Blues Trade Proposals Part XXV

[Daley Tarasenkshow]

i want a young top-4 LHD coming back in any Shatty deal...plus

Then what's the point in trading Shatty in the first place? I think he's traded in the first place because the team is happy with the defense especially now that Parayko is playing great. Not to mention the fact that guys like Schmaltz and even Dunn and Walman could be ready in a couple of years. Schamaltz obviously sooner.

I would expect the team to target a forward in any Shatty deal, and would be very disappointed if a potential top line scorer didn't come back to STL.

 

[carter333167]

Then what's the point in trading Shatty in the first place? I think he's traded in the first place because the team is happy with the defense especially now that Parayko is playing great. Not to mention the fact that guys like Schmaltz and even Dunn and Walman could be ready in a couple of years. Schamaltz obviously sooner.

I would expect the team to target a forward in any Shatty deal, and would be very disappointed if a potential top line scorer didn't come back to STL.

We now have a logjam developing in RHD.

I think most would agree that we want an elite skills forward but Shatty alone may not return a roster top three forward (not sure if the ryjo rumors were true--both Shatty and Parayko were rumored to be the ask).

We just shop him to determine the most elite package we can get. If he returned a true stud LHD (to play with petro and/or Parayko), that wouldn't be a bad thing. Personally, I would like elite propsects or to move up to top 5 in this years draft.

We won't know what he can return until we talk to all interested parties...it should be one of the main priorities for the GM after the season ends.

 

[SirPaste]

There is no point in trading Shatty unless we are getting a top 6 forward who can score goals

 

[Celtic Note]

There is no point in trading Shatty unless we are getting a top 6 forward who can score goals

There is no point unless we get a first line forward or prospect with that potential and a very strong likelihood of reaching it.

 

[carter333167]

Shatty will largely control what we can get for him. If he won't sign an extension in the context of a trade, the return won't be great. Also, if you approach his extension only under the pretext that we are trying to shop him, you risk pissing him off and he might just play out his year and head to FA with the Blues getting nothing.

None of us are privy to these personal issues but it might be safest to just sign him assuming we can limit the NTC restrictions to a reasonable level and then consider our choices. Either way, IMO, we need to let Backes and Brouwer walk at the end of the season.

It would be a real shame to have Shatty walk for nothing at the end of next year.

 

[Spektre]

Who is the realistic target then for Shattenkirk?


If he's extended for 5-6 years at 6 million obviously the return should be more.

From Boston there's Spooner (lefty) who probably should be playing C but isn't. There's also Lauzon if you want a high end LHD prospect. It will be 2-4 years though before Lauzon hits the NHL. There's also Alexander Khokhlachev "Koko" (lefty), another 22 year old prospect who plays Center.

From Edmonton there's RNH, 22 years old (lefty) Center with 56 pts twice. Draisaitl, 20 years old, (lefty) another center but probably pretty hard to pry him out of Edmonton. Yakupov, 22 years old (lefty) 33 points is his high and at this point he really looks to be a 3rd line player. There's Anton Slepyshev, 21 years old (righty) winger. Griffin Reinhart, LHD, 22 years old and doubt they part with him.

From Detroit there's Evgeny Svechnikov 19 year old lefty winger. Anthony Mantha, 21 year old winger (lefty). I don't see any way they would deal Larkin. There's Nyquist, Tatar, & Helm. Helm would be an ideal 3rd Center.

From the Islanders there's Ryan Strome, 22 year old Center (righty). Mathew Barzal, 18 year old Center (righty)


That's at least some potential targets.

 

[Stealth JD]

Then what's the point in trading Shatty in the first place? I think he's traded in the first place because the team is happy with the defense especially now that Parayko is playing great. Not to mention the fact that guys like Schmaltz and even Dunn and Walman could be ready in a couple of years. Schamaltz obviously sooner.

I would expect the team to target a forward in any Shatty deal, and would be very disappointed if a potential top line scorer didn't come back to STL.

I'd like 2 RHD and 2 LHD doing the heavy-lifting within the top-4. Not playing a RHD on his off-side, or having only 3 top-pairing guys with 3-bottom pairing guys. Ideally we'd re-balance the talent by trading a righty for a lefty...even if that lefty is a prospect or a younger guy not yet established.

Shattenkirk alone is not going to return a #1C...and if we're simply moving a d-man for a forward and creating a new hole at D...what's the point? I'd want to see two blue-chip pieces coming back if we're going to move Shattenkirk...even if that's a 1st rounder or two. I'm down with the Petro for Matthews & RNH deal...Draisaitl & EDM 1st...but those deals are pipe-dreams.

 

[MissouriMook]

What about a deal with Arizona around:

To Shattenkirk, Barbashev

To Dvorak/D Strome, Connauton

The value would obviously require an extension agreed to by Shatty. I haven't seen much of Dvorak this season at all, but what I've read has been impressive and Strome appears to have picked up where he left off in his draft year. I just don't know if Dvorak projects to a C at the NHL level, but I would expect Strome does. Connauton would replace Gunnarsson (who I think will get more as a UFA than we should spend) as a 4/5 LD and Barbashev would give ARZ some additional C depth.

Fans of ARZ will probably feel that one of Dvorak or Strome is too much to give up even for an extended Shattenkirk. They would probably suggest Ryan MacInnis as an alternative, but I see Chopper Jr. as more of a 3C with little if any upside over Barbashev. Maybe a deal with Arizona could partner us with a team with several premium forward prospects and potentially more of an appetite for a deal than EDM (or at least their fan base) seem to be.

 

[carter333167]

I'd like 2 RHD and 2 LHD doing the heavy-lifting within the top-4. Not playing a RHD on his off-side, or having only 3 top-pairing guys with 3-bottom pairing guys. Ideally we'd re-balance the talent by trading a righty for a lefty...even if that lefty is a prospect or a younger guy not yet established.

Shattenkirk alone is not going to return a #1C...and if we're simply moving a d-man for a forward and creating a new hole at D...what's the point? I'd want to see two blue-chip pieces coming back if we're going to move Shattenkirk...even if that's a 1st rounder or two. I'm down with the Petro for Matthews & RNH deal...Draisaitl & EDM 1st...but those deals are pipe-dreams.

I agree that we need better balance in our top 4--i.e, better LHD. That Bouwmeester contract looks rough...another 3 years. I don't really think Bo is an elite top pairing LHD.

I think our needs are a new coach, one more goal scorer and an elite LHD....possibly a reliable goaltender too but time will tell.

 

[HappyGilmore]

I think it's a waste of time to map out Pietro trades. I don't see Armstrong even considering it.

Meanwhile Shattenkirk has been credibly rumored more than once, and Parayko's emergence makes him expendable. It would be better to keep Parayko on his right side. I really don't like the plan of a young player with his ceiling having his development complicated by moving him to his off side.

I'm looking for an offseason trade of Shattenkirk with the main piece coming back to be a top 6 forward. Detroit and Vancouver are obvious trade partners. Between the pending free agents and reasonably available players, it's a good time to be dealing RHD.

I expect Backes probably walks and that its for the best. However if the cap contracts the free agents are probably going to have a hard time finding teams with the cap space to meet their expectations. That 5.5m offer might end up being close to what he winds up with anyway.

1. I agree with this. People on this forum seem to ignorantly act as if playing a defenseman on his opposite side has no effect on that player. That probably stems from lack of playing experience though.

2. Unless Backes leads the team to the Western Conference Finals, he should be part of the core that gets phased out of this team.

 

[carter333167]

Who is the realistic target then for Shattenkirk?


If he's extended for 5-6 years at 6 million obviously the return should be more.

From Boston there's Spooner (lefty) who probably should be playing C but isn't. There's also Lauzon if you want a high end LHD prospect. It will be 2-4 years though before Lauzon hits the NHL. There's also Alexander Khokhlachev "Koko" (lefty), another 22 year old prospect who plays Center.

From Edmonton there's RNH, 22 years old (lefty) Center with 56 pts twice. Draisaitl, 20 years old, (lefty) another center but probably pretty hard to pry him out of Edmonton. Yakupov, 22 years old (lefty) 33 points is his high and at this point he really looks to be a 3rd line player. There's Anton Slepyshev, 21 years old (righty) winger. Griffin Reinhart, LHD, 22 years old and doubt they part with him.

From Detroit there's Evgeny Svechnikov 19 year old lefty winger. Anthony Mantha, 21 year old winger (lefty). I don't see any way they would deal Larkin. There's Nyquist, Tatar, & Helm. Helm would be an ideal 3rd Center.

From the Islanders there's Ryan Strome, 22 year old Center (righty). Mathew Barzal, 18 year old Center (righty)


That's at least some potential targets.

IMO, We should demand a forward prospect who projects to having floor production of .8 ppg with a higher ceiling and/or a LHD who projects to be top pairing. If that fails, I would look for picks/pick improvement......how about Shatty for a top 5 pick in 2016? If that fails....how about Shatty plus our second or even our first for a top 5 pick (trying to get at least a shot at Matthews who could change our forward outlook for a long time to come---the other players in the projected top 5 are very solid as well)?

Petro obviously would bring more if we were ever in the mood to discuss trading him but it would need to return guaranteed blockbuster talent.

I wish we had moved Backes this past summer---I think the Ducks and maybe a couple of other teams would have traded a very legit prospect for him.

 

[carter333167]

1. I agree with this. People on this forum seem to ignorantly act as if playing a defenseman on his opposite side has no effect on that player. That probably stems from lack of playing experience though.

2. Unless Backes leads the team to the Western Conference Finals, he should be part of the core that gets phased out of this team.

Regarding point 1, I think Parayko has played as well or better on the left side than Shatty or Petro when they were asked to do so. I also agree that I don't want him playing there at this point is his career. One of his assets is the confidence he seems to bring to the ice...we don't need to be putting him in tough positions as a rookie.

 

[BlueDream]

So what teams actually make sense for a Shattenkirk deal? As in, teams that need him, actually have the assets to acquire him, and also teams we would actually trade with.

Edmonton
Boston
Detroit
Islanders?
Arizona
Tampa Bay?

Maybe 1 or 2 others in the East but I don't see a whole lot more. Not that our options are too limited, as that's a decent enough list.

 

[Daley Tarasenkshow]

I'd like 2 RHD and 2 LHD doing the heavy-lifting within the top-4. Not playing a RHD on his off-side, or having only 3 top-pairing guys with 3-bottom pairing guys. Ideally we'd re-balance the talent by trading a righty for a lefty...even if that lefty is a prospect or a younger guy not yet established.

Shattenkirk alone is not going to return a #1C...and if we're simply moving a d-man for a forward and creating a new hole at D...what's the point? I'd want to see two blue-chip pieces coming back if we're going to move Shattenkirk...even if that's a 1st rounder or two. I'm down with the Petro for Matthews & RNH deal...Draisaitl & EDM 1st...but those deals are pipe-dreams.

I don't think trading Shattenkirk creates a new whole at D. It only adds to a place of need (scoring) and opens of a space for someone like Bortuzzo or Schmaltz to start playing full time. Theres not a reason to ask for a dman in any deal as part of the return for Shattenkirk.

 

[BlueDream]

There's no problem with getting back a defenseman in a deal, just as long as they aren't the main piece. Much like the rumored Boston one with Colin Miller - young guy who put up decent numbers with the Bruins earlier this season. With only 6 d-men playing at a time, you always need depth there. I figure the Blues would at least pickup a stopgap in some form - either through the trade or free agency - until a guy like Schmaltz proves he's ready.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I kind of want to see the Blues push for Helm in the off-season for the 3rd line Center or wing.

 

[Ranksu]

Jesus this board will go mad tilt when Army pull out another bad deal and Shattery bring totally different what we thought. Pointing Oshie <-> Brouwer.

I really don't see nothing win moves by Army anymore. Only positive is last time he wen't for grit and Hitch reckless needs so could he now go for skills? Idk, but I have zero trust his comic show.

I only know off-season will be our longest, derperate and most depressing in a long time in here HFboard.

 

[Spektre]

I only know off-season will be our longest, derperate and most depressing in a long time in here HFboard.

Or we could end up partying like it's 1999... on 2nd thought, (after remembering that president trophy team), forget I said that.

 

[Lord Helix]

I only know off-season will be our longest, derperate and most depressing in a long time in here HFboard.

Yes. Yes, it will.

 

[carter333167]

Honestly, we just need to let Backes and Brouwer walk and concentrate on exploring the parameters of a Shatty extension.

Oh, and we need to find a new coach. IF DA wants to leave if Hitch is not retained, fine by me. I'll eat crow on this point if we make it to the WCF.

 

[EastonBlues22]

New thread is up.

Closed.