News Article: Can Flyers' Mason overcome humiliating goal?

[Curufinwe]

Yes, and after that goal he's been terrible. A Mason on top of his game doesn't let that weak Ovechkin wrister in. He doesn't just drop to the ice and hope pucks hit him. We've seen it before, Mason gets rattled and starts letting in weak goals. Call it whatever you like, but it's clear he can be knocked off his game more easily than other top goalies in the league. It's not garbage when it's a clear trend throughout his career.

He's been mostly solid in Philly, but cracks have been starting to show (and not just now in these playoffs). A couple poor games in a row is fine in the regular season, it isn't acceptable in a 7 game series. This goes for anyone on the team, but it's even more crucial for a goaltender.

Clear trend, lol. The only clear trend in his career is that his SV% is much higher since he came to Philly.

 

[46zone]

Is he ready to be the back up next season? If he is and is seen as the GOTF, one of Mason or Neuv is probably going to be dealt this off season. Mason would probably bring more in return that Neuvirth. IDK if a Mason/Stolarz tandem is any better than Neuvirth/Stolarz one.

Mason has performed like a top 10 goalie (outside of this playoff series) since coming over at the end of the '12-'13 season...yet you don't know if Mason/Stolarz would be any better than Neuvirth/Stolarz? I get that Neuvirth performed well this season, but he is not a viable NHL starter for a playoff team.

Mason is the goalie going forward assuming his contract demands are reasonable.

 

[Boxscore]

6 is fine, but not for 6 years. His health is rather concerning.

I'm a little worried about this too.

Mason is a good-to-very-good goalie IMO. He's not elite. He's not a superstar. And he's not just average either. Making a judgement call on Mason is, perhaps, the trickiest decision Hextall will need to make. Here's how I look at it...

Finding elite goalies are more luck than anything. They are few are far between and the chances of getting an established one is slim to none. So, chances are Mason will be the best of anything available.

The questions though begin with the money and term. Then you need to consider the injuries. Also there were stretches were Neuvirth (the backup) looked as good or better than Mason. Is that more on the team or the goalies themselves? How far away from competing for an NHL job is Stolarz?

I'm not ready to bail on Mason by any means, but I'm also not ready to give him 6 mil over 6 either. Hopefully there can be some shared risk.

 

[PensBrony 6 9*]

I have defended Mason....but in no way do I give him 6 mill at 6 years. I only go with a 3 year deal no matter what. And 6 is the max I would do.

Honestly...3 years at 5.5 is my offer. There are not many #1 jobs out there so he likely takes it.





AGAIN 8th in SV% over the last 3 years.

1.97 GAA .937 SV% 2 years ago in the playoffs when our PK was not a dumpster fire.

And excluding that year, he has around an .860 save percentage and a GAA over 4.00 in the playoffs. He comes up small when it matters. bad pk or not, his sub-.900 career playoff save percentage is brutal. It's not like every goal this series has been some one-timed power play snipe either. He has let in a lot of soft goals, crowned by the softie of the century in game two. Apparently there's nothing he can do, no ugly goal, no harrowing statistic, to dissuade certain people from their love affair with him, but he is an average goalie who not only plays average in the playoffs, but actually gets much, much worse. The stats bear that out. I guess he seems like a nice guy and that's why some people insist on defending him, but you can find a lot of nice guys to stop 86% of the shots they face in the playoffs, and for a lot less than six million a year. What a waste of money that would be. Hopefully hextall recognizes that.

 

[Beef Invictus]

"He comes up small when it matters."


Except when he doesn't. Like, against the Rangers while still concussed.

 

[Curufinwe]

Or the last three weeks of the regular season.

 

[Tripod]

And excluding that year, he has around an .860 save percentage and a GAA over 4.00 in the playoffs. He comes up small when it matters. bad pk or not, his sub-.900 career playoff save percentage is brutal. It's not like every goal this series has been some one-timed power play snipe either. He has let in a lot of soft goals, crowned by the softie of the century in game two. Apparently there's nothing he can do, no ugly goal, no harrowing statistic, to dissuade certain people from their love affair with him, but he is an average goalie who not only plays average in the playoffs, but actually gets much, much worse. The stats bear that out. I guess he seems like a nice guy and that's why some people insist on defending him, but you can find a lot of nice guys to stop 86% of the shots they face in the playoffs, and for a lot less than six million a year. What a waste of money that would be. Hopefully hextall recognizes that.

He is an average goalie....who is tied for 8th in SV% over the last 3 years.
He comes up small when it matters....except this year, last year, the year before's playoffs, etc...
He let's in softies...yup...he let 1 in. Ovie 99 MPH wrist shot was not a softie.

The fact that you even CHOOSE to use stats for what he was in CBus shows what you are trying to do.

AGAIN....4 ES goals in 3 games....1 was a fluke, bad goal.

So tell us....who would you go get who is an upgrade on Mason and what would you trade for him?

 

[baudib1]

All in all, Mason is a slightly above average goalie.

If you go by SV% over the past three years you can make a case for him being in the top 10.

If you go by EV SV% you can argue he's elite.

That's just looking at part of the picture, the part that favors Mason.

Mason plays 55ish games a year, not 65 like Lundqvist or Holtby. If he were capable of playing more it'd be fine to go with a young kid as a backup, but we always need a veteran who can play 25-30 games or more.

He's not good at fighting screens, part of the reason why he's not great on the PK.

He's terrible at shootouts.

He's not good at handling the puck.

His playoff record is terrible.

If Neuvirth plays Game 4, that means Mason hasn't even finished a single playoff series for us, let alone won one. LOL @ he won 2 games against a team that went far in the playoffs two years ago.

We have no idea if Mason can handle playing 20 games in a row during a deep playoff run.

Before this series, there were people saying that Mason could be just as good as Holtby, and used all kinds of different slices of the season to prove it. Holtby is going to win the Vezina, had a record-tying season, and has a 1.82 GAA in the postseason. His resume completely dwarfs Mason's, and the difference between Holtby and Mason is the biggest reason we're down 3-0.

If the Flyers played great in the third period and didn't take stupid penalties, the story of the game is just the soft goals Mason allowed.

 

[Curufinwe]

Saying his playoff record is terrible is just saying the last two games were terrible. When the sample size is so small the swings can be extreme. And that doesn't even get into the absurdity of judging a goalie based on what he did as a 20 year old rookie on a mediocre Columbus team.

And Mason is widely regarded as a very good puck handler.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/playoffs/201...ers-goalie-steve-mason-start-new-york-rangers

He is an average goalie....who is tied for 8th in SV% over the last 3 years.
He comes up small when it matters....except this year, last year, the year before's playoffs, etc...
He let's in softies...yup...he let 1 in. Ovie 99 MPH wrist shot was not a softie.

The fact that you even CHOOSE to use stats for what he was in CBus shows what you are trying to do.

AGAIN....4 ES goals in 3 games....1 was a fluke, bad goal.

So tell us....who would you go get who is an upgrade on Mason and what would you trade for him?

You're wasting your time responding to someone's troll account. 12 games over an eight year period don't mean more than the 166 games he's played with a .921 SV% over the past three seasons as the Flyers starter.

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

All in all, Mason is a slightly above average goalie.

If you go by SV% over the past three years you can make a case for him being in the top 10.

If you go by EV SV% you can argue he's elite.

That's just looking at part of the picture, the part that favors Mason.

This is the Claude Giroux's one good season argument... that extends into multiple seasons.

Mason has been a very good goaltender since he's been with the Flyers. The stats support that.

Mason plays 55ish games a year, not 65 like Lundqvist or Holtby. If he were capable of playing more it'd be fine to go with a young kid as a backup, but we always need a veteran who can play 25-30 games or more.

He's not a workhorse goalie like the elites, but he's still a very good #1 goalie.

His durability is concerning.

He's not good at fighting screens, part of the reason why he's not great on the PK.

His PK save percentage is not very good, but the PK itself has been a dumpster fire.

He's terrible at shootouts.

No argument there.

He's not good at handling the puck.

Incorrect.

His playoff record is terrible.

His playoff record consists of a sweep by the Wings over the Jackets in the first playoff appearance by Columbus (this just happened to be the year after the Wings won a Cup and in the same season the returned to the Final), and the series against the Rangers a couple of seasons ago where he was concussed in the final regular season game.

His sample size is so small, it's practically irrelevant.

If Neuvirth plays Game 4, that means Mason hasn't even finished a single playoff series for us, let alone won one. LOL @ he won 2 games against a team that went far in the playoffs two years ago.

We have no idea if Mason can handle playing 20 games in a row during a deep playoff run.

Before this series, there were people saying that Mason could be just as good as Holtby, and used all kinds of different slices of the season to prove it. Holtby is going to win the Vezina, had a record-tying season, and has a 1.82 GAA in the postseason. His resume completely dwarfs Mason's, and the difference between Holtby and Mason is the biggest reason we're down 3-0.

If the Flyers played great in the third period and didn't take stupid penalties, the story of the game is just the soft goals Mason allowed.

He finished the series against the Rangers, he just didn't start it due to injury. Again, sample size.

Special teams is the reason the Flyers are down 3-0. If they score powerplay goals early in all three games, they have a chance. If they don't give up powerplay goals like they have, they have a chance.

 

[JXC]

Intriguing.

The one thing I have been reminded of this series is that the Vezina is a team award.

He appears to have nice skills but when 75% of shots are seen, blocked, or wide, coupled with facing near zero odd man chances, the demands of the position are eased.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Saying Mason isn't good at handling the puck is just flat out incomprehensible. He's actually quite good at that. Likely best in the division.

If you think our D and bottom six struggle to get up the ice at times now, imagine what they'd be like with Lundqvist trying to move the puck instead of Mason.

 

[Ruck Over]

Intriguing.

The one thing I have been reminded of this series is that the Vezina is a team award.

For the hell of it, the Capitals came in second for the William Jennings, which is a team award, honoring goalies. The first place team beat the Caps by two goals 188 v 191.

The Caps lost the last game of the season 2-0, to the Ducks who were playing for 1st in the Pacific, as a make-up, and the Ducks won the William Jennings.

So... maybe in another year, the Vezina argument would hold more water. But this year, the whole Caps team shares glory in their low GA.

 

[baudib1]

This is the Claude Giroux's one good season argument... that extends into multiple seasons.

Mason has been a very good goaltender since he's been with the Flyers. The stats support that.



He's not a workhorse goalie like the elites, but he's still a very good #1 goalie.

His durability is concerning.



His PK save percentage is not very good, but the PK itself has been a dumpster fire.



No argument there.



Incorrect.



His playoff record consists of a sweep by the Wings over the Jackets in the first playoff appearance by Columbus (this just happened to be the year after the Wings won a Cup and in the same season the returned to the Final), and the series against the Rangers a couple of seasons ago where he was concussed in the final regular season game.

His sample size is so small, it's practically irrelevant.



He finished the series against the Rangers, he just didn't start it due to injury. Again, sample size.

Special teams is the reason the Flyers are down 3-0. If they score powerplay goals early in all three games, they have a chance. If they don't give up powerplay goals like they have, they have a chance.

I'll change that to "Mason has yet to play an entire series for us, let alone win one."

Sample size? Basically there are a lot of goalies in the league who have won a playoff series, and have similar or better regular season stats. Saying Mason is in a class with Holtby or Lundqvist or any number of other goalies is just silly. It's possible he could be as good as them, it's possible he'll win a series for us by himself somewhere down the line.

It hasn't happened yet, and given the question marks, it's fair to withhold judgment.

Since all the apologists say it's ok since he carried us, and he's probably tired, then not having a postseason resume is really disturbing. If he's not capable of being the man down the stretch without having remarkable mental and physical breakdowns then he's not the answer.

 

[Curufinwe]

Who said he was good as Lundqvist?

 

[Ruck Over]

You're most likely being a little unfair to Mason in the verbose rhetoric, because no goalie has ever "won" a playoff series. The context that goes into the position seem to be short changing Mason in many apologist's eyes.

Has there ever been a goalie who has both pitched shut-outs, and scored goals in all playoff games of a series, or maybe just the primary assist on each game winning goal of a series?

So, to say Mason can't do something because he hasn't yet, is also a flawed argument.

Really, the Flyers were an aspiring bubble team, that fell on the made playoffs instead of missing playoffs. I'd rather be here now complaining, than in Boston where there's no playoff team discussion. That Mason hasn't stolen us games isn't a lost aspect, but it's far from the only aspect.

 

[Boxscore]

no goalie has ever "won" a playoff series

Patrick Roy won more than one in 1992-93.

 

[baudib1]

Who said he was good as Lundqvist?

There are people who like to point out his EV SV% to say he's an elite goalie. He's not.

You're most likely being a little unfair to Mason in the verbose rhetoric, because no goalie has ever "won" a playoff series. The context that goes into the position seem to be short changing Mason in many apologist's eyes.

Has there ever been a goalie who has both pitched shut-outs, and scored goals in all playoff games of a series, or maybe just the primary assist on each game winning goal of a series?

So, to say Mason can't do something because he hasn't yet, is also a flawed argument.

Really, the Flyers were an aspiring bubble team, that fell on the made playoffs instead of missing playoffs. I'd rather be here now complaining, than in Boston where there's no playoff team discussion. That Mason hasn't stolen us games isn't a lost aspect, but it's far from the only aspect.

I really think that the goaltending has been so bad around here and it's been so so long that the Flyers made a deep run with great goaltending that people's perspectives are completely warped.

Mason made a lot of fine saves in Game 1. He wasn't spectacular and he needed to be for the Flyers to have any chance. That loss isn't on him, but Holtby was better. The past two games, the Flyers were competing hard and carrying play for the most part, and he gave up multiple soft goals. The Ovechkin wrister was almost as bad as the infamous Claude Lemieux goal. All of Carlsson's goals have been stoppable, you just don't see elite goalies give up multiple goals like that in a series.

Not giving up soft goals in a series is basically the requisite to being a Stanley Cup winning goal. Hextall would play fine all series and give up 1 big goal and people crucified him for it.

I think it remains very much an open question of whether or not Mason can play every game for two months straight and be effective.

 

[chupanibre]

You can almost see his heart sink in this photo. Poor guy

 

[PensBrony 6 9*]

Saying his playoff record is terrible is just saying the last two games were terrible. When the sample size is so small the swings can be extreme. And that doesn't even get into the absurdity of judging a goalie based on what he did as a 20 year old rookie on a mediocre Columbus team.

And Mason is widely regarded as a very good puck handler.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/playoffs/201...ers-goalie-steve-mason-start-new-york-rangers



You're wasting your time responding to someone's troll account. 12 games over an eight year period don't mean more than the 166 games he's played with a .921 SV% over the past three seasons as the Flyers starter.

12 really important games where he's absolutely abysmally sucked more often than not. Also l-o-l at whoever said ovechkin's wrister was 99 mph. Just proving my point that people will find any excuse to justify this head case losing the plot in the playoffs. As for me being a troll, having a valid argument that the flyers hf "brain"trust doesn't want to accept doesn't qualify me as a troll. I recall having similar arguments about Michael raffl's qualifications as a first line forward and I think it's pretty clear how that turned out.

 

[Beef Invictus]

99mph? No. But considering he sailed a 79mph shot in a warmup without really getting anything into it like he does during a game, he could easily be getting into the high 80s and lower 90s depending on situation, which is pretty damned absurd.

 

[PensBrony 6 9*]

99mph? No. But considering he sailed a 79mph shot in a warmup without really getting anything into it like he does during a game, he could easily be getting into the high 80s and lower 90s depending on situation, which is pretty damned absurd.

Haha please. Watch the replay, he took it quickly and didn't get a ton on it. Regardless, Mason had a perfectly clear look at it. It should be stopped. Nhl goalies are expected to stop 100mph slap shots from where that was taken and you're telling me that was a difficult shot? Get real. That's like a pickup hockey goal, and a bad one.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Have you seen Ovechkin play a lot? He brutalizes goalies with that shot. Clear lines of sight, flat out beats them. Repeatedly.

OV's snapshots are still incredibly fast. The guy has, easily, the best wrist shot/snap shot in the league.

 

[baudib1]

Have you seen Ovechkin play a lot? He brutalizes goalies with that shot. Clear lines of sight, flat out beats them. Repeatedly.

OV's snapshots are still incredibly fast. The guy has, easily, the best wrist shot/snap shot in the league.

I'm aware Ovechkin is good.

There are also goalies who stop him ~350-400 times a year.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I'm aware Ovechkin is good.

There are also goalies who stop him ~350-400 times a year.

He's also the guy who beats goalies more than anybody else. The list of players who could expect to take the same number of shots as OV from the same places, and score as many goals, is exceedingly short.