving and he's one of the worst goalies in the league. He's also frequently injured. He needs to spend a ton of time in the offseason strengthening his lower body and improving puck tracking.
 

Rich Nixon

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I like the uncalled for Gibson/Price comparisons, given that at the same age Price was what, still battling Halak for a starting role? Just claiming it and being called an underachiever by the fans? Seriously, it's like ya'll got floppy disks for memories. Isn't this as many games deep as Price has ever gone in a playoff run?

What is a "generational goalie" anyway?
 
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Hackett

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Going with Bernier was the safe and conservative decision, but it clearly ended up being the wrong one. I have hard time believing that whoever their 3rd stringer is couldn't have done better.

Its not unprecedented to bypass the backup in the CF and go with the #3 guy, but its a very gutsy decision to make.

Bernier was completely incompetent.
 

Hackett

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There are people in the Ducks forum that compare him to Price. He's elite at making initial stops when he doesn't have to move. You get him moving and he's one of the worst goalies in the league. He's also frequently injured. He needs to spend a ton of time in the offseason strengthening his lower body and improving puck tracking.

Gibson reminds me more of Quick than Price. He is athletically gifted, but to be compared to Price, your style needs to be economical with minimal movements.

A guy like Martin Jones reminds me much more of Price.
 

Honour Over Glory

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That is why Anaheim needed to keep Andersen, Gibson was shaky at times too. But you need a solid back-up, a reliable one. Bernier is barely that. Wouldn't be shocked to see the Ducks go heavy after Chad Johnson.
 

Bleedred

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I missed most of the 1st period in real time, so I didn't catch the first two goals other than on replays. Now I think the first goal is one I think I should ding him for. Only Brian Boucher pointed out how he should have gotten that puck with his stick before it hit the skate, while the NBC intermission guys said ''It's not really his fault'' or whatever during the intermission. Then after looking at goal 2 again, which I said might have been bad, I think that was definitely stoppable too. If that puck went top shelf on his stick side, I would have not given him any blame for it, but going in where it did, that's definitely stoppable. Goal 3 was stoppable too, goal 4 (the GWG) was not a stoppable goal at all. The first 3 goals weren't the most hideous goals I've seen and not nearly as bad as when Lehtonen murdered the Stars in the 1st period of game 7 against the Blues last year, but they were stoppable at best.

Not sure why Bernier is getting the blame. None of those goals were that bad.
Maybe none were horrific, but the first 3 were stoppable at best.
For some reason people also don't want to acknowledge that Bernier is tiny compared to Gibson, and most other NHL starters. A good number of the "no chance" goals he lets in would just be simple positional saves for a larger man. For a little guy like Bernier, he has to make insane saves regularly to compensate for his stature.
That's a very good point. Goal 2 might be the best example of that. If you really wanna nitpick, maybe you'd say that the GWG might have hit him in the shoulder if he had a couple more inches, even though it wasn't a bad goal by any means. I feel like Alex Stalock was an example of this. He was horrific in his last 2 years with the Sharks, a total liability by his last season. When looking at his goals allowed, it didn't seem like he allowed a lot of bad goals, but there were a lot of goals scored on him simply because he didn't take up as much space in the net. So he allowed a fair share of goals that would have hit some other goalies in the shoulder.
I find it hilarious we live in a world where a man who's 6'0" is called tiny and little.
It's just the reality of the goaltending position at this point. This is where we've come to. It's because of this phenomenon, that teams have drafted these really tall guys or are signing these 6 foot 6 guys, even though a decent amount of them turn out to be nothing and not any good at the NHL level.

If the league were mostly made up of goalies that were 5 foot 11, guys like Bernier would probably be much better than they are right now. A guy like Alex Stalock might have been a pretty good goalie back in the 70's, 80's or even the 90's. The only fairly decent goalies that height in the NHL are probably Halak and Bernier, just off the top of my head. Aaron Dell was great for the Sharks, but has only been in the league for one year. Stalock looked good after his first NHL season too.
 

Bleedred

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That is why Anaheim needed to keep Andersen, Gibson was shaky at times too. But you need a solid back-up, a reliable one. Bernier is barely that. Wouldn't be shocked to see the Ducks go heavy after Chad Johnson.

What exactly makes Chad Johnson better than Bernier? How is he more reliable? I wouldn't want either of these guys as a starter. Both have showed an ability to masquerade as starters for short period's of time. Take Chad Johnson for the Flames this past year as an example. He was red hot early on as the starter, then fell off by quite a bit and they had to go back to Elliott again.

I really wouldn't have wanted Johnson in there tonight any more than Bernier, if I were a Ducks fan. There's a chance he plays better than Bernier did, but if this game had a do-over, there's a chance Bernier stops 2 or 3 of these goals the next time.

I do feel like Bernier suffers from some mental lapses after some of what happened at the end of his Toronto tenure. I kept joking that Bernier was actually playing better than I expected. I expected one to go through him from center ice at one point.
 

The Lunatic Fridge

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As **** as bernier was, you don't play a guy with a ***ed hamstring (gibson's injury) in a playoff elimination game. You're just asking to get abused + risk further injury.
 

Bleedred

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I always thought Gibson would be better than Andersen.

If he turns out not to be, it will be because injuries prevent him from reaching that.
 

6ix

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Bernier is garbage. Sure he will look good a game here and there, but he's literally garbage.

Mentally weak, slow to react, undersized compared to most goalies. It's always "that woulda been a tough save" with him as opposed to "what a save!" . Dude just never makes the big saves and that's why he's a career backup.
 

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