C Aatu Räty - Abbotsford, AHL (2021, 52nd, NYI, traded to VAN) - PART 2

OneSniffTwoSniff

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Jan 18, 2022
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Patrik Laine is a PPG player in the NHL this season, Eeli Tolvanen has never played in the Liiga and Ristolainen has been 20+ minute NHL defenseman, never a hyped guy.

You write a lot of BS, it's clear that you have never watched Liiga, how can you know it's level?

You guys are cherrypicking (Yo look at Kakko for example) while he is pretty much the only prospect who dominated liiga and struggled a lot in the NHL.

What about Heiskanen, Lundell, Barkov, Laine, Aho, Hintz etc. Bbbbbut it doesn't matter. Obviously it matters how many points they are putting up in Liiga.

Yes he might not have played in Liiga, but I would bet that the same people who are liiga fans hyped him to be great, i highly doubt it was the Russian KHL fans who did it.

Also it doesn't matter if Risto plays 5 or 25 minutes a game he will still be terrible lol.
 

Frolov 6'3

Unregistered User
Jun 7, 2003
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The Netherlands
Safe to assume no one outside Finland does, because it's almost impossible to watch it. Which begs the question, why do I bother answering to these posts?
Because you are butthurt like some of your fellow countrymen ? Thats why you are bothering.

Nobody is saying there arent any legitimate players coming out of that league. Just that we shouldn’t label anyone just yet to be a premium prospect because he is putting up some points over there. We have seen that before lately. Its not cherry picking. There are too many to mention.
 

saintunspecified

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Nov 30, 2017
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Take Kaapo Kakko for example. He put up 22 goals in 45 games as an 18 year old. Now he looks like a massive bust. Those kind of numbers would never happen in the other top European leagues such as SHL, KHL, NLA due to them being much stronger in terms of quality of play.

Hate to say this, but Kakko doesn't look like a "massive bust", especially considering so many forwards from that draft class have struggled. He just lacks that top gear + dynamism.

What's hard for people, I think, is to watch Barkov dominate despite also seeming to lack that top gear. It's really difficult to project that kind of thing looking at stats alone, especially 18 y/o stats. Meanwhile Sebastian Aho, who *has* that gear, produced in his draft year not unlike Brad Lambert has this year. Weird, right?

Raty looks like a safe top-9 forward prospect right now, I think, because he's doing NHL-style things. He's winning battles, and finding open teammates around the net. He's crashing the net to chip in rebounds. He's able to find the net up high with a quick release, even in traffic. He seems to understand how to protect the puck with his body. And... it seems like his teammates really like him. Tbh it seems like he's answered every single question there was about before the draft *except* for his average skating. And fortunately, he's 6'2" with a good frame, and not 5'10" with a narrow frame.

Tbh, given how frank he seems to be in interviews, one wonders if his awareness + frankness about where he was mentally negatively affected others' perceptions of him.
 

karhukissa

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Apr 2, 2019
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Yes he might not have played in Liiga, but I would bet that the same people who are liiga fans hyped him to be great, i highly doubt it was the Russian KHL fans who did it.

Also it doesn't matter if Risto plays 5 or 25 minutes a game he will still be terrible lol.
You are as delusional as that guy on your avatar hahah.

Just name another European league that has produced this much star power during last few years? There isn't. I don't think there's any from DEL, maybe Peterka?
 

OneSniffTwoSniff

Registered User
Jan 18, 2022
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Because you are butthurt like some of your fellow countrymen ? Thats why you are bothering.

Nobody is saying there arent any legitimate players coming out of that league. Just that we shouldn’t label anyone just yet to be a premium prospect because he is putting up some points over there. We have seen that before lately. Its not cherry picking. There are too many to mention.

Exactly what I mean.
 

OneSniffTwoSniff

Registered User
Jan 18, 2022
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You are as delusional as that guy on your avatar hahah.

Just name another European league that has produced this much star power during last few years? There isn't. I don't think there's any from DEL, maybe Peterka?

Ummm the guy who is going to win the Calder?
 

OneSniffTwoSniff

Registered User
Jan 18, 2022
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Hate to say this, but Kakko doesn't look like a "massive bust", especially considering so many forwards from that draft class have struggled. He just lacks that top gear + dynamism.

What's hard for people, I think, is to watch Barkov dominate despite also seeming to lack that top gear. It's really difficult to project that kind of thing looking at stats alone, especially 18 y/o stats. Meanwhile Sebastian Aho, who *has* that gear, produced in his draft year not unlike Brad Lambert has this year. Weird, right?

Raty looks like a safe top-9 forward prospect right now, I think, because he's doing NHL-style things. He's winning battles, and finding open teammates around the net. He's crashing the net to chip in rebounds. He's able to find the net up high with a quick release, even in traffic. He seems to understand how to protect the puck with his body. And... it seems like his teammates really like him. Tbh it seems like he's answered every single question there was about before the draft *except* for his average skating. And fortunately, he's 6'2" with a good frame, and not 5'10" with a narrow frame.

Tbh, given how frank he seems to be in interviews, one wonders if his awareness + frankness about where he was mentally negatively affected others' perceptions of him.

Compared to his predraft hype and the #2 overall status he is extremely underwhelming. Also some people here thought he should go over Jack Hughes, probably the same people that thought Laine>Matthews.
 

karhukissa

Registered User
Apr 2, 2019
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Ummm the guy who is going to win the Calder?
Well he played for Rögle as his last European team.

And we can take all prospects from Liiga and compare it to any league, including OHL and WHL and check what's the % of these players succeed in the NHL. Liiga is probably at the top for the last few years. So that "There are too many examples" goes to all the leagues.
 

saintunspecified

Registered User
Nov 30, 2017
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Compared to his predraft hype and the #2 overall status he is extremely underwhelming. Also some people here thought he should go over Jack Hughes, probably the same people that thought Laine>Matthews.

The whole class has been meh. The 2020 nhl draft class is similarly out of the gate slow. If we think really hard, we might be able to come up with some kind of explanation. :huh:

He's been disappointing, not a "massive bust".
 

karhukissa

Registered User
Apr 2, 2019
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Compared to his predraft hype and the #2 overall status he is extremely underwhelming. Also some people here thought he should go over Jack Hughes, probably the same people that thought Laine>Matthews.
And you have to realize that the way Kakko played in Liiga wasn't the biggest hype factor.

It's how he dominated at the WHC and also WJC. Same thing with all hyped Liiga prospects, they dominated against their aged NA guys.
 

OneSniffTwoSniff

Registered User
Jan 18, 2022
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And you have to realize that the way Kakko played in Liiga wasn't the biggest hype factor.

It's how he dominated at the WHC and also WJC. Same thing with all hyped Liiga prospects, they dominated against their aged NA guys.

Fair enough, people need to stop putting too much value on short tournaments.
 

karhukissa

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Apr 2, 2019
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Okay so when are you allowed to get excited for prospects? You should go to eliteprospects, and scroll all past few years draft classes.

Then you'll see that out of those 31 first round picks about 1/3 or even 1/4 are solid/good NHL players. Quite small %.

Most of those unsuccessful picks are Canadian or American. I can find 1 clear Finnish bust and that's Juolevi. So there are some facts.
 

OneSniffTwoSniff

Registered User
Jan 18, 2022
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Okay so when are you allowed to get excited for prospects? You should go to eliteprospects, and scroll all past few years draft classes.

Then you'll see that out of those 31 first round picks about 1/3 or even 1/4 are solid/good NHL players. Quite small %.

Most of those unsuccessful picks are Canadian or American. I can find 1 clear Finnish bust and that's Juolevi. So there are some facts.

Well obviously, considering that most of the people that get drafted are either from the US or Canada. :laugh:
 

karhukissa

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Apr 2, 2019
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Well obviously, considering that most of the people that get drafted are either from the US or Canada. :laugh:
Yes, but still % wise they produce more busts than Finland or Sweden for example. Out of that small amount of players drafted from FI/SWE, players are more likely to become impact players in the NHL if we check recent years. So that should tell you something. And there shouldn't be any comment regarding FEL points being irrelevant, since we can see more good examples than busts.

And that's fine for Canada and US, because they'll just have that sheer mass advantage to other countries. If you just check top-20 scorers in the NHL, 12 of them are NA players even though they produce 10 times more players than other countries.
 
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Riseonfire

Josh Bailey! GAME ONE, TO THE ISLAND!!!
Nov 8, 2009
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Because you are butthurt like some of your fellow countrymen ? Thats why you are bothering.

Nobody is saying there arent any legitimate players coming out of that league. Just that we shouldn’t label anyone just yet to be a premium prospect because he is putting up some points over there. We have seen that before lately. Its not cherry picking. There are too many to mention.

Fellow countrymen is a redundant term.
 

simonedvinsson

Registered User
May 26, 2020
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Safe to assume no one outside Finland does, because it's almost impossible to watch it. Which begs the question, why do I bother answering to these posts?
I don't watch a ton of Finnish hockey, but it's not impossible to watch games. There are websites where I stream from pretty regularly (albeit I'm usually watching the SHL). I've got the JYP-Lukko game on as I type this. To your overall point though, there's nothing wrong with Liiga hockey. I'd still rate it as one of the top handful of leagues in the world and wouldn't hesitate to draft a player who's playing well from there.
 

Kaako Kappo

Kaako Kappo
Oct 12, 2016
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I don't watch a ton of Finnish hockey, but it's not impossible to watch games. There are websites where I stream from pretty regularly (albeit I'm usually watching the SHL). I've got the JYP-Lukko game on as I type this. To your overall point though, there's nothing wrong with Liiga hockey. I'd still rate it as one of the top handful of leagues in the world and wouldn't hesitate to draft a player who's playing well from there.
Yeah, this season it's been possible because they changed the streaming service. Even though the quality is absolute garbage and I refuse to believe anyone does that. Before this year? You'd have to go back a few for it to have been possible.
 

BusQuets

Registered User
Jul 16, 2010
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Seriously ?

Heinola, Kakko, Kupari, Kotkaniemi, Luostarinen, Puljujarvi, Juolevi, Heponiemi etc
Don't forget "Eeli better than Petterson Tolvanen", Patrik "Next tier Legend in the making?" Laine, and Rasmus Ristolainen :laugh:
You do know that Juolevi and Heponiemi were drafted from OHL and WHL?
Also Tolvanen was drafted from NCAA and got his hype from great seasons in KHL.
Puljujarvi scored at great pace in NHL compared to his Liiga points.
Laine outscored his Liiga points in NHL.
Kotkaniemi was never that great in Liiga and actually scored almost at better pace in NHL.

The only legitimate disappointment here is Kakko when you consider what he did in Liiga. Most of these prospect got their hype from WJC playing against their peers.

What a weird weird post considering your original argument.. Almost like you actually have no idea what you're saying.
 
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karhukissa

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Apr 2, 2019
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You do know that Juolevi and Heponiemi were drafted from OHL and WHL?
Also Tolvanen was drafted from NCAA and got his hype from great seasons in KHL.
Puljujarvi scored at great pace in NHL compared to his Liiga points.
Laine outscored his Liiga points in NHL.
Kotkaniemi was never that great in Liiga and actually scored almost at better pace in NHL.

The only legitimate disappointment here is Kakko when you consider what he did in Liiga. Most of these prospect got their hype from WJC playing against their peers.

What a weird weird post considering your original argument.. Almost like you actually have no idea what you're saying.
Guy just namedropped some Finnish 1st/2nd rounders and didn't know that they weren't really Liiga players:laugh: And context was that Liiga players struggle to adapt in the NHL, then you namedrop KHL/OHL/WHL players.

Lundell is the latest example of transition from Liiga to NHL, but nah let's mention Kakko. There are zero "Michael Dal Colles" or "Jake Virtanens" from Liiga, aka high picks that absolutely flopped in the NHL and have no use whatsoever.

If you really want to dig and mention Kapanen or Kotkaniemi, fine but those are still legitimate NHL players.

But anyway, enough of offtopic from my side. It's a topic about Räty!
 
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