Speculation: Armchair GM Thread Version 974. Or, the boulevard of broken dreams

[OvermanKingGainer]

I have argued for a long time that Bishop's save percentages are strongly a function of Tampa's (and then L.A.'s) excellent defensive play, even moreso than Elliott who actually carried the blues at times and had strong underlying save percentages.

I also think Bishop's "low mileage" is exaggerated as people pretend AHL games don't add mileage, which is an absurd position.

HOWEVER, I am in favour of Ben Bishop. Simply put he's one of only five or six goalies in the league who consistently improves his team's puck possession numbers. That kind of small edge would help the Flames even if his save percentage is more Pekka Rinne than Carey Price.

I say this because I am sick and tired of all the screen/traffic/deflection goals this team lets in just because they let the other team set up camp. Under Hartley it was the whole roster. Under Gulutzan it was just the third pair. I want it all gone.

The AAV and term would have to make sense for Calgary, but he's a better option than, say, Chad Johnson who is a nightmare handling the puck. I thought one of Elliott's biggest advantages over Johnson last year was he simply killed plays sooner, and even then Elliott's ability to play the puck was decidedly average.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Mike Smith OKG. Imo he's better then Bishop, moves the puck as well as anyone.

And he literally carried Arizona last year, without him they were Colorado bad.

He called out his team this year and I think he's ready to move on. But the key for me, is it's only two years.

If he sucks this year it's only one more year. If Bishop sucks we are stuck with him for 4-5 more years.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

I'm not a fan of Smith, simply not sold on him. I'd rather have Elliott back.

 

[MonyontheMoney]

Smith is an extraordinary average goalie. he would definitely be a ways down my list.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

In the last two years he has a 914 and 916 save percentage on the Coyotes... the Coyotes....

Not to mention he's the top puck handling goalie and that easily adds another .005 points at least.

I think he could have been a Vezina nominee with the season he had last year if he was playing behind a team like Washington or Anaheim.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

Mike Smith OKG. Imo he's better then Bishop, moves the puck as well as anyone.

He moves the puck as "often" as anyone, but he has never had any positive impact on his team's shot supression the way Bishop and others do. In fact the only backup he has ever outperformed in this regard was... Chad Johnson in 2013. He's a case of flash over substance.

 

[Flameshomer]

Comparing Bishop and Elliott is actually only possible if you don't watch either of them and just pull their stats off NHL.com. For the record, I don't want Bishop and would rather go with a younger (but still unproven) option like Grubrauer. Bishop has just always been a far more positionally and mentally sound goalie than Brian Elliott, who has a long history of mediocre play with stretches of brilliance, followed by mental collapse in periods of stress. It happened in Ottawa, St. Louis, and now here.

 

[InfinityIggy]

No thanks on Smith, guy has terrible temperament in net just like Hiller.

 

[Flameshomer]

Also gtfo whoever seriously brought up smith, that guy blows.

 

[Flameshomer]

No thanks on Smith, guy has terrible temperament in net just like Hiller.

... your avatar

 

[Fig]

Agreed on OKG's point that I forgot to mention as a pro of Bishop earlier. I like Bishop's puck handling and I would love Gillies to have a front row seat learning that ability. That ability would fit our team's style greatly. I also think he becomes even more dangerous if the NHL ever removes the trapezoid. Furthermore, his height means that he would not fall into the same concerns we had with Elliott where he had a lot of difficulty tracking the puck through traffic due to the amount of bodies we like parking in front of our net.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

I have argued for a long time that Bishop's save percentages are strongly a function of Tampa's (and then L.A.'s) excellent defensive play, even moreso than Elliott who actually carried the blues at times and had strong underlying save percentages.

I also think Bishop's "low mileage" is exaggerated as people pretend AHL games don't add mileage, which is an absurd position.

HOWEVER, I am in favour of Ben Bishop. Simply put he's one of only five or six goalies in the league who consistently improves his team's puck possession numbers. That kind of small edge would help the Flames even if his save percentage is more Pekka Rinne than Carey Price.

I say this because I am sick and tired of all the screen/traffic/deflection goals this team lets in just because they let the other team set up camp. Under Hartley it was the whole roster. Under Gulutzan it was just the third pair. I want it all gone.

The AAV and term would have to make sense for Calgary, but he's a better option than, say, Chad Johnson who is a nightmare handling the puck. I thought one of Elliott's biggest advantages over Johnson last year was he simply killed plays sooner, and even then Elliott's ability to play the puck was decidedly average.

While I agree it helps to play for good teams, I've watched Bishop come into the league with the Sens and then in Tampa for a fair bit of regular season and almost all of their playoff games (I love watching them, very entertaining hockey). Bishop was a huge part of the team that challenged for the east for several years there. Tampa was also far from a defensive powerhouse pre-Stralman and Garrison coming in plus Hedman coming into his own (who many were calling a disappointment/bust for a long time). Lets not forget this is the team that overpaid to get guys like half dead Sami Salo on their team in a desperate bid to upgrade the D.

No doubt he took a step back this year though.

 

[Lunatik]

Smith is an extraordinary average goalie. he would definitely be a ways down my list.

No thanks on Smith, guy has terrible temperament in net just like Hiller.

Regarding Smith, I'd only be interested is he was 50% retained with a conditional pick coming back to us if we don't make the playoffs

 

[DCDM]

No thanks on Smith, guy has terrible temperament in net just like Hiller.

Agreed, no thanks to bringing in a big whining baby.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

Agreed, no thanks to bringing in a big whining baby.

This x100

 

[MonyontheMoney]

I don't see anyway trading what would be more than a 3rd for an average starting goalie with one year left, is a better move than just re-signing our current average starting goalie to a multi-year deal while only giving up a 3rd.

Neither is likely an avenue I go down, but if I had to choose it's Elliott easily.

 

[Lunatik]

Agreed, no thanks to bringing in a big whining baby.

Like Gaudreau?

 

[DCDM]

Like Gaudreau?

HF Oil, is that you?

I think if we're being honest, we should at least remember to call Gaudreau a little whining baby.

 

[Lunatik]

I don't see anyway trading what would be more than a 3rd for an average starting goalie with one year left, is a better move than just re-signing our current average starting goalie to a multi-year deal while only giving up a 3rd.

Neither is likely an avenue I go down, but if I had to choose it's Elliott easily.

2 years. The only good thing about Smith is that Treliving will have a better read on him than any of us and let's be honest on a team that awful, it's difficult to get a good read on a goalie

 

[Lunatik]

HF Oil, is that you?

I think if we're being honest, we should at least remember to call Gaudreau a little whining baby.

Johnny Hobbit Tears[sup]TM[/sup]

 

[DCDM]

Johnny Hobbit Tears[sup]TM[/sup]

 

[Fig]

Johnny Hobbit Tears[sup]TM[/sup]

Sad Johnny Paycheque...

 

[Body Checker]

If Flames could get Bishop to sign a 4 year deal (doubt it tho)and Johnson a 1 year deal that would be about right -

17-18: Bishop/Johnson........Gillies full year as #1 in Stockton
18-19: Bishop/Gillies........Parsons begins AHL apprenticeship
19-20: Bishop/Gillies (about this time talk about Gillies being a #1)........Parsons top 5 prospect in THN's Future Watch
20-21: Gillies/Bishop/Parsons call ups
21-22: Gillies/Parsons

 

[Fig]

If Flames could get Bishop to sign a 4 year deal (doubt it tho)and Johnson a 1 year deal that would be about right -

I don't mind that duo.

But honestly speaking, what teams out there would be able/willing to offer 5 years +? I think the odds of getting 3-4 years shouldn't be too bad.

I'm guessing:

5+ - Vegas or Dallas? (Latter unlikely as they'll have other goalie options)
3-4 years - Winnipeg/Calgary/Philly/Vancouver

Anyone else I missed?

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Elliott's "good" underlying numbers in St. Louis were a result of poor rebound control, poor puck handling skills, and the fact most of his shots were visible shots regardless of where it was shot. Again goalies like Bishop, Rinne, Holtby hinder their underlying numbers with their puck abilities and rebound control, whereas goalies like Dubnyk and Crawford inflate it due to sloppiness (And yet Dubnyk's adjusted save percentage is a negative, proving how overrated he is).