Around the NHL 20-21 pt. 2: the season ends

[Peiskos]

I do get a kick out of the Canadian press doing circle jerks over what McDavid and Mathews are doing. All without much analysis as to why their numbers are so high. I mean it is amazing what they’re doing. I’m not saying it isn’t. But their division is clearly playing a role in this.

They have both already established themselves prior to this year as two of the very best in the game. But just look at their career numbers vs this season........

Mathews - career (this season)
GPG —> .56 (.82)
PPG —> 1.01 (1.31)

McDavid
GPG —> .46 (.60)
PPG —-> 1.34 (1.85)


Those are ridiculous jumps in goal scoring and overall production from numbers that were already at the very top of the NHL. That division is playing a big role in that jump. I feel comfortable saying they will go back to their normal dominant career numbers during a normal regular season.

Except for the fact that McDavid is already a proven 100 point player in regular circumstances against all teams and Matthews is already a proven 40-50 goal guy in regular circumstances.

McDavid & Matthews have produced like this in prior years against everyone, so that makes no sense. Stats don't lie.

I'd add Marner in here as well, he's just as much of a star. Arguing that their production is an anomaly is just so lazy, if you do that than use the same logic for all the other top teams, last I checked every division has minimum 3 terrible teams...

 

[joshjull]

 

[Fjordy]

I wonder if he'll be on Adams' potential list.

 

[joshjull]

Except for the fact that McDavid is already a proven 100 point player in regular circumstances against all teams and Matthews is already a proven 40-50 goal guy in regular circumstances.

McDavid & Matthews have produced like this in prior years against everyone, so that makes no sense. Stats don't lie.

No they haven’t.

McDavid
Up to this season -> 1.34ppg (110pt player)
This season ———> 1.82ppg (152pt pace)

Mathews
Up to this season -> .56 gpg (46 goal player)
This season ———-> .82 gpg (67 goal pace)

You’re correct the stats don’t lie. Neither has produced at this level before this season.

I'd add Marner in here as well, he's just as much of a star. Arguing that their production is an anomaly is just so lazy, if you do that than use the same logic for all the other top teams, last I checked every division has minimum 3 terrible teams...

Their production is an anomaly for their careers. I showed that in the first part of my post. That was easy not lazy.

The North is weak because it only has one strong team, the Leafs. The East has 4 teams of that level and West/Central have 3 each. The 2nd place Oilers are on par with the 4th place teams in the West/Central and below the playoffs teams in the East (but better than Rangers). The other 5 teams in the North range from meh to bad.

 

[joshjull]

I wonder if he'll be on Adams' potential list.

We’ll find out soon enough. Its going to be a crazy off season.

 

[joshjull]

 

[UnleashRasmus]

I wonder if he'll be on Adams' potential list.

f*** John Tortorella. I don't want him anywhere near this team. If we're going to bring in a headcase, let it be Babcock.

 

[joshjull]

 

[Peiskos]

No they haven’t.

McDavid
Up to this season -> 1.34ppg (110pt player)
This season ———> 1.82ppg (152pt pace)

Mathews
Up to this season -> .56 gpg (46 goal player)
This season ———-> .82 gpg (67 goal pace)

You’re correct the stats don’t lie. Neither has produced at this level before this season.




Their production is an anomaly for their careers. I showed that in the first part of my post. That was easy not lazy.

The North is weak because it only has one strong team, the Leafs. The East has 4 teams of that level and West/Central have 3 each. The 2nd place Oilers are on par with the 4th place teams in the West/Central and below the playoffs teams in the East (but better than Rangers). The other 5 teams in the North range from meh to bad.

I stated that McDavid is a proven 100 point player in normal circumstances and that Matthews is a proven 40-50 goal scorer in normal circumstances, those are facts that cannot be denied.

McDavid :
2016-17 : 100 points (against all teams)
2017-18 : 108 points (against all teams)
2018-19 : 116 points (against all teams)
2019-20 : 97 points (against all teams)
2020-21 : 100 points (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

Matthews :

2016-17 : 40 goals (against all teams)
2017-18 : 34 goals (against all teams, missed 20 games)
2018-19 : 37 goals (against all teams, missed 26 games)
2019-20 : 47 goals (against all teams, missed 12 games)
2020-21 : 40 goals (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

McDavid and Matthews would be doing the same thing against all teams, just as they've done for the 4 consecutive seasons before this very unique one. Why? well because they're two of the best players in the league.

 

[StoveTopStauffer]

No they haven’t.

McDavid
Up to this season -> 1.34ppg (110pt player)
This season ———> 1.82ppg (152pt pace)

Mathews
Up to this season -> .56 gpg (46 goal player)
This season ———-> .82 gpg (67 goal pace)

You’re correct the stats don’t lie. Neither has produced at this level before this season.




Their production is an anomaly for their careers. I showed that in the first part of my post. That was easy not lazy.

The North is weak because it only has one strong team, the Leafs. The East has 4 teams of that level and West/Central have 3 each. The 2nd place Oilers are on par with the 4th place teams in the West/Central and below the playoffs teams in the East (but better than Rangers). The other 5 teams in the North range from meh to bad.

What was McDavid's ppg each season? Do they trend up?

 

[tsujimoto74]

I stated that McDavid is a proven 100 point player in normal circumstances and that Matthews is a proven 40-50 goal scorer in normal circumstances, those are facts that cannot be denied.

McDavid :
2016-17 : 100 points (against all teams)
2017-18 : 108 points (against all teams)
2018-19 : 116 points (against all teams)
2019-20 : 97 points (against all teams)
2020-21 : 100 points (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

Matthews :

2016-17 : 40 goals (against all teams)
2017-18 : 34 goals (against all teams, missed 20 games)
2018-19 : 37 goals (against all teams, missed 26 games)
2019-20 : 47 goals (against all teams, missed 12 games)
2020-21 : 40 goals (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

McDavid and Matthews would be doing the same thing against all teams, just as they've done for the 4 consecutive seasons before this very unique one. Why? well because they're two of the best players in the league.

Now post their games played/pace. It's like you're not even trying to make a cognizable argument here.

 

[2 others]

I stated that McDavid is a proven 100 point player in normal circumstances and that Matthews is a proven 40-50 goal scorer in normal circumstances, those are facts that cannot be denied.

McDavid :
2016-17 : 100 points (against all teams)
2017-18 : 108 points (against all teams)
2018-19 : 116 points (against all teams)
2019-20 : 97 points (against all teams)
2020-21 : 100 points (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

Matthews :

2016-17 : 40 goals (against all teams)
2017-18 : 34 goals (against all teams, missed 20 games)
2018-19 : 37 goals (against all teams, missed 26 games)
2019-20 : 47 goals (against all teams, missed 12 games)
2020-21 : 40 goals (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

McDavid and Matthews would be doing the same thing against all teams, just as they've done for the 4 consecutive seasons before this very unique one. Why? well because they're two of the best players in the league.

He's for sure a proven 50point player, and Matthews a proven 30 goal scorer

 

[Der Jaeger]

Having a brain fart and need some help. Someone posted a graphic on this board which showed upcoming free agent xGa (I think) and show which free agent defenders were beat at goal suppression, chances against, etc.

I think it was off a Twitter account.

If someone’s got, please re-post. Thanks in advance!

 

[OkimLom]

What was McDavid's ppg each season? Do they trend up?

They trend up each year.

last season, a shortened season vs most teams, he was playing at a 1.52 clip pace for example.

 

[Nikolajs Sillers]

View attachment 431482

Thank you.

 

[WeDislikeEich]

 

[WeDislikeEich]

 

[explore]

All of us are rooting for a more hands-on Dolan when it comes to the Rags

 

[joshjull]

I stated that McDavid is a proven 100 point player in normal circumstances and that Matthews is a proven 40-50 goal scorer in normal circumstances, those are facts that cannot be denied.

McDavid :
2016-17 : 100 points (against all teams)
2017-18 : 108 points (against all teams)
2018-19 : 116 points (against all teams)
2019-20 : 97 points (against all teams)
2020-21 : 100 points (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

Matthews :

2016-17 : 40 goals (against all teams)
2017-18 : 34 goals (against all teams, missed 20 games)
2018-19 : 37 goals (against all teams, missed 26 games)
2019-20 : 47 goals (against all teams, missed 12 games)
2020-21 : 40 goals (North Division)** <-- Suddenly an anomaly?

McDavid and Matthews would be doing the same thing against all teams, just as they've done for the 4 consecutive seasons before this very unique one. Why? well because they're two of the best players in the league.

Whether McDavid can put up 100pts or Mathews can score 40 goals in a normal season is not being debated. Both clearly can and I said so in my last post. Quite honestly why would you even think thats what this debate was about?

The debate is about the production paces they are both on for points and goals respectively in this unique season.

Let me make it simple and to the point.

1) McDavid is on pace for 155pts. Point me to a prior season he was on pace for or produced 155pts. You can’t because its never happened

2) Mathews is on pace for about 67 goals. Point me to a prior season he was on pace for or scored 67 goals. You can’t because its never happened.

They have never produced points or scored goals at these paces before. There is literally no counter argument to this because its a statement of fact. Thats why both of their seasons are anomalies for them.

 

[OkimLom]

Last time anybody sniffed what McDavid was doing, was Mario when he had a 1.77 point pace, back in 2000-2001 season. You’d have to go back to 95-96 to see better point/pace numbers, by you guessed it, Mario.

 

[joshjull]

What was McDavid's ppg each season? Do they trend up?

Yes they do.

15-16 —> 1.07 (87pt player)
16-17 —> 1.22 (100pts)
17-18 —> 1.32 (108pts)
18-19 —> 1.49 (122pts)
19-20 —> 1.52 (125pts)
20-21 —> 1.89 (155pts) 3 games to go


I said he was a 110pt player earlier in this thread. Probably more accurate to say 120pt player since he has two consecutive seasons of it.

 

[Peiskos]

He's for sure a proven 50point player, and Matthews a proven 30 goal scorer

Matthews has hit 40 goals or more in 3 of his 5 current NHL seasons, Matthews is a proven 40 goal scorer, he's above the 30 goal scorer title.

 

[joshjull]

 

[joshjull]

 

[EichHart]

Yes they do.

15-16 —> 1.07 (87pt player)
16-17 —> 1.22 (100pts)
17-18 —> 1.32 (108pts)
18-19 —> 1.49 (122pts)
19-20 —> 1.52 (125pts)
20-21 —> 1.89 (155pts) 3 games to go


I said he was a 110pt player earlier in this thread. Probably more accurate to say 120pt player since he has two consecutive seasons of it.

Usually the peak production from a forward is 24-27, so as they age you would expect their averages to go up each year, and then slowly decline from 28 into their thirties. So did their averages go up because of just facing the north division or because they got better as they got older? That's an argument that will likely be solved next year. Either way I have a hard time believing Matthews wouldn't score 50+ if he faced the Sabres ECHL goalie, the Devils, and the Flyers pathetic goalies. One could argue he would score at a higher pace.