Post-Game Talk: Canucks Lose 4-3 (OT) vs Wild

VanJack

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Jul 11, 2014
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I'm just not getting the love for Garland.....the guy is a whirling dervish out there......but seems to me he gets very little accomplished. I'm just not sure that he's a legit top-six winger, and the Coyotes weren't convinced either, which is the reason they traded him.

He battles hard out there along the wall, but at his size, he's just too easy to eliminate. He's the logical guy to trade if there's a deal out there for a d-man.
 

quat

Faking Life
Apr 4, 2003
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Boeser and Miller both seem to really throw the Trust management has given them right back in their faces.

I know Chaos has a lot of supporters on here, but a point I was arguing earlier was the players with lower ceilings that play a steadier game and are a fraction of the cost, likely make the team equally as good (or as bad), because they're not impacting the other players as significantly. We've got two examples of this with Schenn and Burroughs, neither of whom are as good as Myers when he's on, but who's reliability is a net positive effect. It's why I've felt that it would be a positive trading Myers.

Of course he's not going to be traded and at some point he'll improve for a few games and the team will head back to hover around 500.

OEL predictably is aging out as expected.

They've had a lot of bad luck, and I don't see them beating the Sabres, but they'll begin winning more than they lose for a while as its very unlikely they're going to lose like this for much longer.

The down side is of course, it's so difficult to dig out of these kinds of holes. They may end up just missing the playoffs and Management will again believe they're holding a better hand than they have.

It's hard not to feel like this is a loser organization. You know, because of all the losing.

Good times 😊
 

Play

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I'm just not getting the love for Garland.....the guy is a whirling dervish out there......but seems to me he gets very little accomplished. I'm just not sure that he's a legit top-six winger, and the Coyotes weren't convinced either, which is the reason they traded him.

He battles hard out there along the wall, but at his size, he's just too easy to eliminate. He's the logical guy to trade if there's a deal out there for a d-man.
Call it how you see it sure. But it's easy to love him when he had the same amount of ES points as Miller last year, and you're not worried if he's on the ice when defending a lead.

Guy has offensive instincts and is only 26 and paid less than 5 mil. This is the very type of contracts and players we will aim to get when we run into a goal drought on a contending year
 
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Zippgunn

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May 15, 2011
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If the Canucks actually have a season as bad as this is shaping up to be… I think they’ll be hard pressed to keep Pettersson, Hughes, and Demko any longer. They are going to ask to be traded to contenders.

The infuriating thing is that you are right, every one of these guys (plus Boeser) would almost certainly be much happier playing somewhere else and I say GET RID OF THEM. Dangle Hughes to NJ, Demko to the Cali teams, Boeser to the Wild, Petterson to anybody. I say keep Horvat and start a whole new rebuild around him. Guys like Miller are complete cancers to a team...
 

B-rock

Registered User
Jun 29, 2003
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Pretty much.

I think if you replayed this road trip again and equaled out some of the breaks and gave us .900 goaltending we're 2-3 or 3-2. I mean, we were 4-0-1 after 40 minutes on this trip. Outside of a couple key players, the team overall didn't really play that badly. This is nothing like the start of 20-21 when we were just horrific and being blown apart by everyone other than Ottawa.

The points blown on this trip may absolutely f*** them later on in the season, but I'm not prepared to say 'We suck!' or 'this what to expect going forward' based on what happened on this very bizarre road trip.

Our next 9 games are pretty easy and mostly at home and I wouldn't be surprised at all to see us go 6-3 and be right back at .500. But I also wouldn't be surprised if the team is broken mentally by this and spiral into a coaching change by November. I literally have no idea.
Agreed. We don't see the multiple odd man rushes every game like we have in the Green years.
 

valkynax

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simpsons-suckiest.gif

EDIT: wrong picture
 

mossey3535

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Feb 7, 2011
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I mean there are some positive signs compared to the Green era, but that's a bar about as high as a crack in the sidewalk.

They have to win some games. Doesn't matter how. Doesn't matter if it's "unlucky". They have to show they can win. I think that's the real issue - we all know they sucked for basically three years. Green is gone. The excuses are gone. This core hasn't earned that kind of leeway where we can brush off a 5-game losing streak to start the season. Not only did they suck in these past few seasons, there weren't even many positive indications that they would improve. And then we're rolling out the same crew?

If we're going to play every 5-game segment up to 50% odds, where does that leave us? We'd be below where we finished last year.
 

tyhee

Registered User
Feb 5, 2015
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legit question
Is it very possible for this ownership to finally give up and start over ?
It is hard to see happening, isn't it?

The biggest problem is that if the management group were to reverse direction, they'd be faced with the embarrassing fact that they've hurt the team just about as much as Benning could have in the same circumstances. Signing Mikhayev for more term and money that most would have thought reasonable when they needed help more elsewhere is the least of the issues, really. Re-upping Boeser without then trading him and re-upping Miller for $56 million starting as he reaches hockey senior age are going to hurt, especially Miller. Now they' may have to include a sweetener to get rid of Boeser and Miller's trade value is steadily dropping. By the end of this season his trade value could be negative. That would make signing him instead of trading him for whatever they could get a disastrous mistake with horrible long-term consequences.

They're more likely to hang on and hope things turn around enough to make their moves appear justifiable.
 
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VanillaCoke

Registered User
Oct 30, 2013
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i disagree this team has looked good. they've had decent and even good periods but they've been absolutely ragdolled at least one period of every game. they need to go a whole 60 before they get let off the hook
The excuses are hilarious and ridiculous and seemingly never ending.

Setting multiple league records for losing is in no way indicative of a team playing nearly good enough.
 

CalderSchmalder

Registered User
Jul 26, 2009
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The only silver lining I can see is that we started out the season on a 5 game cross continent road trip (including 3 games in 4 days) which is tough. That doesn't completely excuse poor performances from Miller and others though, they need to step it up for this upcoming homestand.
 

nuxnux1

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Oct 17, 2022
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Get rid of horvat and boeser for anything on a defense upgrade that you can get, keep garland we need his sparkplug style play
 

tantalum

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This is where I’m at.

They’ve been the better team for the majority of each game they’ve played. Statistically speaking, most games like that probably go their way. But they aren’t catching a single break, and they’ve got a massive case of the yips once they have a lead.

I really don’t think it’s true they’ve been the better team overall in their games. It’s only a handful of games in but 5-on-5 they are well below 50% for xGF share. They’ve actually outperformed the expected by a fair degree but still that puts them at a saw off.

The best you can say is that they’ve played even with the competition at ES thus far. Not better. And then at critical moments, special teams and critical positions they have been the poorer team.

I strongly feel from what I’ve watched that 2 points in 10 is well within where you’d expect them to be over this small sample size. It’s not really luck. At least 2 points is very much in the high probability zone. The only thing really necessary for this team to go from average to well below is the goaltending that they’ve received.

They make too many mistakes at too many critical times that without huge save after huge save they will not win many games. Those saves will come from Demko but at what rate and when? Because the team can’t be successful with even average goaltending. They also are a team that can MUST have no passengers on the night to be successful and in every game this year there have been multiple ones (to me last night for instance none of Miller, Garland or Boeser would have been missed if they were stapled to the bench).

And that’s the dilemma/problem management has to build a team (besides the heap of shit Benning left them)…how do they build a team that doesn’t actually need Vezina like performances each and every night just to get a sniff at a wild card spot?
 
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MarkusNaslund19

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Dec 28, 2005
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Mostly decent most of the games. But 3-6 times a game just catastrophic peewee level breakdowns.

Concur with @MS that this season is weird and feels really unpredictable. We might be reminiscing about this weird start on the road in 15 games with a team that's 3 games over .500 and climbing, or the season could be over by November 15th.

4th line was really good and I think spoke to the difference between a coach and forum frequenters who 'always know better than the coach' (and this isn't a victory lap, Boudreau made some mistakes). Playing a team like Minnesota we needed some size and so the calls of scratching Joshua were incorrect and Hoglander was probably the right choice strategically (and apparently he was offered positive feedback about his play and told he will be back in there soon).
Our 4th line had some good cycling shifts aside from the goals and absolutely did their part, even aside from the goals.

People who lump Pettersson in with the struggling stars are, in my opinion, completely misunderstanding what they are seeing. It's not always about results, it's about process and process creates results. Pettersson looks incisive and instinctive again and had a lot of really good plays. Like what I'm seeing from Kuzmenko and Podkolzin a lot as well.
I saw someone saying 'hitting the crossbar and looking up at the sky' is completely useless and he should be dealt (re: Pettersson) and I can only guess that person never played. It's a faaaast game and precision is tough. Hitting the post means you're doing the right thing and getting unfortunate. It's not about 'not wanting it enough' or some bullshit like that (though I suspect that was said in frustration by the poster).

Pearson's taking some dumb penalties but he's not a selfish player, they come at inopportune times but he's trying to do the right thing. I sort of doubt you bench a guy like that, but I will totally concede that that just happened at an awful awful time. But let's also not forget that he created the first goal and his hard work down low created the pp with 5 minutes left that we very well could have won the game on.

Garland had a couple of good shifts but was largely ineffective.

Horvat is getting better but I'm still not liking how much his default feels like it's finesse oriented. He's making too many soft 'hope' plays, almost cheating for offense and I wonder if it's because he wants to put up numbers to justify his contract demands, etc. He's getting better, but he's got the body type of Nathan Mackinnon, he should be an absolute puck battle menace and at times in his career he has been, hasn't felt that way so far.

Boeser has been basically invisible. He's playing with a bad hand, I believe, but maybe it's time to rest him up if we're healthy and he looks like this. I think people are being waaaay premature saying we should dump him for nothing and I think that will be an obviously bad take soon, but I can't deny he looks bad out there. Total non-factor thus far.

Mikheyev is just finding his way and I'm kind of excited to see what it looks like when the team figures out how to utilize his speed. Lobs to the right spot and him skating under it almost like a wide-receiver. Saw that shorthanded with the Leafs last year, this year he gets to play with some more talent (Leafs top end is better obviously, but he wasn't getting those linemates), so I'm hopeful that guys like Petterson and Kuzmenko can give real finesse precision passes for him to skate onto.

I wonder how the "mIlLeR iS tHe rEaL cApTaIn cUz hE lOoKs mAd sUmtImEz' people are feeling about him right now.
He was slightly better tonight, but I'm genuinely appalled by him so far. The shift after the Wild tied it up on the pp in the 3rd Miller made an unconscionably stupid long cross ice pass from the center red line back from the right side to the LD and it was almost a disastrous giveaway.
I'm not some troglodyte who thinks you can never pass backwards, but situational awareness man. It was a high-risk, no reward play with a fragile team in a tie game in the third. Unforgiveable, and it was far from his only bad play.

Playing him with Boeser and Myers in OT was a game ender as well. Who is the speed and tenacity out there? Boeser needs to be sheltered in 3-on-3 (and shouldn't be playing in it right now) and last year's Miller would have been fine. He's been a trainwreck this year and got exposed over and over. Lazy swings at the puck, being out battled by guys he has 20 lbs on. I just don't get it.

Liking Burroughs a lot relative to expectations. Personally, I think he should always play above Poolman.
Schenn looks a little worse this season, but that's probably because his warts aren't being seamlessly covered by Hughes thus far.

Myers is still catching up to the game but in the 3rd period on 4 on 4 he made two incredibly stupid plays I can't get my head around. With time and space he lobbed the puck from our zone towards Wild players in the neutral zone with no Canucks within a time zone of the puck. The team has been talking about pushing forward, not being passive etc and this was pure passivity. I was reminded of old Kung-Fu movies where the old master takes on a student and decimates him and then does the 'come hither motion' and says "again!", except minus the skill, plan, poise and wisdom. Made no sense.
But I will offer the benefit of the doubt that I think it takes him a long time to catch up to the game mentally and he is coming off injury and abbreviated camp.

People saying Hughes is a forward on D (mostly main boards) are just trying to be the Washington Generals of dumb takes, easily getting dunked on. He's shown his potential for two entire seasons and had a bad shortened season and 5 tough games. He's also coming off of an illness and is 2nd in the league for ice time. He's labouring, doesn't trust his feet and is falling down a lot. Because he doesn't trust himself (and he's a brilliantly instinctive player) he's over thinking and making bad mistakes.
He looks bad out there, but there are explanations and they aren't "Hey that 22 year old superstar secretly sucks lmao".

OEL looked better tonight. I was discouraged by his first few games, thought he looked a bit timid and a bit slow. He was letting the play come to him and using his superlative defensive hockey sense quite a bit better tonight.
7.2 million is likely to age poorly at the end, and there are obviously already better ways to spend that money, but he's a useful player and looked better tonight.

Stillman is just okay. Hope he's okay and appreciated him standing up for his teammates.

Demko looked better for parts of the game, but the last goal was so uncharacteristically bad. Like in an entire season of over a thousand games how many times do you see a goalie misread a rebound so badly that he lunges out of the net and turns around? Just wild.
He has absolutely earned a massive benefit of the doubt and I imagine visiting with Clarke at home will yield big dividends but he has been a problem so far. I'm not worried at all overall, but you can't hide from how bad he has been at times.

A couple of bad line deployments by Boudreau (Boeser Miller Myers in OT, not enough of Podz/Petey line, too much Boeser and Miller).

I like Boudreau a lot and always have, but I'm not entirely convinced (though I hope he is) he's the right coach for this team right now. Will be curious to see what happens.
 

4Twenty

Registered User
Dec 18, 2018
9,987
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People keep repeating it but they’ve absolutely NOT been very good on this trip. Getting leads doesn’t = playing well.

It also neglects that the last 3 opponents were also poor and having bad starts.

I thought last night was better but the same malaise is evident.
 

Reverend Mayhem

Lowly Serf/Reluctant Cuckold
Feb 15, 2009
28,280
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Port Coquitlam, BC
I still have absolutely no idea what to make of this start. It's one of the weirdest stretches of games I can ever remember seeing.

It's like the season STILL hasn't started. At least for some players. I don't know, I think we may be in territory right now where the individual pieces are more valuable than the sum. Which to me says there's absolutely no cohesion. I mean, what's this team's identity?
 

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,528
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Some of the moves the new management has made... are truly reminiscent of Jimbo.

Signing Boeser was a mistake, especially for that price. He has been an anchor on any line he has been on for the last few years and continues it... frustrating.

It really feels like the late regime hasn't changed too much with the silly signings this off season where the defense wasn't even looked at. Same old, same old for the Canucks

Ownership stayed the same and that has been the problem all along as they simply won't buy the rebuild that Linden asked for so long ago and we have seen the results or rather the lack of them.
 

TruGr1t

Proper Villain
Jun 26, 2003
23,176
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I'm just not getting the love for Garland.....the guy is a whirling dervish out there......but seems to me he gets very little accomplished. I'm just not sure that he's a legit top-six winger, and the Coyotes weren't convinced either, which is the reason they traded him.

He battles hard out there along the wall, but at his size, he's just too easy to eliminate. He's the logical guy to trade if there's a deal out there for a d-man.

He's better than Boeser and makes less money.
 

DFAC

Registered User
Jan 19, 2008
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It's almost comical at this point that its happened again. Blowing another lead late, sigh
 

BenningHurtsMySoul

Unfair Huggy Bear
Mar 18, 2008
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We share a record with the Golden Seals!


Aren't these two of the worst teams of all time lmao

Everybody knew the contracts for Myers and OEL weren't going to age well......and so far this season it looks like they've fallen off a cliff.

But the real worry is Miller's contract. It doesn't even kick for another season and then has seven more years to run. If this run of games is any indication, that contract might end up being up there with Louie Eriksson. He's been that bad through five games.
If Miller doesn't turn it around, you have to pray you can unload him without giving up anything substantial alongside it.
 

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