Can Toronto Sports ever catch a break?

[Maestro84]

And Toronto has 13 Stanley Cup wins and 2 World Series wins, if you want to start listing off what franchises have done lately. The Bulls have looked like **** since Jordan retired... at the end of the 90's. The Canadians haven't won jack since 1993; that was 25 years ago.



BUT haven't won a single one. And now they're suffering from a decade of selling off up-and-coming young players to try and extend their "championship chances"...

Yea but none since TV added colour, and it was only a 6-team league....

All the cities above have won multiple championships since the last time a Toronto team in general has even made a finals of a major sport...especially the Leafs

 

[indigobuffalo]

1. They're an exciting team but they haven't won or proven anything yet (i.e. they've won zero playoff series)
2. The Warriors were missing a 2x MVP and he greatest shooter ever in Steph Curry, a DPOY candidate in Draymond Green and when healthy, arguably the best centre in the league in Boogie Cousins. If they're even 50% healthy, no team realistically stands a chance against GSW
3. The amount of calls that go against the Raps, especially in the playoffs, proves exactly why the league doesn't want them to make it far. It would be MUCH better for the NBA as a business if the finals was say Philly vs GSW or Boston vs GSW since they know the league will get more money and have easier marketability if it were an all-American finals. Yea they'll gain some Canadian fans but having a Canadian team make the finals could be detrimental to the views in America cuz now American fans have to choose between the Warriors winning another title or a Canadian team winning at "their sport," in other words that'd be a lose-lose situation for most US fans. Ultimately, the leagues doesn't want to lose American viewers in the playoffs at the expense of a Canadian teams presence. In terms of why they have a team, well they were about to until Vince Carter took the league by storm in the early 2000's, and after that it became impossible for them to be relocated.

No professional sport gives a rat’s left nut about what fans think. They care about making the smartest business decisions with the greatest long-term outlook.

If Adam Silver got a report on his desk that showed that if they relocated the Lakers to Iqaluit NU it would generate more profit for the League (and it’s owners) you’d better believe Silver would be signing that deal.

Fans get butt hurt over the tiniest things. These are billion dollar industries.

Expanding the market is a proven winner. It’s why all the leagues are playing games in Europe, expanding to Vegas, and looking under every rock and crevasse for another opportunity to make a buck.

If viewership is down for one year but it means in 3 years they recoup that lost revenue and then some, then that is the decision they will make.

Just like Bettman doesn’t give a shit that people boo him because there’s a team in Carolina but not in Saskatoon. He DGAF.

 

[Aho and the Bunnaman]

Yeah I dunno what you want with this thread dude. Toronto sports have sucked for most part, except for brief periods of fun like the early 90s Jays or the Pat Quinn Leafs or the MLSE teams of the past half decade. Move to Boston if it upsets you so much?

 

[Bedards Dad]

Ya, but you are an ultimate cheerleader. You love everything and every team. Meanwhile the leafs can't win a playoff round and the Raptors can't get past LeBron James.

I'm a happy person who enjoys life and finds the best in things. I realize its only a game and let the bad roll off. I'll support through thick and thin, but have bigger things to worry about.

Kind of sad it has such a negative hold on your life.

 

[Quarter]

The fact that this is the best the leafs have been in living memory is kinda sad, and the Raptors are not winning a title with Gsw healthy and around, plus having a Canadian team winning in basketball is easily the NBA commissioner's biggest nightmare

I said 'promising', not 'successful'. The city of Toronto has had more prominent (however limited) success in the past 5 years than the city had in the decade (04 to 14) preceding that. Off the top of my head, the last 5 years have seen 2 consecutive ALCS appearances, 1 MLS Cup, 1 CONCACAF CL Final appearance, 3 Canadian Championships, and the best seasons in Leafs and Raptors franchise histories while likely having even more from both the Leafs and Raptors, to maybe even the Jays and Toronto FC in the coming years as well.

Compare that to 2 Grey Cups, 2 NLL Championships, and 4 Canadian Championships with zero hype and little promise surrounding literally every franchise in the city between 04 and 14 (there has to be some irony that the worst sides that Toronto FC put out also managed to have the most silverware of any recent Toronto-based sports team).

So yeah, Toronto sports has it pretty good right now.

 

[ottomaddox]

I'm a happy person who enjoys life and finds the best in things. I realize its only a game and let the bad roll off. I'll support through thick and thin, but have bigger things to worry about.

Kind of sad it has such a negative hold on your life.

It's too bad you make such judgements based on the way I post, but have no idea how happy my personal life is too.

 

[Bedards Dad]

It's too bad you make such judgements based on the way I post, but have no idea how happy my personal life is too.

What else would I form an opinion on? Not sure why you even watch with how much you seem to dislike the Leafs.

 

[Advanced stats]

OP is definitely living in 2014.

The leafs are a top 3 team in the NHL and rising.


The raps are at least top 2 in the NBA, if not #1.

Tfc won last season...in a dominating way.

The blue Jays have done well recently, and have been re tooling in the last couple years, currently having the best prospect in the mlb in the last 10 years.

The Argos won last year... although no one cares.

Point is Toronto sports is extremely exciting, and improving rapidly. Every one of those teams has had multiple playoff appreances in the last 5 years. We're not celebrating and happy with playoffs, but we're overflowing in excitement for things to come and a very very bright future.





On a side note, if you want to bitch about reffing and anti Toronto bias in the NHL, NBA and MLB? Be my guest. I wouldn't argue with you .

 

[Damisoph]

What I'm taking from this thread is we have to wait until the team wins a championship, then we have reason to be excited.

 

[Maestro84]

No professional sport gives a rat’s left nut about what fans think. They care about making the smartest business decisions with the greatest long-term outlook.

If Adam Silver got a report on his desk that showed that if they relocated the Lakers to Iqaluit NU it would generate more profit for the League (and it’s owners) you’d better believe Silver would be signing that deal.

Fans get butt hurt over the tiniest things. These are billion dollar industries.

Expanding the market is a proven winner. It’s why all the leagues are playing games in Europe, expanding to Vegas, and looking under every rock and crevasse for another opportunity to make a buck.

If viewership is down for one year but it means in 3 years they recoup that lost revenue and then some, then that is the decision they will make.

Just like Bettman doesn’t give a **** that people boo him because there’s a team in Carolina but not in Saskatoon. He DGAF.

Yea but the smartest business decision in this case is to ensure teams based in their country (the US) plays in the finals and wins the chip. Revenue is always greater when a big American market wins the cup/plays in the finals.

 

[robertmac43]

What I'm taking from this thread is we have to wait until the team wins a championship, then we have reason to be excited.

I mean if you are TFC you can win a championship and still be "unlucky".

 

[robertmac43]

No professional sport gives a rat’s left nut about what fans think. They care about making the smartest business decisions with the greatest long-term outlook.

In NA this is 100% the case. The pendulum switches however in European Football. The fans have much more of a say and are more willing to use their power as fans to change the agenda of their team. For instance if ticket prices are rising to high fans have been none to have sit ins where instead of going to the game they stand outside the stadium to prove a point. For this reason clubs think more about their fans.

This is not the case 100% across clubs, but there is this sentiment in a lot of areas.

 

[indigobuffalo]

Yea but the smartest business decision in this case is to ensure teams based in their country (the US) plays in the finals and wins the chip. Revenue is always greater when a big American market wins the cup/plays in the finals.

But that’s not how business works.

Decisions aren’t made with concern only given to the immediate. These industries are all looking at the long-term. Looooooong-term.

Like I said... $5,000,000 today <<< $15,000,000 tomorrow.

 

[notDatsyuk]

I don't think the issue has to do with how well or poorly the teams are doing, but the perception that teams in Toronto get unfairly treated by the officials.

I agree that a fair number of fans in Toronto believe this, but I think that is perception rather than fact.

Virtually every team, no matter where they play, has a similar group of fans who feel the same. There will always be a certain percentage of fans - and players and coaches and sportswriters - who would rather blame officiating than admit to their own team's shortcomings.

Since this tendency is mainly a result of losing (winners credit themselves, losers blame others), it has been more noticeable in Toronto than some other cities, but that will likely change with better performances by the Leafs et al.

 

[Maestro84]

I don't think the issue has to do with how well or poorly the teams are doing, but the perception that teams in Toronto get unfairly treated by the officials.

I agree that a fair number of fans in Toronto believe this, but I think that is perception rather than fact.

Virtually every team, no matter where they play, has a similar group of fans who feel the same. There will always be a certain percentage of fans - and players and coaches and sportswriters - who would rather blame officiating than admit to their own team's shortcomings.

Since this tendency is mainly a result of losing (winners credit themselves, losers blame others), it has been more noticeable in Toronto than some other cities, but that will likely change with better performances by the Leafs et al.

Yea this thread is mostly about the amount of unlucky incidents that have occurred in Toronto sports, which has been a atrial contributor to this city's lack of winning, and many times, the team that underwent that call fell back to oblivion in the season(s) following that blown chance. Although for the most part, it was just the city's teams being well...bad LOL

Idk about the Leafs but other Toronto teams tend to get a lot of calls go against them. I'm not sure if it was fully proven or not but the Raps vs Nets series was deemed as one which was rigged by the refs cuz they wanted to see Brooklyn advance to play the Heat. Many calls throughout the whole series was going in favour of the Nets and the Raps were hardly getting any calls. They've had tons of called go against them when playing LeBron (basketball's golden boy) over the years too. Kawhi's not getting as many foul calls as he used to get on SA too, which is no coincidence imo.

The Jays have had phantom calls not go in their favor as well. 2015 ALCS, balls were being called strikes for the Jays and they even failed to call an obvious fan interference to award KC an extra HR which was ultimately the reason they lost in 2015. They also had many calls go against them in game 2 (I think it was) the round before vs the Rangers, but the Jays ended up coming back in that series so all was forgiven and forgotten.

Although I wasn't old enough to have seen this live, I've watched the replay of the '92 WS between the Jays & Braves, and the umps in that series were clearly trying to give Atlanta as many calls as possible since replay wasn't around then. They also hung the Canadian flag backwards as a method of further distraction by the Yanks to get into the Jays' head and prevent them from winning. Good thing the Jays were able to pull through in this series too.

Fixing in sports leagues such as the big 4 is not uncommon either as the Kings vs Lakers WCF in 2002 was literally proven rigged in court when an NBA official went to jail for betting on games including that series mentioned above. It's also happened on grand sport's stages too as South Korea somehow finished in 3rd place at the WC in 2002 (wow '02 was a rough year for ethical officiating), when the Koreans got COUNTLESS calls go their way against Italy and Spain

 

[Le Cobra]

Man tonight was yet another reminder as to why being a Toronto sports fan can be a suffering experience. I just finished watching the Raptors vs Nuggets game which ended on a bogus call in favour of Denver, and I thought to myself...man Toronto sports teams always have things backfire on them during the biggest moments, whether it's self-inflicted or cuz of the officials, although its mostly the former, let's be real here.

The Leafs overall have been a laughing stock franchise for the last half century plus, and every time they make it to the playoffs, something bad always happens. Whether it's Wayne Gretzky in 1993, blowing a 4-1 lead in the 3rd against Boston in 2013, coughing up lead after lead against Washington in 2017, and once again, choking in the third against Boston just last year.

Blue Jays went 22 years without making the playoffs, and the one time they did in 2015, they had a mix of questionable calls go against them against KC, while also hitting like absolute crap with RISP in game 6 of the 2015 ALCS.

The Raptors have also been one of the unluckiest teams in the NBA too. Literally every star refuses to play here: Stoudemire left immediately, Camby same thing, Tmac same thing, Carter forced a trade, Bosh also went running the first chance he got and now Leonard is likely gone next summer as well. They've also lost gut-wrenching games such as the 2001 Sixer-Raps series, 2014 Nets-Raps series (which also featured questionable calls against the raps), and getting pip smacked three years in a row by LBJ. I also remember T Ross getting robbed of a game winner a couple years back, and that's just one of many instances.

Even TFC has a habit of choking. After finally becoming relevant for once, they lost an MLS Cup final and Champions league finals both in a shootout, in typical Toronto style. And of course, they fell off just one year later

The lack of winning, execution in the clutch, and unluckiness revolving around their team's players decisions, and some questionable calls are just some of the reasons why Toronto is a tragic sports town and being a fan of its sports teams is just...tough.

Any other Toronto fans feel the same way? Any fans of other sports cities who suffer from similar fates feel the same way too?

But the Argos

 

[Le Cobra]

This topic is the literal version of glass half empty - we are on the verge of getting our own NFL team someday - the UFC is coming here this weekend - Toronto is one of the best sports cities on the PLANET

 

[notDatsyuk]

Yea this thread is mostly about the amount of unlucky incidents that have occurred in Toronto sports, which has been a atrial contributor to this city's lack of winning, and many times, the team that underwent that call fell back to oblivion in the season(s) following that blown chance. Although for the most part, it was just the city's teams being well...bad LOL

Idk about the Leafs but other Toronto teams tend to get a lot of calls go against them. I'm not sure if it was fully proven or not but the Raps vs Nets series was deemed as one which was rigged by the refs cuz they wanted to see Brooklyn advance to play the Heat. Many calls throughout the whole series was going in favour of the Nets and the Raps were hardly getting any calls. They've had tons of called go against them when playing LeBron (basketball's golden boy) over the years too. Kawhi's not getting as many foul calls as he used to get on SA too, which is no coincidence imo.

The Jays have had phantom calls not go in their favor as well. 2015 ALCS, balls were being called strikes for the Jays and they even failed to call an obvious fan interference to award KC an extra HR which was ultimately the reason they lost in 2015. They also had many calls go against them in game 2 (I think it was) the round before vs the Rangers, but the Jays ended up coming back in that series so all was forgiven and forgotten.

Although I wasn't old enough to have seen this live, I've watched the replay of the '92 WS between the Jays & Braves, and the umps in that series were clearly trying to give Atlanta as many calls as possible since replay wasn't around then. They also hung the Canadian flag backwards as a method of further distraction by the Yanks to get into the Jays' head and prevent them from winning. Good thing the Jays were able to pull through in this series too.

Fixing in sports leagues such as the big 4 is not uncommon either as the Kings vs Lakers WCF in 2002 was literally proven rigged in court when an NBA official went to jail for betting on games including that series mentioned above. It's also happened on grand sport's stages too as South Korea somehow finished in 3rd place at the WC in 2002 (wow '02 was a rough year for ethical officiating), when the Koreans got COUNTLESS calls go their way against Italy and Spain

I can't comment on those specific instances, as I don't follow basketball, but aside from deliberate fixing, I think the problem is more perception than fact.

I'm sure every leaf fan remembers the non-call on the Gretzky high stick to Gilmour, but how many recall the nasty boarding that Tucker laid on (I forget his name)? Everyone on Long Island remembers that, and still rants about it costing them a playoffs. Some Habs fans are still mad about a non-call on an Eddie Shack slash in the '67 playoffs that they think cost them a string of five straight Cups (for you kids, Montreal won in '65, '66, '68, and '69).

Bad calls and missed calls happen all the time in sports, and there will always be some people who see conspiracy.

 

[nsleaf]

Yea but the smartest business decision in this case is to ensure teams based in their country (the US) plays in the finals and wins the chip. Revenue is always greater when a big American market wins the cup/plays in the finals.

That league would have no credibility and would likely fail.

 

[Maestro84]

That league would have no credibility and would likely fail.

Well the American market is significantly larger than Canada's, which is why Bettman always gets accused of "Americanizing" hockey since he knows the more popular the NHL gets in the States, the more revenue the league earns. The more hockey markets in places like Vegas, Nashville, San Jose, LA, and Tampa continue to massively grow, the more prosperous the NHL becomes. Brining winning hockey back to cities like Pittsburgh and Chicago certainly helped a lot too. The only way to promote hockey in "smaller" US markets would be to give them a contending team, which many of the cities above have been able to do over the past few years.

 

[nsleaf]

Well the American market is significantly larger than Canada's, which is why Bettman always gets accused of "Americanizing" hockey since he knows the more popular the NHL gets in the States, the more revenue the league earns. With hockey markets in places like Vegas, Nashville, San Jose, LA, and Tampa all growing massively over the years, the more the NHL prosper. Brining winning hockey back to cities like Pittsburgh and Chicago certainly helped a lot too

Yes, but you can't ensure certain teams always win in a competitive league.

 

[Maestro84]

Yes, but you can't ensure certain teams always win in a competitive league.

It's happened before though. The Sacramento Kings were actually massively f***ed over by crappy officiating, which was proven to be rigged in a court case, in game 6 of the WCF in 2002 since a Kings/Nets Finals would've been a nightmare matchup for the NBA, and not having their banner team in the Lakers there wouldn't fit the league's liking either

 

[bmil]

It's happened before though. The Sacramento Kings were actually massively f***ed over by crappy officiating, which was proven to be rigged in a court course, in game 6 of the WCF in 2002 since a Kings/Nets Finals would've been a nightmare matchup for the NBA, and not having their banner team in the Lakers there would've fit the league's liking either

Oh please. Just like the same way the league desperately wanted a Spurs-Pistons finals years later because it was going to draw in massive ratings? Donaghy was a piece of shit and that "court document" is about as valid as a $3 dollar bill. Did you also forget that there was a game 7 in that series played in Sacramento? Was that game "rigged" too because the Queens couldn't win at home?

 

[96]

“TFC fell off”

OP doesn’t know shit about any sport

 

[ottomaddox]

Delusional and misleading? Holy over analyzation.

It was fun as hell. The team was old. Now they're in a retool/rebuild/(insert word here for getting younger).

Why do people hate when teams have any success? They didn't win a championship. But rejuvenated the baseball fans in this entire country and left us with long lasting memories and memorable players.

And they may hurt but also have arguable the entire sports best prospect on the verge of hitting the Major Leagues as a potential future perennial all star.

There have been worse teams to follow over the last decade that's for sure.

It's so hard to respond to this. It's so laced with emotion.

I didn't care for how the team was built, I didn't like the style of play, and I thought there were a lot of unlikeable players (did you actually expect most fans to be in love with Batista)?

I'm glad you had fun. I just watched a whole season of stranded runners and live or die homerun baseball.

The team just announced the other day that they are reducing their payroll. Good luck with that.