C Alex Newhook - Boston College, NCAA (2019, 16th, COL) Part 2

[Muffin]

By putting him in the NHL after just a single season of NCAA, don't you run the risk of the same thing happening to Newhook that happened to Jost?

Jost is what he is because he's simply not good enough. I don't believe in "ruining" prospects, if you're good enough you'll make it there. 1 more year of college wasn't going to make Jost a better skater.

 

[MuckOG]

Jost is what he is because he's simply not good enough. I don't believe in "ruining" prospects, if you're good enough you'll make it there. 1 more year of college wasn't going to make Jost a better skater.

Maybe two years of college and a year in the AHL would've helped him do just that. Skating is something that can be continuously improved throughout a players career.....development doesn't stop at age 19 or 20.

 

[Lemonlimey]

Jost is what he is because he's simply not good enough. I don't believe in "ruining" prospects, if you're good enough you'll make it there. 1 more year of college wasn't going to make Jost a better skater.

you’re right about natural ability not changing but it’s easy to imagine a second year bolstering his maturation in a positive way. What if the Jost we’re seeing the last few games coulda arrived sooner has he waited for the NHL longer. Tortoise beats the Hare and all, this is my hope for Newhook

 

[Muffin]

Maybe two years of college and a year in the AHL would've helped him do just that. Skating is something that can be continuously improved throughout a players career.....development doesn't stop at age 19 or 20.

I don't see how it's any different developing his skating in the NHL as opposed to the AHL/NCAA. That one thing you can do in college that you can't in the NHL is bulk up since you play less games and have more time to hit the gym. Newhook already has NHL size, I think he's NHL ready.

 

[MuckOG]

I don't see how it's any different developing his skating in the NHL as opposed to the AHL/NCAA. That one thing you can do in college that you can't in the NHL is bulk up since you play less games and have more time to hit the gym. Newhook already has NHL size, I think he's NHL ready.

Because the NCAA has fewer games there is more time spent on player development (skating, weight training, etc.). More so than at the AHL/NHL level anyway.

Let me put it another way....can you name a player that was HURT by spending an extra year in college or the minors?

 

[EdAVSfan]

Because the NCAA has fewer games there is more time spent on player development (skating, weight training, etc.). More so than at the AHL/NHL level anyway.

Let me put it another way....can you name a player that was HURT by spending an extra year in college or the minors?

Kind of impossible to know the answer to that.

 

[Masch78]

Hockey writers did a January article ranking the best and toughest leagues in the world. Heres what the ranking looked like and many would agree.

10. OHL
9. NCAA
8 . AHL
7.DEL ( deutsche eishockey liga)
6. NLA ( national league A- swiss)
5. Czhech Extraliga
4. SM- Liga ( Finaland)
3. Elitserien ( SEL- Sweden)
2. KHL
1. NHL

*Edit*

Podkolzin just popped in a goal in game 2 of KHL playoffs round 1. He has 1G 1A in 2 playoff games.

I don't agree with that list. DEL imports are usually mit level AHL or good ECHL players. I'd put the AHL equal to the FEL and the Czech league is way lower. At least behind the NLA.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

I don't agree with that list. DEL imports are usually mit level AHL or good ECHL players. I'd put the AHL equal to the FEL and the Czech league is way lower. At least behind the NLA.

im good with that opinion, it varies..

but there should be zero debate on the closeness of NCAA to SHL and especially KHL

 

[Masch78]

im good with that opinion, it varies..

but there should be zero debate on the closeness of NCAA to SHL and especially KHL

I fully agree with you. I'd even rate some lower level pro leagues (Austria, NLB, Slovakia) close to NCAA. They are all much more demanding and young players will not see much icetime.

 

[not a troll]

I think you are highly over-rating the NCAA and the level of competition based on the fact you think Newhook has jumped over other prospects like Broberg, Soderstorm, Podkolzin whom are all playing VS professionals. You also seem very upbeat about NCAA'ers like Zegras, Boldy, Caufield.

Podkolzin for example plays in the 2nd hardest league in the world with the KHL and he is one of the youngest player in the KHL this season. He finished the year off with something like 8pts in last 12 games when the coach finally started trusting him and his young linemates.

Broberg and Soderstorm are both playing important roles on their SHL teams.

The NCAA is a developmental league, the KHL and SHL are far from it. Its a professional league.

Think about it for a second, anyone that has ever played on a local beer league knows the difference in levels of the top division in beer league hockey compared to the bottom division of beer league hockey. Now use that same perception and magnify it 10x and youll see the diffence between NCAA and other professional leagues.

The NCAA plays what, 2 games a week with very little travel?

As good of a year that Newhook is having in the NCAA i dont think he has surpassed the likes of Broberg, Soderstorm or Podkolzin at all.

Hockey writers did a January article ranking the best and toughest leagues in the world. Heres what the ranking looked like and many would agree.

10. OHL
9. NCAA
8 . AHL
7.DEL ( deutsche eishockey liga)
6. NLA ( national league A- swiss)
5. Czhech Extraliga
4. SM- Liga ( Finaland)
3. Elitserien ( SEL- Sweden)
2. KHL
1. NHL

*Edit*

Podkolzin just popped in a goal in game 2 of KHL playoffs round 1. He has 1G 1A in 2 playoff games.

I don't agree with the list at all and THW isn't exactly a reputable source. They pick up their writers off the streets basically and they get free reign to post whatever they want without editorial overview.

 

[tealhockey]

Jost is what he is because he's simply not good enough. I don't believe in "ruining" prospects, if you're good enough you'll make it there. 1 more year of college wasn't going to make Jost a better skater.

The notion that you can "ruin" a prospect has some merit. Especially in the NHL where a lot of people's livelihoods depend on winning now, patience when it comes to top prospects can be in short supply. Anyone who knows athletes know that confidence is everything and if you put someone in a position where they are in over their head you can hurt their trajectory

 

[57special]

Listing the AHL behind any league that is not the NHL, and possibly the KHL, is a joke.

 

[bsu]

This guy is a stud, I am curious what it would look like if him and zegras traded places.

 

[tfong]

The notion that you can "ruin" a prospect has some merit. Especially in the NHL where a lot of people's livelihoods depend on winning now, patience when it comes to top prospects can be in short supply. Anyone who knows athletes know that confidence is everything and if you put someone in a position where they are in over their head you can hurt their trajectory

Or forcing them into roles that don't match their skillset or giving them competition too easy for them.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

Listing the AHL behind any league that is not the NHL, and possibly the KHL, is a joke.

the AHL is highly over-rated. There are too many teams now and talent has become watered down. Id say 25-30% of players in the AHL should be playing in the ECHL.

Id compare AHL probably same level as Czech League or Liga in Finland. However, the AHL is nowhere near as good as SHL or KHL.

Anyways, the thread is getting side-tracked. The league comparison was in response to a poster saying Newhook has surpassed players like Broberg, Podkolzin , Soderstorm.

When in reality those guys are doing very well in a waaaaaaaayyyyyyyy higher league

KHL>>SHL>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>NCAA.

Lets also not forget that someone like Podkolzin and Broberg are both only 18 and not turning 19 until the summer, while Newhook is already 19.

 

[Dominance]

the AHL is highly over-rated. There are too many teams now and talent has become watered down. Id say 25-30% of players in the AHL should be playing in the ECHL.

Id compare AHL probably same level as Czech League or Liga in Finland. However, the AHL is nowhere near as good as SHL or KHL.

Anyways, the thread is getting side-tracked. The league comparison was in response to a poster saying Newhook has surpassed players like Broberg, Podkolzin , Soderstorm.

When in reality those guys are doing very well in a waaaaaaaayyyyyyyy higher league

KHL>>SHL>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>NCAA.

Lets also not forget that someone like Podkolzin and Broberg are both only 18 and not turning 19 until the summer, while Newhook is already 19.

The agenda to push Podkolzin is very poorly concealed. He’s not the same level of prospect, having ridden a strong Hlinka tournament to a slow slide down the rankings the whole year. Just because he’s a Russian winger doesn’t mean he’s a skill player. You should know yourself, given that he’s your team’s prospect, that he’s more of an effort player. High middle-6 floor and ceiling, but certainly not who I would have chosen at 10 with Boldy and Newhook available.

Either way, he has his own thread.

 

[Byzantium]

the AHL is highly over-rated. There are too many teams now and talent has become watered down. Id say 25-30% of players in the AHL should be playing in the ECHL.

Id compare AHL probably same level as Czech League or Liga in Finland. However, the AHL is nowhere near as good as SHL or KHL.

Anyways, the thread is getting side-tracked. The league comparison was in response to a poster saying Newhook has surpassed players like Broberg, Podkolzin , Soderstorm.

When in reality those guys are doing very well in a waaaaaaaayyyyyyyy higher league

KHL>>SHL>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>NCAA.

Lets also not forget that someone like Podkolzin and Broberg are both only 18 and not turning 19 until the summer, while Newhook is already 19.

Ranking the leagues aside I still prefer players in the AHL because they learn to play North American hockey. There's been too many europeans with monster seasons in KHL, SHL and SM Liiga only to come over and struggle. Eeli Tolvanen, Puljujärvi and David Rundblad comes to mind.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

The agenda to push Podkolzin is very poorly concealed. He’s not the same level of prospect, having ridden a strong Hlinka tournament to a slow slide down the rankings the whole year. Just because he’s a Russian winger doesn’t mean he’s a skill player. You should know yourself, given that he’s your team’s prospect, that he’s more of an effort player. High middle-6 floor and ceiling, but certainly not who I would have chosen at 10 with Boldy and Newhook available.

Either way, he has his own thread.

Right and like i said, i didnt bring up Pods, Broberg, Soderstorm.

i was responding to a poster who said Newhook could be in a top 10 re-draft ahead of those players.

and im not trying to conceal anything, im flat out saying theres no way Newhook is ahead of those players developmentally or theoritically in a re-draft based on the fact that KHL and SHL are supremely greater leagues than the NCAA and the fact that those guys are also considerably younger than Newhook.

AS for Pods, its all preference. I love that he was who we chose. I had him 6 on my board. i would have loved for Zegras to have been available but he went 9. We love what Podz can bring, his biggest comparison ironically is Gabriel Landeskog. AVS fans of all people should know the value of those type of players.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

Ranking the leagues aside I still prefer players in the AHL because they learn to play North American hockey. There's been too many europeans with monster seasons in KHL, SHL and SM Liiga only to come over and struggle. Eeli Tolvanen, Puljujärvi and David Rundblad comes to mind.

Thats a fair point if you like them in AHL to learn the NA style.

However i dont agree with your assessment on players doing well in Eurpoe then struggling in NA like Tolvanen and Puljujarvi and Runblad because i can come back at you and say players like Elias Pettersson, Zuccaerlo, Forsberg, Zibanejad etc..

Have you seen the league leaders for AHL this year or last few years.

Names like
Reid Boucher
Sam Anas
Gerry Mayhew

2018
Daniel Car
TJ Tynan
Andrew Poturalski
Cal Oreily
Mike Sgarbossa

you get the idea.

 

[Byzantium]

Thats a fair point if you like them in AHL to learn the NA style.

However i dont agree with your assessment on players doing well in Eurpoe then struggling in NA like Tolvanen and Puljujarvi and Runblad because i can come back at you and say players like Elias Pettersson, Zuccaerlo, Forsberg, Zibanejad etc..

Have you seen the league leaders for AHL this year or last few years.

Names like
Reid Boucher
Sam Anas
Gerry Mayhew

2018
Daniel Car
TJ Tynan
Andrew Poturalski
Cal Oreily
Mike Sgarbossa

you get the idea.

But none of the AHL players you listed are prospects? I'm not making the point that EU is bad for development, just that I trust the AHL for translating to NHL.

 

[Dominance]

Right and like i said, i didnt bring up Pods, Broberg, Soderstorm.

i was responding to a poster who said Newhook could be in a top 10 re-draft ahead of those players.

and im not trying to conceal anything, im flat out saying theres no way Newhook is ahead of those players developmentally or theoritically in a re-draft based on the fact that KHL and SHL are supremely greater leagues than the NCAA and the fact that those guys are also considerably younger than Newhook.

AS for Pods, its all preference. I love that he was who we chose. I had him 6 on my board. i would have loved for Zegras to have been available but he went 9. We love what Podz can bring, his biggest comparison ironically is Gabriel Landeskog. AVS fans of all people should know the value of those type of players.

My apologies, then. Reading the last few posts made it seem to me that you had introduced the comparison. Thanks for setting me right and providing the reasonable explanation.

 

[tealhockey]

Or forcing them into roles that don't match their skillset or giving them competition too easy for them.

yeah every situation is different. One player might respond well to a really hard challenge, one might respond terribly, one might improve at a lower level, one might get complacent, etc. Very hard to say what would happen with X player had their development been handled differently

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I think you are highly over-rating the NCAA and the level of competition based on the fact you think Newhook has jumped over other prospects like Broberg, Soderstorm, Podkolzin whom are all playing VS professionals. You also seem very upbeat about NCAA'ers like Zegras, Boldy, Caufield.

Podkolzin for example plays in the 2nd hardest league in the world with the KHL and he is one of the youngest player in the KHL this season. He finished the year off with something like 8pts in last 12 games when the coach finally started trusting him and his young linemates.

Broberg and Soderstorm are both playing important roles on their SHL teams.

The NCAA is a developmental league, the KHL and SHL are far from it. Its a professional league.

Think about it for a second, anyone that has ever played on a local beer league knows the difference in levels of the top division in beer league hockey compared to the bottom division of beer league hockey. Now use that same perception and magnify it 10x and youll see the diffence between NCAA and other professional leagues.

The NCAA plays what, 2 games a week with very little travel?

As good of a year that Newhook is having in the NCAA i dont think he has surpassed the likes of Broberg, Soderstorm or Podkolzin at all.

Hockey writers did a January article ranking the best and toughest leagues in the world. Heres what the ranking looked like and many would agree.

10. OHL
9. NCAA
8 . AHL
7.DEL ( deutsche eishockey liga)
6. NLA ( national league A- swiss)
5. Czhech Extraliga
4. SM- Liga ( Finaland)
3. Elitserien ( SEL- Sweden)
2. KHL
1. NHL

*Edit*

Podkolzin just popped in a goal in game 2 of KHL playoffs round 1. He has 1G 1A in 2 playoff games.

So let me get this straight.... You think that simply because those players are playing in a better league(Which nobody suggested otherwise to begin with), they're automatically better prospects than Newhook because Newhook is *only playing in college?


I'm sure this opinion of yours has nothing to do with the fact Podkolzin is a Canuck either.


Your bias is hilarious.


EDIT: I just realized you used age as an argument here as well. You do understand Newhook is a 2001 baby as well right? Or are you gonna try and suggest there's a "significant difference" between ages of two 2001 born prospects at this point?

You're so far out of your element posting in the prospects section.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

So let me get this straight.... You think that simply because those players are playing in a better league(Which nobody suggested otherwise to begin with), they're automatically better prospects than Newhook because Newhook is *only playing in college?


I'm sure this opinion of yours has nothing to do with the fact Podkolzin is a Canuck either.


Your bias is hilarious.

I wasnt even talking about Podz by himself, i was also talking about Broberg and Soderstorm. Or wait do you think im biased with those prospects as well even though their with division rivals?


But yes, i think at this point Podz Broberg and Soderstrom are all better prospects than Newhook. I think their games will translate better in the NHL adding to the fact that Broberg and Podz are both 6 months younger.

This isnt some hot take though, im sure most had those players higher than Newhook in their pre-draft rankings, Newhook's NCAA season and the others' professional season shouldnt change those refelctions.

 

[Dominance]

I wasnt even talking about Podz by himself, i was also talking about Broberg and Soderstorm. Or wait do you think im biased with those prospects as well even though their with division rivals?


But yes, i think at this point Podz Broberg and Soderstrom are all better prospects than Newhook. I think their games will translate better in the NHL adding to the fact that Broberg and Podz are both 6 months younger.

This isnt some hot take though, im sure most had those players higher than Newhook in their pre-draft rankings, Newhook's NCAA season and the others' professional season shouldnt change those refelctions.

I think the point that is being made throughout this thread is that Newhook should have been much higher, IMO a top-5 pick. He had that level of hype for years, and he delivered on it in a huge way in the BCHL and international tournaments, and fell almost certainly due to the league he played in and the resultant questions, which he has emphatically answered by being a strong two-way centre and one of the most dominant players in the NCAA, full stop.