Speculation: Crawford

[Robsker]

Not to mention Tim Thomas had one of, if not the best goaltending-year ever when he was 38.

Age in-and-of-itself is not a concern for Crawford. Whether or not whatever he's suffering from is something he can bounce back from is.

both age and his health --- and, in addition rust from having not played in so long are all concerns. that is, there is not a single prevailing concern --- but rather there are no less than 3 concerns. Thus, with three issues in view, a return to the Crow of old is less probable than is a return (if he returns) of a diminished Crow. Age is a factor --- as recovery from injury and overcoming rust is typically more difficult for an older guy than is the case for a younger guy. I agree that the "injury" and rust may be bigger factors --- but the age issue is a real one as well.

 

[Pez68]

It wouldn't be my biggest concern.

 

[LordKOTL]

both age and his health --- and, in addition rust from having not played in so long are all concerns. that is, there is not a single prevailing concern --- but rather there are no less than 3 concerns. Thus, with three issues in view, a return to the Crow of old is less probable than is a return (if he returns) of a diminished Crow. Age is a factor --- as recovery from injury and overcoming rust is typically more difficult for an older guy than is the case for a younger guy. I agree that the "injury" and rust may be bigger factors --- but the age issue is a real one as well.

IMHO age is secondary to that because it might affect his healing and his ability to shake off rust, but it's whatever happened to him that is primary. If he didn't get injured, would him being his age in-and-of-itself have been an issue? Likely not--and likely not at any time on his contract because Goalies tend to be viable well into their 30's. Just under half of the 25-games-or-more goalies this past season turned 30 or were older so you can't look at goalies the same as FWDs or D-men, the timeline is different.

Besdies, we signed Ward. I believe he's older than Crawford. The issues with Ward have much less to do with his age and more to do with the fact he's not even average as a goaltender.

 

[Robsker]

Ward was certainly better than average when he was younger. the ravages of age --- it catches up with most.

And... sure the injury (or whatever it is) is primary --- but age certainly is a factor in how well one might recover from that injury. As i said all three -- the injury, the age and the rust act together in making it unlikely for Crow to return as the old Crow. he might, but it is more likely that he returns --- if he returns --- at a level below what we have previously seen.

 

[featherhawk]

hawks should trade of Pickard and then watch him take the starting role if Crow does not return to his old form....

 

[KWP]

[QUOTE="Robsker, post: "... the ravages of age --- it catches up with most. ..."

Catches up w/ all. (And it's a b*tch.)

 

[LordKOTL]

Ward was certainly better than average when he was younger. the ravages of age --- it catches up with most.

And... sure the injury (or whatever it is) is primary --- but age certainly is a factor in how well one might recover from that injury. As i said all three -- the injury, the age and the rust act together in making it unlikely for Crow to return as the old Crow. he might, but it is more likely that he returns --- if he returns --- at a level below what we have previously seen.

Ward had maybe 1 or 2 good seasons, the rest he was Meh. or Sub-Meh. Kinda like Mike "Greg Luganis" Smith except he has a cup win.

 

[Robsker]

[QUOTE="Robsker, post: "... the ravages of age --- it catches up with most. ..."

Catches up w/ all. (And it's a b*tch.)

Oh yes my friend --- I agree --- the ravages of age beats us all. My mind says I am still 30 --- but the 60 year old body I have strongly suggests otherwise.

 

[hawksfan50]

The Ravages of Age issue...ah yes!Probably deserves a thread by itself..but in defense of the "geezers" who are past vest days we can argue plenty of exceptions. ..


As for goalies...they usually have long careers of good for if they are elite....most play well into late 30s ...Crawford is still "young" compared to how well Lundqvist Luongp and others played for several years past his current cafe. .the mysterious health issue plaguing him is Mother matter but to bring ravages of age into being an issue for him is stretching it..

As for the 'special case" for Hawks payers (ie. Add 2 years of age to their real ages because they played so many long playoff series the past 8 of the past 10 seasons...well again they have has a very long time to do summer recovery this summer and then one before..it Ought to gave re-juvebated them.

As for position players vs. Goalies who can keep top for longer it seems, the ravages of Age concerning Toews Keith Seabrook. .. and soon Kane when he gets "overc30" ...well,except for Seabrook whose problem is not age but rather weight /conditioning issues ..he still should be OK till 35 -37 if he was in proper condition ...only Keith has hit 35 ...but if we look to Chara who was still effective defending at his creaking age lady season and if you compare his greatbpkus/minus to Keith lousy effort and terrible -29 last season ,it is more likely you cannot blame a 34 urvold Keith last season using age as an excuse for putrid play.As we all know he is one of the best conditioned athletes in hockey ...so that was no excuse as it is with Seabrook ..Keith's issue is not age..but rather his attitude stink last season..his will to compete vanished and his heart disappeared. His mind and heart were not there ...he played like he was in a fog ...he gave little resistance to stopping any attack or trying to get picks back.He played pitifully but it was not age but lack of will and concentration..as if something else was bothering him..then he makes the insane comment he wants to play to 45..Well nobody will want him to pay even 1 morevyearbifvhe duplicatesbhis poor effort of last season again this season.
But if an older ...much older Chara can still compete hard (albeit with less minutes than in his prime 20s /early 30s),we expect Leith still should compete hard too (albeit like g as Q reduces his minutes to an appropriate level ₩...the age should reduce the minutes. ..of course..but each shift payed should still be showing hard competition..not relaxed foigy half-hearted play ..so I still expect Keith to be "good" if no longer "great"..I do not expect him to stink like last season and refuse to blame it on age ..I still expect 3 -4 more at least "goid"years from such a well conditioned athlete.

As to Toews and Kane..they are still pups ..compare to Eric Staal who after most had said the "ravages of age"had removed him from starring anymore,he has a rebound year after several years of decline ... re-juvenated/motivated again by being traded to Minnesota ...so we get a starry 42 goal season from this supposedly washed up geezer ...Alex Ovechkin the ravages of age supposedly marking his decline..instead plays inspired hockey to score goals and "lead" his team to the glory of cash Cup ...

It would seem the ravages of age as an excuse do not hold water and should not hold water till latte 30s at the earliest ..not the done at 30 excuse we are getting for Hawks core "stars" ...Rather
..health issues /injuries aside...it would seem that motivation/want/professional pride ...the are the key "issues" we Ought to focus on for the famous 4 core ...In Seanrook's case it is not the mond/heart issues that are the concern but a real issue on his weight and conditioning ..he simply cannot move fast enough to be good unless he gets a lot of weight off and ups his conditioning regime. ..But with Toews Kane and Keith ...the issue of motivation and want really are thebpromevissues.If they go Country Club on us ...shame on them ..not age but how badly do they still really really want it?
With Crawford till he got his dizzyness problem and out of lineup ,we saw no isdues with Want and Compete levels. .but we saw Toews show up for maybe 1/4 of the schedule ...22 games of competing hard ...if that..well not good enough for a $3 million player let alone a $10.5! Keith stunk the entire season. ..Not good at all..Kane quit the entire 2nd half after CC went down ..It is 1 thing to quit if you realize your team has no chance ..why exert yourself if it cN hardly impact an outcome, right? But still...that "human response" for most of us in life is an easy cop-out...For highly paid $100. 5 athletes like Kane there ought still to be a professional pride and a realization the teM gave you high pay to give your best...They do not pay $10.5 expecting you to quit and just go through the laziest of efforts to finish shout a 2nd half just because you see your team has zero chance of being on playoffs. THIS lack of motivation reflects on the "leadership by example that bis assumed for key core players who are tour supposed best .

Age is not the issue. ..once they get to agex38 maybe then.. but till then I do not accept it as NY for of excuse for poor play .

 

[CallMeShaft]

People can say what they want about age getting to them, but none of you have it as bad as Fiddy. I mean just look at that above post.

 

[BobbyJet]

I keep reading about Seabs being overweight and out of shape. Is this just speculation based on the product on the ice? Just curious where it is coming from exactly. Personally, I find it difficult to believe that the org would let this happen to any player without some action being taken.

 

[BK]

I keep reading about Seabs being overweight and out of shape. Is this just speculation based on the product on the ice? Just curious where it is coming from exactly. Personally, I find it difficult to believe that the org would let this happen to any player without some action being taken.

I believe it is based on the report that Seabrook changing his focus this offseason to get lighter to get his "speed" back.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

I keep reading about Seabs being overweight and out of shape. Is this just speculation based on the product on the ice? Just curious where it is coming from exactly. Personally, I find it difficult to believe that the org would let this happen to any player without some action being taken.

It was in an athletic article. If I’m recalling correctly it wasn’t saying that he was way out of shape but he’s got a much sharper focus on being in great shape this year and he’s lost some weight.

 

[Pez68]

I keep reading about Seabs being overweight and out of shape. Is this just speculation based on the product on the ice? Just curious where it is coming from exactly. Personally, I find it difficult to believe that the org would let this happen to any player without some action being taken.

Have you met him? Watched him play? Pretty clear he's been out of shape for a couple seasons now.

 

[BobbyJet]

I believe it is based on the report that Seabrook changing his focus this offseason to get lighter to get his "speed" back.

Have you met him? Watched him play? Pretty clear he's been out of shape for a couple seasons now.

The above I know, but folks have been saying this for years about Seabs. Seems quite obvious it is based on their own beliefs and nothing more. I find it difficult to believe a player can play in the NHL and not be in shape. I suspect the reply by Pez68 is par for the course.

I hope he can improve his play by losing weight but it seems to me that the mental mistakes are just as prominent as those caused by physical limitations.

And BTW, I think Seabs poor play is greatly exaggerated here. He just cant play 20+ minutes anymore, and preferably should play outside of the top 4. But I still like his offensive game and should remain on the PP (unlike Keith).

 

[Salvaged Ship]

If only losing weight was going to make a huge difference at this stage. I don’t buy it, he is done. His legs are gone, weight loss at this point might give a very minimal improvement but no matter how much weight he loses the guy is still going to be a slug and continue downward. I love the guy, I appreciate what he has given this franchise, and I don't blame him one bit for signing a dream contract he never should have gotten and we all would have signed. The contract is all on Bowman and management.

 

[LavalPhantom]

I saw a massive difference in my (beer league) play by losing just 10lbs. I went from 165 to 155 so the 10lbs has a bigger impact on me than on Seabs, but let's say he's 15lbs over what he used to be. I have no doubt it can affect his play.

 

[Pez68]

If you are overweight, losing that weight can make a huge difference on the ice.... Stamina, foot speed, agility, speed. And all of that translates to more time to make better decisions(when you're tired, you make poor decisions).

I can attest to this, just like LavalPhantom. I went from 189 to 183 and felt it made a DRASTIC difference in my legs and lungs.

I'm cautiously hopeful it really helps him. I was an advocate of him losing weight even in his prime years.

 

[x Tame Impala]

Don't know how anyone can say that losing 10-20lbs wont make him a player better at this point. Just the wear and tear on his body alone being lessened would be a huge benefit to him IMHO. It's not like he's cruising around throwing huge hits all game now anyway. I'd like to see him be quicker and have a little more endurance. It'd do wonders for him IMHO

 

[AmericanDream]

he also has to do a better job of taking hits...a lot of the younger dmen in the league are NOT going into corners for pucks getting crushed and taking the hit to hold the puck...they are more elusive, side stepping, and trying to out stick-work the opponent for the puck..Seabs has taken thousands of these hits, it doesn't make him any less physical to avoid some hits like this and give his body the chance to play at a healthier level throughout the year..

 

[x Tame Impala]

Agility isn't likely to improve at this stage of his career though. He's never been that type of player and I don't think he ever will be. What myself and others are talking about is him just generally having less weight on him so he can get back to his 2014/2015 levels of endurance and mobility.

 

[AmericanDream]

Agility isn't likely to improve at this stage of his career though. He's never been that type of player and I don't think he ever will be. What myself and others are talking about is him just generally having less weight on him so he can get back to his 2014/2015 levels of endurance and mobility.

agreed, I just want to see him take less unnecessary hits..Seabs doesn't need to turn his back to the rushing player and go into the corner and get hit 100/100 times...at least change it up a bit hahaha

 

[BobbyJet]

agreed, I just want to see him take less unnecessary hits..Seabs doesn't need to turn his back to the rushing player and go into the corner and get hit 100/100 times...at least change it up a bit hahaha

Yeah I hear you but it's a catch-22 for Seabs. Take a hit to make the play which he has done effectively most of his career .... or risk a costly turnover. Problem also that he doesn't seem to be able to absorb those hits as well - another sign of his aging body. Yes, Seabs needs to take a more cerebral approach than he has for most of his career. No easy task when his mobility isn't what it was. Maybe the weight loss will help his game in this regard.

 

[BK]

Hopefully the weight loss buys him the extra .5 to 1 seconded needed.

 

[Pez68]

Seabs could never take a hit. And I mean that quite literally. He is quite possibly the worst NHL player I have ever seen at defending himself and bracing for impact. He might want to try and bend his knees every now and then.