Confirmed with Link: Carolina Officially Matches Habs' Offer Sheet for Aho

[Kriss E]

I'm not explaining how that contract was tricky to Carolina's owner. It was explained a thousand times on this board. Choose what you want to believe.

There's nothing tricky about this contract. Not sure why you're so defensive.
They banked on the signing bonus being too large to match, which was laughable...as you say.
It was too low, along with the AAV. Hence....they matched.
I only read a few Habs fans discuss how this was meant to be ''tough'' for the Carolina owner...I have not heard a single person outside Habs land thought the Canes would not match this or have difficulties doing it.

 

[SpeedyPotato]

I just read a piece on the athletic reminding me that the Sabres, who'd just lost Drury and Briere to free agency, matched the Oilers offersheet for Vanek that would've netted them 4 firsts which ended up being Hall, RNH, Paajarvi, and Tyler Myers... I know times change, but the Canes weren't accepting to be bullied here, and Aho is 100x the player Vanek ever was, they were still matching at 10 millions, they probably still were at 12.

 

[Hfbsux]

There's nothing tricky about this contract. Not sure why you're so defensive.
They banked on the signing bonus being too large to match, which was laughable...as you say.
It was too low, along with the AAV. Hence....they matched.

It's just tiring, it has been discussed too many time and there is still confusion. Instead of explaining how it was all about the bonus and not the AAV, please tell me how Carolina's GM wouldn't match a 10.5 AAV?

 

[CHarlie]

Ive lost lowballing before......my first reaction was damn shouldve went higher......not sure Berg and Molson are doing that.......they said this wasnt just a wim they have been planning this for 12 months......so it was this amount or we dont do it at all

 

[Kriss E]

It's just tiring, it has been discussed too many time and there is still confusion. Instead of explaining how it was all about the bonus and not the AAV, please tell me how Carolina's GM wouldn't match a 10.5 AAV?

I'm not saying they wouldn't, hence me endlessly discussing how OS are a terrible strategy and should only be entertained when you're willing to stupidly overpay.

 

[Hfbsux]

I'm not saying they wouldn't, hence me endlessly discussing how OS are a terrible strategy and should only be entertained when you're willing to stupidly overpay.

Well, Bergevin had scoop from Aho's agent. Why not try if they thought he didn't have cash atm? Like you said, all we did was lose time. Time for what exactly? Time for signing Gardiner or Ferland? Since Duchene chose Nashville over us, there's not much to do on the UFA market. MB could still negociate trade while we were waiting. The waste of time argument is overexagerated.

 

[Milhouse40]

People who hates Bergevin. Funny how they discredit his attempt at signing an elite player bringing up the low AAV which had nothing to do with the matching at all. I mean, this was explained how many times? Haters will hate no matter what. Pathetic.

Okay, you want to credit him for his attempt for going after the wrong target with the wrong offer....your choices. It's not about giving away a 10.5M AVV or the bonuses in the offer....it was plain and simple the wrong target and a smart GM would have known that.

 

[Hfbsux]

Okay, you want to credit him for his attempt for going after the wrong target with the wrong offer....your choices. It's not about giving away a 10.5M AVV or the bonuses in the offer....it was plain and simple the wrong target and a smart GM would have known that.

How is it a wrong target when he signed the OS?

 

[Rosso Scuderia]

Well, Bergevin had scoop from Aho's agent. Why not try if they thought he didn't have cash atm? Like you said, all we did was lose time. Time for what exactly? Time for signing Gardiner or Ferland? Since Duchene chose Nashville over us, there's not much to do on the UFA market. MB could still negociate trade while we were waiting. The waste of time argument is overexagerated.

I think you actually take the "losing time" argument too literally.

We're not saying that time saved would have gave us anything else. It's just a waste of time doing all the prep work and calculations for something that had no chance to succeed.

 

[Kriss E]

Well, Bergevin had scoop from Aho's agent. Why not try if they thought he didn't have cash atm? Like you said, all we did was lose time. Time for what exactly? Time for signing Gardiner or Ferland? Since Duchene chose Nashville over us, there's not much to do on the UFA market. MB could still negociate trade while we were waiting. The waste of time argument is overexagerated.

There is nothing ''overexaggerated''. It was a pointless move that lead to nothing. That's a fact.
You're back to square 1. Maybe you don't care about going around in circle, I find the strategy extremely futile.
Again, if you're going to try...then go all in. Give Aho 12-13M if you really want him. No, I wouldn't like that deal, but then...if you think flexing your muscles at Carolina is just 11M+9M in signing bonuses in first two years...you're not going anywhere. Again, hence, the matching and the laughing at Habs offer from them.

Nobody means ''waste of time'' as in we lost 6 days and missed out on oh-so-many opportunities. They mean ''waste of time'' as in it was completely useless. I thought that was obvious...

 

[Hfbsux]

I think you actually take the "losing time" argument too literally.

We're not saying that time saved would have gave us anything else. It's just a waste of time doing all the prep work and calculations for something that had no chance to succeed.

There is nothing ''overexaggerated''. It was a pointless move that lead to nothing. That's a fact.
You're back to square 1. Maybe you don't care about going around in circle, I find the strategy extremely futile.
Again, if you're going to try...then go all in. Give Aho 12-13M if you really want him. No, I wouldn't like that deal, but then...if you think flexing your muscles at Carolina is just 11M+9M in signing bonuses in first two years...you're not going anywhere. Again, hence, the matching and the laughing at Habs offer from them.

Nobody means ''waste of time'' as in we lost 6 days and missed out on oh-so-many opportunities. They mean ''waste of time'' as in it was completely useless. I thought that was obvious...

No risk, no reward. We should have just done nothing instead?

 

[Kriss E]

I just read a piece on the athletic reminding me that the Sabres, who'd just lost Drury and Briere to free agency, matched the Oilers offersheet for Vanek that would've netted them 4 firsts which ended up being Hall, RNH, Paajarvi, and Tyler Myers... I know times change, but the Canes weren't accepting to be bullied here, and Aho is 100x the player Vanek ever was, they were still matching at 10 millions, they probably still were at 12.

Getting Vanek might have lead them to better results which means they wouldn't have drafted at the same spots, but, knowing how terrible their management have been, chances are they would have continued sucking.

 

[Hostile Offer]

is it, though? It has 7 years left at $10.5M. The Panthers just gave Bobrovsky 7 years with a $10M cap. I'm sure we could find a place for Price if we wanted to trade him.

They also had to do quite a bit of cap gymnastics to make it done. First of all it's a niche market, not everyone needs or can afford a goalie making that much, and secondly cap pretty much has to be moved somewhere to make it happen. Also Price has a full NMC to boot. I'm sure there aren't a lot of takers for that contract, and one of those needs to be a team where Price wants to go. And that's just what we need to have to even start discussing the actual trade. In all likeliness there's no trade to be made there.

 

[Milhouse40]

How is it a wrong target when he signed the OS?

Carolina had the Cap space to match easily
Aho is their very top franchise player.....not one of many like Marner is in Toronto or Laine in Winnipeg or Point in Tampa.

You want to go after Carolina's only Top franchise player they had like in 10 years with a ridiculous offer that doesn't even put any kind of pressure on their Cap?

You want to make an offer sheet, you go after team that don't even have the Cap to match it and if you go after their very best player, you better overpay to make sure you get him and even then, you probably won't get him since the team doesn't have anybody else.

If you go after a team with multiple top players with an offer sheet that put pressure on their Cap, then you have a chance to get him.

There's a reason offer sheet was talked about before the UFA open up......and the name of Aho never came up like Point or Marner, cause it wasn't a good target AT ALL.

 

[Kriss E]

No risk, no reward. We should have just done nothing instead?

What he did was the equivalent of nothing, that's what you're failing to grasp here.
You are falling victim to what Bergevin himself admitted publicly. He made this move to show fans how he and Molson are serious about improving. It was a very lame attempt at an improvement that was predictably useless and unsuccessful.

No..he shouldn't have done nothing, he should have focused on a different plan.

 

[Hfbsux]

Carolina had the Cap space to match easily
Aho is their very top franchise player.....not one of many like Marner is in Toronto or Laine in Winnipeg or Point in Tampa.

You want to go after Carolina's only Top franchise player they had like in 10 years with a ridiculous offer that doesn't even put any kind of pressure on their Cap?

You want to make an offer sheet, you go after team that don't even have the Cap to match it and if you go after their very best player, you better overpay to make sure you get him and even then, you probably won't get him since the team doesn't have anybody else.

If you go after a team with multiple top players with an offer sheet that put pressure on their Cap, then you have a chance to get him.

There's a reason offer sheet was talked about before the UFA open up......and the name of Aho never came up like Point or Marner, cause it wasn't a good target AT ALL.

I haven't talked about AAV and cap because it wasn't Carolina's problem. Negociation with Aho and the Canes were obviously not going well. They saw an opportunity and tried it. The targets you're talking about are still unsigned, so what's all the fuss about him being not the right target (as you claimed)?

 

[Milhouse40]

What he did was the equivalent of nothing, that's what you're failing to grasp here.
You are falling victim to what Bergevin himself admitted publicly. He made this move to show fans how he and Molson are serious about improving. It was a very lame attempt at an improvement that was predictably useless and unsuccessful.

No..he shouldn't have done nothing, he should have focused on a different plan.

And we all know....if Duchene signed in Montreal, that offer sheet would never existed.
Since we also know that Bergevin was on Duchene until the very end, it's obvious he didn't took a week to fully preprared that offer sheet.....smells so much like a panic move because he lost on Duchene and took about 24h to put that offer sheet on the table. Badly planned, badly executed

 

[Le Tricolore]

They also had to do quite a bit of cap gymnastics to make it done. First of all it's a niche market, not everyone needs or can afford a goalie making that much, and secondly cap pretty much has to be moved somewhere to make it happen. Also Price has a full NMC to boot. I'm sure there aren't a lot of takers for that contract, and one of those needs to be a team where Price wants to go. And that's just what we need to have to even start discussing the actual trade. In all likeliness there's no trade to be made there.

Right, but if they had to pay him that much, you have to think that other teams offered similar contracts.

I'm just saying that Price can be traded if we had to move him.

 

[Hfbsux]

What he did was the equivalent of nothing, that's what you're failing to grasp here.
You are falling victim to what Bergevin himself admitted publicly. He made this move to show fans how he and Molson are serious about improving. It was a very lame attempt at an improvement that was predictably useless and unsuccessful.

No..he shouldn't have done nothing, he should have focused on a different plan.

Didn't know a GM can only have one plan at a time. I think there's a whole lot of complaining for nothing here.

 

[Hfbsux]

And we all know....if Duchene signed in Montreal, that offer sheet would never existed.
Since we also know that Bergevin was on Duchene until the very end, it's obvious he didn't took a week to fully preprared that offer sheet.....smells so much like a panic move because he lost on Duchene and took about 24h to put that offer sheet on the table. Badly planned, badly executed

I don't think it was a secret Duchene was plan A. How would you offer for the "poorly executed" offersheet?

 

[Milhouse40]

I haven't talked about AAV and cap because it wasn't Carolina's problem. Negociation with Aho and the Canes were obviously not going well. They saw an opportunity and tried it. The targets you're talking about are still unsigned, so what's all the fuss about him being not the right target (as you claimed)?

You think paying an extra of 12.55M was going to scare an owner from keeping their very best players?
You think after going to the ECF (where teams made money) they would let go of their young top player because of 12.55M freaking millions?

 

[Milhouse40]

I don't think it was a secret Duchene was plan A. How would you offer for the "poorly executed" offersheet?

I would not have targeted Aho to begin with.

 

[Hfbsux]

You think paying an extra of 12.55M was going to scare an owner from keeping their very best players?
You think after going to the ECF (where teams made money) they would let go of their young top player because of 12.55M freaking millions?

Not at all. In fact, I've been saying the AAV had nothing to do with it. So, yeah I agree with you on that. All they did was test the owner to come up with 11M in 2 weeks and another 9 next July. They try, didn't work. They can go for what you consider good targets now, if they sign the OS to begin with.

 

[Milhouse40]

Not at all. In fact, I've been saying the AAV had nothing to do with it. So, yeah I agree with you on that. All they did was test the owner to come up with 11M in 2 weeks and another 9 next July. They try, didn't work. They can go for what you consider good targets now, if they sign the OS to begin with.

Not looking to go the offer sheet route anyway, not even for Point or Marner.

Dundon paid 420 millions for his share of this franchises.....now if Bergevin or Molson thought that 11 millions was a problem for him to get in a week, they should be fired. When you're worth more than a billion dollars, that's cheap change and real easy to find.

 

[Hfbsux]

Not looking to go the offer sheet route anyway, not even for Point or Marner.

Dundon paid 420 millions for his share of this franchises.....now if Bergevin or Molson thought that 11 millions was a problem for him to get in a week, they should be fired. When you're worth more than a billion dollars, that's cheap change and real easy to find.

Yep, Bergevin should be fired for thinking an owner who just declared bankrupcy over his investment in the AAF can't come up with 11M in 2 weeks. That's a little much don't you think?

Edit: I mean, he could be fired for other reason, but not this one.