GDT: CGY @ COL: A Song of Ice & Fire (9:30 ET / 7:30 MT)

[Bender]

George is a problem. I like Prosvetov but he is a work in progress.

Goalie is officially a problem.

Goaltending becomes a problem when the rest of the team is playing really well but the goalie can't make a save to give them a chance to win OR lets in bad goals to let other teams take the lead or control of a game over a long stretch of games.

That's CLEARLY NOT what's happening right now. The team is not playing well enough. Our star players are not playing 60 minutes or even close to that right now.

The 1st goal was all Rantanen's turnover in the middle of the ice. The 2nd goal was terrible defensive coverage by Ryjo (but also Byram was behind the net). The 3rd goal was tipped by Makar because 'apparently goaltending is TOO EASY so you have to have your own players tip puck on their own goaltender'... (not a strong play by Cale and I think he'd admit that). The 4th goal was a mid-air tip and the 5th goal was a backdoor pass that Makar should have seen coming, if he had covered his man. That happened 4-on-4, you'd think we'd have the advantage.

So then in the 3rd, our stars actually show up and play hard and we get the win. If I'm Bednar (or if Bednar is like me) - the only thing positive out of that game last night is the 2 points in the standings. I'll give credit to the 3rd and 4th lines for their effort and secondary scoring as well but if we keep playing like that overall as a team, we're going to lose 9 times out of 10. It's the stars of this team that set the pace and lead by example. If they think they can consistently play 20 minutes and win on a regular basis, they're going to need a massive wake-up call.

Also, I'm not sure I've EVER seen a hockey game played by professionals with as many 'whiffs on shots and passes' then the Avs had last night. Has to be an NHL record there for sure. Did the equipment manager bet against the Avs and grease up their sticks or something?? WTF?

It's a lack of attention to detail and an overall lack of focus from the majority of the top players on the team.

 

[Bender]

What an adventure of a game. That was like a half season's worth of drama in one game.

Opening seconds and Colton lays a huge clean hit in the corner to draw a penalty. Then they control the play for the most part but Toews makes another terrible turnover and they go down 1-0.

Then Tatar scores a huge emotional goal for his first of the season pumping up the bench and the crowd. Then Cale scores on a bomb from a nice new PP setup.

Then Manson is a little late to get to Kadri and RJ loses his man in the slot and the Flames tie it 2-2.

Then Coleman scores from far out to re take the lead on a shot that looked like it did tip off Cale's stick to me, which the broadcast didn't pick up on. It started wobbling after it went past the stick. Still think Georgiev needs to give them a save there though, because the tip came from far out, and it went 7 hole.

Then Meyers scores a bit of an emotional goal for himself to tie the game again, on his first callup of the year, obviously hoping to stick in the NHL.

Then Toews plays the front of the net soft again, and doesn't take the body or tie up Zary's stick, who then bats the puck out of the air to make it 4-3 Flames again.

Then Nate is a little too soft covering his assignment around the net and Cale gets caught puck watching and forgets for a moment about his man back door, and the Flames go up 5-3.

Then Georgiev gets pulled to start the 3rd.

Then Byram makes a nice poised play to gather the puck and set up Manson for a bomb, which bounces off two feet and goes to Colton beside the net for a huge 5-4 goal.

Then Bednar puts Byram and Makar together, who make a couple of nice give and go plays in their own end to jump start Byram on the rush, who gains the zone, cuts to the middle, and nicely sets up Cale who dances around his man and fires a shot for Mikko and Val to find a way to bat in with their lunch pales in front of the net for a massive 5-5 goal.

Then all five guys get in on the GWG. Bo runs a little subtle interference to buy Cale a tad bit more time chasing down the dump in, Cale send the puck around for Mikko, who makes a great pass all the way from the halfway to the blueline, where Val makes an incredible pass while taking the hit to make the play, and Nate goes in and you could just tell he was not going to be denied on that shot to put them ahead after all they'd been through.

What. A. Game. Feed off this one and keep her going boys.

Calgary Flames - Colorado Avalanche - Dec 11, 2023 | NHL.com

NHL Gamecenter - Calgary Flames vs. Colorado Avalanche, Dec 11, 2023 - summary, stats, boxscore, play by play, recap and more.

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How is that Toews' terrible turnover? The pass actually GETS THROUGH to Rantanen who fobbles it TWICE and then is too lazy to actually move his legs to try and backcheck.

But sure, it's Toews' fault for making sure there wasn't a big, mean flames player in the vincinity to steal the puck from 96.

 

[Ceremony]

I hope Lehky's dad bags on Ryjo before next game

Get him to have a go at Georgiev. Either we get a goalie who can stop a beach ball or we get something much more entertaining.

 

[JLo217]

Goaltending becomes a problem when the rest of the team is playing really well but the goalie can't make a save to give them a chance to win OR lets in bad goals to let other teams take the lead or control of a game over a long stretch of games.

That's CLEARLY NOT what's happening right now. The team is not playing well enough. Our star players are not playing 60 minutes or even close to that right now.

The 1st goal was all Rantanen's turnover in the middle of the ice. The 2nd goal was terrible defensive coverage by Ryjo (but also Byram was behind the net). The 3rd goal was tipped by Makar because 'apparently goaltending is TOO EASY so you have to have your own players tip puck on their own goaltender'... (not a strong play by Cale and I think he'd admit that). The 4th goal was a mid-air tip and the 5th goal was a backdoor pass that Makar should have seen coming, if he had covered his man. That happened 4-on-4, you'd think we'd have the advantage.

So then in the 3rd, our stars actually show up and play hard and we get the win. If I'm Bednar (or if Bednar is like me) - the only thing positive out of that game last night is the 2 points in the standings. I'll give credit to the 3rd and 4th lines for their effort and secondary scoring as well but if we keep playing like that overall as a team, we're going to lose 9 times out of 10. It's the stars of this team that set the pace and lead by example. If they think they can consistently play 20 minutes and win on a regular basis, they're going to need a massive wake-up call.

Also, I'm not sure I've EVER seen a hockey game played by professionals with as many 'whiffs on shots and passes' then the Avs had last night. Has to be an NHL record there for sure. Did the equipment manager bet against the Avs and grease up their sticks or something?? WTF?

It's a lack of attention to detail and an overall lack of focus from the majority of the top players on the team.

Overall I agree. But they also aren't getting shut out. I'd argue in that of the last 7 games the Avs should've won 3-4 more of them. Especially if goaltending can stop some obvious saves, cut some of the rebounds down and the defense plays a bit tighter.

The main team adjustment that's needed is getting back better. So many odd man rushes against right now. I think the play style doesn't fit with some of the new players. Ryjo isn't a rush guy. That said teams have also figured out how to jump the Avs on a rush and go the other way.

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

Spoiler alert: he hasn't

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https://twitter.com/search?q=%40hockeystatcards%20%23GoAvsGo&src=typed_query&f=live

thats surprising, but imagine what potential he has, if he is playing badly now? Of course you could argue Toews and Byram are both bad at the moment.

 

[Ararana]

thats surprising, but imagine what potential he has, if he is playing badly now? Of course you could argue Toews and Byram are both bad at the moment.

To me the numbers are showing I think we see Byram overtake Toews sooner than even I was expecting. Toews has has been under the radar shit for a year and half.

Byram needs to find consistency in his play and eliminate the low lows and he'll leave Toews in the dust.

 

[henchman21]

We are way too soft on George...

 

[forsbergavs32]

We are way too soft on George...

George is way too soft on goals

 

[Ararana]

George is way too soft on goals

George is not too soft on Malinski

 

[LOFIN]

We are way too soft on George...

I've seen plenty of (justified) criticism for him this season.

 

[dahrougem2]

At even strength last night the Avs had more scoring chances 31-27 but less high danger chances (14-11 Flames). The 2nd period was a disaster. 9 of Calgary's 14 high danger chances came in that period.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

We are way too soft on George...

Dude's new haircut is a disaster. He should shave it all off. And feel bad. There.

 

[Bender]

We are way too soft on George...

I don't know about soft. I don't think he's played particularly well but I also don't think he's given up bad goals and our defensive structure's been sound. It hasn't. The goals that are going in are mostly self-inflicted from bad turnovers in our own zone. When George has been on and playing well, he's saving our bacon from those... lately he hasn't been. That's my take on it.

 

[henchman21]

I've seen plenty of (justified) criticism for him this season.

We still have a lot of people just giving him a complete pass despite being a bottom 10 starter. He was a major reason for the Seattle series loss and he’s a major reason for struggles this year. It is very hard to win consistently when a goalie gives up a soft goal every other or every game.

I don't know about soft. I don't think he's played particularly well but I also don't think he's given up bad goals and our defensive structure's been sound. It hasn't. The goals that are going in are mostly self-inflicted from bad turnovers in our own zone. When George has been on and playing well, he's saving our bacon from those... lately he hasn't been. That's my take on it.

There are breakdowns on even the best teams. Thats what you need goalies for. All the data says that George is getting somewhere between top 5 and 10 easiest minutes and giving a bottom 10 performance. Its simply not good enough.

 

[LOFIN]

We still have a lot of people just giving him a complete pass despite being a bottom 10 starter. He was a major reason for the Seattle series loss and he’s a major reason for struggles this year. It is very hard to win consistently when a goalie gives up a soft goal every other or every game.

I don't see it, the majority have been critical of him. I also don't see how he was the reason for the Seattle loss. That series was lost on the lack of depth scoring, injuries and a suspension.

 

[Balthazar]

We are way too soft on George...

He’s paid bottom tier starter money and plays like a bottom tier starter. We knew what we were getting.

 

[Ceremony]

I don't read every post but there's much more criticism of Georgiev on here than excuses.

 

[henchman21]

I don't see it, the majority have been critical of him. I also don't see how he was the reason for the Seattle loss. That series was lost on the lack of depth scoring, injuries and a suspension.

We have @Bender giving him a pass on this page.

Against Seattle he was giving up a soft goal in nearly every game. As tight as the series was, that could be argued was the difference.

He’s paid bottom tier starter money and plays like a bottom tier starter. We knew what we were getting.

He’s paid that because he wasn’t an established starter. He got the high end of a backup traded to take over a starting job contract.

In the Avs system, any half decent goalie should be giving at least average results. The Avs aren’t getting that.

 

[S E P H]

Based on how Rantanen has looked the last three weeks; slow, weak, and lazy, I don't think Ismo's comments are wrong at all...

 

[chet1926]

Goaltending becomes a problem when the rest of the team is playing really well but the goalie can't make a save to give them a chance to win OR lets in bad goals to let other teams take the lead or control of a game over a long stretch of games.

That's CLEARLY NOT what's happening right now. The team is not playing well enough. Our star players are not playing 60 minutes or even close to that right now.

The 1st goal was all Rantanen's turnover in the middle of the ice. The 2nd goal was terrible defensive coverage by Ryjo (but also Byram was behind the net). The 3rd goal was tipped by Makar because 'apparently goaltending is TOO EASY so you have to have your own players tip puck on their own goaltender'... (not a strong play by Cale and I think he'd admit that). The 4th goal was a mid-air tip and the 5th goal was a backdoor pass that Makar should have seen coming, if he had covered his man. That happened 4-on-4, you'd think we'd have the advantage.

So then in the 3rd, our stars actually show up and play hard and we get the win. If I'm Bednar (or if Bednar is like me) - the only thing positive out of that game last night is the 2 points in the standings. I'll give credit to the 3rd and 4th lines for their effort and secondary scoring as well but if we keep playing like that overall as a team, we're going to lose 9 times out of 10. It's the stars of this team that set the pace and lead by example. If they think they can consistently play 20 minutes and win on a regular basis, they're going to need a massive wake-up call.

Also, I'm not sure I've EVER seen a hockey game played by professionals with as many 'whiffs on shots and passes' then the Avs had last night. Has to be an NHL record there for sure. Did the equipment manager bet against the Avs and grease up their sticks or something?? WTF?

It's a lack of attention to detail and an overall lack of focus from the majority of the top players on the team.

1st goal, turnover, yes. Was the play readable and the shot saveable, yes. That's on George. Sometimes you've got help you're teammates out after a turnover. This was a perfect example of not making a save on a saveable shot. Turnover or not.

2nd goal, not great defense. That's on team defense.

3rd goal was atrocious. Makar absolutely didn't tip it. And even if he did it was very minute and that's a mile away from the goal on an 75-80mph wrister, George has to make this save. Simply inexcusable.

4th goal terrible rebound given by George, that's on him.

5th goal is not on him, bad defense.

The fact is 3 of the goals he gave up need to be saves.

We played good enough team defense last night to be in the 2-3 goals against range. Not 5.

 

[LOFIN]

We have @Bender giving him a pass on this page.

Against Seattle he was giving up a soft goal in nearly every game. As tight as the series was, that could be argued was the difference.

If one person says it, that doesn't make it a popular opinion. And yes, Georgiev wasn't great in that series but I still think our problems was the lack of scoring.

 

[henchman21]

If one person says it, that doesn't make it a popular opinion. And yes, Georgiev wasn't great in that series but I still think our problems was the lack of scoring.

There are plenty of posts when this comes up. I don’t know if it is the majority, but there are a number just willing to let his play slide.

With how the series played out, a reasonable argument could be made that the Avs win the series if the goalies were swapped.

 

[wayninja]

We have @Bender giving him a pass on this page.

Against Seattle he was giving up a soft goal in nearly every game. As tight as the series was, that could be argued was the difference.


He’s paid that because he wasn’t an established starter. He got the high end of a backup traded to take over a starting job contract.

In the Avs system, any half decent goalie should be giving at least average results. The Avs aren’t getting that.

FIRE BENDER!

 

[Bender]

FIRE BENDER!

I deserve to be FIRED...

OUT OF A CANNON...

TOWARDS THE SUN!!!!!!!!!

 

[Karjala609]

NHL-tähdet sparraavat toisiaan Turussa – 82 ottelun maraton asettaa kovan vaatimustason kesäharjoittelulle - Suomen Olympiakomitea

NHL-jääkiekkoilijoiden kausi alkaa vasta lokakuun puolessavälissä, mutta edellytykset menestyneelle kaudelle luodaan juuri nyt. Myös jääharjoittelulla on kesällä iso merkitys – ja Turussa paikalliset NHL-pelaajat hakevat vaatimustasoa ja mielekkyyttä harjoitteluun yhdessä kokeneen valmentajan...

www.olympiakomitea.fi

There is interesting article from 2021 where Ismo Lehkonen is running on ice training for Finnish NHLers during summer time in Finland. Players include Artturi, Rasmus Ristolainen, Mikko Rantanen, Mikko Lehtonen and Kaapo Kähkönen. It says on the article that Ismo does on ice training with those players whole summer. I believe Ismo has been doing that regularly for many years already.

I don't know if Rantanen trained with Ismo last summer but he has for sure on previous years. So it could be that Ismo actually knows something about when he was talking about Mikko's summer training on Finnish media. Or maybe not, I have no idea.