Player Discussion Danton Heinen VI - (re-signed 2 years, $2.8M/yr)

[LSCII]

Just another reason why Sweeney is a D minus GM.

The guy just put together a team that went to the cup finals. Something very few of even the most ardent B's fans and experts thought would happen. How exactly does he get a D-? Because he didn't fill the roster with fighters that would have likely resulted in a playoff non qualifier?

 

[Marcobruin]

I'll take that best easily.

Dzingel is fast and has a good shot but he's not capable of creating his own offense, is horrific along the boards, and is one of the most disengaged defensive players on the league. He plays a poor man version of what Phil Kessel does on D but without the elite offense to make up for it.

Dzingel is not a good player. Why else would he have zero suitors after back to back 50 point seasons? It's because the NIL knows what he is.

Yet Kessel was one of the best 5on5 players playing for one of the worse teams in the league.(Toronto)
A playoff beast and arguably
Could have Conn Smythe winner 3years ago yet pick the invisible man who does squat and have to dig deep in order to find a silver lining .

 

[Marcobruin]

The guy just put together a team that went to the cup finals. Something very few of even the most ardent B's fans and experts thought would happen. How exactly does he get a D-? Because he didn't fill the roster with fighters that would have likely resulted in a playoff non qualifier?

'put together a team"
Did he get Pastrnak, Marchand ,Bergeron, Rask, Krejci krug and even Chara ???
Give him a little credit. .fine but definitely not all

 

[Fenian24]

Avatar bet?

On

 

[Clint Eastwood]

'put together a team"
Did he get Pastrnak, Marchand ,Bergeron, Rask, Krejci krug and even Chara ???
Give him a little credit. .fine but definitely not all

He did hire Bruce. He drafted Debrusk. He traded for Coyle and Mojo (without them, no way we make it as far). He signed Wagner, Nordstrom, and traded for Kuraly who are all very important pieces to the 4th line. He drafted McAvoy and Carlo . . oh and Vaakanainen and Studnicka. He signed Halak who's been our best backup in years. He's handed out bargan deals to Pastrnak and Marchand, signed Heinen to a very reasonable deal, and the only bad contract he's given out is Backes.

 

[LSCII]

'put together a team"
Did he get Pastrnak, Marchand ,Bergeron, Rask, Krejci krug and even Chara ???
Give him a little credit. .fine but definitely not all

Same argument can be made that chiarelli inherited a team from O'Connell and gorton yet people bend over backwards to give him full credit for 2011...

 

[Marcobruin]

He did hire Bruce. He drafted Debrusk. He traded for Coyle and Mojo (without them, no way we make it as far). He signed Wagner, Nordstrom, and traded for Kuraly who are all very important pieces to the 4th line. He drafted McAvoy and Carlo . . oh and Vaakanainen and Studnicka. He signed Halak who's been our best backup in years. He's handed out bargan deals to Pastrnak and Marchand, signed Heinen to a very reasonable deal, and the only bad contract he's given out is Backes.

Beleskey contract was a dandy
Hayes trade another dandy
Some very questionable draft picks.
If not for my aforementioned players in my previous post .they wouldn't even had a wiff at the finals possibly the playoffs. BUT as I mentioned give him some credit but definitely not all

 

[Marcobruin]

Same argument can be made that chiarelli inherited a team from O'Connell and gorton yet people bend over backwards to give him full credit for 2011...

No argument from me. I think Chiarelli Is one of the worse
And will never be a gm in the NHL again He got some luck though.btw I've been a huge Gorton supporter for years hated when Chiarelli fired him(he must have been intimated) and I knew way back then when NY hired him that ultimately he'd be the NY gm
He's a good one
The mistakes that Chiarelli made both in Boston and EDM are irreparable and unforgivable

 

[LSCII]

No argument from me. I think Chiarelli Is one of the worse
And will never be a gm in the NHL again He got some luck though.btw I've been a huge Gorton supporter for years hated when Chiarelli fired him(he must have been intimated) and I knew way back then when NY hired him that ultimately he'd be the NY gm
He's a good one
The mistakes that Chiarelli made both in Boston and EDM are irreparable and unforgivable

Every GM inherits a core of players that are already in the organization. It's just life. So holding it against them for not being the first and only GM of a team is a little strong, IMO. lol

As for Sweeney, he identified who to keep, who to move, who to resign, who to draft, and who to acquire. The end results speak for themselves, whether you give him a little or a lot of credit and I leave that up to the individual. His fingerprints are all over this roster though. And keep in mind that he didn't come from outside the organization like a lot of GMs. He was here during the previous regime, where I would assume he had some input on personnel decisions. Plus he gets bonus points for finally shit canning Claude, even if I think it should have happened sooner. And then picking the right guy in Cassidy to replace Claude.

 

[Marcobruin]

Every GM inherits a core of players that are already in the organization. It's just life. So holding it against them for not being the first and only GM of a team is a little strong, IMO. lol

As for Sweeney, he identified who to keep, who to move, who to resign, who to draft, and who to acquire. The end results speak for themselves, whether you give him a little or a lot of credit and I leave that up to the individual. His fingerprints are all over this roster though. And keep in mind that he didn't come from outside the organization like a lot of GMs. He was here during the previous regime, where I would assume he had some input on personnel decisions. Plus he gets bonus points for finally **** canning Claude, even if I think it should have happened sooner. And then picking the right guy in Cassidy to replace Claude.

True to first paragraph..concerning Don Sweeney he was honest when he said that Jeff Gorton played the biggest hand when it came to drafting when JG was responsible for scouting .
He was a huge factor in the drafting of Bergeron Krejci
Lucic Kessel Marchand and more .
I still recall vividly when he asked about his drafting of Marchand ...Gorton replied
" Watch this kid he is my sleeper of the draft"... Man did he know his stuff.
The Rangers have a great man as gm of course now he's a gm so he surely no longer has nearly as much time to scout the young kids as he did in Boston.
Ny imo is building a nice future
With youngsters such as Kaapo,
Kravstov, buchnevich ,

 

[ODAAT]

All good points. The odd thing about his release is that the season before this past one, Heinen showed a pretty quick release on his wrister many times. He has a nice shot, just needs to use it more. He's too unselfish. I'm convinced he is going to be a 20 goal scorer within the next couple years if he is given the chance to establish chemistry on a line rather than get moved all over the place.

no argument here friend, sometimes it pays to be a bit selfish, think too he could be a 20 goal guy

 

[ODAAT]

Beleskey contract was a dandy
Hayes trade another dandy
Some very questionable draft picks.
If not for my aforementioned players in my previous post .they wouldn't even had a wiff at the finals possibly the playoffs. BUT as I mentioned give him some credit but definitely not all

Donnie has certainly made his mistakes, whether that was through the draft and/or UFA signings and some of them sting but when I`m on the "Sweeney sucks" train which I jump on from time to time I look at the bigger picture and see that he`s essentially done what he has insisted was his mission when he was named GM, stock the prospect cupboard, develop then promote from within while being competitive. Kind of have to check most of those boxes

You and I could do a deep dive into the 30 other teams and it wouldn`t take long to pick off their GM`s draft/UFA and/or contract mistakes, there is no perfect GM, tough job, DS is doing well

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

I take Heinen before Dzingel any day.

Younger, better, cheaper.

Dzingel stinks. Highly overrated. So glad the Bruins had no interest.

 

[Marcobruin]

Donnie has certainly made his mistakes, whether that was through the draft and/or UFA signings and some of them sting but when I`m on the "Sweeney sucks" train which I jump on from time to time I look at the bigger picture and see that he`s essentially done what he has insisted was his mission when he was named GM, stock the prospect cupboard, develop then promote from within while being competitive. Kind of have to check most of those boxes

You and I could do a deep dive into the 30 other teams and it wouldn`t take long to pick off their GM`s draft/UFA and/or contract mistakes, there is no perfect GM, tough job, DS is doing well

I'll agree that there is no perfect gm. Just scanning quickly I like what Yzerman did and how he handled The Drouin situation.
Id have to start looking how many have signed 2 flops in backes and beleskey. I'm sure many like myself hated both of those signings Backes more than beleskey hence why didn't a gm like DS see what plain other ppl like myself saw?

 

[Gordon Lightfoot]

The guy just put together a team that went to the cup finals. Something very few of even the most ardent B's fans and experts thought would happen. How exactly does he get a D-? Because he didn't fill the roster with fighters that would have likely resulted in a playoff non qualifier?

He gets a D- because he didn’t land Ferland. You’re not seeing through the BS. Papa Jacobs bought him the GMOTY award to placate the fans who are basically sheep.

 

[UncleRico]

He did hire Bruce. He drafted Debrusk. He traded for Coyle and Mojo (without them, no way we make it as far). He signed Wagner, Nordstrom, and traded for Kuraly who are all very important pieces to the 4th line. He drafted McAvoy and Carlo . . oh and Vaakanainen and Studnicka. He signed Halak who's been our best backup in years. He's handed out bargan deals to Pastrnak and Marchand, signed Heinen to a very reasonable deal, and the only bad contract he's given out is Backes.

I like Sweeney overall but backes isn’t the only bad contract, he signed beleskey and Moore is also a decently bad contract but not too bad. He missed terribly on zboril and senyshyn (at least compared to the players available). Frederic doesn’t look like he will be anything more than a 3rd line center if not a 4th line center.

Love Sweeney’s trades tho, especially the Hamilton, lucic, mojo and coyle trades. As well as his ability to sign home grown talent to new deals.

 

[Dr Hook]

I like Sweeney overall but backes isn’t the only bad contract, he signed beleskey and Moore is also a decently bad contract but not too bad. He missed terribly on zboril and senyshyn (at least compared to the players available). Frederic doesn’t look like he will be anything more than a 3rd line center if not a 4th line center.

Love Sweeney’s trades tho, especially the Hamilton, lucic, mojo and coyle trades. As well as his ability to sign home grown talent to new deals.

Justify this one, please. Moore at 2.5m and term is decently bad how? It is a great cost for a bottom pairing guy who can play solid minutes, skates well, and can line up on either side. Now I know his shoulder is gaunched pretty bad, but if he recovers okay, and no reason to think he won't, he is expansion draft eligible and/or easily tradeable if necessary. Given what happened the past two seasons with injuries on the blueline, I don't see how the Moore contract can be seen as bad.

 

[arider1990]

Justify this one, please. Moore at 2.5m and term is decently bad how? It is a great cost for a bottom pairing guy who can play solid minutes, skates well, and can line up on either side. Now I know his shoulder is gaunched pretty bad, but if he recovers okay, and no reason to think he won't, he is expansion draft eligible and/or easily tradeable if necessary. Given what happened the past two seasons with injuries on the blueline, I don't see how the Moore contract can be seen as bad.

At this point does anything that happens in a Heinen thread surprise you anymore?

 

[Donnie Shulzhoffer]

There are so many smart people in here with great points but it is now like reading directions on a shampoo bottle

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Justify this one, please. Moore at 2.5m and term is decently bad how? It is a great cost for a bottom pairing guy who can play solid minutes, skates well, and can line up on either side. Now I know his shoulder is gaunched pretty bad, but if he recovers okay, and no reason to think he won't, he is expansion draft eligible and/or easily tradeable if necessary. Given what happened the past two seasons with injuries on the blueline, I don't see how the Moore contract can be seen as bad.

there are only 127 dmen in the nhl making 2 mill or more... obviously much less making 2.5mill

our top 6 dmen project to be in some order McAvoy/krug/carlo/chara/grezlyck/Clifton

those bottom 2 guys are making a great cost for bottom pairing guys...

we have moore and miller at 7/8 on our depth chart making top 4 money... theres no way you can slice this to say thats a great cost

I could argue they would be 3/4 dmen on some other teams... but not great 3/4 dmen... low end 3/4 dmen

certainly they would be very good 5/6 dmen on most teams... but they are being paid premium money for that role

theres no way we can say these are great contracts... but they arent horrible contracts if they end up on a team that needs them

 

[Dr Hook]

theres no way we can say these are great contracts... but they arent horrible contracts if they end up on a team that needs them

And my point wasn't that it was a great deal- he called it a decently bad contract. It clearly isn't. According to you, and you may be right, there is a slight overpay. Slightly overpaying he or Miller in no way qualifies them as having bad contracts. If you paid them what they are worth in your calculus, the team saves just over a million on the cap. Big whoop. If that million is the source of collapse, someone, somewhere is not doing their job properly. Anyway, I don't want to further derail the Heinen thread

 

[Dueling Banjos]

Just turned 24, 0.5 ppg player, versatile...for 2.8M per, well done.

 

[Donnie Shulzhoffer]

Just turned 24, 0.5 ppg player, versatile...for 2.8M per, well done.

And done

 

[UncleRico]

Justify this one, please. Moore at 2.5m and term is decently bad how? It is a great cost for a bottom pairing guy who can play solid minutes, skates well, and can line up on either side. Now I know his shoulder is gaunched pretty bad, but if he recovers okay, and no reason to think he won't, he is expansion draft eligible and/or easily tradeable if necessary. Given what happened the past two seasons with injuries on the blueline, I don't see how the Moore contract can be seen as bad.

Well see your last sentence is the big problem. He’s really only going to see the ice if there are injuries. Unless there are injuries it’s $2.5m worth of cap for a healthy scratch.

With Miller and the emergence of Clifton, only way Moore sees the ice is if Chara/krug/gryz are injured. With Vaak or lauzon being capable of being called up to play Incase of injury, $2.5 million is a lot of money for a potential 7th or 8th defender.

It’s much more a bad contract than it is a bad player. Considering the depth on defense we currently have.

 

[Donnie Shulzhoffer]

I defy anyone to make a point in here that has not been before

This is not mocking or out of disrespect

You are all smart people.