OT: Bucs, Rays & Other Florida Sports Teams Thread

[Stormbreaker]

Court finds that Buccaneers used creative accounting to support claim for Deepwater Horizon compensation
Not a good look

 

[Hoek]

Seriously embarassing.. .why would they even dare to put in a claim?

 

[These Are The Days]

Starting to think the Rays might be the real deal, folks. If not this year then soon cuz dat pipeline be stacked AND we are one of the better teams

 

[Felonious Python]

 

[Master P]

Absolute joke.

 

[CupsOverCash]

I know it doesn't say they are moving but this sure looks like that is where it's going.

 

[Stormbreaker]

 

[Stormbreaker]

 

[berlin]

Wish the Rays would just move away. I’m soooooooo tired of hearing about attendance, and being the butt of all the jokes.

 

[Felonious Python]

This always seemed to be the case. I'm not sure what the play was here exactly. A new building of course, but Montreal would be in the new stadium business as well. Is it just to give them urgency since one market may pony-up before the other? It's a bit of a scorched Earth plan for the owners.

 

[Hoek]

What a f***ing stupid idea. Just move.

 

[Rschmitz]

If the Rays move, it will only be a matter of time before we get another club here. Maybe this time Vinik could get involved and start things off properly. I don't think Ybor is the best place for a stadium, but he could make it work if they don't go cheap on the infrastructure. He has the good will of the city, he'd make a fortune. Just dreaming here, but with a good transit system in place and the proper amnesties, it would be amazing. Upgrade the trolly system and build a bunch more parking garages

 

[T REX]

The rays are as good as gone. This is a precursor to move. The Rays will not accept any proposal from St Pete so the mayor is just going to die on the vine. Let's be real honest here...neither Pinellas nor Hills is going to pony up $800 mill for a stadium. Stu knows this. Within 3 years he'll be able to easily break the lease(the penalties are greatly reduced).

It was doomed from the get go in St Pete. They tried to be a big city and they're not.

 

[These Are The Days]

What a ****ing stupid idea. Just move.

Better idea.... just build the damn ballpark.

Tampa's sitting on an average of a $2,000 taxpayer surplus and regular fans around here are liable to spend $1500 between tickets (especially seasons tickets) concessions, merchandise etc or any other leisure within 3-10 years. Ask them to pledge that much over the course of 40 years for a ballpark and everyone loses their minds. And that total was assuming that solely 400,000 taxpayers (as if we aren't gonna have more in 40 years) are footing $600 million of the bill out of pocket and we aren't using anything creative like hotels or the other 500,000+ people (as if we aren't gonna have more) in the rest of Bay Area/Metro region to help out. Cuz sports fans be damned they're gonna be taxed likely less than $37.50 a year over 40 years when they can pay twice that much for tickets alone. Hell I spent that much in gas this morning.

I know it works differently than this but this is basic numbers crunching and how absurd it is that people say "Well why don't the Rays just build it?" great idea.... tell an owner worth $800 million to drop $800 million on a ballpark. Why didn't I think of that?

 

[T REX]

Better idea.... just build the damn ballpark.

Tampa's sitting on an average of a $2,000 taxpayer surplus and regular fans around here are liable to spend $1500 between tickets (especially seasons tickets) concessions, merchandise etc or any other leisure within 3-10 years. Ask them to pledge that much over the course of 40 years for a ballpark and everyone loses their minds. And that total was assuming that solely 400,000 taxpayers (as if we aren't gonna have more in 40 years) are footing $600 million of the bill out of pocket and we aren't using anything creative like hotels or the other 500,000+ people (as if we aren't gonna have more) in the rest of Bay Area/Metro region to help out. Cuz sports fans be damned they're gonna be taxed likely less than $37.50 a year over 40 years when they can pay twice that much for tickets alone. Hell I spent that much in gas this morning.

I know it works differently than this but this is basic numbers crunching and how absurd it is that people say "Well why don't the Rays just build it?" great idea.... tell an owner worth $800 million to drop $800 million on a ballpark. Why didn't I think of that?

Sorry but no more sports team welfare. It's never gonna happen here. Ever. At least for the Rays. The money can be spent on many other things that need it. I refuse to line the pockets of a freaking jerk off Mets fan. And thank god a LOT of folks think like me. Nice!

 

[These Are The Days]

Sorry but no more sports team welfare. It's never gonna happen here. Ever. At least for the Rays. The money can be spent on many other things that need it. I refuse to line the pockets of a freaking jerk off Mets fan. And thank god a LOT of folks think like me. Nice!

And of course not everyone is going to be invested in the project. More than anything the point is people who want the team to stay (like me) have no room for outrage

 

[CupsOverCash]

Theyre gone. I do think that once they are gone, they will make plans to build the stadium in Tampa somewhere and then get a new team eventually. The problem is they cant get the stadium done now because the owner doesnt want to spend the money and nobody here wants to use the tax money on it. Also its complicated to get out of the current stadium. So the easiest(well cheapest) route was to move the team now and think about the stadium later. This is my prediction.

 

[RegularSznAllStars]

Better idea.... just build the damn ballpark.

Tampa's sitting on an average of a $2,000 taxpayer surplus and regular fans around here are liable to spend $1500 between tickets (especially seasons tickets) concessions, merchandise etc or any other leisure within 3-10 years. Ask them to pledge that much over the course of 40 years for a ballpark and everyone loses their minds. And that total was assuming that solely 400,000 taxpayers (as if we aren't gonna have more in 40 years) are footing $600 million of the bill out of pocket and we aren't using anything creative like hotels or the other 500,000+ people (as if we aren't gonna have more) in the rest of Bay Area/Metro region to help out. Cuz sports fans be damned they're gonna be taxed likely less than $37.50 a year over 40 years when they can pay twice that much for tickets alone. Hell I spent that much in gas this morning.

I know it works differently than this but this is basic numbers crunching and how absurd it is that people say "Well why don't the Rays just build it?" great idea.... tell an owner worth $800 million to drop $800 million on a ballpark. Why didn't I think of that?

f*** that. We need to be spending on so many other things. Hurricane infrastructure? Preparing our city for global warming issues that arise from being a coastal region?

This city should not pay a dime to build a stadium for a failing sport and an owner who won’t invest a dollar in the team.

 

[These Are The Days]

**** that. We need to be spending on so many other things. Hurricane infrastructure? Preparing our city for global warming issues that arise from being a coastal region?

This city should not pay a dime to build a stadium for a failing sport and an owner who won’t invest a dollar in the team.

And I wanted the Tampa-Orlando-Miami light rail project but it got shot down because the perceived efficiency of the project was based on good days along I-4 etc and not the chaotic cluster f***s where you'd be saving 40-60 minutes or more. The fact we don't have any of these things you've suggested better demonstrates the failure of foresight by local government. But that's another ballgame I don't want to get started on.... but based on those statements you made I freaking love you....

But as for the Rays Sternberg has invested like $50 million to renovate Tropicana Field. You remember how bad it was 20 years ago right? But let's not even focus on that. We've been fielding playoff caliber teams on a shoestring budget in an area that's too small in business and population to sustain it while the former Mayor waved that f***ing lease around during the best years the team ever had an Hillsborough was head over heels in love with the team. Look, I don't ever feel bad for multimillionaires but all Tampa Bay has done is f*** the dude over and give excuse after excuse after excuse as to why our shoestring baseball team can't get any better than a hastily constructed tuna can from back in the 80's because we somehow thought we were gonna get the Giants or the White Sox. No one has ever tried to put themselves in Sternberg's position. If I asked you to take every asset you have to buy a house you can't afford you'd rightfully tell me no because it's a bad idea. Just because the dollars are bigger doesn't mean the situation is any different. The Yankees and Dodgers are probably the only two teams on the American continent that can afford to build a $800 million stadium out of pocket.

Look more often than not you, Rex and anyone else telling this guy to take a private jet to the sun are dead on. But I've been watching this story play out for 14 excruciating years and I can comfortably the Bay Area has done less for the team than Sternberg ever has, right down to not even selling out playoff games. If seeing 600 blue seats along the left and right-field foul poles counts as a sellout then that's pathetic. It ultimately boils down to fact that I understand that if I want something nice (and God how I want a new ballpark that's NOT 40 miles away from me) I'm gonna have to pitch in. I don't have to like it but bitching about it on my end isn't gonna make it better.



One of these days in probably 20 years or so Amalie Arena is gonna need replacement. If the land isn't used for anything else, there's probably an 85% chance the new arena is gonna be built at or near the old Expo Hall by the fairgrounds and it's gonna cost A LOT of money. God help us if Jeff Vinik passes away by then. I am NOT gonna watch my hockey team be taken from me because it doesn't have a suitable arena.... You bet your life I'll help pay for it with whatever penny of my tax dollar. I'll always be a baseball fan and I don't want to see the Rays for that reason.

 

[T REX]

And I wanted the Tampa-Orlando-Miami light rail project but it got shot down because the perceived efficiency of the project was based on good days along I-4 etc and not the chaotic cluster ****s where you'd be saving 40-60 minutes or more. The fact we don't have any of these things you've suggested better demonstrates the failure of foresight by local government. But that's another ballgame I don't want to get started on.... but based on those statements you made I freaking love you....

But as for the Rays Sternberg has invested like $50 million to renovate Tropicana Field. You remember how bad it was 20 years ago right? But let's not even focus on that. We've been fielding playoff caliber teams on a shoestring budget in an area that's too small in business and population to sustain it while the former Mayor waved that ****ing lease around during the best years the team ever had an Hillsborough was head over heels in love with the team. Look, I don't ever feel bad for multimillionaires but all Tampa Bay has done is **** the dude over and give excuse after excuse after excuse as to why our shoestring baseball team can't get any better than a hastily constructed tuna can from back in the 80's because we somehow thought we were gonna get the Giants or the White Sox. No one has ever tried to put themselves in Sternberg's position. If I asked you to take every asset you have to buy a house you can't afford you'd rightfully tell me no because it's a bad idea. Just because the dollars are bigger doesn't mean the situation is any different. The Yankees and Dodgers are probably the only two teams on the American continent that can afford to build a $800 million stadium out of pocket.

Look more often than not you, Rex and anyone else telling this guy to take a private jet to the sun are dead on. But I've been watching this story play out for 14 excruciating years and I can comfortably the Bay Area has done less for the team than Sternberg ever has, right down to not even selling out playoff games. If seeing 600 blue seats along the left and right-field foul poles counts as a sellout then that's pathetic. It ultimately boils down to fact that I understand that if I want something nice (and God how I want a new ballpark that's NOT 40 miles away from me) I'm gonna have to pitch in. I don't have to like it but *****ing about it on my end isn't gonna make it better.



One of these days in probably 20 years or so Amalie Arena is gonna need replacement. If the land isn't used for anything else, there's probably an 85% chance the new arena is gonna be built at or near the old Expo Hall by the fairgrounds and it's gonna cost A LOT of money. God help us if Jeff Vinik passes away by then. I am NOT gonna watch my hockey team be taken from me because it doesn't have a suitable arena.... You bet your life I'll help pay for it with whatever penny of my tax dollar. I'll always be a baseball fan and I don't want to see the Rays for that reason.

You can't compare a house to a stadium. That's a horrific analogy.

Tampa Bay Rays revenue 2001-2018 | Statistic

Aside from the appreciation of said team, there's a revenue stream. It's a freaking BUSINESS not a house. Houses do appreciate but unless you are running drugs, gambling or hookers out of it...It's not going to generate an income. Wanna try again? I don't understand your "oh poor stu" attitude. He can haul ass. I'll help him pack. Damn Mets fan.

 

[These Are The Days]

You can't compare a house to a stadium. That's a horrific analogy.

Tampa Bay Rays revenue 2001-2018 | Statistic

Aside from the appreciation of said team, there's a revenue stream. It's a freaking BUSINESS not a house. Houses do appreciate but unless you are running drugs, gambling or hookers out of it...It's not going to generate an income. Wanna try again? I don't understand your "oh poor stu" attitude. He can haul ass. I'll help him pack. Damn Mets fan.

Dude.... who cares if houses don't generate income? The point is if you spend every single penny you have on something you still can't afford, the results are exactly the same. You're basically telling me he can haul ass because he's worth $800 million (this also includes his ownership of the team/revenue) and won't put it all into a single building because you think the revenue stream it generates should be enough compensation for all the losses he's going to sustain doing it. $800 million for the ballpark is an estimate.... it might actually end up being more but the outrage is gonna be all the same, right?

No you're just pissed off that he's a Mets fan and doesn't live here. How do I know? You've mentioned it twice already. Get over yourself.

 

[T REX]

Dude.... who cares if houses don't generate income? The point is if you spend every single penny you have on something still can't afford, the results are exactly the same. You're basically telling me he can haul ass because he's worth $800 million (this also includes his ownership of the team/revenue) and won't put it all into a single building because you think the revenue stream it generates should be enough compensation for all the losses he's going to sustain doing it.

No you're just pissed off that he's a Mets fan and doesn't live here. How do I know? You've mentioned it twice already. Get over yourself.

No, he was only willing to put up a small pittance...$150 mill. Tampa told him to get lost. He's looking for a hand out. He has to put in at least half before I'll even consider it.

Also, these things are funded through bonds and other financing options. He wouldn't be asked to come up with the whole amount in cash. You finance it. Like a car or a HOUSE(lol). I don't think you understand the economics of it all. That's ok.

 

[These Are The Days]

No, he was only willing to put up a small pittance...$150 mill. Tampa told him to get lost. He's looking for a hand out. He has to put in at least half before I'll even consider it.

Also, these things are funded through bonds and other financing options. He wouldn't be asked to come up with the whole amount in cash. You finance it. Like a car or a HOUSE(lol). I don't think you understand the economics of it all. That's ok.

Of course it's financed.... almost crazy why I'd make a comparison towards something that you finance isn't it? But again it doesn't matter if you can't afford it. It doesn't matter if it's a sports team, a house, a car, boat, hookers and blow. It's out of his price range regardless of the revenue stream he stands to receive. How long do you think it's gonna take to finance hundreds of millions of dollars? And out of pocket? How would he sustain his other businesses? And $150 million is pittance? I'm worried you don't understand money. But whatever this is dumb man. We can't continue this anymore.

I'll see you during the draft. Let's hope we get a good one.

 

[T REX]

Of course it's financed.... almost crazy why I'd make a comparison towards something that you finance isn't it? But again it doesn't matter if you can't afford it. It doesn't matter if it's a sports team, a house, a car, boat, hookers and blow. It's out of his price range regardless of the revenue stream he stands to receive. How long do you think it's gonna take to finance hundreds of millions of dollars? And out of pocket? How would he sustain his other businesses? And $150 million is pittance? I'm worried you don't understand money. But whatever this is dumb man. We can't continue this anymore.

I'll see you during the draft. Let's hope we get a good one.

Oh poor stu...poor poor stu...come on man. The Trop was financed over 30 years...it's the same thing. He's not going to put up $150 mill in cash or $400 mill. He's going to finance it. It's not out of his price range at all. It's the cost of doing business. No corporate welfare hand outs. Again, I don't think you understand the numbers or economics at all. Dude is pulling in a quarter billion a year. Poor stu?

PS We'll agree to disagree. NBD. Go bolts! We need some muscle.

 

[These Are The Days]

Oh poor stu...poor poor stu...come on man. The Trop was financed over 30 years...it's the same thing. He's not going to put up $150 mill in cash or $400 mill. He's going to finance it. It's not out of his price range at all. It's the cost of doing business. No corporate welfare hand outs. Again, I don't think you understand the numbers or economics at all. Dude is pulling in a quarter billion a year. Poor stu?

You're not telling me anything I don't already know. I know his end is going to be financed, Rex. But for all I know that $150 million he pledged out of pocket was already going to be financed. For all I know it is all he can currently afford to do. And how do we know he's not paying off other loans now? I'm never going to know the full story of his end. The man is 60. How much longer is he gonna work to pay off financing? But again I've watched shoestring budget teams compete for playoff spots for 10 years now and I've watched Tampa/St. Pete collectively refuse to support the team the whole time. I've watched Stu go from a saint and one of the best owners in all sports to a disgusting penny, pinching sinner over those 10 years because of it. And in those 10 years I've gone to that depressing tuna can of a ballpark and watched the seating shrink by the thousands and I've listened to the cavernous echoes of blow horns and cowbells and one idiot yelling "Tampa" and 8 people yelling back "Bay" and because of it I now no longer wonder why Stu might need help.

The team is dying Rex and it's not Stu's fault when Tampa and St. Pete both collectively scream "NO!!!" when we are so much a part of the problem