TSN: Bob McKenzie: O'Reilly and Myers

[sabrebuild]

You say "change his mind" as if it wouldn't be totally irrational and potentially deleterious. He could "change his mind" about playing hockey at all but we ought not to consider that.



In the extremely unlikely chance this scenario would occur, it could vary in return. The Hossa return wasn't thought of as a bad one at the time, it just played out that way.





That's the point of sign and trade in that scenario. A full year without game checks/playing time could dissuade.


The point being was that even in the incredibly unlikely situation that you're projecting as a serious concern there are options.

No, the point is that if you have him on your team, without a long term deal signed, there is enormous risk that he will either walk or you will trade him for a lot less than you gave up.

Look I want him and I would take all the risks that comes with that, but absolutely not for Myers. Look at the history of the league. No team is ever in a control when a player is on the last year of a contract with free agency coming. As someone else alluded to, if you think a Peca type situation is control, good luck.

 

[joshjull]

Have a good one.

Great counterpoint.

 

[Beerz]

Great counterpoint.

Not counterpointing your misrepresentation.

 

[sabrebuild]

dbi, just out of curiosity I looked up who had argued against trading for ROR earlier, and I noticed you were one of them, because the price would be too high. What changed for you? Not trying to catch you or anything, just curious to know what new information made you reconsider your position?

 

[joshjull]

Not counterpointing your misrepresentation.

What did I misrepresent?

The foolish idea that Myers game is going to fall off the earth. We all know or should know what happened previously and why it won't repeat.

Or the idea that we will be able to replace Myers and his minutes as simply as you think we can. Risto is going to take over as the #1 RHD dman if Myers is gone. Thats simply a fact. No one we sign or from in house is going to take that role.

Or the idea that we need to add depth to the part of the roster (forwards) that will be inundated next year and beyond from our own prospect pool alone. Let alone any UFAs we sign or minor trades we make.

Whereas our d-corp has only Myers, Risto, Zads, Pysyk and to a lesser extent McCabe. No reinforcements are coming there.

Feel free to enlighten me as to what I got wrong.

 

[joshjull]

@Beerz

How about we just agree to fundamentally disagree on the merits of trading Myers for ROR and the level of dman he is and thus his value to the team.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

Just a question: Does this Garth guy on Hockeybuzz have any credibility? He's making some good points about the Avs and how awful their defense is, but I don't know what to take from the guy because I have no idea who he is.

 

[Beerz]

Just a question: Does this Garth guy on Hockeybuzz have any credibility? He's making some good points about the Avs and how awful their defense is, but I don't know what to take from the guy because I have no idea who he is.

lol.

None what so ever.

 

[enthusiast]

No, the point is that if you have him on your team, without a long term deal signed, there is enormous risk that he will either walk or you will trade him for a lot less than you gave up.

This is where we disagree, specifically on the magnitude of that risk. We probably have to just agree to disagree since we're both speculating imo

dbi, just out of curiosity I looked up who had argued against trading for ROR earlier, and I noticed you were one of them, because the price would be too high. What changed for you? Not trying to catch you or anything, just curious to know what new information made you reconsider your position?

Mostly the development of RR/Z. I've never been a huge fan of Myers and I think this is a "sell high" scenario also

 

[Paxon]

Just a question: Does this Garth guy on Hockeybuzz have any credibility? He's making some good points about the Avs and how awful their defense is, but I don't know what to take from the guy because I have no idea who he is.

I have a hard time believing someone with 40,000 posts on this site doesn't know about Garth...

 

[BeTheBallDanny]

This seems like a draft day move if we're sitting at number 3 and Murray wants to shake things up a bit. Trade Myers for ROR, Draft Hanifin and let ROR shelter Reinhart and Grigorenko.

 

[Bps21*]

If we are drafting 3 he new gm should handle things like that, not the one we had to fire for ****ing up the entire thing,

 

[Shoey]

If we are drafting 3 he new gm should handle things like that, not the one we had to fire for ****ing up the entire thing,

 

[BeTheBallDanny]

 

[CatsforReinhart]

I am probably in the minority here but I wouldn't trade Myers for ROR straight up. I think ROR has reached his potential and he is a great player to have but I think Myers in another 2 or 3 years will be even better. I just can't help but think about how Ottawa and NYI let Chara go and that was a huge mistake. I am not saying Myers is Chara but I think Myers will progress. On top of that I think if we really want to move Myers then why not package him and get a better player then ROR and one who is locked up long term.

 

[BowieSabresFan]

I am probably in the minority here but I wouldn't trade Myers for ROR straight up. I think ROR has reached his potential and he is a great player to have but I think Myers in another 2 or 3 years will be even better. I just can't help but think about how Ottawa and NYI let Chara go and that was a huge mistake. I am not saying Myers is Chara but I think Myers will progress. On top of that I think if we really want to move Myers then why not package him and get a better player then ROR and one who is locked up long term.

Actually, I don't think you're in the minority. I also don't understand how some posters think (or imply) that it's a virtual certainty Risto/Zads are the #1 pair of the future. Zadorov, in particular, has an awful lot of developing to do in order to reach that level.

 

[1point21Gigawatts]

Actually, I don't think you're in the minority. I also don't understand how some posters think (or imply) that it's a virtual certainty Risto/Zads are the #1 pair of the future. Zadorov, in particular, has an awful lot of developing to do in order to reach that level.

Speaking for myself, I bank a lot on his potential. There have been games where Zads and Risto were the shining stars. Seeing that, it's hard not to dream of those two just running the blue line.

That said, I agree that Zads especially has a lot of developing to do. Risto has even slumped a bit lately (though hard not to do on this team).

 

[ADoubleD]

If we are drafting 3 he new gm should handle things like that, not the one we had to fire for ****ing up the entire thing,

I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say here. Care to explain?

 

[ZeroPT*]

I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say here. Care to explain?

some nonsense about firing Murray if we get 3 which is completely idiotic

 

[CatsforReinhart]

Actually, I don't think you're in the minority. I also don't understand how some posters think (or imply) that it's a virtual certainty Risto/Zads are the #1 pair of the future. Zadorov, in particular, has an awful lot of developing to do in order to reach that level.

I just think the defence with
Myers
Risto
McCabe
Pysyk
Zadorov
trade/draft
Can win us a stanley cup. Why trade away a piece to get a piece leaving us with a hole still.

Buffalo should wait two more years before we start putting the pieces together for a stanley cup team. Then trade away prospects and picks for a forward/defenceman that we need.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

I have a hard time believing someone with 40,000 posts on this site doesn't know about Garth...

I don't visit Hockeybuzz, so had never heard of the guy before the other day when someone posted his blog post.

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

I'm unclear on one thing. Can he sign an extension before July 1? If the answer is no, this debate is pointless.

 

[joshjull]

I'm unclear on one thing. Can he sign an extension before July 1? If the answer is no, this debate is pointless.

No he can't

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

They can't unless the trade is made after July 1st.

Yes...that's what I was talking about.

 

[Duddy]

1st (Isles or STL), Pysyk, lesser roster player, that's all I would offer and ROR won't fetch more than that from any other team.

Insane to trade a guy who is the anchor on our D for a guy signed for 1.5 years. The trade ****s up our whole D, thrusting Zads, Risto and others in roles they're not able to handle now. I don't want to repeat the same mistakes they made when Drury/Briere left and they brought in nobody to replace them and let the Rochester core rot away without any help. And no you're not getting a top pairing defender in FA or cheap. Let Reinhart, Girg develope into that role. If they need some sheltering bring in some forwards on the cheap like we did with Gionta this year.