Dan Hamhuis - Will test FA; "We're still working through things, so we'll see"

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me2

Go ahead foot
Jun 28, 2002
37,903
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Make my day.

Sbisa $3.6m lol lol lol lol its cap

Or

#BenningDefense 1: cap doesn't matter

Besides with so many young D we need a veteran to fill the veteran age gap. We will just have to trade one of them now. Hutton for Bieksa! #agegap #benninglogic
 
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biturbo19

Registered User
Jul 13, 2010
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Seems like a pretty misleading title based on the info in OP. Obviously will not be signed before the UFA period opens...but that they're "still working through stuff" sounds like they're still leaving the door open a crack on bringing him back, depending what else happens with Free Agency.
 

F A N

Registered User
Aug 12, 2005
18,784
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I don't understand the anger here. This has pretty much been a forgone conclusion. Look, I am a big believer in getting what you can for a pending UFA you are unlikely to re-sign and so I was extremely disappointed at the deadline, but at the end of the day, you are dealing with two players who had full NTCs who didn't want to go anywhere.

Vrbata reportedly gave Benning a list of 8 teams. None of the 8 teams made an offer. Hamhuis gave the Canucks a list of 2 teams and Dallas chose to go with Russell instead. They apparently circled back but we don't have any information as to what the circled back offer was except Benning said it didn't make sense. Maybe Dallas wanted the Canucks to take on a contract? And quite frankly if you were discussing a similar deal with Dallas to the Calgary deal then they chose to acquire Russel instead and then came back and said well we are still interested in Hamhuis but we can only offer you this significantly worse deal would you take it? At some point, you have to say forget it. No deal.

People like to bring up losing Matthias and Richardson for nothing. The Canucks were in playoff contention. Richardson, if I remember correctly, was injured at the deadline. Matthias was actually a difference maker down the stretch that helped the Canucks make the playoffs. It's not like Benning traded assets for pending UFAs. Teams in playoff contention don't tend to trade away roster players for draft picks at the deadline.

It seems some fans fail to grasp the concept of players signing contracts with full NTCs and feel like they should be traded before their contract ends and is mad when that does not happen.
 

Hit the post

I have your gold medal Zippy!
Oct 1, 2015
22,454
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Hiding under WTG's bed...
It seems some fans fail to grasp the concept of players signing contracts with full NTCs and feel like they should be traded before their contract ends and is mad when that does not happen.
Nobody said it was easy - that's why Benning gets paid the big bucks. He failed completely. "Worst contract in the NHL was dealt" - and the return wasn't that bad.
 

Nuckles

_________
Apr 27, 2010
28,424
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heck
Nobody said it was easy - that's why Benning gets paid the big bucks. He failed completely. "Worst contract in the NHL was dealt" - and the return wasn't that bad.

It definitely shouldn't have been hard to trade Hamhuis. The demand for d-men was huge at the deadline, Mike Weber even got a 3rd round pick.
Also, it's very well known that Benning is a terrible negotiator. We've seen the trades he's made and the contracts he has handed out.

And yes, Hamhuis had a NTC, but he gave a list of a few playoff teams who were definitely looking to acquire a d-man. Benning did a piss poor job shopping him and working out a deal. Stop making excuses for this inept fool who is completely out of his depth. The most average of GMs could have easily gotten a 1st for Hamhuis, even if it meant getting a 2017 1st instead.

Instead we're in a situation where we lose yet another valuable asset for nothing, and for no good reason whatsoever.
 

Snatcher Demko

High-End Intangibles
Oct 8, 2006
5,994
1,428
Time to let him go.

We'd have too many, especially with one (or more) of Juolevi, Stecher and Subban, plus the fact that Sbisa's contract can't be unloaded, and we also have Tryamkin who is promising.

Obviously anyone would rather have Sbisa than Hammer, but that's not a choice anymore, thanks to that idiotic signing.

Anyways, anything beyond a 2 year deal would have been bad value for Hammer anyways. His best years are behind him and it's a shame we didn't get any assets for him.
 

SgtToody

Registered User
Mar 16, 2013
1,215
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I don't understand the anger here. This has pretty much been a forgone conclusion. Look, I am a big believer in getting what you can for a pending UFA you are unlikely to re-sign and so I was extremely disappointed at the deadline, but at the end of the day, you are dealing with two players who had full NTCs who didn't want to go anywhere.

Vrbata reportedly gave Benning a list of 8 teams. None of the 8 teams made an offer. Hamhuis gave the Canucks a list of 2 teams and Dallas chose to go with Russell instead. They apparently circled back but we don't have any information as to what the circled back offer was except Benning said it didn't make sense. Maybe Dallas wanted the Canucks to take on a contract? And quite frankly if you were discussing a similar deal with Dallas to the Calgary deal then they chose to acquire Russel instead and then came back and said well we are still interested in Hamhuis but we can only offer you this significantly worse deal would you take it? At some point, you have to say forget it. No deal.

People like to bring up losing Matthias and Richardson for nothing. The Canucks were in playoff contention. Richardson, if I remember correctly, was injured at the deadline. Matthias was actually a difference maker down the stretch that helped the Canucks make the playoffs. It's not like Benning traded assets for pending UFAs. Teams in playoff contention don't tend to trade away roster players for draft picks at the deadline.

It seems some fans fail to grasp the concept of players signing contracts with full NTCs and feel like they should be traded before their contract ends and is mad when that does not happen.
I don't buy your rationalizations, but my counter is just one word: Corrado.
 

kanucks25

Chris Tanev #1 Fan
Nov 29, 2013
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While I do hate that, you also have to consider Hamhuis will likely insist on a NMC. We can't give him one because we'll need to protect Edler, Tanev and Gudbranson. So unless Hamhuis steps down from a NMC or agrees to a single year, we literally can't sign him.

I HIGHLY doubt Hamhuis would be insisting on a NMC this summer. Limited NTC maybe, but that doesn't affect the expansion draft.

Could have just signed a 1-year deal with a full NTC (not NMC) with the promise of another year afterwards. I think Linden and Hamhuis have a close enough relationship for them to be able to hash that out with a handshake agreement. That way expansion has no impact on the situation.

Ehh. It'll really depend what we get out of Gudbranson. If I recall, he got partnered with Willie Mitchell in Florida. That's... a death sentence. If he can play at a solid second pairing level, we're better off with him than a year or two of Hamhuis. Much as I love the guy, he's very near the end of his career.

Except we paid a premium for Gudbranson and Hamhuis is free.

And why does Hamhuis take a one year deal with us without exploring his options elsewhere? If Dallas offers 4.5/3yrs, then he's better off taking that deal than hoping injuries don't catch up to him.

Because it's obvious he's desperate to stay here because of family/community reasons.

So now you guys are clamoring for Benning to sign aging vets on the decline. Predictable.

I personally would have like Hamhuis resigned cheap and Sbisa moved out, but just like Jovo, Ohlund, Salo, and Mitchell before him, sometimes you have to let guys walk. Good luck to Hammer, but I'd have no interest in anything longer than 2 years and even that gets dicey with the expansion draft coming.

People wouldn't be upset if:

1) We got something for him at the deadline

or

2) His replacement isn't a terrible player in Sbisa that is making similar money

Another factor people are neglecting: Ben Hutton. He single-handedly pushed Hamhuis to the third pairing. So not only would we be asking him to sign for less than he'll probably get on the market, he'll be getting third pairing minutes. I can't say I'm surprised Hamhuis is exploring his options.

Hutton had a very promising year but to say he was already better all-around than Hamhuis is not true. Maybe it'll happen this upcoming season, but he could hit a bump in the road just like a lot of other young players do just as easily.

We were hoping GM's would ignore his injury, the fact he wasnt 100% healthy, and his season-to-date for those 7-8 solid pre-TDL games and memories of past season play.

The Hamhuis trade possibility died the day he got injured. As posted at the time he got hurt.

We know at least Chicago and Dallas were interested and a few more in the East that Hamhuis wouldn't waive to.

The injury didn't kill the deal.

Hamhuis gave the Canucks a list of 2 teams and Dallas chose to go with Russell instead. They apparently circled back but we don't have any information as to what the circled back offer was except Benning said it didn't make sense. Maybe Dallas wanted the Canucks to take on a contract? And quite frankly if you were discussing a similar deal with Dallas to the Calgary deal then they chose to acquire Russel instead and then came back and said well we are still interested in Hamhuis but we can only offer you this significantly worse deal would you take it? At some point, you have to say forget it. No deal.

It seems some fans fail to grasp the concept of players signing contracts with full NTCs and feel like they should be traded before their contract ends and is mad when that does not happen.

The fact is that Benning did a terrible job of trying to work out a deal.

Like others have said, it's clear he has no negotiation ability in trades.

Look at what Holland did with the Datsyuk contract... figured out a way to give away 7mil cap for free.

A good GM figures it out. Every time Benning makes a bad move (which is almost always) apparently it's not his fault because his hands were tied for one reason or another.

Excuse after excuse.

Time to let him go.

We'd have too many, especially with one (or more) of Juolevi, Stecher and Subban

Players that are years away from the NHL (or might not even make it at all) should have no impact on this signing.

Especially because it'll likely be a shorter deal and they are apparently ruining the rebuild in a stupid attempt to make the playoffs.

Letting Hamhuis walk would be a complete rebuild mode. It'd be easier to swallow if all the other moves they made followed suit, but it's a directionless mixed bag. If Hamhuis is considered too old and it's time to transition into the next core, that's totally fair. But get a draft pick for him, get draft picks for other players, and don't trade away draft picks. Don't do one thing that feeds the rebuild and then do other "win now" moves.
 

VanillaCoke

Registered User
Oct 30, 2013
25,487
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The excuses are just ridiculous baseless nonsense.

Just look at all the worse players traded over the last few years... we got nothing because Benning is bad.
 

thecupismine

Registered User
Apr 1, 2007
2,377
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If the team had any brains at all they would just sign him to a 1-year contract with a full no-movement clause and then put in place a handshake agreement for an extension afterwards. Normally, I'd assume they were just waiting to see how much they could offer him after they do their free agency plunge with Lucic/Eriksson (which I disagree with), but given how stupid this management team is they probably think that our defense will be okay without him and will let him go for nothing.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
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Seems like a pretty misleading title based on the info in OP. Obviously will not be signed before the UFA period opens...but that they're "still working through stuff" sounds like they're still leaving the door open a crack on bringing him back, depending what else happens with Free Agency.

Changed the title to potentially to avoid confusion.
 

Captain Bowie

Registered User
Jan 18, 2012
27,139
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If the team had any brains at all they would just sign him to a 1-year contract with a full no-movement clause and then put in place a handshake agreement for an extension afterwards. Normally, I'd assume they were just waiting to see how much they could offer him after they do their free agency plunge with Lucic/Eriksson (which I disagree with), but given how stupid this management team is they probably think that our defense will be okay without him and will let him go for nothing.

Why would Hamhuis agree to that? He knows full well that a "handshake agreement" is not binding and if he suffers a major injury he is screwed.
 

Bobby Digital

Registered User
Jun 15, 2006
1,435
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I don't understand the anger here. This has pretty much been a forgone conclusion. Look, I am a big believer in getting what you can for a pending UFA you are unlikely to re-sign and so I was extremely disappointed at the deadline, but at the end of the day, you are dealing with two players who had full NTCs who didn't want to go anywhere.

Vrbata reportedly gave Benning a list of 8 teams. None of the 8 teams made an offer. Hamhuis gave the Canucks a list of 2 teams and Dallas chose to go with Russell instead. They apparently circled back but we don't have any information as to what the circled back offer was except Benning said it didn't make sense. Maybe Dallas wanted the Canucks to take on a contract? And quite frankly if you were discussing a similar deal with Dallas to the Calgary deal then they chose to acquire Russel instead and then came back and said well we are still interested in Hamhuis but we can only offer you this significantly worse deal would you take it? At some point, you have to say forget it. No deal.

People like to bring up losing Matthias and Richardson for nothing. The Canucks were in playoff contention. Richardson, if I remember correctly, was injured at the deadline. Matthias was actually a difference maker down the stretch that helped the Canucks make the playoffs. It's not like Benning traded assets for pending UFAs. Teams in playoff contention don't tend to trade away roster players for draft picks at the deadline.

It seems some fans fail to grasp the concept of players signing contracts with full NTCs and feel like they should be traded before their contract ends and is mad when that does not happen.

Vrbata gave a list of teams he knew had no interest in him because his wife was expecting. If we approached him last offseason he would have gave a list of teams that would have been interested. This all came directly from his mouth.

Hamhuis said he was only approached to waive a week before the TDL. If Benning approached him earlier he most likely could have got something done.

It's obvious what happened here. Benning waited to long to decide if he wanted to trade them due to sheer incompetence. Anybody could tell back in December this wasn't a playoff team. Instead he held on and held on and back himself in a corner. The NTC were workable if you listen to what both Vrbata and Hamhuis had to say.

You can look at it any way you want but at the end of the day Benning failed to get anything back for two guys who were willing to waive. Dude just sucks at his job and that's why we weren't able to get anything back. I have no idea how this guy still has a job.
 
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Ace101

Registered User
Apr 2, 2014
435
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If the team had any brains at all they would just sign him to a 1-year contract with a full no-movement clause and then put in place a handshake agreement for an extension afterwards. Normally, I'd assume they were just waiting to see how much they could offer him after they do their free agency plunge with Lucic/Eriksson (which I disagree with), but given how stupid this management team is they probably think that our defense will be okay without him and will let him go for nothing.

Exactly what I was thinking when I heard of the expansion draft. Hammer's game isn't likely to fall off a cliff and he's a great vet (no not Dorsett and Prust like "great"). He can actually be a good mentor to guys like Hutton, Tryamkin, and Juolevi.
 

Cogburn

Pretend they're yachts.
May 28, 2010
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Vancouver
We're hemorrhaging prospects and youth, management is afraid to move veteran players until it's too late, we have management that seems to have it out for fans, and have no direction and mired in mediocraty...you know who fixed this once? Gillis.

We've regressed back to the end of the Nonis/Burke era here. Make the playoffs at all costs, trade the draft picks, overpay for the players you want, use the remaining picks on pet projects (not Juolevi per se), exile players when they exercise their rights, and be just bad enough to get a mediocre pick and miss the playoffs. I fear that's the direction we are in.

Too bad, I really, really, really would prefer Hamhuis to Sbisa, in every facet and category. Sbisa, over the last two seasons, I feel has gotten an insane amount of face time, almost like Benning and Co. are trying to sell us on him, in spite of his on ice play...
 

rune74

Registered User
Oct 10, 2008
9,228
552
We're hemorrhaging prospects and youth, management is afraid to move veteran players until it's too late, we have management that seems to have it out for fans, and have no direction and mired in mediocraty...you know who fixed this once? Gillis.

We've regressed back to the end of the Nonis/Burke era here. Make the playoffs at all costs, trade the draft picks, overpay for the players you want, use the remaining picks on pet projects (not Juolevi per se), exile players when they exercise their rights, and be just bad enough to get a mediocre pick and miss the playoffs. I fear that's the direction we are in.

Too bad, I really, really, really would prefer Hamhuis to Sbisa, in every facet and category. Sbisa, over the last two seasons, I feel has gotten an insane amount of face time, almost like Benning and Co. are trying to sell us on him, in spite of his on ice play...

Really, you are going back to the Gillis days to talk about youth? We are losing assets but we are getting younger as well....we have way more young prospects then we had before Benning. Don't like a lot of his moves, but you can't be serious in saying Gillis "fixed" anything there, matter of fact he left us pretty barren in that department.

I'm curious as to what "pet" projects he's drafted? Boeser? Themko? Virtanen?
 

F A N

Registered User
Aug 12, 2005
18,784
5,988
Vrbata gave a list of teams he knew had no interest in him because his wife was expecting. If we approached him last offseason he would have gave a list of teams that would have been interested. This all came directly from his mouth.
Right...

The NTC were workable if you listen to what... Vrbata... had to say.
Huh? So your argument is that Benning should have traded Vrbata in the offseason? I think that's a separate discussion.

Hamhuis said he was only approached to waive a week before the TDL. If Benning approached him earlier he most likely could have got something done.

It's obvious what happened here. Benning waited to long to decide if he wanted to trade them due to sheer incompetence. Anybody could tell back in December this wasn't a playoff team. Instead he held on and held on and back himself in a corner. The NTC were workable if you listen to what both Vrbata and Hamhuis had to say.

First of all, it's not unusual for GMs to field offers and listen and discuss potential frameworks with teams before asking a player for a list of teams. In fact, teams regularly work out a deal before going to the player and asking him to waive his NTC. Second of all, back in December, Hamhuis got hurt and he didn't come back until less than a month from the trade deadline. You want Benning to ask a guy who at that time can't talk and eat solid foods whether he wants to be traded? And even so, you don't think teams want to see how Hamhuis plays coming back from injury? Lastly, had Benning traded Hamhuis back in December or in February, Benning haters would have criticized him for not trading him near the deadline where prices are expected to be higher.

You can look at it any way you want but at the end of the day Benning failed to get anything back for two guys who were willing to waive. Dude just sucks at his job and that's why we weren't able to get anything back. I have no idea how this guy still has a job.

Benning failed to get anything back for two guys who didn't want to leave. There were numerous reports that Hamhuis was not amenable to waiving his NTC. It was reported that Benning had worked out a deal with Chicago and asked Hamhuis to waive. Hamhuis took too long to make a decision and Chicago moved on. Hamhuis apparently refused Boston. And it took some more time for Hamhuis to even consider Dallas. You said so yourself that Vrbata gave a list of teams that had no interest in him.
 

Trelane

Registered User
Feb 12, 2013
1,987
42
Salusa Secundus
I don't understand the anger here. This has pretty much been a forgone conclusion. Look, I am a big believer in getting what you can for a pending UFA you are unlikely to re-sign and so I was extremely disappointed at the deadline, but at the end of the day, you are dealing with two players who had full NTCs who didn't want to go anywhere.

Vrbata reportedly gave Benning a list of 8 teams. None of the 8 teams made an offer. Hamhuis gave the Canucks a list of 2 teams and Dallas chose to go with Russell instead. They apparently circled back but we don't have any information as to what the circled back offer was except Benning said it didn't make sense. Maybe Dallas wanted the Canucks to take on a contract? And quite frankly if you were discussing a similar deal with Dallas to the Calgary deal then they chose to acquire Russel instead and then came back and said well we are still interested in Hamhuis but we can only offer you this significantly worse deal would you take it? At some point, you have to say forget it. No deal.
...

This is my understanding as well. Not a fan of Weisbrod but his terming the last offer "insulting" and not worthy of reply was correct. Would set a bad precedent of being a pushover. Chicago and Dallas went in a different direction and paid for it with early playoff exits.

However, Nucks can still be faulted for not working on a trade well before the deadline and perhaps not leaning more on Hammer to expend the list if talks were going nowhere, but, ultimately, his NM meant he was fully in charge of the process. I also got the sense the regime was already getting a rep for mercilessly moving players with NM, a fact they were conscious of, and did not want to add to it in this instance. Him being a homeboy, gentleman and pillar of community also had a role. Can't always be slashing and burning.

Emergence of Hutton, acquiring Guddy and now drafting Juolevi, who'll be ready for bottom pairing duty in a year or two at most, makes Hammer's departure a certainty.
 

Intoewsables

Registered User
Jul 30, 2009
5,756
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Toronto
The excuses are just ridiculous baseless nonsense.

Just look at all the worse players traded over the last few years... we got nothing because Benning is bad.

Raphael ****ing Diaz returned a 5th rounder in the worst year to be a seller, but Hamhuis had no value. Seems legit.
 

biturbo19

Registered User
Jul 13, 2010
26,242
11,323
Why would Hamhuis agree to that? He knows full well that a "handshake agreement" is not binding and if he suffers a major injury he is screwed.

The thing may be, how many teams out there are actually going to be willing to give him a multi-year deal that carries through the expansion draft...and the NMC to ensure he doesn't end up in Las Vegas?

Especially when you consider how narrow Hamhuis' list of teams he was interested in going to appeared to be.


Like how many teams out there would Dan Hamhuis be one of their 3 defencemen they want to protect, at this stage in his career? He's still a good player and i'd love to have him back here...but unless he wants a multi-year deal with the risk of being contractually obligated to uproot again from wherever and move to Las Vegas with his family...i'm just not sure what the market will be out there for him on a longer-term deal with expansion protection.

Which is where his best fit might ultimately end up being in Vancouver where he doesn't have to uproot at all...under that sort of 1-year deal with a handshake agreement of future extension potential. He may get out there on the market and realize he's going to be facing something like that with most teams of interest. :dunno:

Expansion could make for some really strange free agency results. Or maybe teams will just ignore it and paint themselves into a corner. You never know i guess. :laugh:
 
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