GDT: Bruins @ Gambrell-less Sharks 7pm

[Fistfullofbeer]

Seattle needs a goalie. Sweeten the deal by giving them Vlasic to pick Jones in the expansion draft. They can make our pick a couple years early to really prepare their players.

Vlasic has a NMC. Jones has a modified NTC. I don't see them waiving for Seattle.

 

[Bleedred]

I’m sure there’s a concern about helping a rival. I always thought that absurd. We (the California teams) have made an amazing impact on the growth of hockey out here. While I’m not going to be thrilled if a rival wins a cup, we still need to improve our team, and keep on eye on the future of hockey. Having a California team in contention is good for all of us.....as the rival fans grind our teeth of course....
Miller’s been good for us and for USA hockey, I’d personally not mind him having a chance for a cup, especially if it helps our future a bit
But far more people than my wife believe I’m insane


Edit
And for proof, I quoted the wrong post.....this was about the response on Miller sorry.....I’ll slink my way out!

It's no problem, I understood which post you were meaning to address.

Obviously, as fans, I think a lot of us don't care so much about helping a rival have a better chance to win the cup, but I think those in management might feel a bit differently. I really doubt it's off the table though, but it would probably have to be for the right price for Murray to send him our way.

That said, I'm not sure a lot of playoff teams will be interested in a guy like Miller, I actually think the Sharks are the best bet, maybe Calgary. The only other teams that I think could use him would be some of the bubble teams like Carolina or (strangely enough) Vancouver and Vancouver is only a bubble team right now because of how insanely bad the West is at the bubble. Calgary could use him, but because of Smith (who they seem to respect too much) and the fact they probably wouldn't wanna trade Rittich, I think a guy like Dell is more expendable to us than those guys would be to them. Even though I think they absolutely can afford to lose Mike Smith, but that's a whole other topic. Now would the Ducks wanna acquire Dell who has a year left? I saw Boyle get a few starts and a shutout recently. Not sure if he's a legit prospect for you guys or what, but maybe he's the guy they want to backup Gibson next year, so they really wouldn't take Dell?

 

[WSS11]

Maybe they just need to invite Jones over for a sleepover.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Vlasic has a NMC. Jones has a modified NTC. I don't see them waiving for Seattle.

Jones won't have a choice when it comes to the Seattle expansion draft. He is available to be exposed by the team.

 

[Lebanezer]

 

[Bizz]

We should have kept Greiss.

Greiss was f***ing terrible too. About as bad as Niemi when he was here.

 

[Juxtaposer]

OUCH.

I do think it's too early to talk about a Jones buyout, as he's usually an average goalie and his cap hit isn't too bad for an average goalie, but the term isn't good. That's the worst part of his deal to me.

Honestly, I'd buy out Vlasic before Jones, if we were given the get out of jail for free card today.

I think we’d have to choose Jones. You can hide a subpar defenseman lower on your roster even if he’s overpaid (ie Seabrook). You cannot hide a starting goaltender making $6M for the next 5.25 years.

 

[pbgoalie]

It's no problem, I understood which post you were meaning to address.

Obviously, as fans, I think a lot of us don't care so much about helping a rival have a better chance to win the cup, but I think those in management might feel a bit differently. I really doubt it's off the table though, but it would probably have to be for the right price for Murray to send him our way.

That said, I'm not sure a lot of playoff teams will be interested in a guy like Miller, I actually think the Sharks are the best bet, maybe Calgary. The only other teams that I think could use him would be some of the bubble teams like Carolina or (strangely enough) Vancouver and Vancouver is only a bubble team right now because of how insanely bad the West is at the bubble. Calgary could use him, but because of Smith (who they seem to respect too much) and the fact they probably wouldn't wanna trade Rittich, I think a guy like Dell is more expendable to us than those guys would be to them. Even though I think they absolutely can afford to lose Mike Smith, but that's a whole other topic. Now would the Ducks wanna acquire Dell who has a year left? I saw Boyle get a few starts and a shutout recently. Not sure if he's a legit prospect for you guys or what, but maybe he's the guy they want to backup Gibson next year, so they really wouldn't take Dell?

I’m assuming we wouldn’t want to take Dell, and would go with Boyle on our current depth chart. Where we are heading, we need prospects/picks, and to save money, unless we can have Kesler and Eaves somehow take a flight on Amelia Earhart Airlines to Robidas Island

 

[WTFetus]

I think we’d have to choose Jones. You can hide a subpar defenseman lower on your roster even if he’s overpaid (ie Seabrook). You cannot hide a starting goaltender making $6M for the next 5.25 years.

Expansion draft is in the 2020 off-season right? Could probably deal with 1 more season and then give Seattle a pick to take Jones.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Expansion draft is in the 2020 off-season right? Could probably deal with 1 more season and then give Seattle a pick to take Jones.

I guess it’s theoretically possible, but it doesn’t fix the current issue, which is Jones stinking up the joint this season and ruining a potential Cup contender.

 

[Sharksfan83]

Expansion draft is in the 2020 off-season right? Could probably deal with 1 more season and then give Seattle a pick to take Jones.

Im not sure what we do without Jones.. Who legitimately has a goalie available? Or is Korenar that good of a prospect that he can be a NHL starter in 2 years?

 

[Bleedred]

We should have kept Greiss.

You really think he would have stayed behind here the last 6 years to be a backup? I do not.

And if you think he should have been kept to be the starter, he had a worse season last year than Jones has ever had. His season last year was worse than Alex Stalock bad. Obviously, it was just a down year, but he's also not that good either.

He's a good 1b goalie at the very most. Jones ceiling was absolutely higher than his and probably still is.

I think we’d have to choose Jones. You can hide a subpar defenseman lower on your roster even if he’s overpaid (ie Seabrook). You cannot hide a starting goaltender making $6M for the next 5.25 years.

It's certainly a valid argument. My rationale for it (as of this moment) is that Jones is usually an average to slightly above average goaltender, but is not this year. My hope is that he's not that bad this year and will progress back to average next year and I think he will be closer to average next year. He may even have a really good season, but even that is probably an aberration, just like this year (hopefully) is.

Vlasic has been bad for like 3 years now, so as of this very moment, I think Vlasic is the one I'd take a buyout on, especially if it was an amnesty buyout. Both are way too devastating for a regular buyout right now.

Another year and I could feel the opposite, if Jones has another sub-900% season in him.

I disagree. Teams are always on the lookout for a D-man. Vlasic is turning it around and still has trade value, though it is limited by his NMC.

Goalie's are tricky because you only have 1 starter per team and with the money that Jones makes, he has to be the #1 on that team.

I don't really think Vlasic is turning it around. I think if Vlasic is tradable, it certainly isn't right now, as he's only in year one of an 8 year deal. You don't see players with that long of term traded in year one of their contract. I'm sure you can find examples of it happening, but it's rare.

Not that I think Jones is a movable deal right now either, unless Doug wanted to take back Cory Schneider or possibly Jake Allen or Scott Darling.

Expansion draft is in the 2020 off-season right? Could probably deal with 1 more season and then give Seattle a pick to take Jones.

It'll be in the 2021 off-season.

It appeared like it was gonna be in the 2020 offseason, but due to the Key Arena renovations not being on schedule to be completed until November of 2020, they decided to start play in the 2021 season, so they didn't have to open the first month on the road. I'm sure the CBA expiration also plays a role in that. It would be disastrous from their perspective to have the NHL on a lockout during their first year of play and delaying their debut.

 

[WSS11]

Boston fans are seriously saying the refs were screwing them tonight too lol... but this is truly inconclusive. On the flip side if they called it a goal on the ice then It would have stood.

 

[WTFetus]

I don't really think Vlasic is turning it around. I think if Vlasic is tradable, it certainly isn't right now, as he's only in year one of an 8 year deal. You don't see players with that long of term traded in year one of their contract. I'm sure you can find examples of it happening, but it's rare.

Not that I think Jones is a movable deal right now either, unless Doug wanted to take back Cory Schneider or possibly Jake Allen or Scott Darling.

I just think Vlasic has his past reputation going for him. Teams likely aren't paying close attention to either and will just rely on what their stats are. All Vlasic has against him stats-wise is a terrible +/- this year, which is an unreliable stat. Save percentage is pretty cut-and-dry.

 

[Tw1ster]

Boston fans are seriously saying the refs were screwing them tonight too lol... but this is truly inconclusive. On the flip side if they called it a goal on the ice then It would have stood.

I kind of think that was in as well. The refs sucked and even if that counted and the calls were right it would have went to OT. End of the day we need more than 14 saves on 20 shots

 

[Bleedred]

I just think Vlasic has his past reputation going for him. Teams likely aren't paying close attention to either and will just rely on what their stats are. All Vlasic has against him stats-wise is a terrible +/- this year, which is an unreliable stat. Save percentage is pretty cut-and-dry.

Vlasic's relative corsi is also pretty horrific this year and poor the last two years before this, but that is a good point that he has past reputation going for him.

Jones having this kind of a save percentage on a team that's got this many points and wins is pretty scary if you're scouting him. Although he has fooled many in the media and fans (mostly out of town fans that don't follow his team) into believing he's an ''Elite'' or ''Top-10'' goalie. My guess is that this is because they see he plays for a strong team, that's always in the playoffs since he's been here and even a finals berth (he played great that first year and playoffs) and they think ''Well, this is a GOOD team. The goalie must be REALLY good!''.

 

[gaucholoco3]

I have been to a lot of sharks games and this was the first time bottles were thrown at the officials at the end of the game. It was crazy. Just ruined the great atmosphere after jumbos hatty.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

I was just looking at Moneypuck's SV% above expected statistic, and one thing that jumped out at me was that that the top-5 starting goaltenders in the stat are all starting goaltenders on teams that are top-6 in points percentage. The one goaltender whose team is in the top-6 in points percentage, but who also isn't in the top-5 in this state, is Martin Jones. 6th in the stat is Jimmy Howard, which is almost too funny of a coincidence to be true.

So, I went ahead and took a closer look at things. I looked at every starting goaltender's points percentage in decisions and tried to see if there was a correlation between their save% above expected and their winning percentage.

Indeed, there was a strong correlation; on average, for every 1% by which save percentage above expected increases, the goaltenders's winning percentage increases by 13%. I included a chart because it's easier to visualize things that way.

The x-axis is SV% above expected and the y-axis is points percentage. So, hypothetically, top-right is good goalies on good teams, bottom-left is bad goalies on bad teams, top-left is bad goalies on bad teams, and bottom-right is good goalies on bad teams. I highlighted Martin Jones.

 

[Doctor Soraluce]

I was just looking at Moneypuck's SV% above expected statistic, and one thing that jumped out at me was that that the top-5 starting goaltenders in the stat are all starting goaltenders on teams that are top-6 in points percentage. The one goaltender whose team is in the top-6 in points percentage, but who also isn't in the top-5 in this state, is Martin Jones. 6th in the stat is Jimmy Howard, which is almost too funny of a coincidence to be true.

So, I went ahead and took a closer look at things. I looked at every starting goaltender's points percentage in decisions and tried to see if there was a correlation between their save% above expected and their winning percentage.

Indeed, there was a strong correlation; on average, for every 1% by which save percentage above expected increases, the goaltenders's winning percentage increases by 13%. I included a chart because it's easier to visualize things that way.

The x-axis is SV% above expected and the y-axis is points percentage. So, hypothetically, top-right is good goalies on good teams, bottom-left is bad goalies on bad teams, top-left is bad goalies on bad teams, and bottom-right is good goalies on bad teams. I highlighted Martin Jones.

This is horrifying... Going to be really interesting to see if DW thinks this is as big a deal as we do. Seems like Howard might be the most realistic option to add at the trade deadline. Seems like jones is either giving up 2 goals and playing well or giving up 6 with no in-between. Sheesh...

 

[Alwalys]

Boston fans are seriously saying the refs were screwing them tonight too lol... but this is truly inconclusive. On the flip side if they called it a goal on the ice then It would have stood.

actually there might have been enough to overturn it, this view shows the puck is in the air, and the overhead shows no white between the line and the puck, so it can be said to not have completely crossed the line. but of course toronto can never be trusted.

 

[Coily]

Jones has run out of time to show he can make routine saves on a nightly basis and keep rebounds under control. It's just silly to assume he'll "amp up" in the playoffs.

 

[Alwalys]

I'm just mostly really bummed that Thornton's epic night did not get the happy ending it deserved.

 

[slocal]

From November of last year:

I can’t say for sure, but it appeared referee Francis Charron handed out the penalty to Vlasic.

“The kill came through,” DeBoer said. “There’s a personal issue with those two guys. They go at it every time we play. You hope the more mature one would take the higher road, so to speak. But I guess that didn’t happen.”

Joe Thornton shines on San Jose Sharks' third line

So...at least Pickles didn't get an unsportsmanlike this time? That's a positive, yeah?

 

[Jaleel619]

I loved the part where somebody belts out, "Thats Highsticking!" Its like take that Canadians! We too know hockey!

 

[hohosaregood]

From November of last year:

I can’t say for sure, but it appeared referee Francis Charron handed out the penalty to Vlasic.

“The kill came through,” DeBoer said. “There’s a personal issue with those two guys. They go at it every time we play. You hope the more mature one would take the higher road, so to speak. But I guess that didn’t happen.”

Joe Thornton shines on San Jose Sharks' third line

So...at least Pickles didn't get an unsportsmanlike this time? That's a positive, yeah?

Vlasic's feud with every Quebecois continues