Rumor: Boeser to Minnesota?

[krutovsdonut]

this thread was started by a minny fan based on a tweet from a minnesota reporter about a minnesota born and raised hockey player and his agent, who is also from minnesota, who are reported to be working on a trade of the player to a minnesota team.

in this thread multiple minny fans are claiming they are barely interested in said player and regaling canucks fans with very low valuations of boeser.

i guess it's like grade school when i learned you can tell a girl really likes a boy because she keeps talking about him and you have to disregard the fact she is talking about how much she hates him.

 

[Cogburn]

Fair. The Wild can trade Greenway and/or Adddison in the off-season as well. They don't have to be part of the trade. We have plenty of cap space for this season.

I think Boeser would need to be retained down to 5M for it to work for the Wild past this season. At that salary, he's worth a 2nd and maybe a B prospect. Maybe that's not worth it for Vancouver. But there are rental options for the Wild at that price that don't require making additional trades to clear cap space for next year.

I agree 100% with the first statement you made. Greenway and Addison aren't vital pieces for Vancouver. We have wingers, we have PP specialist D, I believe Minnesota would find better value with another set of teams for these assets. I also agree there are better assets to target that fit Minnesota's unique cap situation, if it was simply a rental they were after.

We are no longer frantically trying to scramble every dollar of cap space we can get to resign Kuzmenko and Horvat. Ottawa just paid a little below this (a 2nd and a 4th) for similar amount (3/4s?) of cap space next season (instead of over 2) alone, without a 50-60 point scorer attached. I would agree, that, in a cap world, a player like Boeser with no cap dumps or retention would be worth about what you are describing here, and I reserve my right to argue what constitutes a "B prospect". That retention, even for a seemingly small amount, spikes the price of the player though.

 

[Digitalbooya]

According to this one tweet. Other sources have had Minnesota being the party, uh, "offending party" as it were. I lazily posted a few of the top results earlier in the thread, so there is at least less of a consensus there.

So Greenway, who again we have no use for even if he does bounce back to regular form, is an ideal bounce back candidate, but Boeser, who is younger and is already starting to put up points like his old self, is a headache. Respectfully, I am not following that line of thought at all. I understand the delicate cap situation the Wild are in, and if that sewers interest, that's fine, but you can't sell a redundant player to us based on hope he will bounce back, and claim the far better player you're getting back has no hope to do the same.

Fair play regarding Lekkerimaki. It is about how the game translates more then points for me (see Podkolzin as an example), but he and Klimovich were being used just to demonstrate we aren't going to need wingers in the future either. Klim might earn his debut next year, but no need to rush either of them.

Boeser is currently ranked tied at 110 in scoring for forwards, below top line standards, even after an awful start to the year, and improves as we look back at the last 3 years(81st) and 5 years(67th). Another 2 point night and he moves up to 98, on the cusp of top line scoring. This is points scored by the way, not pace. Considering we only have 32 teams, being just out side of top tier scoring this year, and historically well with in the conversation at least puts his production in the "1st line" group, even if he isn't always riding shotgun with Pettersson for us. Boeser's prime asset was his shot, yes, that's why we drafted him, but he has adapted, and has had to take on different roles because the aforementioned wrist injury he suffered. Even if he isn't scoring on clean wrist shots from the blueline anymore, he's still found away to put up points.

I suppose Micheal Russo better thank his lucky stars you and I aren't managing our favourite teams then, eh? This rumour would have been put to bed already, instead he's been able to stretch this into a multi year rumour that seems to elicit strong reactions from both sides.

Boeser isn't strictly a 5 on 5 player for us though, we have others like Garland (who we definitely weren't rumoured to be moving the same reasons as Boeser as recently as last month...ahem) or Petey or Kuzmenko (who are having tremendous seasons looking at ESP/60 where they sit 1st and 12th league wide). As long as 5 on 5 production isn't nil, I personally don't really care where the production comes from. If a guy has 20 shorthanded points in a season, no powerplay time, and a dozen of 5 on 5 points, he's still a 30+ point scorer, to me.

1. Every single time Minnesota has asked prior, it's been determined they can't make Boeser's contract work.

2. Did you really just use the Boeser's younger than Greenway line? Greenway is 9 DAYS older than Boeser.

3. I'm not selling you on Greenway. I'm saying there is less damage to be done if Greenway doesn't bounce back vs Boeser simply because of their cap hits. That damage would be amplified for Minnesota, not necessarily Vancouver. Both players have the same term. One is half the cost of the other. They both had almost identical 5v5 production for the three years prior to this year. One has been dealing with injuries. One has been dealing with family concerns/loss. Both are bounce back candidates. Both have potential to not bounce back as well. It's clear Boeser's heart is in Minnesota given how hard his agent is trying to force this whole situation. I just think there is a lot less wiggle room/flexibility from Minnesota's side given the cap situation. It's a struggle to fit him in even at $5M and the assets we would have to give up basically make this trade unworkable without a third party.

4. I have heavy concerns on Boeser's production. He's 8th on Vancouver for 5v5 goals, which is what Minnesota is after. All of Kane, Barbashev, JVR, and Domi would be better fits for goal scoring and they don't come with cap headaches.

5. I don't get your last point. Boeser doesn't play PK and I'm not even sure he would play on the top power play unit for Minnesota. He's not replacing Kap or Zucc. He's not replacing Eriksson Ek (center, net front). I highly doubt he would replace Boldy. Him being the PP QB would be a disaster. So, from Minnesota's perspective, we are looking for an ES producer.

 

[Cogburn]

I think Vancouver is just going to need to keep Boeser until he either lives up to his contract or is a UFA the following year and he becomes a rental.

Enjoy

He's doing that already, or there are a lot more "below production" cap hits out there on the same level as Boeser.

Will do though, Boeser back to being a treat to watch during a lot of games.

 

[Digitalbooya]

this thread was started by a minny fan based on a tweet from a minnesota reporter about a minnesota born and raised hockey player and his agent, who is also from minnesota, who are reported to be working on a trade of the player to a minnesota team.

in this thread multiple minny fans are claiming they are barely interested in said player and regaling canucks fans with very low valuations of boeser.

i guess it's like grade school when i learned you can tell a girl really likes a boy because she keeps talking about him and you have to disregard the fact she is talking about how much she hates him.

Ah yes, the hockey forums do not allow for discussion about what is being reported.

You fail to realize that Boeser and his agent are more like sad puppy dogs trying to get Minnesota to buy them from the shelter.

 

[krutovsdonut]

You fail to realize that Boeser and his agent are more like sad puppy dogs trying to get Minnesota to buy them from the shelter.

did you really just compare boeser to a puppy dog who needs to be rescued (and cuddled)?

because that would be proving my analogy not refuting it.

 

[sting101]

Which other NHL teams in a playoff hunt have lots of cap room thru 2025? The answer is 0.

Boeser will either require significant retention to trade or he’d get moved for an equally bad contract with term. That will still be the case this summer. Same as today.

He’s probably got some solid value around $4mm AAV, but I doubt you’d get anything more than a bad contract and a low pick (5th round) if his AAV starts with a $5.

Have you missed July 1st forever

 

[Cogburn]

1. Every single time Minnesota has asked prior, it's been determined they can't make Boeser's contract work.

2. Did you really just use the Boeser's younger than Greenway line? Greenway is 9 DAYS older than Boeser.

3. I'm not selling you on Greenway. I'm saying there is less damage to be done if Greenway doesn't bounce back vs Boeser simply because of their cap hits. That damage would be amplified for Minnesota, not necessarily Vancouver. Both players have the same term. One is half the cost of the other. They both had almost identical 5v5 production for the three years prior to this year. One has been dealing with injuries. One has been dealing with family concerns/loss. Both are bounce back candidates. Both have potential to not bounce back as well. It's clear Boeser's heart is in Minnesota given how hard his agent is trying to force this whole situation. I just think there is a lot less wiggle room/flexibility from Minnesota's side given the cap situation. It's a struggle to fit him in even at $5M and the assets we would have to give up basically make this trade unworkable without a third party.

4. I have heavy concerns on Boeser's production. He's 8th on Vancouver for 5v5 goals, which is what Minnesota is after. All of Kane, Barbashev, JVR, and Domi would be better fits for goal scoring and they don't come with cap headaches.

5. I don't get your last point. Boeser doesn't play PK and I'm not even sure he would play on the top power play unit for Minnesota. He's not replacing Kap or Zucc. He's not replacing Eriksson Ek (center, net front). I highly doubt he would replace Boldy. Him being the PP QB would be a disaster. So, from Minnesota's perspective, we are looking for an ES producer.

I agree, bad fit cap wise. But aside from Russo, there have been other reporters who have, usually through second hand sources in my experience, said it's not Boeser's agent or the Canucks starting or driving communication.

Younger is younger. No, I didn't look dates up. Give me 2 days and the numbers will line up better, Capfriendly doesn't mess around with updating ages though, damn.

But what I think is being swept under the rug here is that Greenway, even having bounced back, has little value to the Canucks as they are currently made up. We have 7 other wingers that he'd be competing with for a roster spot, and even at his best, is probably in the Hoglander/Pearson tier. Boeser is well on his way to "bouncing back", scoring at a pace that is almost negating his bad start earlier this season. Even strength production might be equal, but you reach a certain point where you pay a premium for the extra production, so yes, the cap hit for the PP production is higher. A third party, at the very least for Greenway and/or Addison for future cap space for the Wild would help things. Having them as the main component coming back to Vancouver does not work though.

I am significantly less worried about his production then I was even earlier this season. He is producing points and driving play more the he had been, and frankly his 5 on 5 play isn't why we paid him. Yes, I agree, actual rentals would make more sense if thats the way the Wild are leaning. Part of this whole song and dance is PR and bringing Boeser home and all that though, and trying to fix scoring problems long term.

No, he doesn't, my point is that it doesn't matter, to my valuation of a player, how the points are scored. PP, shorthanded, even strength...points are points, there will always be penalties in a game. I don't know the ins and outs of Minnesota's powerplay, but net front presence or PPQB are definitely not his forte, but if you're looking solely for an even strength scorer, Boeser isn't the best option. He's fine at it, but he earns his paycheque on the powerplay.

 

[Digitalbooya]

did you really just compare boeser to a puppy dog who needs to be rescued (and cuddled)?

because that would be proving my analogy not refuting it.

Sure, if your point is that sad puppy dog has a $2,000 price tag and it needs to come down to at least $1,000 for the person to be able to afford said sad puppy dog. Yeah, I think we are saying the same thing then.

 

[strattonius]

Sure. Boeser at $4.25mm is a decent contract for the wild.

Vancouver gets a reclamation project in greenway and a skilled, point producing offensive Dman in Addison. He can play with Myers.

No.

Greenway is an overpaid plug.

Addison may be a good player one day but the Canucks do not need a powerplay producer who struggles defensively.

That package is unrealistic not sure why everyone thinks it's what the Canucks need.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I agree, bad fit cap wise. But aside from Russo, there have been other reporters who have, usually through second hand sources in my experience, said it's not Boeser's agent or the Canucks starting or driving communication.

Younger is younger. No, I didn't look dates up. Give me 2 days and the numbers will line up better, Capfriendly doesn't mess around with updating ages though, damn.

But what I think is being swept under the rug here is that Greenway, even having bounced back, has little value to the Canucks as they are currently made up. We have 7 other wingers that he'd be competing with for a roster spot, and even at his best, is probably in the Hoglander/Pearson tier. Boeser is well on his way to "bouncing back", scoring at a pace that is almost negating his bad start earlier this season. Even strength production might be equal, but you reach a certain point where you pay a premium for the extra production, so yes, the cap hit for the PP production is higher. A third party, at the very least for Greenway and/or Addison for future cap space for the Wild would help things. Having them as the main component coming back to Vancouver does not work though.

I am significantly less worried about his production then I was even earlier this season. He is producing points and driving play more the he had been, and frankly his 5 on 5 play isn't why we paid him. Yes, I agree, actual rentals would make more sense if thats the way the Wild are leaning. Part of this whole song and dance is PR and bringing Boeser home and all that though, and trying to fix scoring problems long term.

No, he doesn't, my point is that it doesn't matter, to my valuation of a player, how the points are scored. PP, shorthanded, even strength...points are points, there will always be penalties in a game. I don't know the ins and outs of Minnesota's powerplay, but net front presence or PPQB are definitely not his forte, but if you're looking solely for an even strength scorer, Boeser isn't the best option. He's fine at it, but he earns his paycheque on the powerplay.

Boeser has been linked to Minnesota because his family is there and with what they have faced over the last couple seasons he might want to be home. Anybody can write an article saying that, but they almost always say something like "Wild are looking to add scoring... Made calls on Kane, JVR, Bertuzzi, Boeser, etc... Boeser doesn't work unless Vancouver retains... etc." I like that Guerin has called about all these players, but I especially like that he isn't bending the knee to asking prices. I assume most follow up calls go as "are you willing to retain on Boeser yet? No? Okay, bye."

Alright, well if you can make a deal manageable where you take Goligoski and retain $2M per season on Boeser then we can discuss something further. Otherwise I don't see any way. That's the reason Greenway is brought up. He's the closest forward we've got to a cap dump.

If the Wild did find a taker for Greenway and say it was a 3rd round pick, would Vancouver do 2nd+3rd for Boeser ($1.65M retained)? Saves you $5M now and you get two draft picks for the retool/rebuild

 

[Cogburn]

Boeser has been linked to Minnesota because his family is there and with what they have faced over the last couple seasons he might want to be home. Anybody can write an article saying that, but they almost always say something like "Wild are looking to add scoring... Made calls on Kane, JVR, Bertuzzi, Boeser, etc... Boeser doesn't work unless Vancouver retains... etc." I like that Guerin has called about all these players, but I especially like that he isn't bending the knee to asking prices. I assume most follow up calls go as "are you willing to retain on Boeser yet? No? Okay, bye."

Alright, well if you can make a deal manageable where you take Goligoski and retain $2M per season on Boeser then we can discuss something further. Otherwise I don't see any way. That's the reason Greenway is brought up. He's the closest forward we've got to a cap dump.

If the Wild did find a taker for Greenway and say it was a 3rd round pick, would Vancouver do 2nd+3rd for Boeser ($1.65M retained)? Saves you $5M now and you get two draft picks for the retool/rebuild

Yes, there is a lot of circumstantial evidence that there should be mutual interest between Boeser and Minnesota. I think your interpretation of other sources, while simplified, is likely accurate, or simply building on this circumstantial evidence. Guerin likely isn't that blunt, but if that's the jist of how things go, I think we'd have heard the last of this rumour when Boeser resigned with Vancouver.

Goligoski, or Foligno, or even Greenway, or who ever, being included doesn't kill any deal, again if it were you and I doing the negotiations here. What kills it is low value for Boeser the player, then including salaried players we don't want or need as they have the same value to us that they do to your team. Greenway, or even Goligoski, are cap dumps to us. We don't need them, they aren't worth any thing more then their salaries and cap numbers to us. Greenway, who is 3x3=9 million in cap hit, would cost in the neighbourhood of what Ottawa paid to move Zaitsev, 2x4.5=9. If Greenway gets a 3rd from another team, spectacular, yes, we can transfer that pick into the package for Boeser. Boeser is worth more to us then a 2nd and a 3rd though, especially if we're retaining salary as well. Saving cap space isn't the primary goal of moving Boeser any more, can I at least get confirmation that this is being acknowledged? It keeps coming up like it's our main reason to move Boeser.

If we get a 2nd and a "B" prospect (Khusnutdinov, Firstov, Ohgren, Hunt or Peart are what I'd considered B prospects in my limited knowledge of Wild prospect depth), for Boeser, unretained, I think we're in business. If we're retaining, or taking a Goligoski style cap dump, or both, we'd want more. This is where I feel things are breaking down. We could also combine cap dumps and assets, and as an example, have Hartman+Goligoski be included, presume Greenway is moved elsewhere, and equal up the value with futures to Vancouver. This would negate Boeser's cap hit, before ELCs or replacement minor players are called up.

 

[Chainshot]

1. Every single time Minnesota has asked prior, it's been determined they can't make Boeser's contract work.

2. Did you really just use the Boeser's younger than Greenway line? Greenway is 9 DAYS older than Boeser.

3. I'm not selling you on Greenway. I'm saying there is less damage to be done if Greenway doesn't bounce back vs Boeser simply because of their cap hits. That damage would be amplified for Minnesota, not necessarily Vancouver. Both players have the same term. One is half the cost of the other. They both had almost identical 5v5 production for the three years prior to this year. One has been dealing with injuries. One has been dealing with family concerns/loss. Both are bounce back candidates. Both have potential to not bounce back as well. It's clear Boeser's heart is in Minnesota given how hard his agent is trying to force this whole situation. I just think there is a lot less wiggle room/flexibility from Minnesota's side given the cap situation. It's a struggle to fit him in even at $5M and the assets we would have to give up basically make this trade unworkable without a third party.

4. I have heavy concerns on Boeser's production. He's 8th on Vancouver for 5v5 goals, which is what Minnesota is after. All of Kane, Barbashev, JVR, and Domi would be better fits for goal scoring and they don't come with cap headaches.

5. I don't get your last point. Boeser doesn't play PK and I'm not even sure he would play on the top power play unit for Minnesota. He's not replacing Kap or Zucc. He's not replacing Eriksson Ek (center, net front). I highly doubt he would replace Boldy. Him being the PP QB would be a disaster. So, from Minnesota's perspective, we are looking for an ES producer.

An ES producer sounds more like Garland than Boeser TBH. Still doesn't seem to fit cap wise but probably a better fit for what the Wild actually need at 5-on-5 than Boeser.

 

[UrbanImpact]

Unless Vancouver can get what they want which is:

1. Cap Flexebility
2. Picks and Prospects

Then they shouldnt just move Boeser for the sake of moving Boeser.

He is still very productive, playing at a 62 point pace.

Sure, retain 1mil or so but no need to make a trade where the $ is even ala getting Greenway back and then getting stiffed on the picks and prospects.

Just keep him and increase his value next year.

Canucks should be in no rush to move him, he is a good player.

 

[57special]

Where are all the the Boeser trade threads to other teams? Surely there are other teams that can use/ afford him.

 

[Cogburn]

Where are all the the Boeser trade threads to other teams? Surely there are other teams that can use/ afford him.

Where are Russo's reports Minnesota and Guerin are even aware that there are more teams willing to move players other than Vancouver? Surely there are other teams this guy can fixate on.

 

[ThatGuy22]

this thread was started by a minny fan based on a tweet from a minnesota reporter about a minnesota born and raised hockey player and his agent, who is also from minnesota, who are reported to be working on a trade of the player to a minnesota team.

in this thread multiple minny fans are claiming they are barely interested in said player and regaling canucks fans with very low valuations of boeser.

i guess it's like grade school when i learned you can tell a girl really likes a boy because she keeps talking about him and you have to disregard the fact she is talking about how much she hates him.

I mean, two things can be true at once. All the Minnesota Connections with the article, and the Wild fans that would be HFBoards members aren't all that interested in the cost.

I'm sure there is a good segment of the Minnesota fanbase that would go nuts for Boeser, without thinking about the longer term.

The people that frequent HFBoards obsess over the long term, and in Minnesota's case in particular we are acutely aware of what next season looks like for the Wild from a cap perspective, and literally every move has to be looked at through the lens of what does that meen for 23/25 and 24/25.

In Boeser's case, without significant retention the juice just isn't worth the squeeze and the headaches the contract brings in.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Awful, Minnesota wouldnt trade Wallstedt alone for that.

I don’t understand? Wallstedt + 1/2 of Rossi should equal Demko and 1/2 Rossi + Greenway isn’t worth Boeser 18% retained?

Value wise it’s not crazy at all and that is a move made to compete now on a team like Minnesota.

Greenway at this point maybe has neutral value.

 

[ThatGuy22]

Where are Russo's reports Minnesota and Guerin are even aware that there are more teams willing to move players other than Vancouver? Surely there are other teams this guy can fixate on.

You act like he's rumor mongering. Whether it offends your sensabilities or not, an NHL agent going on record talking about a potential trade moves the Wild my make, and naming specific Wild players is not only news, but frankly strange he would do that. Any reporter would write an article about it.

I'm sensing left over hostilities from the Elias Peterson dust up a month or so back.

 

[ThatGuy22]

I don’t understand? Wallstedt + 1/2 of Rossi should equal Demko and 1/2 Rossi + Greenway isn’t worth Boeser 18% retained?

Value wise it’s not crazy at all and that is a move made to compete now on a team like Minnesota.

Greenway at this point maybe has neutral value.

Beyond the fact that Demko's contract would be as problamatic as an unretained Boeser's contract.

Wallstedt is the best goalie prospect in the world, and is lighting up the AHL as a 20 year old rookie. He might be one of the top 5 most untouchable prospects in the league at this point.

Rossi is also our most NHL ready center prospect, on a team that desperately needs centers.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Beyond the fact that Demko's contract would be as problamatic as an unretained Boeser's contract.

Wallstedt is the best goalie prospect in the world, and is lighting up the AHL as a 20 year old rookie. He might be one of the top 5 most untouchable prospects in the league at this point.

Rossi is also our most NHL ready center prospect, on a team that desperately needs centers.

The whole basis was you move Fleury for other assets as well. Fleury and Greenway off the books you have the Cap to make it happen.

 

[McJedi]

Have you missed July 1st forever

I don’t think July 1st will have any meaning for Boeser. His contract is negative value today, June 30th and July 10th.

He won’t be easy to move today or in the offseason. He’s been on the market for over a year. Still in Vancouver. That’s not because your GM is driving a hard bargain either. He’s just trying not to take too much of an L. And hoping Boeser plays better than he has.

 

[Bazeek]

You act like he's rumor mongering. Whether it offends your sensabilities or not, an NHL agent going on record talking about a potential trade moves the Wild my make, and naming specific Wild players is not only news, but frankly strange he would do that. Any reporter would write an article about it.

I'm sensing left over hostilities from the Elias Peterson dust up a month or so back.

I only got a chance to see Hankinson's quotes today and I agree that they were pretty odd. I don't think I've ever seen an agent just start talking about other players on a different team as trade bait like that. Seems like a professional faux pas to me, but agents are a different breed.

 

[ThatGuy22]

The whole basis was you move Fleury for other assets as well. Fleury and Greenway off the books you have the Cap to make it happen.

Moving Fleury isn't just a snap of a fingers. He's 38 years, with a full NMC and has been average on his best days.

Demko just doesn't really make any sense for the Wild. Beyond the fact that he's currently injured, and has been bad when he played this year. Wallstedt will be ready in under two years, and it appears Filip Gustavsson remembered at 23 he was a high pick and a good goaltender.

There is really just no need for Demko to be involved at all.

 

[Spurgeon]

Moving Fleury isn't just a snap of a fingers. He's 38 years, with a full NMC and has been average on his best days.

Demko just doesn't really make any sense for the Wild. Beyond the fact that he's currently injured, and has been bad when he played this year. Wallstedt will be ready in under two years, and it appears Filip Gustavsson remembered at 23 he was a high pick and a good goaltender.

There is really just no need for Demko to be involved at all.

That guy is trolling