Post-Game Talk: Devastating loss

[bone]

At least two of the top 4 D need to be replaced. Good luck finding anyone to take on Keith/Barrie. Maybe someone takes Ceci.

Barrie is isn't unmoveable whatsoever. His contract is pretty much at market value and a team deficient in offense from the defense would consider taking him. You wouldn't necessarily get much back, but he can moved. Moving Ceci, may very well be the second stupidest idea floated today after I floated Draisaitl for shock value a couple hours.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

Woody sucks dontchaknow, guy salvaged the season and had them on one of their best point percentages in decades. He got schooled by the guy who couldn’t get an elite Sharks team to the promised land (and was shown up by DeBoer when they made it further with the same core).

The reality is this team is good enough to beat the Kings and it’s not the coach or the goalie that has prevented them from doing so. Sobering thought that people will kick and scream against because those are “easy” solutions.



They’d probably find a way to lose while being coached by Scotty Bowman.

I think there were multiple things that saved this regular season. Woodcroft's 'new voice' is one. The Kane acquisition was arguably the biggest with the on-ice production he delivered and the depth of adding a top line talent enabled this team to run its strength of a three centre spine. Healthy goaltending after running for an extended period without their number 2A goaltender. Health-ier roster after being among the league leaders in man games lost. Return of this team's 'expected goals' to actual production results. Collective reset to where this team's anticipated regular season expectations.

Woodcroft has proven he's an NHL coach. I've think he will be a good one. But he's not won the playoff coaching match up and his roster deployment - a major strength of his reset work - has not worked well in the playoffs. The crucial OT start of Kulak Keith was absolutely head scratching. The old bad coach has managed to reset his group after embarrassing losses with maintaining their highly structured system and composure of the players. Notably he was also the guy who got the moribund Oilers out of a first round playoff.

The overwhelming accountability lives with the players on-ice with their split second decisions within a highly chaotic, fast and reactive sport. Lack of work rate and consistent wilting in pressure situations of playoff conditions is on the players overwhelmingly so. This Oilers team's personnel have proven to be chronic under achievers under multiple coaches and Woodcroft is the latest to watch and wonder how this team in a must win game, within an incredible jacked up arena, can completely collapse to what we saw last night for over 50 minutes.

To an man (outside McDavid) this team will have to look inside and demand much more of themselves to get off the canvas and fight, battle and claw to a desperation game seven opportunity. The talent is there. Is the character and will?

 

[OfCorsiDid]

Its kind of funny that you live in Bandwagon Toronto saying all this. This market isn't what the Toronto market is really like. We follow losers and winners here.

With the New arena and the plans the NHL has for it and the ways they have already used it Edmonton Oilers are not going on the block, and the league at present would not approve of it. I mean they save Arizona ffs.

Theres some down takes after a hard game but speculation on the Oilers being history here is a bit reactive.

Talking down to me simply because of where I live is a bizarre thing to do, especially since I was born and raised in Edmonton.

Either way, are you actually trying to tell me that there wouldn’t be a decline in any of this if we traded away McDrai? Because we have concrete proof that there will be a decline. It happened last time we traded away a fan favourite.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Barrie is isn't unmoveable whatsoever. His contract is pretty much at market value and a team deficient in offense from the defense would consider taking him. You wouldn't necessarily get much back, but he can moved. Moving Ceci, may very well be the second stupidest idea floated today after I floated Draisaitl for shock value a couple hours.

Maybe you can move Barrie, but he hasn't really been as offensive as he should be in the playoffs.

I say Ceci because good luck moving Keith or Nurse. Those are absolute anchors that aren't going anywhere.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Couldn't have said it any better. Holland was given a head start when he was hired here and he's done nothing but trip and hold this team back. There's simply no defense for him and this staff at this point.

I was actually surprised to see that @Drivesaitl was very pessimistic about the hiring.

Like others I reviewed the last several years of Hollands work in Detroit. It wasn't good. Nor was I keen on hiring burned out Holland when we already had Nicholson in the fold. Don't particularly trust either. Still, its saying something after Chiarelli that almost anything is better.

All told Holland hasn't helped or improved the team much considering what kind of Cap he had this season to play with. More misses than hits. Kane dropped in his lap and Kane wanted to resurrect here because of McD. He knew he'd look good. Smart guy.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Like others I reviewed the last several years of Hollands work in Detroit. It wasn't good. Nor was I keen on hiring burned out Holland when we already had Nicholson in the fold. Don't particularly trust either. Still, its saying something after Chiarelli that almost anything is better.

All told Holland hasn't helped or improved the team much considering what kind of Cap he had this season to play with. More misses than hits. Kane dropped in his lap and Kane wanted to resurrect here because of McD. He knew he'd look good. Smart guy.

Knowing that we passed on Bill Zito (Panthers GM) twice for tweedle dee and tweedle dipshit just makes everything all the more painful. The Oilers saw a "HOF GM" was available and went right for him, forgoing whatever process they had in mind. How Bob Nicholson still has a job is mystifying. There is no bigger fraud in hockey than him. He might honestly be the worst thing to ever happen to the Oilers.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Talking down to me simply because of where I live is a bizarre thing to do, especially since I was born and raised in Edmonton.

Either way, are you actually trying to tell me that there wouldn’t be a decline in any of this if we traded away McDrai? Because we have concrete proof that there will be a decline. It happened last time we traded away a fan favourite.

Leave it to you to be offended at what was meant as a joke. But then again you brayed racism when somebody mentioned Drake just yesterday in what was an obvious joke.

I mean how can anybody not recognize this as joking around when I actually said this;

"Its kind of funny that you live in Bandwagon Toronto saying all this. This market isn't what the Toronto market is really like. We follow losers and winners here."

Anybody from Edmonton would recognize, I would think, as a typical Edmonton barb towards the bandwagon center of the universe.

ps people barb Calgary here constantly. Is that Bizarre too? I was mocking Toronto. You're a bit sensitive. Are jokes about where somebody is living now going to be cancelled as well?

 

[bone]

Yzerman also cleared off some salary with savvy deals, the very kind that we could use around here. I mean hell, he conned Kenny for AA.

I've been reading the thread where Holland was hired... Lots of misplaced optimism.

I liked his Mantha trade to free up some space but AA wasn't a cap issue as his contract expired that year. They just wanted to move on from the player and caught Holland in an overpay.

 

[Leonardlizard]

How crazy is it to draft some optimism on the fact that the team seems to respond when they're truly up against the wall .... Like things looked pretty bad in the first week of February before the shift and it was a scramble to the end to come back and get into playoff position. So maybe they come out flat subconsciously knowing the season isn't on the line...now it's do or die. Idk... I'm looking for anything to help with the pain.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I liked his Mantha trade to free up some space but AA wasn't a cap issue as his contract expired that year. They just wanted to move on from the player and caught Holland in an overpay.

You're right but it's still a savvy deal that took advantage of a dumb GM, something we haven't seen here since 2006.

 

[bone]

Yzerman doesn't have McDavid and Draisaitl and the reason why Yzerman has had to build that team from the ground up is because Holland destroyed them with his horrendous cap management and poor drafting.

For sure, I'm just saying it hasn't been all success in Detroit's cap issues were mostly gone already. I'd definitely have more confidence that Yzerman could build a team from scratch compared to Holland, I'm just saying that the cleanup was already underway before he got there.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I was thinking about the last couple years and for the third straight year the Oilers have an element that should inspire them. In 19/20 it was Colby Cave, in 20/21 it was Joey Moss and this year it's Ben. And they haven't raised their game for any of them. If the Oilers lose this series there should be questions about basically everyone on and off the ice for the utterly uninspiring efforts we've seen given what they've been through.

 

[Captain Fantastic]

@Bobby9 quit trolling this thread or you'll be reported.

 

[McAsuno]

Aside from being a defensive f***ing pylon on the GWG against, here's Keith once again earlier in last night's game making a stupid errant pass that leads to a goal. Had enough time to break it out easily to Kane. What a f***ing dumb trade.

 

[Lacaar]

You maybe saw me saying the same at start of series. That the Oilers had to win games by a 6-2 type scoreline because they seem unable to comprehend or manage tight games. We lost all 3 games in this series that were close.

With the Oilers its as if something is wrong with their internal calibration of where games are at. You can spot it all the time. The Oilers score the 1-1 goal in the game and act like they won the SC. All they did was tie a game against the grain of play in a game in which they were being vastly outplayed. The Oilers proceed to play two more strong shifts before Kings take the game back and score two more goals. Oilers get one back and feel good about themselves. Kings score another and OIlers get it back tied late in game, act like they've won the cup again.

Yet every fan of this team viewed the OT with trepidation. I mean who really thought we were going to win in OT? Our chance to W was late in game. With the 20min break I knew the Kings would be able to reset. They even said that on telecast. The Oilers thought something entirely different. Maybe they thought they would "Weather the storm" lol

Man, we're fans of the Oilers. The 80's club was legendary for putting teams out of their misery in OT especially guys like Anderson. They would deliver euthanasia quick in OT, most of the time, and generally understood that OT is a one goal crapshoot. You better score first. Kings got the memo, this Oilers team never does. I mean imagine coming out in OT like that in a playoff game. Kings almost won the game 3 times in 70secs.

It's definitely something I'd be investigating as the coach and gm. What's done in between periods and games in that organization and players that causes such a swoon in their play.

1. Are they just not fond of each other and not a tight team?
2. Are they just scared of failure and play timid out of the gate.

Why does something have to go right for the team before it can play a competitive game of hockey?

Why was there absolutely no push back when L.A went up 1-0

I feel how your team comes out and starts games and periods is a direct reflection on the teams will to win. The drive to win and lay it on the line. Your desire to win the game. Shit happens on the ice after that causes momentum swings. That's hockey. But when a team is consistently coming into periods and asserting their will on the other team it speaks volumes about which one is really dedicated and invested.

The Oilers are a team of individual talents that can't assert their will on the game until desperate. They emotionally drain themselves during the game and series because they only know how to play competitive hockey when they're desperate or things are going well for them. Were we really that good in game 2 and 3... or was L.A just poor?

I feel the only the Oilers are going to win this series is if they get especially lucky. Or L.A lets them. If L.A wants it.. it's theirs. That's what I've seen over 5 games. 3 games where L.A wanted it. And 2 games were L.A let up and let the Oilers have it. I have yet to see a game the Oilers took by the nuts against an L.A team that was giving it all.

L.A has it figured out... in 1 playoff series.
Edmonton hasn't figured it out.. in 2 years going on 3.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Aside from being a defensive f***ing pylon on the GWG against, here's Keith once again earlier in last night's game making a stupid errant pass that leads to a goal. Had enough time to break it out easily to Kane. What a f***ing dumb trade.

Weak clear, weak defense, weak goaltending... A completely preventable goal.

 

[Marty McSurly]

Aside from being a defensive f***ing pylon on the GWG against, here's Keith once again earlier in last night's game making a stupid errant pass that leads to a goal. Had enough time to break it out easily to Kane. What a f***ing dumb trade.

Holland's takeaway from the series against the Jets was "more experience" via "grey beards" .

The experience? An older guy who makes the same mistakes as Ethan Bear lol.

 

[Lacaar]

Aside from being a defensive f***ing pylon on the GWG against, here's Keith once again earlier in last night's game making a stupid errant pass that leads to a goal. Had enough time to break it out easily to Kane. What a f***ing dumb trade.

Shitty play but I feel any Oilers d-man was going to do the same thing. That's a product of playing scared chicken shit hockey. Veteran Keith craps his pants.. falls down and gives up the puck because he thinks he's under more pressure than he is. Because L.A never stops pressuring.

L.A has playoff hockey figured out. Edmonton doesn't. The only chance Edmonton has is to get the first one and pray to god L.A gets out of their playoff hockey mode.

And while Keith messed up the outlet... Smith gave up a f***ing cheezer there as well. In a tie game.. THAT's when you need the big saves. That's when we aren't getting them.

Last game was Bouchard, This game was Keith, First game was Smith. Next game the goat will be someone else.
They just take turns making errors on simple plays because they play scared.

 

[bellagiobob]

45shot average by the Kings last 3GP. That isn't a workload, thats a bombing blitz. In games where the Oilers have mustered anything close to this kind of shots Quick has folded his tent. Kings play a greasy down low game and buzz the net constantly. How they play. To beat them you have to force Kings to play their own end and keep them out of your end as much as possible. Once the Kings are in your yard and infestation has taken hold its hard to fumigate.

Not sure about the Koski angle. Hasn't looked good lately and in contrast to Smith his rebound control not as solid and his puck management next to non existent. On Koski all kings have to do is dump in and retrieve, and with how hot they are converging on pucks they can do that. The D are having trouble with pressure even WITH Smith as a puck playing pressure valve.

As you know I’m not a big Koski fan, so for me to even suggest they that they ponder it, you know times are desperate.

 

[themilosh]

Clean house?

Waive Smith
Buy out Keith
Sign any goalie not named Mikko Koskinen or Mike Smith

New management + Barry Trotz could be interesting

You can have Price next year.

 

[russ99]

It's definitely something I'd be investigating as the coach and gm. What's done in between periods and games in that organization and players that causes such a swoon in their play.

1. Are they just not fond of each other and not a tight team?
2. Are they just scared of failure and play timid out of the gate.

Why does something have to go right for the team before it can play a competitive game of hockey?

Why was there absolutely no push back when L.A went up 1-0

I feel how your team comes out and starts games and periods is a direct reflection on the teams will to win. The drive to win and lay it on the line. Your desire to win the game. Shit happens on the ice after that causes momentum swings. That's hockey. But when a team is consistently coming into periods and asserting their will on the other team it speaks volumes about which one is really dedicated and invested.

The Oilers are a team of individual talents that can't assert their will on the game until desperate. They emotionally drain themselves during the game and series because they only know how to play competitive hockey when they're desperate or things are going well for them. Were we really that good in game 2 and 3... or was L.A just poor?

I feel the only the Oilers are going to win this series is if they get especially lucky. Or L.A lets them. If L.A wants it.. it's theirs. That's what I've seen over 5 games. 3 games where L.A wanted it. And 2 games were L.A let up and let the Oilers have it. I have yet to see a game the Oilers took by the nuts against an L.A team that was giving it all.

L.A has it figured out... in 1 playoff series.
Edmonton hasn't figured it out.. in 2 years going on 3.

I refuse to believe a group of pro hockey players would just quit like this.

Did you see that locker room shot before game 4 where Woodcroft said to “stick with the system no matter what happens”? 5 periods of sticking with the system before McDavid got fed up and put the team on his back.

Credit the Kings, they watched video of those two games and adapted to shut our system down. The onus is on us to react.

Woodcroft has not been a head coach at the NHL level and no amount of preparation can set you up for postseason pressure. He’s handled it poorly, I hope he can learn from it and adapt before it’s too late.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Shitty play but I feel any Oilers d-man was going to do the same thing. That's a product of playing scared chicken shit hockey. Veteran Keith craps his pants.. falls down and gives up the puck because he thinks he's under more pressure than he is. Because L.A never stops pressuring.

L.A has playoff hockey figured out. Edmonton doesn't. The only chance Edmonton has is to get the first one and pray to god L.A gets out of their playoff hockey mode.

And while Keith messed up the outlet... Smith gave up a f***ing cheezer there as well. In a tie game.. THAT's when you need the big saves. That's when we aren't getting them.

Last game was Bouchard, This game was Keith, First game was Smith. Next game the goat will be someone else.
They just take turns making errors on simple plays because they play scared.

Excellent point, particularly the bolded, and a good understanding of the effects of pressure forecheck in hockey.

LA have confounded other clubs with their pace and pressure. They're good at making efficient plays to gain zone or puck battle as well. Its odd the same club has trouble on PP. But anyway.

Its the same thing in Football. A blitz package is good even when you're not blitzing. Because the QB starts getting happy feet expecting your blitzing. With Kings they disguise it decently too and sometimes fake blitz but then go back into NZ intercept mode. For what they have its a well oiled machine and starts with really smart forwards like Kopitar, Danault, Kempe, Iafallo, Moore. Any of these guys would be coaches down the road if they wanted it. They read games so well.

I'll say this too. In fairness to Keith he's developed a learned allergy in handing Bouchard the puck. I mean I wouldn't be doing it either. Neither Keith or Smith are giving Bouchard the puck a lot.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I refuse to believe a group of pro hockey players would just quit like this.

Did you see that locker room shot before game 4 where Woodcroft said to “stick with the system no matter what happens”? 5 periods of sticking with the system before McDavid got fed up and put the team on his back.

Credit the Kings, they watched video of those two games and adapted to shut our system down. The onus is on us to react.

Woodcroft has not been a head coach at the NHL level and no amount of preparation can set you up for postseason pressure. He’s handled it poorly, I hope he can learn from it and adapt before it’s too late.

I rather enjoyed when Woodcroft told the Conn Smythe winner to serve up pizzas and play like a pylon.

 

[themilosh]

Every Cup champion has faced a do or die. It's time for Edmonton to show they can finally embrace adversity and win-out.

 

[VainGretzky]

A 2 game winning streak is very possible, also Koskinen should have started game 4 and rest the 40-year-old Smith considering how much rubber he endured 1st 3 games and it showed in game 5 with the softies.