Post-Game Talk: Cats 3, Pens 2 OT | At Least We Got a Point

[EightyOne]

Sid-Guentzel-Letang---all offense
Bjugstad-Kessel-Dumoulin---offense with some defense
Cullen-Rust-Pettersson---mostly defense/quick strike/hold the line until the other lines can come back out
...rotate until a goal. eh?

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

At this point, I just don't even know what to say. They follow up an embarrassing 4-0 loss to Carolina with that kind of effort tonight?

How many "closed door meetings" does this team need? At what point do they actually start looking like they have even a semblance of structure to their game?

 

[Pancakes]

I don't have a lot of faith we beat Tampa or Philly on the road. I bet two games from now we're on the outside looking in.

Boy I hope I'm wrong, but I've got a bad feeling.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I don't have a lot of faith we beat Tampa or Philly on the road. I bet two games from now we're on the outside looking in.

Boy I hope I'm wrong, but I've got a bad feeling.

I hope you're right. Maybe something drastic like sitting outside a playoff spot will get JR to actually fix the damn defense instead of hoarding and swapping out as many forwards he possibly can.

 

[Vyruz Reaper]

this is amazing stat. I thought Sid has been playing some of the best hockey of his life, jake on fire and he is only +2, no wonder why we suck

It's probably that low because of all the shorties our PP is giving up lol

 

[canadianguy77]

Some people complain about peripheral issues a bit much. OT line combos? Really? It’s three on three with a star on the ice at almost all times.. they should win anyway. How about getting generally outplayed and deserving to lose to a perennial loser?

And some people complain that this is all about the defensive personnel not being able to get the puck up the ice.

While there's a lot of truth to that, there are also major issues with forwards getting the puck through the NZ even when they get it in a timely manner, and sustaining pressure when they have the puck in the offensive zone.

There are major coaching issues with this team, and my complaining about the OT was only another example of why it's probably time for some changes.

This staff needs some fresh eyes to not only objectively evaluate the talent they have, but they also need some new ideas on how to play a more structured game that will fit with that talent.

 

[Turin]

This team was a really good possession team every year under Sully besides this one and 17. In 17 they were good defensively still, this year they’re terrible. If you look at the D rosters.. that makes complete sense. It’s not coaching.

 

[EightyOne]

This team was a really good possession team every year under Sully besides this one and 17. In 17 they were good defensively still, this year they’re terrible. If you look at the D rosters.. that makes complete sense. It’s not coaching.

Indeed. This slide began in 2017. I think the 2nd Cup was PURE luck. Which is in stark, stark contrast to the 2016 team which was executing hockey at an early 80s Soviet vs a bantam team level against the rest of the league. They were SOOOOOO good at everything. 2017 some question marks emerged but the overall success hid them well. Last year the hens came home to roost and it has returned this year.

The strangest part is the roster should be stronger today than most of the last 24 months, yet, here they are. Looking like fools too many nights.

 

[Turin]

Indeed. This slide began in 2017. I think the 2nd Cup was PURE luck. Which is in stark, stark contrast to the 2016 team which was executing hockey at an early 80s Soviet vs a bantam team level against the rest of the league. They were SOOOOOO good at everything. 2017 some question marks emerged but the overall success hid them well. Last year the hens came home to roost and it has returned this year.

The strangest part is the roster should be stronger today than most of the last 24 months, yet, here they are. Looking like fools too many nights.

17 was luckier but it wasn’t pure luck. That was a good counter attack team and was good at bending/not breaking, but the possession was killed because no Letang. Last year they were a really good team and probably 3 peat if not for injuries, though there were goalie/Letang issues. This year they have no Schultz and downgraded the D further by going from Cole to JJ.

 

[canadianguy77]

This team was a really good possession team every year under Sully besides this one and 17. In 17 they were good defensively still, this year they’re terrible. If you look at the D rosters.. that makes complete sense. It’s not coaching.

What do the defenseman have to do with our forwards running into one another and passing the puck to the other team in the NZ? At this point our dmen are still at our circles.

Sullivan and co are making them play a 90's type of game, when it doesnt fit with the personnel. There is no good reason why they should be playing a dump/chase game when the team collectively sucks at it.

They aren't as slow as last season. They should go back to the '16 model where the wingers pressure the oppositions dmen when they're in our zone.

But instead its collapse, collapse,collapse. And then people wonder why we cant get through the NZ with any speed and the other team seems to always have at least 3 men back.

I said there are issues with the D corps. But there are also major issues with the coaching as well. But Sullivan is insistent on playing it safe and playing with minimal risk. He fell into the same trap that most other coaches do. I'd rather win track meets than lose like this.

 

[Turin]

I don’t really have much to rebut that because we’re seeing entirely different things. On one page you have people begging Sully to play conservative to compensate the lineup and now you’re reaming him out for playing too conservative.

 

[USMC607]

There isnt one thing to me that can fix this.

Geno not being himself basically all year. Crosby and Kessel not shooting when they got a high% chance.

Too many passengers.

Not being consistent and playing with effort. Too lax like they are just gonna sleep walk into the playoffs.(I can see a few games here and there over 82 games but it's been alot more than a few).

Our passing is atrocious, too much east west, or just panic throws to the middle of the ice. Having trouble receiving passes and fumbling the puck.

Not being able to keep the puck in the offensive zone. Cant get it out of the defensive zone.

Terrible neutral zone entries with no support.

Dump and chase instead of walking it in when we have a chance, but with alot of players not hustling or doing board work after the chip in.

Dmen cant get the puck to the net from the point. Dmen having trouble with the break out pass of our zone.

Losing assignments.

Bad shift changes or playefs changing too early before we know we have control of the puck.

No effort in the forecheck for some players. No effort back checking for some players.

Just a bad combination of everything right now.

 

[USMC607]

It comes down to if these guys want it or not.

Right now it really looks like they could care less. I know they do. But it doesnt show.

It just looks like they are indifferent, and it cant be that way. We were back to back champs not too long ago. Teams are going to get up to play against us. Not so much this yr but we are one of those teams others teams look at and use us as a measuring stick, and get up to play against.

So on top of all our issues. If we cant or are unwilling to match that kind of intensity most nights, it's going to be a rough go...

 

[Angrrus]

I don't care about what happened in the 3 periods before OT, I blame this OT loss 1000000% on Kessel. That is all him. Pathetic.

People can complain about the depth players, puck movers on defense or coaching staff all they want. It doesn't matter if your big money players aren't playing like big money players. This team wins this game if they star players play like star players.

Amen to that. That’s been a major problem for a year and a half already, but all I can hear here is “Jack Johnson this, Jack Johnson that”.

Also about refs and opposing goalies standing on their head. That’s about it.

 

[Angrrus]

Not playing with Matt Cullen as his center at ES might help.

It’s not like he was lights out when he played with Malkin, Crosby, Brassard and McCann.

 

[Angrrus]

That’s been our season in a nutshell...we may be out of a PO spot soon...

I’m growing more and more confident that this group of players fully deserves this embarrassment.

Just to think of all the talk last year that they simply were gassed, they would have a full summer of rest and contend for the cup again next season... Sweet talk...

 

[Angrrus]

More of the same.

Wonderful next few days. Best team in the league Saturday, then Philly, who's red hot, on Monday night. Looking forward to the new American Dad on Monday, not the Pens game.

Why, remember we beat them 4:2 just a week ago! Pens are perfectly fine, based on that one game, the 2019 SC is in our hip pocket!

 

[Angrrus]

All situations goal differential in the last 15 games:

Letang: +1 (25 GF, 24 GA)
Crosby: +2 (20 GF, 18 GA)
Guentzel: +3 (21 GF, 20 GA)
Kessel: -8 (13 GF, 21 GA)
Malkin: -1 (16 GF, 17 GA in 11 games)

When your top players are playing to a draw in terms of goals for and goals against, you're going to have a lot of trouble winning games. This team is basically demanding their depth players win games for them right now, because their top players are getting scored on just as much as they're scoring. That isn't a recipe for success for any team.



You're trying to excuse Kessel's horrid play, which has been more than just tonight, based on what center he's playing with. Don't come up with excuses for his play, he's good enough where he shouldn't be a huge net negative to this team when playing with someone like Kessel.

Where’s that guy who threw at me last week stats of Kessel’s scoring when Pens are trailing? I wonder what he’d say about this.

 

[Angrrus]

I think they looked like a legit contender during that win streak. And even a little of the loss streak before it. But the rest of the year... Yikes.

I remember short time ago somebody told me Pens have positive record this season every month except Oct.

Shows you just how hypocritical it is to use stats like this as an argument.

 

[Angrrus]

Schultz has always been our Dman that we could rely on to put accurate shots on net.

That is something this team desperately needs.

That is something that Hornqvist has made a living on and desperately needs. He can’t do **** when the rest of our Dmen rifle shots off of the backboards.

In the meantime, Kris Letang eats up 7+ min of cap space.

 

[Angrrus]

Its called the ebbs and flows of an 82 game season.

Sid Letang and Jake are the 3 biggest reasons this team is still in a playoff spot.

Those 3 players are the last players that deserve criticism.

Nope. If they create just about as many goals as they allow to be scored - it means they are simply padding up their individual point totals without really facilitating wins in games.

 

[Angrrus]

Do you even read what you post anymore? If a goal against and a negative shot share is a standard game you don’t belong in the league.

Sounds like most D on Pens roster during the 2016-17 Cup run.

 

[Icarium]

We give up the neutral zone way, way too easily. Maybe it was the different camera angle but this really struck me. If a team passes our forecheck in their zone, they have a virtually guaranteed easy entry into our zone. It puts a huge strain on our D and as we all know it's not particularly good to begin with. In some of our better games this season we clog up the neutral zone well but in most games we barely even try. It's maddening.

Kessel in OT and that 5 on 3 were just putrid. Honestly, DeSmith saved our bacon, we didn't do much to deserve even a point. The endless line juggling is killing whatever chemistry we manage to find.

 

[ChaosAgent]

Kessel in OT and that 5 on 3 were just putrid. Honestly, DeSmith saved our bacon, we didn't do much to deserve even a point. The endless line juggling is killing whatever chemistry we manage to find.

There's a rumor going around that he put up 92 points last year. Production.

 

[LittleSpoon]

There's a rumor going around that he put up 92 points last year. Production.

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