Around the NHL 2015-16: Part VII - Campy McCamp Face Edition

[EichHart]

I don't blame Murray one bit for selecting Nylander. The Russian factor is 100% real in almost every case. If they don't actually go to Russia they will use it for leverage in contract negotiation which results in overpaying the majority of the time. Just look at Nish this year and even Dats left with a year left on his contract, screwing Detriot over. I had Nylander going at 6 to the Flames and was shocked he fell. Still thrilled at the pick, he's a top 6 player. Can never have enough of those on ELC. I thought a trade for a player like Fowler would come after though, so obviously we are very thin on D still.

 

[NotABadPeriod]

He should have been our pick, and it's no slight to Nylander who I actually like a lot. He just would have filled a massive organizational need for us.

We also still had a need for scoring wingers. Remember that we played guys like McGinn and NIK DESLAURIERS on our top line at times last year, and while we have potential middle 6 guys in Bailey and Fasching there was no one in the pipeline who projected to be top line calibur.

I wanted us to address D-man not just because of our need but the fact that they typically have longer development curves. So going D-man this year and forward next draft would have fit our timetable better IMO. But I have no doubt that Nylander is going to play a big role on this team in the near future.

 

[Heraldic]

I'm pretty sure that there was a huge consensus that especially Chychrun was pretty NHL-ready, and also that Sergachev's tools were pretty NHL-ready. On the other hand, everyone knew that Nylander is not NHL-ready, and will need some grooming.

So when we're actually seeing the things happening that everyone at least should have been aware of, there are people starting to "panic"? I remember something similar going on regarding Reinhart on 2014-2015...

We don't even know how long Chychrun or Sergachev are going to stay up. And we don't know how they actually look against real NHL competition. And most importantly, we have no clue about how things are looking 2-3 years from now. That should be the most important thing here.

 

[sabresfan129103]

Brutal.

That's on the Huberdeau injury BTW.

 

[joshjull]

 

[joshjull]

Wonder what that means for Laich

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

I'm pretty sure that there was a huge consensus that especially Chychrun was pretty NHL-ready, and also that Sergachev's tools were pretty NHL-ready. On the other hand, everyone knew that Nylander is not NHL-ready, and will need some grooming.

So when we're actually seeing the things happening that everyone at least should have been aware of, there are people starting to "panic"? I remember something similar going on regarding Reinhart on 2014-2015...

We don't even know how long Chychrun or Sergachev are going to stay up. And we don't know how they actually look against real NHL competition. And most importantly, we have no clue about how things are looking 2-3 years from now. That should be the most important thing here.

No one is panicking -- just sighing because these two guys could've filled the gaping hole on our team right away. Nylander fills a lesser need in the future, and who knows if it'll even be as big of a need by that point.

There's a perfectly fine argument to be made for taking Nylander, and I don't disagree with any of it, it's just that time also has value, which people don't acknowledge. When you say it only matters how they play 2-3 years out, you're ignoring the value of having players play now, when we have the need. Time should have even more value when your team has been 'suffering' for years on end.

All that said, I only have that one minor gripe with the pick -- he's an awesome prospect and I'm still extremely happy with the pick. He'll take longer than Reinhart but Nylander is going to be amazing when he gets there.

 

[Heraldic]

No one is panicking -- just sighing because these two guys could've filled the gaping hole on our team right away. Nylander fills a lesser need in the future, and who knows if it'll even be as big of a need by that point.

Panicking might be a wrong word here. But the point was that there should be pretty much no whimpering just because Chychrun or Sergachev made their teams (at this point). It is an indication of nothing that wasn't well known before the draft.

And Chychrun and Sergachev would have filled no holes. There is absolutely nothing indicating they would be any improvement over Kulikov, McCabe or Gorges. And Segrachev has also played on his right side in juniors.

You also really cannot say what our needs are in the future. Do you remember that when we picked Zadorov there were arguments that we shouldn't have picked where we had no needs (we had Ehrhoff, Weber, McNabb and McCabe. We also had Sekera, but he was traded at the same draft)). At the moment that is our weakest position and it was only 3 years ago. Only one of those players is still within the organisation.

There's a perfectly fine argument to be made for taking Nylander, and I don't disagree with any of it, it's just that time also has value, which people don't acknowledge. When you say it only matters how they play 2-3 years out, you're ignoring the value of having players play now, when we have the need. Time should have even more value when your team has been 'suffering' for years on end.

Sergachev and Chychrun are not likely going to contribute in any meaningful way this season (if they are even staying longer than 9 games). And you you simply don't draft a player because he is ready to contribute year or two sooner, unless you see them equal otherwise. You simply don't draft Myers or Bogosian over Pietrangelo just because they contribute sooner.

All that said, I only have that one minor gripe with the pick -- he's an awesome prospect and I'm still extremely happy with the pick. He'll take longer than Reinhart but Nylander is going to be amazing when he gets there.

Nylander might end up being the worst pick between those three, but it is settled far more in the future. That's pretty much the point.

 

[Myllz]

I fail to see how what Montreal and Arizona are doing with their prospects has anything to do with Buffalo. Just because Serg and Chych might be starting the season with their respective NHL clubs doesn't mean it would be the same if Buffalo had selected one of them. For all we know, if Montreal or Arizona had selected Nylander, he might be starting the season with them also. Those guys starting the season with those clubs is irrelevant.

 

[Aladyyn]

No one is panicking -- just sighing because these two guys could've filled the gaping hole on our team right away. Nylander fills a lesser need in the future, and who knows if it'll even be as big of a need by that point.

There's a perfectly fine argument to be made for taking Nylander, and I don't disagree with any of it, it's just that time also has value, which people don't acknowledge. When you say it only matters how they play 2-3 years out, you're ignoring the value of having players play now, when we have the need. Time should have even more value when your team has been 'suffering' for years on end.

All that said, I only have that one minor gripe with the pick -- he's an awesome prospect and I'm still extremely happy with the pick. He'll take longer than Reinhart but Nylander is going to be amazing when he gets there.

Replacing Gorges on the bottom pairing is not "filling a gaping hole"

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

We had an organizational need for LHD.

We passed on 2.

Wings are less valuable than D.

We passed on the D for a wing.

We passed on the D, despite them being worthy of the pick at 8.

Nylander doesn't need to be a top 6 player to make the pick worth while, he needs to be considerably better than both of the D we passed on. Which is different than saying that to be a success Nylander needs to be a top 6 player. He can be a successful draft pick and still have been the wrong pick.

 

[Taro Tsujimoto]

 

[sabrebuild]

We had an organizational need for LHD.

We passed on 2.

Wings are less valuable than D.

We passed on the D for a wing.

We passed on the D, despite them being worthy of the pick at 8.

Nylander doesn't need to be a top 6 player to make the pick worth while, he needs to be considerably better than both of the D we passed on. Which is different than saying that to be a success Nylander needs to be a top 6 player. He can be a successful draft pick and still have been the wrong pick.

Agreed

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Sitting the next 3 games will really teach Gudas, and everyone else, a real lesson...

 

[Slangston]

I think what's being overlooked in the evaluation of Nylander is just how flexible he is. He's an incredibly smart, highly skilled, utility forward. The guy can literally play ALL 3 forward positions. As of now, he figures to be playing the LW, but who's to say he can't find himself playing elsewhere later on down the road.

What he brings to the table is rare, and I think that's why the Sabres were so high on him.

 

[Jame]

Mountains out of molehills

It's perfectly normal for everyone who preferred one of those LDs to point to their present success/path.

It's not closing the book. Its simply taking stock of the present for discussion.

 

[Thorton02]

I didn't see it, but a hearing for interference? What am I missing?

 

[Sabretooth]

I didn't see it, but a hearing for interference? What am I missing?

Its the new interference major penalty that went onto effect last year.

 

[BuffaloKatanas]

I think it is pretty crazy that some people are all upset with picking Nylander without any context.

Do the 2 D we passed on fill an immediate organizational need? Yes, but you have zero clue into what GMTM's plan is. What if Murray believes that Nylander will be better than those two D in the future and has a plan to acquire a top LHD after the expansion draft next year. The two D we passed might play well in the NHL in their first years, but they certainly wouldn't have been the difference in us making the playoffs this year. GMs are hired to build the team and plan for its future.

 

[EichHart]

I think it is pretty crazy that some people are all upset with picking Nylander without any context.

Do the 2 D we passed on fill an immediate organizational need? Yes, but you have zero clue into what GMTM's plan is. What if Murray believes that Nylander will be better than those two D in the future and has a plan to acquire a top LHD after the expansion draft next year. The two D we passed might play well in the NHL in their first years, but they certainly wouldn't have been the difference in us making the playoffs this year. GMs are hired to build the team and plan for its future.

Tim Murray was at Bada Bings today for the game, I should of asked him this question.

 

[Zman5778]

Some interesting names waived today:

Pavelec
McNeill
Pulkkinen
Z. Michalek
Scuderi
PAP

 

[joshjull]

There are certainly some quality options out there.

 

[Zman5778]

Provorov and Konecny both make the Flyers.

 

[Zman5778]

Here's the full list of today's waived players:

Sgarbossa, Michael (ANA)
Dahlbeck, Klas (ARI)
Michalek, Zbynek (ARI)
Griffith, Seth (BOS)
Randell, Tyler (BOS)
Schaller, Timothy (BOS)
Falk, Justin (BUF)
Campbell, Gregory (CBJ)
Bollig, Brandon (CGY)
Mashinter, Brandon (CHI)
McNeill, Mark (CHI)
Bourque, Gabriel (COL)
Sislo, Michael (COL)
Backman, Mattias (DAL)
Pulkkinen, Teemu (DET)
Street, Ben (DET)
Lander, Anton (EDM)
Thompson, Paul (FLA)
Latta, Michael (LA)
Scuderi, Robert (LA)
Stalock, Alex (MIN)
Condon, Mike (MTL)
Wedgewood, Scott (NJD)
Parenteau, Pierre-Alexandre (NYI)
Claesson, Fredrik (OTT)
Conacher, Cory (TBL)
Condra, Erik (TBL)
Vermin, Joel (TB)
Melchiori, Julian (WPG)
Pavelec, Ondrej (WPG)
Peluso, Anthony (WPG)
Strait, Brian (WPG)
Ness, Aaron (WSH)
Sill, Zach (WSH)

 

[joshjull]