Friedman: Capitals interested in Marc-Andre Fleury

[SherVaughn30]

For Samsonov's sake, get him away from Lavi.

You mean Scott Murray the Caps goalie coach. They went from Mitch Korn to a nobody goalie coach, that even Holtby could not connect with.

 

[Nakawick]

I hope the Caps get him.

 

[Skrudland2Lomakin]

There's so many faulty assumptions in here.

Buffalo traded a guy with a broken neck for several guys they absolutely love that are succeeding in their new home; therefore, a much younger cheaper healthier 40 goal scorer won't return much.

His value is tough to determine because a guy like him almost never gets traded. Eichel is not a comp for every big trade.

First, we’re doing some extreme retconning if we’re talking as if Eichel was seen as a broken asset that no one wanted. Mannnnny teams were interested in him but felt he was overvalued by BUF. The neck hurt his value for sure, but it didn’t make his worth diminish to that it was comparable to DeBrincat.

Next, I actually audibly laughed at the concept that Eichel isn’t a useful barometer because we’ve never seen a player like DeBrincat traded.

I ask you simply to give me a comparable haul to what you want for a player in the last 10 years. You’re pitching this as if DeBrincat has significant term on a league minimum deal. He makes 6.5 and has a year left before presumably negotiating what will be his big deal. It’s not the most enviable contract in league history. I don’t see how this gets more than a first, top prospect, mid prospect/pick.

 

[Skrudland2Lomakin]

The sabres were motivated to make a move with jack. Cat is extremely likely in the hawks (terrible) long term plans.

“The Sabres were extremely motivated to make a move with Jack.”


Now I know you guys are crazy. They sat on him for two seasons because they hated every deal. They made him a week away from filing a grievance before finally pulling the trigger.


Motivated? Bwahaha

 

[SherVaughn30]

Can a Caps fan fill me in? I'm a neutral fan, and don't see a lot of Washington. Why would they need a goalie with Samsonov and Vanecek?

Is Samsonov still the guy going forward?

That's the big question mark right now. He and VV have been up and down for a 2nd season now. Neither has grabbed the bull by the horns yet. Basically the Caps don't have a clear cut #1 goalie right now. If you look at all the teams currently in a playoff position in the East, every team except the Caps has a #1 goalie going into the playoffs. Going with platoon goaltending into the playoffs with just 3 playoffs games of experience(Sammy), is a recipe for a 1st round exit. VV only has 20 min of playoff experience as he injured himself in his first ever playoff start, last season.

 

[SherVaughn30]

Fleury won 9 of the 32 wins in Pittsburgh’s latest two cup postseasons. He’s a career 0.913 workhorse with high variance. He’s apparently an excellent teammate and a wonderful person, but this was reminiscent of some of his playoff performances with Pittsburgh

Fleury actually became a better goalie after leaving the Pens. When he took Vegas into the Cup Final against the Caps, Fleury was playing a lot better than when he won the Cup as the Pens #1 goalie in '09.

 

[harv33173]

Fleury actually became a better goalie after leaving the Pens. When he took Vegas into the Cup Final against the Caps, Fleury was playing a lot better than when he won the Cup as the Pens #1 goalie in '09.

would be a great fit for the florida panthers. could replace bobrosky who is not suited to playoff hockey in my opinion.

 

[Bevans]

First, we’re doing some extreme retconning if we’re talking as if Eichel was seen as a broken asset that no one wanted. Mannnnny teams were interested in him but felt he was overvalued by BUF. The neck hurt his value for sure, but it didn’t make his worth diminish to that it was comparable to DeBrincat.

Next, I actually audibly laughed at the concept that Eichel isn’t a useful barometer because we’ve never seen a player like DeBrincat traded.

I ask you simply to give me a comparable haul to what you want for a player in the last 10 years. You’re pitching this as if DeBrincat has significant term on a league minimum deal. He makes 6.5 and has a year left before presumably negotiating what will be his big deal. It’s not the most enviable contract in league history. I don’t see how this gets more than a first, top prospect, mid prospect/pick.

Eichel is not a useful barometer for anyone. If you want to go from thread to thread saying "yeah but eichel!", gloss over all the extremely rare circumstances that surrounded his trade, and talk down krebs and tuch despite their very strong starts, then have at it. But be prepared to rightfully be called out on it consistently.

 

[SherVaughn30]

I think the Caps would be comfortable with Holtby. You are trying to make a case the Caps should spend more than they will. If it takes their first round pick, the Caps say no. If it takes McMichael or Lapierre or Protas, the Caps say no. Trade Fluery somewhere else

Being a Caps fan, I would be fine if they traded Sammy. Is Lankinen supposed to be the Hawks next #1 goalie or are the Hawks not sure?

 

[Skrudland2Lomakin]

Eichel is not a useful barometer for anyone. If you want to go from thread to thread saying "yeah but eichel!", gloss over all the extremely rare circumstances that surrounded his trade, and talk down krebs and tuch despite their very strong starts, then have at it. But be prepared to rightfully be called out on it consistently.

No one has done literally any of this. Eichel was used as an establishment of market prices. You can say he’s s unique case, but literally all trades are. He is a valuable context in his own right to the rate of players and picks in this market.

I’m like 12 posts into the conversation still waiting for anyone to provide any alternative offer and comps thst justify it beyond just naysaying.


It’s exceptionally easy to play the game of “wronnnnng, terrible offer”, but folks get tight lipped when asked what a good offer is and why.

 

[Crow]

Being a Caps fan, I would be fine if they traded Sammy. Is Lankinen supposed to be the Hawks next #1 goalie or are the Hawks not sure?

Probably not, more of a stopgap for a couple years unless he somehow improves unexpectedly.

 

[echlfreak]

Probably not, more of a stopgap for a couple years unless he somehow improves unexpectedly.

Lankinen is a decent low cost back up. He hasn't been able to play many games this year with MAF and his first few games were under the horrible JC system which even MAF sucked under.

 

[Crow]

Lankinen is a decent low cost back up. He hasn't been able to play many games this year with MAF and his first few games were under the horrible JC system which even MAF sucked under.

I agree with you but seeing as how we are going to suck for a couple years, I expect to see a lot of him after MAF leaves one way or the other.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Caps seem intent on recreating the Pens 2016-17 Cup rosters.

 

[Bevans]

No one has done literally any of this. Eichel was used as an establishment of market prices. You can say he’s s unique case, but literally all trades are. He is a valuable context in his own right to the rate of players and picks in this market.

I’m like 12 posts into the conversation still waiting for anyone to provide any alternative offer and comps thst justify it beyond just naysaying.


It’s exceptionally easy to play the game of “wronnnnng, terrible offer”, but folks get tight lipped when asked what a good offer is and why.

This is a fleury thread. I gave a fleury range. I didn't compare fleury to eichel as that would be about as dumb as comparing him to Debrincat.

Have fun with your Eichel Thermometer.

 

[Hockey4Lyfe]

Whats your comp trade then? What player/haul do you feel is a fair comparison to this trade?

Because this is my issue with HFboards trade proposal analysis, they often just ferry in the realm of “not enough” or “way too much” and they never seem to

A). Offer alternatives

B). Justify those alternatives with actual trade comps that have established values league wide

Why am I not allowed to say it’s ludicrous without giving actual players or a package? There isn’t some standard that people need to be held to to post their opinions.

Why in the hell would the Blackhawks want Schultz right now? He’s a negative asset with his contract. They would need a sweetener just to take him.

Vanecek and a 3rd makes sense for MAF.

So that leaves Schultz (a player almost no one would want without a sweetener) and a 1st for Debrincat. A dude that’s 24 and already one of the very best goal scorers in the league.

You aren’t getting him with a late round 1st and an aging plug defenseman.

 

[IafrateOvie34]

Caps seem intent on recreating the Pens 2016-17 Cup rosters.

Why not, it worked.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDo]

Fleury actually became a better goalie after leaving the Pens. When he took Vegas into the Cup Final against the Caps, Fleury was playing a lot better than when he won the Cup as the Pens #1 goalie in '09.

He was a 0.930 playoff goalie in 2008 when the Pens lost to the Wings. Like I said high variability.

 

[shtorm2005]

 

[Fallschirmyager]

So let me get this straight. He has a limited No Movement Clause where he names 10 teams that are absolute no's? So any of the other 21 teams he is subject to and if the CAPS are one of those teams he can say he'd prefer not to but can't technically say no?

 

[Mrfenn92]

So let me get this straight. He has a limited No Movement Clause where he names 10 teams that are absolute no's? So any of the other 21 teams he is subject to and if the CAPS are one of those teams he can say he'd prefer not to but can't technically say no?

Correct

 

[Skrudland2Lomakin]

Why am I not allowed to say it’s ludicrous without giving actual players or a package? There isn’t some standard that people need to be held to to post their opinions.

Why in the hell would the Blackhawks want Schultz right now? He’s a negative asset with his contract. They would need a sweetener just to take him.

Vanecek and a 3rd makes sense for MAF.

So that leaves Schultz (a player almost no one would want without a sweetener) and a 1st for Debrincat. A dude that’s 24 and already one of the very best goal scorers in the league.

You aren’t getting him with a late round 1st and an aging plug defenseman.

Schultz isn’t an asset, he’s an expiring UFA that has a 4.5 million cap hit. Thought it was obvious he’s included literally to make the salary cap work.

I think you are vaaaaaastly over valuing MAF, a guy literally acquired by you last year for a warm body. Obviously the context of the season is relevant, but I’m not seeing how he, an aging G on expiring deal, is worth more than a 3rd. I ask for your counter because it forces you to reckon with the reality that there isn’t any G traded that yield a ton more.


Vanecek is included because he’s a desirable G project on a friendly deal, teams losing Gs tend to like replacements . I don’t see why CHI wouldn’t.


The first +Protas seems fair value to me for DeBrincat as I’ve explained his current contract isn’t a steal and Protas is a future top 6, I don’t think you’ll see a windfall but I’ve explained this ad nauseum

 

[StephenPeat]

That's your opinion. I'm merely pointing out what we all know Washington is interested in MAF , his experience and play makes him a worthy risk plus Washington is signaling there weakness is in goal. Chicago I'm sure is having discussions with many teams , to my understanding they want multiple draft picks and elite young prospects.

Washington isn't getting MAF for free nor is Chicago taking on a bad contract and not getting a great return.

Trade deadline deals usually not always but 80% of the time teams pay higher prices for the 1 chance to win a cup.

Washington will not pay anything like you’re suggesting for a Pure Rental Marc-Andre Fleury.

 

[Empoleon8771]

So let me get this straight. He has a limited No Movement Clause where he names 10 teams that are absolute no's? So any of the other 21 teams he is subject to and if the CAPS are one of those teams he can say he'd prefer not to but can't technically say no?

Yes but trading a future HHoFer against his will to a team he doesn't want to go to is a great way to sour future relations with other players.

 

[StephenPeat]

Your not a serious person, anyone who has no clue as to how major league sports and trades work is nothing more than the peanut gallery. Besides your not the GM so get a grip on reality.

Trades are commenced between 2 teams who are both seeking a particular outcome and both teams understand in order to make such a deal there must be a give and take.

MAF isn't some low level player so they asking price and or the receiving team must be willing to make a realistic offer.

This is an example of horrible self-aggrandizing logic. We get you love Fleury more than his mother. GMs of actual teams are based in reality, your opinion is just #BASED.