Injury Report: Cowen to have hernia surgery

[Sens Rule]

Actually I don't think the ESPN article is misleading at all. Here is a quote from the wiki page:

"The Wonderlic Cognitive Ability Test (formerly known as the Wonderlic Personnel Test) is a popular group intelligence test used to assess the aptitude of prospective employees for learning and problem-solving in a range of occupations. "

I do agree that whether you call it wonderlic or IQ or shamalaybingbang test, that it only tests a specific portion of a person's intelligence. The point you are missing is that my argument is that the suggestion of these "intelligence tests" should be implemented in the NHL as it is in other sports. I think it would weed out some players, maybe even Cowen as was suggested but shot down by Xspyrate.

Looking forward to the next Xspryte condescending post.

That test is hot garbage.

Actual intellectual tests mean crap.

You would be better off with a sound and a buzzer to press and test reaction time.

A hockey players score on an academic or IQ or math or language test is meaningless.

The difference between reacting in a pro hockey game and Their intelligence in a test like the one described would be irrelevant.

Maybe it might yell you about a QB and his ability to remember plays. But that is a stop/start game. Hockey is flow.

Gretzky is by far the smartest hockey player ever. His hockey smarts likely are like the minds of Einstein and Mozart. Freakish... Off charts. And Gretzky can not really use those smarts even in hockey since he is no longer playing.

There have been a lot of stupid athletes.

Anyway saying Cowen is stupid outside of a hockey game is insulting.

Greening might be the brightest guy on the team. He might be strongest and fastest and have among the hardest shots. Except he has little on-ice hockey IQ compared to NHLers it seems. Gonchar is still playing because he has a high hockey IQ despite being old and slow.

Anyway I think the idea of intelligence tests for players... If as rudimentary as the sample test in this thread... Are utterly pointless.

 

[ChocolateLeclaire]

Actually I don't think the ESPN article is misleading at all. Here is a quote from the wiki page:

"The Wonderlic Cognitive Ability Test (formerly known as the Wonderlic Personnel Test) is a popular group intelligence test used to assess the aptitude of prospective employees for learning and problem-solving in a range of occupations. "

I do agree that whether you call it wonderlic or IQ or shamalaybingbang test, that it only tests a specific portion of a person's intelligence. The point you are missing is that my argument is that the suggestion of these "intelligence tests" should be implemented in the NHL as it is in other sports. I think it would weed out some players, maybe even Cowen as was suggested but shot down by Xspyrate.

Looking forward to the next Xspryte condescending post.

He wasn't condescending in the least. He politely pointed out that ESPN dumbed it down for their audience and gave his reasoning why it can't be considered an IQ test in the traditional sense.

Quoting Wikipedia doesn't help your reasoning due to the fact that since it is open source, many use it as additional marketing to control the definition.

As for the Wonderlic itself, I've had to do it. As others have stated, the questions are easy, but they rapid fire them at you to see how well you answer them under a stressful environment. They use it in the NFL draft to see how well players can process information at high speeds.

 

[Sens Rule]

He wasn't condescending in the least. He politely pointed out that ESPN dumbed it down for their audience and gave his reasoning why it can't be considered an IQ test in the traditional sense.

Quoting Wikipedia doesn't help your reasoning due to the fact that since it is open source, many use it as additional marketing to control the definition.

As for the Wonderlic itself, I've had to do it. As others have stated, the questions are easy, but they rapid fire them at you to see how well you answer them under a stressful environment. They use it in the NFL draft to see how well players can process information at high speeds.

Considering NFLers are in their 20's and should have a degree or 2/3 years of college at least.... If they find this test "stressful"... I would find that funny....

8, 4, 2, 1, 1/2, 1/4

What is the next number?

I mean....

Maybe they should give them a Nintendo DS and have them play Brain Age for 10 minutes?

 

[God Says No]

He wasn't condescending in the least. He politely pointed out that ESPN dumbed it down for their audience and gave his reasoning why it can't be considered an IQ test in the traditional sense.

Quoting Wikipedia doesn't help your reasoning due to the fact that since it is open source, many use it as additional marketing to control the definition.

As for the Wonderlic itself, I've had to do it. As others have stated, the questions are easy, but they rapid fire them at you to see how well you answer them under a stressful environment. They use it in the NFL draft to see how well players can process information at high speeds.

I wasn't saying Bonk is condescending. Bonk is all class. I was speaking of Xspyrate post which seems to have been deleted now.

In any case, I do think the wonderlic has a place in evaluating talent. It's not the be all and end all of evaluation, but it does provide you with more data. Completely dismissing it would be folly. But taking too much stake in it is the same.

It would be interesting to see how well or bad Cowen would do on a test such as that. He seems to be having issues with exactly what this test is trying to test. Quick decisions under a time sensitive situation. How many times you guys have yelled at Cowen to move the puck instead of just standing and looking? I know I have a bunch of times.

 

[guyzeur]

I wasn't saying Bonk is condescending. Bonk is all class. I was speaking of Xspyrate post which seems to have been deleted now.

In any case, I do think the wonderlic has a place in evaluating talent. It's not the be all and end all of evaluation, but it does provide you with more data. Completely dismissing it would be folly. But taking too much stake in it is the same.

It would be interesting to see how well or bad Cowen would do on a test such as that. He seems to be having issues with exactly what this test is trying to test. Quick decisions under a time sensitive situation. How many times you guys have yelled at Cowen to move the puck instead of just standing and looking? I know I have a bunch of times.

Funny you say that because our coaches were complaining that Wiercioch was too slow in his decision making If I recall correctly.

 

[God Says No]

Funny you say that because our coaches were complaining that Wiercioch was too slow in his decision making If I recall correctly.

I think Wier's problem is getting to the puck in time. Once he has it it's ok. At least that's how I remember being phrased by the coaching/management.

The thing is, we have way too many slow puck movers. They are big, but too dang slow.

 

[ChocolateLeclaire]

I wasn't saying Bonk is condescending. Bonk is all class. I was speaking of Xspyrate post which seems to have been deleted now.

In any case, I do think the wonderlic has a place in evaluating talent. It's not the be all and end all of evaluation, but it does provide you with more data. Completely dismissing it would be folly. But taking too much stake in it is the same.

It would be interesting to see how well or bad Cowen would do on a test such as that. He seems to be having issues with exactly what this test is trying to test. Quick decisions under a time sensitive situation. How many times you guys have yelled at Cowen to move the puck instead of just standing and looking? I know I have a bunch of times.

ah, gotcha...

As for the test itself, it does have a place in sports evaluation for sure. But I think too many people think it's a "this guy is dumb" test when the reality is it's more of a "this guy thinks quickly, which is a great trait to have in a QB".

And yes, it would be helpful to see how Cowen would do on that because there were many times that it seemed like he was struggling with the speed of play and processing what to do. That may be a by-product of "over-thinking" though too. I do recall that after his first scratching, Jason Smith distinctly told him to simplify his game.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

I think Wier's problem is getting to the puck in time. Once he has it it's ok. At least that's how I remember being phrased by the coaching/management.

The thing is, we have way too many slow puck movers. They are big, but too dang slow.

Cowen's timing for everything related to hockey is a second late. Wier's timing is inconsistent and he normally has to rush things because his skating doesnt give him any extra time.

If Wier has all the time in the world to make a stetch pass to a skater in motion he will make it tape to tape
If cowen has all the time in the world to make a stretch pass to a skater in motion he'll pass it behind them, infront or pass to hard

He judges things poorly in this sense

 

[guyzeur]

I think Wier's problem is getting to the puck in time. Once he has it it's ok. At least that's how I remember being phrased by the coaching/management.

The thing is, we have way too many slow puck movers. They are big, but too dang slow.

Quote from from Cameron:

"The thing that was missing from Patty's game, from a defensive point of view, is that he moves the puck pretty well, but sometimes when you get offensive guys, that's all they think they have to do," said Cameron. "For Patty, it was just convincing him he has to do things a little bit quicker, he has to be better without the puck, because there's long periods of time you don't have the puck, you have to get it back. And he bought in. Like most young players he got better a little bit at a time, to the point it was never discussed taking him out."

 

[God Says No]

Quote from from Cameron:

"The thing that was missing from Patty's game, from a defensive point of view, is that he moves the puck pretty well, but sometimes when you get offensive guys, that's all they think they have to do," said Cameron. "For Patty, it was just convincing him he has to do things a little bit quicker, he has to be better without the puck, because there's long periods of time you don't have the puck, you have to get it back. And he bought in. Like most young players he got better a little bit at a time, to the point it was never discussed taking him out."

Yeah, so basically what I said. He has to be quicker/better without the puck. Once he has it, it's ok. Cowen has issues whether he has the puck or doesn't. You can put Gryba and Phillips into that category as well with different degrees.

 

[jbeck5]

Maybe the hernia can help explain some of his mediocre play.

I keep waiting for the news that they found a 20 pound weight lodged inside Wiercoch's digestive tract, so as to account for his complete lack of burst/speed.

So he's actually 128 pounds.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I think too many have given up on Cowen for him to have a legit shot with the team next year. His best bet is to find a second chance on another team. Unfortunately, there's a great chance it'll turn out to be another Myers type situation, where the kid looks like a star on another team. At least there aren't enough Cowen fanboys on the boards to go full Silf in the forums for the next two years about it.

I definitely feel he has legit #3-4 defenseman potential. we've seen it enough times int eh past few years. It just won't be with us.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

I think too many have given up on Cowen for him to have a legit shot with the team next year. His best bet is to find a second chance on another team. Unfortunately, there's a great chance it'll turn out to be another Myers type situation, where the kid looks like a star on another team. At least there aren't enough Cowen fanboys on the boards to go full Silf in the forums for the next two years about it.

I definitely feel he has legit #3-4 defenseman potential. we've seen it enough times int eh past few years. It just won't be with us.

I think too many have given up on Cowen for him to have a legit shot with the team next year. His best bet is to find a second chance on another team. Unfortunately, there's a great chance it'll turn out to be another Myers type situation, where the kid looks like a star on another team. At least there aren't enough Cowen fanboys on the boards to go full Silf in the forums for the next two years about it.

I definitely feel he has legit #3-4 defenseman potential. we've seen it enough times int eh past few years. It just won't be with us.

Well it doesnt really matter what we think. I mean people for awhile were saying he was playing like a top 4 dmen when he wasnt. Didnt make him a top 4 dman in the eyes of the team. Based on what Murray said its sounds like he has a lot of faith in him

Myers actually looked good in the NHL at times/years and many buffalo fans were saying he was underrated and going to look much better when traded off a bad team. Myers looked like a star. Then his team sucked and he still looked like the best player on the team. Then he was traded and was good. Theres also a huge difference in the role Cowen and Myers had/have

Great chance is kinda laughable considering were talking about a top pairing dmen who had won the calder and established himself before some injuries set in and the turned to crap. Cowen is in a top 4 situation and struggled mighty on a playoff team


Theres a huge difference in Myers and Cowen's situation
One is a top pairing former calder winner who had some injury issues on a team that is not only a non playoff team but the worst team in the league...The other is a struggling top 4 dman going through injuries on a playoff team that got better once he left the line up two years in a row

comments like this blow my mind because hes shown nothing outside not sucking as a 4/5 dman as a rookie. Since then we've watched him fail terribly. I mean Myers didnt look terrible most of the time he was in buffalo despite his stats. If he did people would value him like Cowen

 

[Ice-Tray]

Well it doesnt really matter what we think. I mean people for awhile were saying he was playing like a top 4 dmen when he wasnt. Didnt make him a top 4 dman in the eyes of the team. Based on what Murray said its sounds like he has a lot of faith in him

Myers actually looked good in the NHL at times/years and many buffalo fans were saying he was underrated and going to look much better when traded off a bad team. Myers looked like a star. Then his team sucked and he still looked like the best player on the team. Then he was traded and was good. Theres also a huge difference in the role Cowen and Myers had/have

Great chance is kinda laughable considering were talking about a top pairing dmen who had won the calder and established himself before some injuries set in and the turned to crap. Cowen is in a top 4 situation and struggled mighty on a playoff team


Theres a huge difference in Myers and Cowen's situation
One is a top pairing former calder winner who had some injury issues on a team that is not only a non playoff team but the worst team in the league...The other is a struggling top 4 dman going through injuries on a playoff team that got better once he left the line up two years in a row

comments like this blow my mind because hes shown nothing outside not sucking as a 4/5 dman as a rookie. Since then we've watched him fail terribly. I mean Myers didnt look terrible most of the time he was in buffalo despite his stats. If he did people would value him like Cowen

Your mind would likely be less blown if you were to remember that all of this is merely your subjective opinion, and not a general fact.

Other people unsurprisingly have differing subjective opinions. Perhaps THIS fact will blow your mind...

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

Your mind would likely be less blown if you were to remember that all of this is merely your subjective opinion, and not a general fact.

Other people unsurprisingly have differing subjective opinions. Perhaps THIS fact will blow your mind...

Lol you are totally right...my mistake. As someone who regularly makes a point of saying these types of things are subjective i look like a hypocrite lol

 

[Ice-Tray]

Lol you are totally right...my mistake. As someone who regularly makes a point of saying these types of things are subjective i look like a hypocrite lol

Haha, no worries, I just wanted to look clever on the internet...

 

[Tnouc Alucard]

the 200 Game mark is a big one for Dmen - remember when everyone was saying that Hedmond was a bust as a #2 overall and the Bolts should of taken Duchesne?

Ottawa and Cowen should make it the goal that he reaches 300 games this year, that means a full season and 2 playoff rounds - I think he takes another big step this season and becomes a solid top 4.

Ottawas biggest step forward this year is not trades, it's guys like Cowen, Lazar, Pageau, Stone, Hoffman all being better players,.

I know this sounds crazy but Cowen could play at a Norris level this season, he could be Seabrooke type of Dman for us, he has the leadership and the competitive ability, he just needs to put it all together.

Denis Potvin has said (many times) when he was the colour man for Sens local TV broadcasts that Dmen need to play "at least 300 NHL games before you know what you have"...........Cowen has played 212, and the injuries and recovery time may push his number a little higher.

The Islanders gave up on Chara after only playing 231 NL games, so I'm with you on keeping Cowen, and not tossing him away like most people seem to want to do.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

Denis Potvin has said (many times) when he was the colour man for Sens local TV broadcasts that Dmen need to play "at least 300 NHL games before you know what you have"...........Cowen has played 212, and the injuries and recovery time may push his number a little higher.

The Islanders gave up on Chara after only playing 231 NL games, so I'm with you on keeping Cowen, and not tossing him away like most people seem to want to do.

Dont trade Boro, Gryba, Wier, Ceci?

Dont trade or let walk any of our AHL dmen without playing them 300 games in the NHL?

 

[Tnouc Alucard]

Cowen has had four years to establish himself and has not done so. To wait another three years on the off chance he can is misusing a valuable roster spot.

All these guys we are drafting need that spot. Wideman is ready now, then there is Claesson, Wikstrand, Englund, Harper,a shot what they can do.

Done with Cowen - get something for him and move on. If he needs another three years, let someone else invest the roster spot and salary while he works his issues out.

Wideman is an UFA, I believe.

Cowen has only played 212 games in the NHL, and Many NHL experts including Denis Potvin have said that you need to give young NHL D'men at least 300 games inthe NHL before you know what you have.

The Islanders gave up on Chara after 231 games, what a huge mistake that was for them.

 

[Spezza]

And the fact he made it to 212, lets you know he isn't the next Boris Valabik either!

 

[Xamar*]

Wideman is an UFA, I believe.

Cowen has only played 212 games in the NHL, and Many NHL experts including Denis Potvin have said that you need to give young NHL D'men at least 300 games inthe NHL before you know what you have.

The Islanders gave up on Chara after 231 games, what a huge mistake that was for them.

Mike Milbury. But yea I get what you mean you have a good point. I don't think Chara was Cowen bad tho ..

 

[SanderSen]

Mike Milbury. But yea I get what you mean you have a good point. I don't think Chara was Cowen bad tho ..

He was a no thought extra piece to toss into the Yashin trade, there was not angst from Isle on losing him in the trade. With the ongoing injuries it is hard to compare the two as Cowen actually has better early career accomplishments. Chara has an incredible capacity to work and has adapted his game through his career to become better - which has led to his success.

The outcome of this latest surgery will be important for Cowen, just wish the team had sent him right away, even before the season ended.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Mike Milbury. But yea I get what you mean you have a good point. I don't think Chara was Cowen bad tho ..

He wasn't very good. Mostly considered a third pair goonish defenseman with a bit of upside.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

He wasn't very good. Mostly considered a third pair goonish defenseman with a bit of upside.

sounds a little like Boro. NOBODY SUGGEST TRADING BORO BEFORE 300 GAMES

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

Cowen hasn't quite lived up to expectations has he? Got to think we look at trading him once we know he's over this hernia surgery.

Who's going to want him?