GDT: CGY @ COL: A Song of Ice & Fire (9:30 ET / 7:30 MT)

SirLoinOfCloth

Registered User
Apr 22, 2019
5,943
12,079
Colorado
George has not been great, but the hate here is out of control. The vast majority of goals he has let in have been because of defensive breakdowns. We're a mess defensively right now. Too many odd-man situations; too many turnovers in our own zone; too many missed clearing attempts; too many seam passes allowed; too much time given to players in front of the net.

Georgiev is not the problem, he's part of the problem and needs to tighten up, but the team defense is a bigger concern.
 

Foppa2118

Registered User
Oct 3, 2003
52,339
31,499
How is that Toews' terrible turnover? The pass actually GETS THROUGH to Rantanen who fobbles it TWICE and then is too lazy to actually move his legs to try and backcheck.

But sure, it's Toews' fault for making sure there wasn't a big, mean flames player in the vincinity to steal the puck from 96.

It barely got through but got broken up by the Flames player, and there was no Av even around where Toews was passing anyway.

Not sure who he was even passing to, everyone was on their way rushing up ice, and he passed it behind them. It was just a very slow telegraphed pass at his blueline that was easy to pick off. Opposition easily could have just grabbed the puck for a breakaway.

It's the main reason for the goal. Any time there's a turnover at your own blueline it causes chaos and breakdowns, because nobody is expecting it. Mikko fumbled it, but he wouldn't have been in that position if Devon put the puck on his tape.

It's also another example of soft play from Toews. He felt the pressure coming from the Flame player and rushed the pass. He was also too soft on his net front coverage for Zary's goal. It's become a bad habit of his.

It's mostly terrible though because of the context. This happens almost every game now with Toews and it was another turnover that happened after they had been playing better than the other team, only to shoot themselves in the foot and give up the first goal.

If Toews was wearing #4 this year he'd be covered in tar and feathers.
 
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henchman21

Mr. Meeseeks
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Feb 24, 2012
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The way the fanbase is acting Georgiev should be blamed both for not being Andrei Vasilevskiy and not stopping the Avs from allowing dangerous passes to connect with no pressure. Lack of goalie literacy going around.
It isn’t about being Vasi… it is about being average. He’s just been far below average. So many here are in the bottom third of starters.

 
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Foppa2118

Registered User
Oct 3, 2003
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Cale Makar doing his best Tyson Barrie impression last night. Bo back on top.



I thought Bo was fantastic in this game. Even before seeing the analytics I thought he was the best D last night.

Cale had the goal and some nice O zone plays, but he also made some mistakes. So did Toews again. So did Manson. So did Malinski, though I thought he played well overall.

Bo played solid defense all night, and was creating some offensive plays with his rushes. I think the only other D that didn't really make a mistake was JJ, but he played a lesser role.

Just in general the entire D core has been very mistake prone this year, but for some reason we only talk about 22 year old Byram's mistakes.
 
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Foppa2118

Registered User
Oct 3, 2003
52,339
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The way the fanbase is acting Georgiev should be blamed both for not being Andrei Vasilevskiy and not stopping the Avs from allowing dangerous passes to connect with no pressure. Lack of goalie literacy going around.

There's been plenty of criticism of George too. It just hasn't been super negative because only super negative people would criticize his performance that way.

He's mostly guilty of not making the big saves this year. Softies here and there, but there haven't been a bunch of egregious goals or anything. He even started the year looking better than last year.

And his sub par play coincides with the sub par play of the rest of the team. It's not like the team has been playing well, and he's the reason they're losing. But he does need to play better. That can't be denied.
 

Foppa2118

Registered User
Oct 3, 2003
52,339
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Wasn't it Mangiapane who swung at Georgiev and Kadri simply happened to be in the line of fire?

Yeah and then he skated behind the net while Kadri moved to where he was just standing while George wasn't looking. He most likely thought Kadri was the one that poked at him.

George had the puck covered and Mangiapane skated up and poked at it. That always draws a reaction. And it should.

I don't have any issue with his reaction there. Shows he has some fight in him, even when things aren't going well. You want that in a goalie.
 
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John Mandalorian

2022 Avs: The First Dance
Nov 29, 2018
10,947
6,738
The thing about Georgiev is that he’s at a very reasonable salary. So on one hand, you’re grateful he’s not Campbell and paid a lot to be awful. But on the other hand, he doesn’t make so much that he shouldn’t be held accountable for his performance by giving the net to the backup if he’s not getting it done.
 

Foppa2118

Registered User
Oct 3, 2003
52,339
31,499
The thing here is, while we have a tendency to call Mikko lazy because of his style of play, and while he never does optional skates, I bet that questioning his effort in summer training hit a nerve because he has been known to work out like crazy during the summers. Didn't he at least used to always be in the best shape when the physicals were done before training camp? At least that's what was said a few years ago, he has been the best since his rookie season. And I think, in his mind, Rantanen thinks that Ismo should know that as well.

Yeah, I bet it probably hurt more that it was coming from Ismo, rather than some random member of the media. Mikko doesn't just know Lehky he knows his dad as well. They grew up together and Ismo brought him chocolates last year.

I took Mikko's comments as a semi friendly, "leave my name outa your mouth" kind of comment. Like a shot across the bow so he doesn't continue to question his work ethic the way he might other players.

Even if that's a bit of a double standard from how Ismo normally handles things with his job, that's what friends kind of expect from one another.
 

Foppa2118

Registered User
Oct 3, 2003
52,339
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Also, I think Mikko was just trying to circumvent actually saying "Lehkonen". Heat of the moment thing, it's obvious who he referring to, but I think that was his intention.

Yeah Mikko was just trying not to drag his buddy into it.
 

littletonhockeycoach

NOT the Hanson Bros.....
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Oct 26, 2008
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It’s just not good for the entire team. It really isn’t when it comes to chemistry. His dad was a f***ing idiot for saying that.
Agree but Mack throws a lot shit at his team mates as well with his moping and nutrition standards and insistence on perfect passes in practice, etc..

I'm thinking this is just the current locker room w/o the maturity of a Gabe and EJ present.

It might burn them but it might also be their way of holding each other accountable. (?)

George has not been great, but the hate here is out of control. The vast majority of goals he has let in have been because of defensive breakdowns. We're a mess defensively right now. Too many odd-man situations; too many turnovers in our own zone; too many missed clearing attempts; too many seam passes allowed; too much time given to players in front of the net.

Georgiev is not the problem, he's part of the problem and needs to tighten up, but the team defense is a bigger concern.
People always want simple answers to complex multi-variant problems.
 
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SB

Registered User
Mar 9, 2004
2,182
192
Colorado
George was better last year, I want old George back.
He was so good the first bunch of games this season, too. Better than last year. But then so was everyone else.

They aren't robots. I remember the Avs of the early 2000s (post-2001 cup) doing a little of this. They seemed bored with the regular season and just wanted to get to playoffs.

And yes, most of all, they miss Gabe and EJ (let's keep him tomorrow; don't have to play him, just in the locker room).
 
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expatriatedtexan

Habitual Line Stepper
Aug 17, 2005
16,712
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He was so good the first bunch of games this season, too. Better than last year. But then so was everyone else.

They aren't robots. I remember the Avs of the early 2000s (post-2001 cup) doing a little of this. They seemed bored with the regular season and just wanted to get to playoffs.

And yes, most of all, they miss Gabe and EJ (let's keep him tomorrow; don't have to play him, just in the locker room).
Screw it, I'm in.

RyJo for EJ, LFG!!!!
 

Gigantor The Goalie

Speak for the Goalies
Feb 4, 2012
13,078
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New London
It isn’t about being Vasi… it is about being average. He’s just been far below average. So many here are in the bottom third of starters.


I deal with stats on a daily basis and I get it. I'm not going to claim his stats look pretty. When it comes to goaltending though, public stats specifically, just are not advanced enough to capture what's happening. When his stats are looking this weird that's when you start to look at what's happening in these games. The Avs are allowing chances that don't play into Georgiev's strengths the same way when the Oilers were losing they weren't having breakdowns that favoured how Skinner played. The Avs have a 6' 1" goalie in net, they can't afford to give up time and space to allow shooters to pick their spots. They can't afford to allow passes that take advantage of how aggressive they want Georgiev to play because as fast as Georgiev is he's not big and fast enough to get over to make the saves they're now asking him to make. If you're going to spend 3M on your 1G, you better play to his strengths at least somewhat. They're not and that's why the stats look so funky. Same thing happened in Buffalo with Devon Levi. Buffalo was just allowing opposing teams to have easy access to the most dangerous passes and as a result Levi goes to the AHL. He comes back up and the Sabres have learned how to play better defensively and Levi's numbers look better. This season is really testing the limits of what public data can show us.

AllStats (65).png
 

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