Confirmed with Link: Canucks sign Ashton Sautner to an entry level deal

Pip

Registered User
Feb 2, 2012
69,190
8,518
Granduland
The guy philly signed is 5'8 162lbs.....

The chances of him making the NHL are much slimmer than Sautners

What makes you think his chances are lower than Sautners?

The kid has great speed and obviously a great offensive game. Yeah he's a longshot but to me he looks like he has better tools to become an NHLer, despite his size.

These guys are all going to be longshots, but I'd rather bank on ones with projectable tools and good hockey IQ who have proven to be the elite of the CHL.
 

arsmaster*

Guest
The guy philly signed is 5'8 162lbs.....

The chances of him making the NHL are much slimmer than Sautners

How big is that kid playing on calgary's top line?

I just watched that kid play twice in a week and he's dynamic, feisty, understands positioning and how to manipulate defenders and space.

How much Sautner have you seen? People are going crazy with Tanev/Giordano projections so I can only assume these people haven't watched this player.
 

FroshaugFan2

Registered User
Dec 7, 2006
7,133
1,173
Where would the 'Nucks be right now without Lack, Tanev, Burrows and Kenins?...sometimes those undrafted players really work out....even though guys like McEneny, Fox, Archibald and Sautner may not pan out, they're still better value than some of the duds the 'Nucks have drafted in later rounds.:handclap:
Notice how none of those guys were signed as CHL overagers? Even Burrows didn't get an NHL contact until he was an established AHLer.

Unless an overager is dominanting the CHL and has corrected the deficiencies that kept him from being drafted I would be weary of giving them ELCs. I prefer signing guys like Lack and Kenins who have already proven themselves at a pro level and you have a better idea that they can step into the AHL no problem.

I'm not against this signing as I don't know much about Saunter, just nothing I have heard about him has wowed me and made me say we need this guy signed to an NHL deal. It certainly isn't a Stefan Schneider kind of contact where you know there is no hope right from the beginning.
 

arsmaster*

Guest
Stanton type rise is the best you can hope for. Giordano and Tanev are just pie in the sky hopes IMO.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
23,887
7,982
Pickle Time Deli & Market
What makes you think his chances are lower than Sautners?

The kid has great speed and obviously a great offensive game. Yeah he's a longshot but to me he looks like he has better tools to become an NHLer, despite his size.

These guys are all going to be longshots, but I'd rather bank on ones with projectable tools and good hockey IQ who have proven to be the elite of the CHL.

Saunter has tools. He also isn't a smurf on skates.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
23,887
7,982
Pickle Time Deli & Market
How big is that kid playing on calgary's top line?

I just watched that kid play twice in a week and he's dynamic, feisty, understands positioning and how to manipulate defenders and space.

How much Sautner have you seen? People are going crazy with Tanev/Giordano projections so I can only assume these people haven't watched this player.

Can't compare gaudreau and someone who played in the Q.

What Gaudreau did at BC was flat out impressive. And that NCAA is just flat out a better league than the Q.
 

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,682
84,499
Vancouver, BC
Saunter has tools. He also isn't a smurf on skates.

Explain his tools and what he does that projects as an NHL player. Because I've seen him a lot and can't really think of anything.

As a defender, your three 'foundation skills' are hockey sense, mobility, and size/strength. He comes up short on all 3.
 

arsmaster*

Guest
He put up about the same ppg his last year as Corrado did.

Give the kid a chance. I haven't seen him play enough to comment on him. But to write him off now is just dumb.

But you're taking a hard line stance with people who've seen him a lot. You don't see a problem with that.

Corrado didn't play his overage season. He was also invited to team Canada wj camp.

He was a better prospect than sautner by miles and miles.

I could google a bust with the same stats. You're trying to convince people who have seen him that he's something he isn't.

I'll leave you to it.
 

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,682
84,499
Vancouver, BC
He put up about the same ppg his last year as Corrado did.

Give the kid a chance. I haven't seen him play enough to comment on him. But to write him off now is just dumb.

Corrado is bigger than Sautner, has plus mobility, and has vastly superior hockey IQ. He nearly made the Canadian WJC team for a reason. There are tons of CHL defenders who can score ~40 points at 19 or 20, and most don't project as NHL players.

I'm not 'writing him off'. I hope he proves me wrong and does well, and I'm cheering for him to succeed. But based on what I've seen, the odds of that are very small and he isn't a player I would have signed.
 

Pip

Registered User
Feb 2, 2012
69,190
8,518
Granduland
He put up about the same ppg his last year as Corrado did.

Give the kid a chance. I haven't seen him play enough to comment on him. But to write him off now is just dumb.

I don't know a ton about the kid, I'm just trying to figure out what he has that will help him become a possible NHLer. His production certainly doesn't blow me away so I was hoping for an encouraging skillset.

The Fox signing was one I could get behind. A guy who scored at a ridiculous goal scoring pace who had an NHL caliber shot that would be among the best on our team right now. Yeah he's not working out but he was a decent gamble IMO.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
23,887
7,982
Pickle Time Deli & Market
Corrado is bigger than Sautner, has plus mobility, and has vastly superior hockey IQ. He nearly made the Canadian WJC team for a reason. There are tons of CHL defenders who can score ~40 points at 19 or 20, and most don't project as NHL players.

I'm not 'writing him off'. I hope he proves me wrong and does well, and I'm cheering for him to succeed. But based on what I've seen, the odds of that are very small and he isn't a player I would have signed.

Yeah, I mean. I can't really defend Sautner here. Personally, I haven't watched enough of him to know what kind of player he is.

But, to write him off now seems a bit silly. Don't think he'll be the next Tanev/Giordano, he might be a decent AHLer or a bottom pairing guy in the NHL if he pans out and there's nothing wrong with that.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
23,887
7,982
Pickle Time Deli & Market
But you're taking a hard line stance with people who've seen him a lot. You don't see a problem with that.

Corrado didn't play his overage season. He was also invited to team Canada wj camp.

He was a better prospect than sautner by miles and miles.

I could google a bust with the same stats. You're trying to convince people who have seen him that he's something he isn't.

I'll leave you to it.

I'm taking a hard stance because I don't like it when people write off prospects too early.

Kid should be given a chance to show himself in training camp before I make any conclusions about him.

I don't know a ton about the kid, I'm just trying to figure out what he has that will help him become a possible NHLer. His production certainly doesn't blow me away so I was hoping for an encouraging skillset.

The Fox signing was one I could get behind. A guy who scored at a ridiculous goal scoring pace who had an NHL caliber shot that would be among the best on our team right now. Yeah he's not working out but he was a decent gamble IMO.

I understand.

Again, to repeat myself. I have not watched enough of Sautner to know his upside. I just think that writing him off now is silly.
 

Pip

Registered User
Feb 2, 2012
69,190
8,518
Granduland
Yeah, I mean. I can't really defend Sautner here. Personally, I haven't watched enough of him to know what kind of player he is.

But, to write him off now seems a bit silly. Don't think he'll be the next Tanev/Giordano, he might be a decent AHLer or a bottom pairing guy in the NHL if he pans out and there's nothing wrong with that.

There's a difference between writing him off and thinking that he was not the best use of a contract spot. Nobody is saying that there's zero chance he'll work out.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
23,887
7,982
Pickle Time Deli & Market
There's a difference between writing him off and thinking that he was not the best use of a contract spot. Nobody is saying that there's zero chance he'll work out.

Yeah I get that.

Usually, you'd prefer to take a chance at a guy like Fox who was low risk high reward kind of types. But, maybe Benning sees something in this Sautner kid. Who knows.

I'll wait till training camp. Maybe he'll surprise.
 

tc 23

#GaunceForGM
Dec 11, 2012
11,358
21
Vancouver
Yeah, I mean. I can't really defend Sautner here. Personally, I haven't watched enough of him to know what kind of player he is.

But, to write him off now seems a bit silly. Don't think he'll be the next Tanev/Giordano, he might be a decent AHLer or a bottom pairing guy in the NHL if he pans out and there's nothing wrong with that.

No ones writing him off though.

I've kept up with the thread and, from the sound of things, some people who have seen him play a number of times feel he won't project to be an NHL player because he lacks the tools that will let him succeed at the next level.

I don't think there's anything wrong with those having educated opinions not projecting Sautner to be a decent NHL or AHL player. No one jumped on RS for giving his thoughts based on viewings, yet so many are jumping MS for giving his.

At the end of the day, it's pretty inconsequential as it costs nothing but a contract slot but you have to wonder if there are better gambles out there.
 

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,682
84,499
Vancouver, BC
I'm taking a hard stance because I don't like it when people write off prospects too early.

Kid should be given a chance to show himself in training camp before I make any conclusions about him.

If you haven't seen him, fair enough to wait to make judgment.

But for those of us who have seen this player play a ton, it's fair enough to make a judgment now. And that judgment isn't 'writing him off', it's that he wasn't a great choice for a contract slot.

It isn't like he's some unknown quantity (as Stanton was to an extent after spending his WHL career on HORRIBLE Moose Jaw teams). He's played on one of the most high-profile WHL teams for the last 4 years, deep into the playoffs, and in 2 Memorial Cups. He's had a ton of exposure and was never drafted for a reason.

And prospects are pretty much never written off too early.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
23,887
7,982
Pickle Time Deli & Market
No ones writing him off though.

I've kept up with the thread and, from the sound of things, some people who have seen him play a number of times feel he won't project to be an NHL player because he lacks the tools that will let him succeed at the next level.

I don't think there's anything wrong with those having educated opinions not projecting Sautner to be a decent NHL or AHL player. No one jumped on RS for giving his thoughts based on viewings, yet so many are jumping MS for giving his.

At the end of the day, it's pretty inconsequential as it costs nothing but a contract slot but you have to wonder if there are better gambles out there.

Yeah I guess you are right.

Just woke up and haven't had my coffee yet.

Sorry MS.


We'll see with Sautner though. Hope he pans out.
 

Verviticus

Registered User
Jul 23, 2010
12,664
592
i'd take a dozen martels over sautners, but as i said before - there's really no way to know with ELC deals if the canucks had a chance at him. philly and a bunch of other teams could be offering and he just gets to pick whomever
 

me2

Go ahead foot
Jun 28, 2002
37,903
5,595
Make my day.
Stanton type rise is the best you can hope for. Giordano and Tanev are just pie in the sky hopes IMO.

that would be a great outcome. Even if he only tops out as a good AHLer/callup it will be a good use of a contract. So long as it doesn't cost the Canucks a player like Tochkin potentially cost the Canucks Roussel (if I recall the dates right) it should be a non-issue.
 

alternate

Win the week!
Jun 9, 2006
8,180
3,084
victoria
Losing a single contract slot to someone who may not play a game of NHL is poor management, and while trivial, these types of decisions can cumulate into something a lot worse later on down the road.

That's pretty unrealistic of an expectation though. Every player signed to a contract that hasn't yet played "a game of NHL" *may* not. In fact the opposite is very much true...to have a successful organization you're going to HAVE to allot a percentage of your contracts to players that have no shot at a game of NHL. I don't think that's a controversial statement.

At the end of the day, it's pretty inconsequential as it costs nothing but a contract slot but you have to wonder if there are better gambles out there.

Problem with "better gambles out there" is there's no guarantee you land them. There's potentially 30+ teams (the + being a Europe/KHL fall back for some UDFAs) bidding on a given asset. You can take a prospect like Sautner and say "well, other options exist" but those other assets aren't promised in anyway.

I believe you have to take a shotgun approach to signing UDFAs. Throw enough ****** hockey players against a wall, something will stick. Of every 10-15 UDFAs signed over a 3-5 year period you might get, what 2-3 that contribute at the NHL level, a few more that contribute at the AHL level (from a season long tryout to being a productive piece).

Benning saw something worth taking a chance on, and they added a piece for practically nothing. I'll take my standard position on added prospects and give him a couple years. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. If he becomes a contributor for Utica it's a good signing. Anything more, bonus. Anything less, *shrug*.
 

Cupless44

Registered User
Jun 25, 2014
7,154
3,298
I'm guessing the GM of the Canucks, a pretty experienced talent scout, would not have bothered to sign Sautner if he is a waste of time that doesn't have any chance to ever be an NHL player
 

arsmaster*

Guest
I'm guessing the GM of the Canucks, a pretty experienced talent scout, would not have bothered to sign Sautner if he is a waste of time that doesn't have any chance to ever be an NHL player

His time as major talent evaluator for the bruins didn't exactly turn up a bunch of hidden gems that I missed did it?
 

F A N

Registered User
Aug 12, 2005
18,721
5,957
Do people realize who we have down on the farm on defense?

With the "graduation" of Corrado, Andersson is currently the only Canucks drafted defenseman down on the farm (and who knows if he will be back). And Pedan is our only other prospect. The Comets are regularly dressing 4 veteran defensemen. In other words, both the Comets and the Wings can absorb a couple of defenseman that they are trying to develop. The Canucks also have a number of forwards taking up contract slots who may not have their contracts renewed next season (with only Cassels coming in). I wouldn't worry about the contract limit.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad