Player Discussion: Braydon Coburn

[TheTriplets]

to triplets i love coburn as a five not as a 3 or 4 he is just ok but as a 5 he will be perfect imho for what he brings advanced stats are ok to use but i view you as a hater more then seeing the entire game hell yes he gets hemmed in but to me with our system that is cause hes out there with pac man and brown and boyle all the time etc...

if flipper is running the third line next year he will do much better even if is playing 3-4 spot

i also knew exactly what coburn brings to table before signing him the good and the bad its our forwards that need to get the pucks out more then him he cant really be hedman and skate it out

carle was much much much worse and often he was paired with garrison who was tired or not the same guy he was during season or ohhhhh my god shut the eyes sustr lol

again i like that he tries to shut down the opposition at the line i like that he will block shots and kick people out of crease i dont care if he does more then that

i want our forwards to do more myself the top forwards actually do more

Well, whether he plays 2nd or 3rd pairing doesn't really influence the fact he's getting buried in his zone. 3rd pairing makes it a bit better, because usually 3rd pair dman play less than 2nd par dman, but it doesnt solve the problem in general.

I'm a hater? WTF? Why would I hate my team ('s player)? I love this team and every single player on it. I love Coburn as a person (not that I'd know him, but from what I hear in interviews, etc), but he's just not a defenseman I like seeing out in the ice in a lightning sweater. Everytime he's one, you just know, that A) we won't score and B) the chance the opponent scores vastly increases. And since I love this team, I don't like to feel that way.

Well first, I don't thnk it's true he plays more with the 4th line than others. Why would he? 55-5 play with the triplets and the stamkos line as well. Sure, Fs can help bring the puck out, but it starts with the D's. He does not have to be Hedman. There's sth in the middle between one of, if not the best player at bringing the puck out in Hedman and one of the worst in Coburn. Like Carle for example. He turns the puck over at times, yes (so does Coburn). But he doesn't get stuck in his zone nearly as often as Coburn does.
The one thing I give to Coburn is, he's on of the few on the team able to clearing the crease. That's a good thing. But doesn't really make up for everything else.

 

[Hoek]

We tried Carle on the right side. It was loltastically bad.

Still think Coburn will be better next season when he has time to actually learn the system and our breakouts, etc.

 

[Vasilevskiy]

Yeah, and they tell the story I see on the ice every game.
You don't get me point. It's not whether he's put on to defend/attack or whatever. It's not about offensive stats (goals, assists, etc).
It's about the fact, that whenever Coburn is on the ice, TB is in their own end (and not, or just in a few cases, because they start there), which leads to two things:

1. opponent can score
2. TB can't score

that's the entire, simple problem. That's what I observed watching the games. And that's what advanced stats prove and underline in impressive fashion.

How does it help that he's somewhat okay playing in his own end, if that's the lone thing he does?
It's basically bringing oneself in danger but often being able to rescue oneself. Wouldn't it be much smarter bringing the opponent in danger?

You're saying he ticks the box "not making mistakes". Well, he has a few turnovers less than Carle or Sustr, I'll give you that (actually pretty close, Coburn 16, Carle 19 in the playoffs). But his mistake is to net get the puck out. He chips the pucks in the neutral zone and 80% of the time, an opponent brings/chips it right back in our zone.

You know what?
When next season starts if he's on the team (no reason why he wouldn't be) I will take a closer look at him (it's obvious you do) and if he sucks so much in our transition game I will eat my words.

 

[TheTriplets]

You know what?
When next season starts if he's on the team (no reason why he wouldn't be) I will take a closer look at him (it's obvious you do) and if he sucks so much in our transition game I will eat my words.

Do it, if his play doesn't radically change (and why would it?), I'm pretty sure you'll agree..

 

[HoseEmDown]

Depends on the situation. As I said, I have no problem with Carle playing next to Garrison/Barberio/Stralman. Next to Sustr, he was horrible.

I'd rather have a Garrison/Carle pairing, than a Garrison/Coburn pairing.

But I'd prefer Coburn/Sustr over Carle/Sustr.

It depends whom you play them with. But of course, after next season, Carle (or better his contract) has to be moved, no doubt.

So you're seriously saying that you'd take Carle over Coburn unless Coburn was paired with Sustr? There's no way you watched all 100+ games if that's the case and that your advanced stats are garbage.

You must be more knowledgeable then everyone else on here because nobody who watches games not advanced stats will tell you Carle is the better player. I like Carle and don't think he's nearly that bad, besides contract, but Coburn easily is the better player.

When you watch all 100+ games do you keep a stopwatch with you and time how long players are stuck in their own zone? Not sure what the appeal is to advanced stats fans, seems like it wouldn't be enjoyable watching to determine who spent x amount of time in each zone instead of for entertainment. There's plenty of games where I can tell a player is doing terrible in their own zone but as long as they have few of those with many strong games then I consider them a good player.

 

[nhljohnson]

As for Coburn, I don't know how anyone can be left anything but underwhelmed. There's no way around acknowledging he served as a boat anchor for Garrison, his main partner, when you review the extended metrics.

That said, ure, beyond own Coburn's limitations, I think part of the blame belongs with Bowness for continuously matching two guys, both fairly mobile but neither really that agile or fleet of foot (Coburn skates well for his size), whose strengths do not include carrying or moving the puck out and through the defensive and neutral zones.

As with Carle, Coburn probably comes up smelling a hell of a lot better with a partner better suited to for him, someonr more capable not only in retrieving the puck but in distributing it cleanly and with more efficiency, thereby pushing the play the other way.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

Well, whether he plays 2nd or 3rd pairing doesn't really influence the fact he's getting buried in his zone. 3rd pairing makes it a bit better, because usually 3rd pair dman play less than 2nd par dman, but it doesnt solve the problem in general.

I'm a hater? WTF? Why would I hate my team ('s player)? I love this team and every single player on it. I love Coburn as a person (not that I'd know him, but from what I hear in interviews, etc), but he's just not a defenseman I like seeing out in the ice in a lightning sweater. Everytime he's one, you just know, that A) we won't score and B) the chance the opponent scores vastly increases. And since I love this team, I don't like to feel that way.

Well first, I don't thnk it's true he plays more with the 4th line than others. Why would he? 55-5 play with the triplets and the stamkos line as well. Sure, Fs can help bring the puck out, but it starts with the D's. He does not have to be Hedman. There's sth in the middle between one of, if not the best player at bringing the puck out in Hedman and one of the worst in Coburn. Like Carle for example. He turns the puck over at times, yes (so does Coburn). But he doesn't get stuck in his zone nearly as often as Coburn does.
The one thing I give to Coburn is, he's on of the few on the team able to clearing the crease. That's a good thing. But doesn't really make up for everything else.

simply this coburn might not get it out everytime but he does get it around on boards with right forwards we usually get a line change carle would turn it over and lose us goals lol

 

[Stamper]

As for Coburn, I don't know how anyone can be left anything but underwhelmed. There's no way around acknowledging he served as a boat anchor for Garrison, his main partner, when you review the extended metrics.

That said, ure, beyond own Coburn's limitations, I think part of the blame belongs with Bowness for continuously matching two guys, both fairly mobile but neither really that agile or fleet of foot (Coburn skates well for his size), whose strengths do not include carrying or moving the puck out and through the defensive and neutral zones.

As with Carle, Coburn probably comes up smelling a hell of a lot better with a partner better suited to for him, someonr more capable not only in retrieving the puck but in distributing it cleanly and with more efficiency, thereby pushing the play the other way.

He's always been bad at transition, or that's what I've made out of flyers fans descriptions, but I'm pretty sure some of his woes there are due to not knowing our system, or his injury hampering him.

Garrison and Coburn should have fitted each other pretty good, next season we'll have a better picture of the extent of his skills and woes.

 

[Werewolf]

Coburn is there to clear the crease, win board battles, and take on the larger PFs from the other team. He gives us physicality on the back line without being out of position and the skating ability to keep up with the smaller forwards. He is not here to be an offensive catalyst, nor be puck possession hog, nor put up points from the blue line. He is simply here to post up the biggest dudes on the other team and fight in front of Bishop...which he does very well with a huge frame.

You are looking at the wrong stat if you are looking at possession numbers and Coburn - he is not here to drive possession. You are looking at a defensive stalwart (reliable, hardworking, staunch) that gobbles up forwards and can skate up and down the ice with anyone in the league. He probably needs to be paired with a more offensive minded defenseman than Garrison.

Besides Hedman we really did not have any defenseman that can carry the puck from zone to zone. Ultimately, how many defensive acquisitions truly made a difference for their teams? Ranger fans hated Yandle. Kimmo Timonen barely saw the ice. Tim Gleason, Bortuzzo, Simon Despres...nothings to see here. Probably Petry made the biggest splash and we knocked their sorry butts out of the playoffs and is costing Montreal over $5M p/year - locked for 6 years. For Jeff Petry...lmao.

This was an excellent and shrewd acquisition by Yzerman to fit in a specific role for our team...and its probably seen as the best acquisition by any team at the trade deadline.

 

[Bolt32]

Coburn is there to clear the crease, win board battles, and take on the larger PFs from the other team. He gives us physicality on the back line without being out of position and the skating ability to keep up with the smaller forwards. He is not here to be an offensive catalyst, nor be puck possession hog, nor put up points from the blue line. He is simply here to post up the biggest dudes on the other team and fight in front of Bishop...which he does very well with a huge frame.

You are looking at the wrong stat if you are looking at possession numbers and Coburn - he is not here to drive possession. You are looking at a defensive stalwart (reliable, hardworking, staunch) that gobbles up forwards and can skate up and down the ice with anyone in the league. He probably needs to be paired with a more offensive minded defenseman than Garrison.

Besides Hedman we really did not have any defenseman that can carry the puck from zone to zone. Ultimately, how many defensive acquisitions truly made a difference for their teams? Ranger fans hated Yandle. Kimmo Timonen barely saw the ice. Tim Gleason, Bortuzzo, Simon Despres...nothings to see here. Probably Petry made the biggest splash and we knocked their sorry butts out of the playoffs and is costing Montreal over $5M p/year - locked for 6 years. For Jeff Petry...lmao.

This was an excellent and shrewd acquisition by Yzerman to fit in a specific role for our team...and its probably seen as the best acquisition by any team at the trade deadline.

Honestly I would love to see Nesterov paired with Coburn. Let Nesterov pitch up offensively which he seems to do well and has the hockey IQ for it, and let Coburn cover for him when he does. Would be an awesome bottom pairing. That is if Coburn resigns with us.....

 

[Vasilevskiy]

What about...
Coburn - Hedman
Stralman - Garrison
Nesterov - XXX
Sustr

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

Honestly I would love to see Nesterov paired with Coburn. Let Nesterov pitch up offensively which he seems to do well and has the hockey IQ for it, and let Coburn cover for him when he does. Would be an awesome bottom pairing. That is if Coburn resigns with us.....

this is what im hoping for also let nestea do what he does best let coburn stay at home

 

[LightningStrikes]

What about...
Coburn - Hedman
Stralman - Garrison
Nesterov - XXX
Sustr

Hedman - Coburn
Garrison - Stralman

That's the sides they played on this season.

 

[Rschmitz]

What about...
Coburn - Hedman
Stralman - Garrison
Nesterov - XXX
Sustr

Sustr will be in the top 6, and even if Yzerman signs a pretty good D Nesterov would be the one on the outside looking in.

 

[Vasilevskiy]

Hedman - Coburn
Garrison - Stralman

That's the sides they played on this season.

Yeah, that, I wasn't thinking about the sides, just the pairings

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

Trade him for prospect(s) while his value is still rumored to be high....its how you keep your team on top

 

[Bolt32]

Sustr will be in the top 6, and even if Yzerman signs a pretty good D Nesterov would be the one on the outside looking in.

Right now. I don't like you.....

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Trade him for prospect(s) while his value is still rumored to be high....its how you keep your team on top

No way man, trade Hedman for picks. He might ask for 5.5m

 

[Stammertime91]

Lol at people saying how bad he is....

So would you rather have Gudas? I wouldnt. Without Coburn we don't make it past detroit, not just of his goal, but because we don't have NHL caliber dmen out side the swedes and garrison. Getting him got us to the final. He was very good in the first 2 rounds. Very good. He had a tough time in a couple of the ECF games and I felt he played poor in 4/6 SCF games but overall, he's a very good top 4 dman to have.

If you point fingers at Coburn, point fingers at the immobile Jason Garrison. Not to knock Garrison as he was so damn good all year, but he had his moments too.

 

[KevinRedkey]

Thoughts on his play thus far?
Will Tampa be re-signing him? If so what kind of money/term do you think he deserves?

I haven't seen him play outside of 2 games this year so I'm curious what everyone thinks.

 

[Iceman]

Below average.... he started out fine with us, got injured and had a decent playoffs all things considered.

Now? Below average.

But he is our least problem right now.

 

[DFC]

He's probably gonna walk as a UFA, unless we find ourselves way, way out of the playoff picture at the TDL. Then we might deal him as a cheap rental.

 

[ultra63]

He's probably gonna walk as a UFA, unless we find ourselves way, way out of the playoff picture at the TDL. Then we might deal him as a cheap rental.

Like a Dman and a 1st and 3rd draft pick

 

[Hoek]

Coburn is fine but not irreplaceable.

 

[The Gongshow]

Was a decent pick up and helped in the long run for the playoffs. Now he's just alright. He's a big body on the back end which is always a good thing to have, helps a bit since most of our team is so small and once they get pushed around they tend to flop and not play their speed game.

I would be okay to signing him again, not for a long term or a lot of money, but would also be okay if we traded or didn't resign him. Koekkoek and DeAngelo are the two future blue liners in Yzermans back pocket that will be at the door sooner rather than later