Player Discussion Bobby Ryan Part VII

[Tuna99]

Stone for Brannstrom might be the worst trade in Sens history if the kid doesn't pan out.

Can’t forget about Mats Soggard, could be an NHL goalie

 

[Tuna99]

Great post, thank you

It seems that guys that relies more on skill than athleticism (Havlat, Gaborik, Ryan, Heatley, Spezza+++) might decline faster because they can't afford to lose much of their "athleticism". The Bergerons and Alfies are exceptional players. Cullen is a great example, I think it really lies down to how much your body can take in the end. Moblity is important and you need to have it in spades, so when you lose some, you still stay efficient.

Ideally, Sens would have signed Ryan 6.0-6.5 x 5 years which would have been perfect but realistically, I don't think Ottawa had any leverage to be able to do that. He would have went on the UFA market and get 7 x 7 easily. Most teams are not scared to give contracts like that because they are profitable enough and worse case scenario, the player will be bought out, buried (see Leafs and Habs who did it several times) or even traded in a "financial deal". Habs currently have Alzner, Weise and Peca in the AHL. It's not going to hurt much the 100+ M$ in profit they make every year, and not even talking about Evenko which is a money printing machine.

They could have flipped him back before extending him too, could even have had a package with much better results than what Anaheim got.

Also why is was such a terrible trade, low character low compete player who you had to sign long term for what you gave u for him. Sens pro-scouting heavily critiqued for the 10 years, this was their worst pro evaluation on Ryan, said he’d be ready for a bigger roll and increased minutes and they expected increased production being able to play top minutes. He wasn’t in physical shape to handle the increased minutes and emotionally he just doesn’t have the drive to want to win or be a difference maker.

Ryan is a floater and always has been. Can’t win wth floaters.

 

[BonkTastic]

hoffman for boedker is worse

Hmm... Yeah, that one's pretty bad too.

At least you can put an asterisk on that one, since it happened after the whole Monika Caryk / Melinda Karlsson thing. It certainly doesn't excuse the bad trade, but perhaps the added context knocks it down the list a few spots.

 

[BonkTastic]

Let him join Boedker in the press box.

Speak of the devil...

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Good on the coaching staff. You can't have a guy like Ryan just give no f***s on and off the ice around these young guys. Sends a horrible message.

 

[BonkTastic]

While we're on the subject of "Bobby Ryan's decline is significantly due to his half-assing it / not having a passion for it anymore", the new coach has pretty much all but confirmed he's not happy with Ryan's work ethic.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

While we're on the subject of "Bobby Ryan's decline is significantly due to his half-assing it / not having a passion for it anymore", the new coach has pretty much all but confirmed he's not happy with Ryan's work ethic.

I wonder if he's happy with his ability to spell.

 

[BonkTastic]

I wonder if he's happy with his ability to spell.

It's pretty crazy how right Burke was on Ryan.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

While we're on the subject of "Bobby Ryan's decline is significantly due to his half-assing it / not having a passion for it anymore", the new coach has pretty much all but confirmed he's not happy with Ryan's work ethic.

His assessment is on. Ryan on a good team could be an offensive contributor (probably). On this team of lunch pails he needs to be faster and work hard at both ends of the ice .. He just can't or has never really done that for any extended time (within a game) nevermind game to game in my recollection.

 

[SensFactor]

They should waive Bobby and see if playing in the AHL doesn't motivate him

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

They should waive Bobby and see if playing in the AHL doesn't motivate him

NMC. Can't waive him. Should have bought him out this summer but Dorion likely felt he was going to have a resurgence to his glory days.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

 

[Icelevel]

Lots of bad trades .. losing Stone may have hurt the rebuild the most vs losing Karlsson because of Chabot. The Duchene acquisition trade was idiotic team "ready to compete" evaluation and cost us at least 2 1st round picks. The Hoffman trade really is signature Dorion. Very hard to pick the worst

Hard to beat zibanejad for brassard especially considering he added the pick. Hoffman for boedker is up there especially considering he added the better pick. Stone for brannstrom will be up there and could win it all if brannstrom doesn’t turn out.
Rank them how you like but what’s confirmed is that Dorion is absolutely terrible at making trades.

 

[TheDebater]

Smith has now become the best coach ever in my eyes.

He definitely gained some credibility in my eyes with this. I like Bobby Ryan as a person, seems like a great guy but Ryan the hockey player has been so disappointing. This also sends a message to the rest of the team that everyone on the team is accountable for their play and will be rewarded or punished based on how they perform. Ballsy move by DJ.

 

[SensFactor]

DJ Smith doesn't care who your daddy is. He will scratch you if he sees you playing without heart.

 

[robsenz]

DJ Smith just gained some respect from me in scratching Ryan. Sad reality is, it's not going to change things, we've been waiting for Ryan to turn the corner basically since he got here. Not happening.

 

[JungleBeat]

Ryan is weak mentally and physically. Great job scratching him as his horrible work ethic is poisonous to the young roster.

 

[BondraTime]

Can’t forget about Mats Soggard, could be an NHL goalie

He's not a part of the Stone trade in any way

 

[Stylizer1]

lol at worse trade in history... Is this the year Silverberg finally outscores Ryan? Maybe it will only take 500-600 games with their new teams!

I mean, if a 7.25 AAV for a player who gave you 0.53 to 0.69 PPGs for 5 of 6 years is "crippling" your team maybe you shouldn't have a NHL franchise to begin with lol




Thanks but I don't know if I expressed myself correctly, it's a combination of both : age + injury history

I mean, it's already natural to decline with age but "injuries" will just accelerate the process. My father at 62 is in much better shape than my step dad who is 6 years younger, but had a big injury at work.

Bobby Ryan peaked right away, superstar from 21 y/o to 24 y/o, then after that he was "just a 1st liner" for the next 5 years. Then, he declined in his late 20's (which happens a lot when you look at NHLers, there is countless examples) as, like I said, the game became faster every year and after he dealt with many injuries.

I don't see what it is so special about Ryan situation... it actually happens to most NHL players. Decline in late 20's-early 30's. They can still be good players a few more years after that but now, by the age of 35, it's an uphill battle to be able to stay in the NHL. The game is just faster and younger.

Ryan was still putting 1st line numbers until 29 y/o
Spezza was until 33 y/o
Heatley was until 31 yo

Do you see huge differences? Spezza "only" dealt with back problems so he "lasted" a bit longer. His skating/mobility was not affected the way it did for Heatley and Ryan.

Also, you say "Ryan has not had a good season for a long time now". He had a great season in 2015-16 which is 3-4 years ago and monster playoffs in 2017, which is 2-3 years ago. Sure, he hasn't put 1st line numbers since but the only guys who did it on this team are Duchene, Hoffman and Stone, who are pretty close to elite forwards. Turris (who seems to have declined at the same age as Ryan) in 2016-17 and Dzingel before being traded last year.

Ryan put 0.53 and 0.54 PPGs the last 2 years which is close to ~45 pts per season, so really just 10 points under low 1st line numbers... This really isn't that bad considering the team he plays on, his TOI, age, injury history, etc. Put him with 2 two top-6 forwards and I guarantee you that he'd score over 50 points.

NHLers are not robots, they are athletes yes but they are subject to same gravitational reality. Nothing really stays the same.

And yeah, if you're comparing any player with HOFers and exceptions like you did with Alfie and in your response to JD1, it's not going to allow you to draw good conclusions



Very true, considering his injury history, it's already good that he's still able to play in the NHL. IMO, it's only because of above average skill/vision/IQ because his mobility/skating and hands took a hit.

Bobby Ryan was never a superstar. He was Larry in a Three's Company bit.

 

[Yak]

Just need to keep in the pressbox and tell his agent to find a trade......lol..... This is clearly not working out for both sides for a long time. Rather him sit at home and watch hockey then take up a roster spot to player who wants to try and will try.

 

[aragorn]

Also why is was such a terrible trade, low character low compete player who you had to sign long term for what you gave u for him. Sens pro-scouting heavily critiqued for the 10 years, this was their worst pro evaluation on Ryan, said he’d be ready for a bigger roll and increased minutes and they expected increased production being able to play top minutes. He wasn’t in physical shape to handle the increased minutes and emotionally he just doesn’t have the drive to want to win or be a difference maker.

Ryan is a floater and always has been. Can’t win wth floaters.

I was flamed a lot for saying most of what you just said around the time of the trade, now he is being scratched again. And what the hell are some of these comments regarding Brannstrom, I thought he was the darling of this board? What the hell is going on here these days? Very confusing. Anyone else like Scott Sabourin?

 

[supsens]

His assessment is on. Ryan on a good team could be an offensive contributor (probably). On this team of lunch pails he needs to be faster and work hard at both ends of the ice .. He just can't or has never really done that for any extended time (within a game) nevermind game to game in my recollection.

He was solid in the last playoff run the sens had. It’s been a while now tho

 

[Langdon Alger]

Man, can we get rid of this guy already?

 

[The Lewler]

He's pretty lucky that he ended up as a cap hit lynchpin on a trash team, or he would have been bought out by now.

 

[supsens]

He's pretty lucky that he ended up as a cap hit lynchpin on a trash team, or he would have been bought out by now.

I have no idea what good scratching him does, he has zero fear of being bought out.
Bobby your scratched
“Cool”