Brighter Future: Edmonton or Toronto?

[biotk]

Well Corsica shows McDavid with 500 min with Maroon and 229 min with Lucic 5/5 so where in the hell does he get 45% with McDavid and 37 % with Nuge He has played more min with Nuge then McDavid and Maroon has played more then double the 5/5 min as Lucic with McDavid . I knew I smelled BS ty for playing.

Perhaps you should learn how follow directions.

The first thing that would happen if you did is you would figure out that can't determine the percentage of Lucic's minutes which he played with McDavid by looking at McDavid.

The second thing you would figure out is that the 500 minutes you mentioned is not all the minutes that McDavid has played with Maroon - but the minutes that McDavid has played with BOTH Maroon and Draisatl.

So when you actually follow the direction and look at Lucic you see that Lucic has played with 12 different line combinations at 5v5 and they total 933 5v5 minutes.

McDavid is a linemate on 5 of those 12 line combinations: for 229, 72, 66, 42 and 11 minutes totalling 420 minutes or 45% of Lucic's 5v5 time.

Nuge is a linemate on 2 of those 12 line combinations: for 292 and 50 minutes - totalling 342 minutes or 37% of Lucic's 5v5 time.

So, no you didn't smell BS.

 

[Soundwave]

So if McDavid doesn't make players better, does that mean Draisaitl is incredibly awesome and perhaps a Matthews tier player himself?

Can't have it both ways.

 

[Eyedea]

Seems kinda like splitting hairs at this point. If you are 19/20 and you're winning the freaking Art Ross and Hart trophy against a Sidney Crosby who's still in his 20s no less ... you are a player of a caliber that this league has seen maybe 3-4 times total in its entire history.

We also saw Ovechkin win 3 Harts before Crosby won 2, and Lindsay's to go along with them. Previous eras were painted with one particular player winning Art Ross' over the rest. Nowadays the parity and competition is just so ridiculous that it's difficult to see one player stand above everyone else for five, six years in a row. McDavid can obviously be that guy, hence the generational talent, but to be that guy is even more rare.

 

[No1]

So if McDavid doesn't make players better, does that mean Draisaitl is incredibly awesome and perhaps a Matthews tier player himself?

Can't have it both ways.

You missed earlier in the thread when they were saying Draisaitl is way better than Matthews.

 

[biotk]

And he would have still been in top 4 in league scoring. As a ROOKIE.

Something Matthews isn't even CLOSE to.

And wouldn't have made the top 25 in goals, while Matthews is currently 2nd.

 

[TheNumber4]

And wouldn't have made the top 25 in goals, while Matthews is currently 2nd.

I'm sorry I dont live in a Leafs fantasy world where Assists don't exist.

 

[Ninety7]

And wouldn't have made the top 25 in goals, while Matthews is currently 2nd.

Wow gee golly second in the league!!!

Let me know when he gets to first though

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Wow gee golly second in the league!!!

Let me know when he gets to first though

Yeah second in goals in his rookie year, such a pedestrian achievement. If only he could've gotten nearly 50 points like McDavid

 

[TheNumber4]

Yeah second in goals in his rookie year, such a pedestrian achievement. If only he could've gotten nearly 50 points like McDavid

*in 45 games.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

*in 45 games.

Still a worse season, even if it was an unlucky break for the poor kid. Let's see what Matthews can do in his second year

 

[TheNumber4]

Still a worse season, even if it was an unlucky break for the poor kid. Let's see what Matthews can do in his second year

Wrong. Playing at an above point per game pace that would have put him top 3 in league scoring is a better season than Auston "Barely Cracks Top 20" Matthews.

 

[Soundwave]

Still a worse season, even if it was an unlucky break for the poor kid. Let's see what Matthews can do in his second year

I will be interested to see what both Matthews and Laine can do as sophomores, the expectations are now going to be much higher. McDavid has basically passed that test with ease this year.

 

[Ninety7]

Yeah second in goals in his rookie year, such a pedestrian achievement. If only he could've gotten nearly 50 points like McDavid

Great achievement. But what McDavid is doing right now is more impressive.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Wrong. Playing at an above point per game pace that would have put him top 3 in league scoring is a better season than Auston "Barely Cracks Top 20" Matthews.

if you were a coach would you rather have a player get 67 points in a season or 48?

 

[TheNumber4]

if you were a coach would you rather have a player get 67 points in a season or 48?

If I were an NHL coach I wouldn't be stupid enough to fall for that stupid question. I'd realize how points per game and injuries work. Nice try though! Real clever!

Now ask all 30 coaches in the League and 30 GMs in the League who would they rather have? McDavid or Matthews. And the answer will be conclusively McDavid and you know it. And Leafs fans would say the same thing although their homer glasses won't allow them to admit it.

 

[lebdafor norris]

Agreed, names don't mean much. Stats do.

That's why the Oilers are top 10 in most defensive stats and the Leafs are bottom 10.

Even in the simplest stat, GA, the Oilers are significantly ahead (7th to 19th). Jeez, the Leafs are tied with the CANUCKS for goals against and the Canucks have an abysmal defense.

Goalies are even.
Defense edge to Oilers.
Offense slight edge to Leafs but I think the edge will dissipate once Poolparty is ready (yes, I know the Leafs have prospects as well but none are at Poolparty's tier).

Leafs 5 vs 5 HDCA60 (high danger chances against per 60 minutes): 10.6 (16th in the league)

Oilers 5 vs 5 HDCA60: 11.36 (27th in the league)

Leafs 5 vs 5 xGA60 (expected goals against per 60): 2.70 (28th in the League)
Oilers 5 vs 5 xGA60: 2.63 (24th in the League)

Leafs PK: 83% (8th in the League)
Oilers PK: 80.2% (19th in the League)

Which defensive stats are you referring to? Because according to this statistics the Oilers skaters have actually been quite poor defensively but the team have still manage to put up a low GA average thanks to Cam Talbot's performance this season (whom in my opinion deserves to be nominated for the Vezna).

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

If I were an NHL coach I wouldn't be stupid enough to fall for that stupid question. I'd realize how points per game and injuries work. Nice try though! Real clever!

Now ask all 30 coaches in the League and 30 GMs in the League who would they rather have? McDavid or Matthews. And the answer will be conclusively McDavid and you know it. And Leafs fans would say the same thing although their homer glasses won't allow them to admit it.

Matthews has had a better rookie season from any objective standpoint, which is probably why that fact is beyond you. Yes McDavid being hurt for half the year is a big part of that, but it doesn't stop it from being true. Panarin winning the Calder over him should tell you everything you need to know about how voters felt about his year

 

[Namtsua]

if you were a coach would you rather have a player get 67 points in a season or 48?

This is such a silly argument.

Objectively, you'd want the player with more points, but you're completely discounting the fact that McDavid missed practically half a season.

Let's follow your logic for a second. Let's say Crosby gets 48 points, but is injured halfway through the year. Let's also say Yakupov channels his inner Matthews and gets 67 points. Are you telling me that any coach would pick Yakpouv over Crosby?

 

[TheNumber4]

Matthews has had a better rookie season from any objective standpoint, which is probably why that fact is beyond you. Yes McDavid being hurt for half the year is a big part of that, but it doesn't stop it from being true. Panarin winning the Calder over him should tell you everything you need to know about how voters felt about his year

1. He hasn't because an "objective standpoint" wouldn't ignore an entire category of points called assists and an injury.
2. McDavid is the better player ACTUALLY objectively.
3. That's all the matters.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

This is such a silly argument.

Objectively, you'd want the player with more points, but you're completely discounting the fact that McDavid missed practically half a season.

Let's follow your logic for a second. Let's say Crosby gets 48 points, but is injured halfway through the year. Let's also say Yakupov channels his inner Matthews and gets 67 points. Are you telling me that any coach would pick Yakpouv over Crosby?

no, but any coach would take Yak's season over Crosby's season. Glad you agree Matthews has been a more impressive rookie, and I guess we can see if he can build on his success like McDavid has

 

[TheNumber4]

no, but any coach would take Yak's season over Crosby's season. Glad you agree Matthews has been a more impressive rookie, and I guess we can see if he can build on his success like MI cDavid has

I missed the part where he agreed with your argument. And can you please remind me when the next Hockey Season Trade DeadLine is? Oilers need to be ready to trade our players' seasons with another just in case an injury happens again.

 

[VainGretzky]

Leafs 5 vs 5 HDCA60 (high danger chances against per 60 minutes): 10.6 (16th in the league)

Oilers 5 vs 5 HDCA60: 11.36 (27th in the league)

Leafs 5 vs 5 xGA60 (expected goals against per 60): 2.70 (28th in the League)
Oilers 5 vs 5 xGA60: 2.63 (24th in the League)

Leafs PK: 83% (8th in the League)
Oilers PK: 80.2% (19th in the League)

Which defensive stats are you referring to? Because according to this statistics the Oilers skaters have actually been quite poor defensively but the team have still manage to put up a low GA average thanks to Cam Talbot's performance this season (whom in my opinion deserves to be nominated for the Vezna).

Wow expected stats instead of actual results Here are actual not expected Gaa Edmonton 7th Toronto 19th so what is it Toronto's bad Defence or horrible goaltending what makes me laugh about anaylitics is that we're told not to trust our eyes but to trust the eyes recording these stats If anyone has watched the Oilers this season would see how solid the D has been .

 

[Soundwave]

I think Matthews has had a obviously fantastic rookie year, a rare one (as has Laine). That said I think he's more of that Stamkos (pre-knee injury) tier than the Crosby tier. Ditto for Laine and Eichel. I think McDavid is in the Crosby tier.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

I missed the part where he agreed with your argument. And can you please remind me when the next Hockey Season Trade DeadLine is? Oilers need to be ready to trade our players' seasons with another just in case an injury happens again.

it was when he said "Obviously you'd take the player with more points"
He can be reasonable and say Matthews had a better rookie season, yet you still want to twist around to avoid giving him credit. Pretty weird honestly

 

[TheNumber4]

it was when he said "Obviously you'd take the player with more points"
He can be reasonable and say Matthews had a better rookie season, yet you still want to twist around to avoid giving him credit. Pretty weird honestly

Did you forget about the part where he called your argument silly and then went into how stupid it is to ignore an injury when assessing someone's season?