Speculation: Carolina summer shakeup?

[BHD]

Hanifin for Jost and Timmins

The Canes need an established, big name player. One would think Dundon pushed Francis aside because he wasn't interested in trades that pay off down the road.

 

[mpp9]

Offer Tavares all the money. They need a legit #1C.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Someone get them a goalie! They are a good team!

 

[Jarey Curry]

The Canes need an established, big name player. One would think Dundon pushed Francis aside because he wasn't interested in trades that pay off down the road.

Do you have some particular player in mind from Colorado to trade for Hanifin?

 

[BHD]

Do you have some particular player in mind from Colorado to trade for Hanifin?

It would have to be one of their forwards, and I doubt the Avs are thinking about trading one of them anytime soon. The rest of their forwards, while decent players, wouldn't do it for the Canes.

 

[Jarey Curry]

It would have to be one of their forwards, and I doubt the Avs are thinking about trading one of them anytime soon.

Outside of top 3 forwards, the avs are willing to listen

 

[xNogaitx]

Carolina needs goals. They are ranked 27th this year in that department. There's only one pure goal scorer available on the market and he's at a discount rate with Mtl's management being dumb. The Canes are supposed to be competing with their core's age group but they aren't.

Their top assets going into this draft will be their #1 pick and J.Bean (which they don't really need due to their young D being stacked.) Personally, I believe they shouldn't move any of their established back-end guys nor any of their top prospects offensively as they sorely need support up front and in net.

CAR:
LW Pacioretty (To provide the goals)
C/RW Andrew Shaw (To spark up that lineup and also, his 35-40pts/season average would put him in their top 10 overall pts producer)
G. Charlie Lindgren (To help strengthen their G position, he's not starter ready, but could be molded into the role over the next couple of seasons)

MTL:
J. Bean
2018 1st rd pick
2018 2nd rd pick
2020 2nd rd pick
Marcus Kruger (Cap dump)

Montreal doesn't get the roster player they want and surrender 3 established players, but they get some solid prospects in return to help the rebuilt at positions of need (LD with Bean, a C with the 9-13th overall pick).


Cap space wise, they would still have more than enough money to sign Tavares in the offseason as well.

 

[mariolemieux66]

Carolina needs goals. They are ranked 27th this year in that department. There's only one pure goal scorer available on the market and he's at a discount rate with Mtl's management being dumb. The Canes are supposed to be competing with their core's age group but they aren't.

Their top assets going into this draft will be their #1 pick and J.Bean (which they don't really need due to their young D being stacked.) Personally, I believe they shouldn't move any of their established back-end guys nor any of their top prospects offensively as they sorely need support up front and in net.

CAR:
LW Pacioretty (To provide the goals)
C/RW Andrew Shaw (To spark up that lineup and also, his 35-40pts/season average would put him in their top 10 overall pts producer)
G. Charlie Lindgren (To help strengthen their G position, he's not starter ready, but could be molded into the role over the next couple of seasons)

MTL:
J. Bean
2018 1st rd pick
2018 2nd rd pick
2020 2nd rd pick
Marcus Kruger (Cap dump)

Montreal doesn't get the roster player they want and surrender 3 established players, but they get some solid prospects in return to help the rebuilt at positions of need (LD with Bean, a C with the 9-13th overall pick).


Cap space wise, they would still have more than enough money to sign Tavares in the offseason as well.

Carolina should also take Price and fix their goaltending problems. Montreal will retain.

Price $ retained
Pacioretty
Shaw

For

Darling
Nekac
Fleury
Roy
2018 1st
2018 2nd
2019 2nd

 

[Canes]

Carolina needs goals. They are ranked 27th this year in that department. There's only one pure goal scorer available on the market and he's at a discount rate with Mtl's management being dumb. The Canes are supposed to be competing with their core's age group but they aren't.

Their top assets going into this draft will be their #1 pick and J.Bean (which they don't really need due to their young D being stacked.) Personally, I believe they shouldn't move any of their established back-end guys nor any of their top prospects offensively as they sorely need support up front and in net.

CAR:
LW Pacioretty (To provide the goals)
C/RW Andrew Shaw (To spark up that lineup and also, his 35-40pts/season average would put him in their top 10 overall pts producer)
G. Charlie Lindgren (To help strengthen their G position, he's not starter ready, but could be molded into the role over the next couple of seasons)

MTL:
J. Bean
2018 1st rd pick
2018 2nd rd pick
2020 2nd rd pick
Marcus Kruger (Cap dump)

Montreal doesn't get the roster player they want and surrender 3 established players, but they get some solid prospects in return to help the rebuilt at positions of need (LD with Bean, a C with the 9-13th overall pick).


Cap space wise, they would still have more than enough money to sign Tavares in the offseason as well.

LMAO, we're not giving up all that for Pacioretty, Shaw and another unproven goalie

Those doesn't really make us all that more competitive and it mortgages a decent portion of our future/trade assets

If I'm giving up all of that I want more than a player like Pacioretty

 

[xNogaitx]

LMAO, we're not giving up all that for Pacioretty, Shaw and another unproven goalie

Those doesn't really make us all that more competitive and it mortgages a decent portion of our future/trade assets

If I'm giving up all of that I want more than a player like Pacioretty

Realistically what you're getting in Patches and Shaw is 2 guys that would slot in on your top 2 lines the way Carolina's offense is looking like. Those pieces going back don't touch any of your current players/top assets except Bean (which is not needed going forward due to Carolina's strong defense corps.)

If you add 30-35 goals to your team's season plus another 15-20 goals from Shaw, i'm pretty sure your team wouldn't be battling in and out of the last wild card spot at this point in time.

The value is there on both ends, big trades hurt and help at once, that's why they are called major shakeups.

 

[jonlin]

Someone get them a goalie! They are a good team!

Raanta is a 1G and is UFA this summer. Throw him 6x 4M and he will sign. He has posted really good numbers 4 years now. Trade Darling + 2nd, 3rd to AZ for minor pieces to save cap for a 1C

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Realistically what you're getting in Patches and Shaw is 2 guys that would slot in on your top 2 lines the way Carolina's offense is looking like. Those pieces going back don't touch any of your current players/top assets except Bean (which is not needed going forward due to Carolina's strong defense corps.)

If you add 30-35 goals to your team's season plus another 15-20 goals from Shaw, i'm pretty sure your team wouldn't be battling in and out of the last wild card spot at this point in time.

The value is there on both ends, big trades hurt and help at once, that's why they are called major shakeups.

I don't like it for Carolina.

First, Pacioretty is under contract for 1 year so he's a stopgap. I don't see the Canes giving up that much for 1 year of a guy and not fill their most important position of need? (Center). Secondly, Shaw is an overpaid grinder signed for way too much for way too long and definitely not a guy that would slot into our top 2 lines. He's a 10-15G, 25-30 point player. Canes have their own version in Brock McGinn who is younger and much cheaper. Shaw doesn't ADD value in a deal to Carolina because of his contract. Thirdly, goalie prospects like Lindgren don't hold much value or get much in returns in trades. Lastly, can't see the Canes trying to "dump" Kruger at the cost of picks. He's signed for only 1 more year and his actual salary is only $2.3M.

Would much rather keep those assets and/or try to use them in a deal for a center and then try to sign Kane, JVR, etc.. via UFA.

If Patches would agree to an extension, then I could see a 1st and a prospect type deal, but no need complicating it with all the other stuff.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Carolina should also take Price and fix their goaltending problems. Montreal will retain.

Price $ retained
Pacioretty
Shaw

For

Darling
Necas
Fleury
Roy
2018 1st
2018 2nd
2019 2nd

• Shaw is of no interest and actually detracts from value. He's paid too much, for too long for a 3rd line grinder.
  
• Patches is under contract for 1 season and then will be 31 (november) when he starts his next contract.
• Biggest need for Carolina is a 1C and typically teams have to get those through the draft. You are proposing they trade away the 1 guy in their system that could potentially be a 1C in Necas. IMO, any deal involving Necas is a non-starter unless it's as part of a deal for a young, 1C (which rarely happens).
• And while Price is great, that contract is probably too untenable, even with retention. He's going to be 31 to start next season and signed for 8 more years at $84M.
  
• Not to mention he has a NMC.

 

[varano]

Francis has quietly been one the best GMs in the league, .

Do you really think so?

All He did was trust his scouting staff at drafts and put a crappy product on the ice so they could draft high. How has he addressed the needs of the team?

Darling? Kruger?

This was well overdue. You don't need a million defence prospects like the Hurricanes have. For a league where Adam Larsson was traded for Taylor Hall, You would think Francis would have clued in and said ... HMMM.. Maybe I can get that scoring player we need up front...

 

[Benstheman]

• Shaw is of no interest and actually detracts from value. He's paid too much, for too long for a 3rd line grinder.
  
• Patches is under contract for 1 season and then will be 31 (november) when he starts his next contract.
• Biggest need for Carolina is a 1C and typically teams have to get those through the draft. You are proposing they trade away the 1 guy in their system that could potentially be a 1C in Necas. IMO, any deal involving Necas is a non-starter unless it's as part of a deal for a young, 1C (which rarely happens).
• And while Price is great, that contract is probably too untenable, even with retention. He's going to be 31 to start next season and signed for 8 more years at $84M.
  
• Not to mention he has a NMC.

Just so you know, it has been talked about recently in the traditional medias. Arpon Basu on the Athletic just write an article on the ''opportunity'' for Habs to take advantage of the situation in Carolina to make a major deal with them. I don't have the links (don't want to pay) but it says Price and Pacioretty would be of interests for Carolina and great prospects would be welcomed in Mtl.

But still, i'm agreeing with you on some of your points :

• Don't know why Shaw would interest Carolina
• As for Pacioretty, i think you guys need more veterans presence. I don't know how the new owner will permit the new GM to spend through the cap but if Pacioretty agrees to resign with you guys, he would be a great piece to add.
• Absolutely agreed Necas shouldn't be disponible for trades. he is your best odds at getting a real top line center.
• Same as Pacioretty but, imo, with way greater positive impact on your team. With the good yound D Canes have, getting Price get you 5 years of playoffs and competitiveness, which should be the priority for new ownership. Off course, the contract is big to swallow but you have the space and i guess there is a possibility Habs retain a certain amount.
• At this point, i think Price would welcome a trade to any teams that are way ahead of Habs on rebuild process and to a market where pressure isn't a problem.

I wouldn't venture on the parameters of such a trade because i think nobody knows what is the value of Price's contract and you add a goal scoring winger with 1 year left on his contract on top of that.

 

[BHD]

You have to look at it from the Canes point of view, though. They have players they can move and a ton of cap space. The latter is very advantageous in a cap world. They shouldn't take on a player just because they can. Of course it depends who calls the shots when the new 'general manager' is hired, but this could be a golden opportunity for them.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Just so you know, it has been talked about recently in the traditional medias. Arpon Basu on the Athletic just write an article on the ''opportunity'' for Habs to take advantage of the situation in Carolina to make a major deal with them. I don't have the links (don't want to pay) but it says Price and Pacioretty would be of interests for Carolina and great prospects would be welcomed in Mtl.

Yeah, I saw that. It's just a writer speculating about what might make sense though, same as EDM writers used to write about what might make sense, same as Toronto writers use to say Eric Staal (5-6 years ago) to Toronto made sense, etc... It's just speculation.

But still, i'm agreeing with you on some of your points :

• Don't know why Shaw would interest Carolina
• As for Pacioretty, i think you guys need more veterans presence. I don't know how the new owner will permit the new GM to spend through the cap but if Pacioretty agrees to resign with you guys, he would be a great piece to add.
• Absolutely agreed Necas shouldn't be disponible for trades. he is your best odds at getting a real top line center.
• Same as Pacioretty but, imo, with way greater positive impact on your team. With the good yound D Canes have, getting Price get you 5 years of playoffs and competitiveness, which should be the priority for new ownership. Off course, the contract is big to swallow but you have the space and i guess there is a possibility Habs retain a certain amount.
• At this point, i think Price would welcome a trade to any teams that are way ahead of Habs on rebuild process and to a market where pressure isn't a problem.

I wouldn't venture on the parameters of such a trade because i think nobody knows what is the value of Price's contract and you add a goal scoring winger with 1 year left on his contract on top of that.

Yeah, as I said earlier, I wouldn't mind Patches, but not for the price being asked for 1 year of a guy, particularly one that "reportedly" requested a trade to Florida. That makes me think he wouldn't re-sign or at least is a risk. Even so, I get very nervous when forwards get big pay days in their 30s as more often than not, those don't pan out. So if the Canes were going down that path, I'd much rather not also give up assets. Go for a JVR, Kane, Neal, or for lesser amount Nash...etc.. and then try to use the 1st round pick and other assets to try and pry a guy like ROR out of Buffalo, which fills a bigger need.

re: Price, yah, that's a tough one. No doubt he'd fill a need, but he has a NMC, so who knows if he'd even want to go to a team, Carolina, that hasn't made the playoffs in 9 years and plays in an arena that is rarely full even if they are "further ahead" in the rebuild. Then you take into account his age, contract and recent injury history and it makes it tough to gauge a return.

Until we get a new GM, who knows what will happen, but I'll very surprised (and extremely disappointed) if ANY deal included Necas or even as many picks / players as some of what is proposed above. Moving this years first (after the lottery is done) and some prospects not named Necas? sure, but even then, it better be a damn good deal if they are moving the 1st in a deep draft.

Necas is the first player I've seen the Canes draft since I moved here (2004) where I said "WOW" the first time I've seen him. (and continued to be wow'd). Didn't see that with Skinner. Didn't see that with Aho. Didn't see that with Hanifin, etc... Of course there's risk he doesn't meet expectations, but I think this kid is going to be an absolute stud.

 

[GoldiFox]

Realistically what you're getting in Patches and Shaw is 2 guys that would slot in on your top 2 lines the way Carolina's offense is looking like. Those pieces going back don't touch any of your current players/top assets except Bean (which is not needed going forward due to Carolina's strong defense corps.)

If you add 30-35 goals to your team's season plus another 15-20 goals from Shaw, i'm pretty sure your team wouldn't be battling in and out of the last wild card spot at this point in time.

The value is there on both ends, big trades hurt and help at once, that's why they are called major shakeups.

Canes aren’t trading two high 1st round picks plus for one year of Pacioretty and a Cap Dump.

Price isn’t waiving for Carolina.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Carolina should also take Price and fix their goaltending problems. Montreal will retain.

Price $ retained
Pacioretty
Shaw

For

Darling
Nekac
Fleury
Roy
2018 1st
2018 2nd
2019 2nd

Carolina isn't trading their 1st alone for that package, let alone adding Fleury, Roy, and more picks. Sure taking Darling's bad contract along with a person that's never played hockey is tempting, but still.

 

[go comets]

Everyone has to remember that 90% of Francis time as GM was spent with a small internal budget from PK. New owner in place obviously wants his own people, that's his right.

I think RF was waiting for free agency this summer so that he didn't have to give up talent.

His biggest error was obviously Darling and that alone probably cost him his job.

Several GMs said asking prices for players were extremely high at the trade deadline....

And it was obvious that the want to keep the kids together in Charlotte and let them develop together.....

Winning the lottery would help a lot... Just no franchise Players....

 

[connormcmuffin]

Do you really think so?

All He did was trust his scouting staff at drafts and put a crappy product on the ice so they could draft high. How has he addressed the needs of the team?

Darling? Kruger?

This was well overdue. You don't need a million defence prospects like the Hurricanes have. For a league where Adam Larsson was traded for Taylor Hall, You would think Francis would have clued in and said ... HMMM.. Maybe I can get that scoring player we need up front...

Listen to your scouts and draft well, it's that easy but GM and fanbases try to play God with the process and destroy their teams. Hiring and listening to good scouts = great GM.

Is Necas a defenseman? Is Aho?

He has a bunch of young defensemen prospects worth their weight in gold on the trade market, who should he target? There isn't a good C to be had for the chips he has to play. And the longer they develop the better their worth.

Is Hextall dumb too for hording young blueliners? Is Murray?

Shallow hot take, Canes are one or two pieces away from building something special but blow it up to get Paul Statsny and Raanta.

 

[jeromeo87]

Trade Faulk+2nd for RNH+4th
Trade Rask to Arizona for 3rd (Carolina retains some, if necessary)
Sign Raanta ($4.5 million)
Sign JVR ($6 million)
Resign Hanifin (around $5 million?)
Resign Lindholm (around $4 million?)
Resign TVR (around $3 million?)
Resign Dahlbeck (around $1 million?)

Aho JStaal Teravainen
JVR RNH Lindholm
Skinner Necas Williams
McGinn Wallmark Zykov

Slavin Pesce
Hanifin TVR
Fleury Dahlbeck/McKeown

Raanta
Darling

They should still have around $8 million in cap space.

 

[DaveG]

Even with the season he's been having, losing Faulk and not replacing him in UFA would be a HUGE mistake. I like McKeown and he's ready for that #5/6 slot, but not sure he'll ever be that top 4 guy, and I'm pretty sure that TVR flat out won't be a top 4 guy. Don't think we'd have to add that much of a kicker to Faulk to get RNH (or either side add a kicker at all).

 

[jeromeo87]

Even with the season he's been having, losing Faulk and not replacing him in UFA would be a HUGE mistake. I like McKeown and he's ready for that #5/6 slot, but not sure he'll ever be that top 4 guy, and I'm pretty sure that TVR flat out won't be a top 4 guy. Don't think we'd have to add that much of a kicker to Faulk to get RNH (or either side add a kicker at all).

I would trade either one of Faulk or Skinner for RNH.

 

[MinJaBen]

Trade Faulk+2nd for RNH+4th
Trade Rask to Arizona for 3rd (Carolina retains some, if necessary)
Sign Raanta ($4.5 million)
Sign JVR ($6 million)
Resign Hanifin (around $5 million?)
Resign Lindholm (around $4 million?)
Resign TVR (around $3 million?)
Resign Dahlbeck (around $1 million?)

Aho JStaal Teravainen
JVR RNH Lindholm
Skinner Necas Williams
McGinn Wallmark Zykov

Slavin Pesce
Hanifin TVR
Fleury Dahlbeck/McKeown

Raanta
Darling

They should still have around $8 million in cap space.

Nothing terribly wrong here. I, like @DaveG, don't think a RNH for Faulk needs the picks. I think you are overpaying both TVR and Hanifin while I think JVR gets more than you are paying if he were to come here. The most problematic issue is that I think Raanta won't make it to UFA. His agent and the Yotes both are making positive statements about getting a deal done before July 1st. If we want him, I'd think we need to go all in and give Arizona a trade that they wouldn't refuse. Not sure what that would be, but unless we act now to do so, my guess is he is signed before the draft lottery.