Anthony Mantha (looking good so far in AHL)

[Hugh Mongusbig]

So, only goals count as being productive? Feel free to set the bar higher, PPG's only maybe?

Did we draft Mantha to be a playmaking center or a power forward goal scorer?

if Mantha was a center, then the team would probably be thrilled with him getting assists, and no goals, but at this point, getting assists in the AHL isn't what the Red Wings need out of Mantha. He has been deferring to his line mates way too often and I think the team is letting him know.

 

[sean3250]

9 points in 14 games in your draft +3 year is not a good thing, imo. Plenty of players Mantha's age and younger have been outproducing him in the AHL. AA has been outproducing him for example. For all of his goal scoring ability, he only has 17 goals in 77 games. AA has 23 goals in 73 games. He is one of many doing much better than Mantha at this stage. Things could be going a lot better for Mantha right now.

Mantha- .22 GPG
Athanasiou- .32 GPG.

Players around the same age that have done better than Mantha since turning pro include:

Charles Hudon, Michael McCarron, Connor Brown, Mikko Rantanen, Emile Poirier, Hunter Shinkaruk, Kerby Rychel, Marko Dano etc etc.

Those names are just off the top of my head also.

 

[Pavels Dog]

9 points in 14 games in your draft +3 year is not a good thing, imo. Plenty of players Mantha's age and younger have been outproducing him in the AHL. AA has been outproducing him for example. For all of his goal scoring ability, he only has 17 goals in 77 games. AA has 23 goals in 73 games. He is one of many doing much better than Mantha at this stage. Things could be going a lot better for Mantha right now.

Mantha- .22 GPG
Athanasiou- .32 GPG.

Players around the same age that have done better than Mantha since turning pro include:

Charles Hudon, Michael McCarron, Connor Brown, Mikko Rantanen, Emile Poirier, Hunter Shinkaruk, Kerby Rychel, Marko Dano etc etc.

Those names are just off the top of my head also.

I think we can all agree that his AHL production up to this point has been underwhelming. His actual play is heading the right way though. I'm very optimistic about how he may translate to the NHL.

 

[Frk It]

No Mantha tonight. Same lines and d pairs at morning skate.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

No Mantha tonight. Same lines and d pairs at morning skate.

Yeah he just gets back from an Injury, And now is a healthy scratch not sure what gives.

 

[ap3x]

He simply needs to shoot the puck more instead of passing it all around and goals will come. I'm not worrying at all. I acknowledge the next step he's taking.

 

[SimplySolace]

First people ***** about him being a one-dimensional scorer, now it's that he does everything but? Don't get it.

 

[sean3250]

First people ***** about him being a one-dimensional scorer, now it's that he does everything but? Don't get it.

It's great that Mantha is "improving" his all around game, but he's not gonna make the NHL unless he can be a scoring threat. Mantha wasn't drafted for his playmaking ability, and defensive game. He was drafted to be a 25+ goal scoring winger.

Looks like he might be one of the worst 50 goal scorers in their draft year. I remember everyone saying almost all 50 goal scorers all go on to be above average players in the NHL. Looks like Mantha might buck this trend.

Mantha's improving his playmaking? Great. He's got 25 assists in 77 games.

Mantha's improving his defensive play? Great. He's about average defensively and isn't considered a liability. Awesome.

He has 17 goals in 77 games. No bueno especially considering that's his calling card.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Doesn't pass the sniff test. Causing someone else to score a goal is just as valuable as scoring it yourself, as far as the Griffins are concerned.

 

[Flowah]

Doesn't pass the sniff test. Causing someone else to score a goal is just as valuable as scoring it yourself, as far as the Griffins are concerned.

Goals will always be more valuable than assists. Would you rather have a 50 goal scorer or a 50 assister? This isn't to say it's not great he's got some playmaking. But to say that assists and goals are of equal worth is nutso. It is significantly easier to rack up assists than goals, if only because there are significantly more assists handed out than goals every single season.

 

[Shaman464]

Goals will always be more valuable than assists. Would you rather have a 50 goal scorer or a 50 assister? This isn't to say it's not great he's got some playmaking. But to say that assists and goals are of equal worth is nutso. It is significantly easier to rack up assists than goals, if only because there are significantly more assists handed out than goals every single season.

It depends, a Justin Abdelkader assist is different than a Joe Thornton in his prime assist. Players like Thornton make players around him scoring threats.

But anyway, Mantha isn't a playmaker, he's okay at it, but he was drafted to score, and he's not showing any ability to do so against men. This is exactly why I was suspicious of him, he started to dominate when he was a man among boys, he got away with a lot of sloppy plays and he still has a lot of bad habits.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Who cares if a goal is more valuable than an assist? If you help the puck go into the net on your shift, you've contributed. Players who contribute generally don't get scratched. But even beyond some theoretical discussion of hockey value, several of us can testify that Mantha has actually been playing well this season. I really don't think it's as simple as "Frk is playing better than Mantha."

But you want to hear what's weirder? This.

As for the reasoning to sit Mantha, coach Todd Nelson said, "It was just a coach's decision. He's healthy, he's all good. But it was just my decision and Frkey hasn't played in a bit, and it was nice to see him get the game-winner tonight."

When asked later if he was upset with Mantha, Nelson added, "No, not at all. Those things happens. He smiled at me on the ice today."

What is that supposed to mean? That seems really... weird. There's something going on there that is not made public, I think. It's possible that there are non-hockey reasons.

 

[Hugh Mongusbig]

But you want to hear what's weirder? This.

As for the reasoning to sit Mantha, coach Todd Nelson said, "It was just a coach's decision. He's healthy, he's all good. But it was just my decision and Frkey hasn't played in a bit, and it was nice to see him get the game-winner tonight."

When asked later if he was upset with Mantha, Nelson added, "No, not at all. Those things happens. He smiled at me on the ice today."

What is that supposed to mean? That seems really... weird. There's something going on there that is not made public, I think. It's possible that there are non-hockey reasons.

Or there is nothing weird going on and its all as they say. Nelson just benched/scratched Mantha. Nelson was then asked if Mantha was mad at him and Nelson said, No, Mantha understood why he was benched and the two are still on the same page..... what exactly is so weird or hard to understand here?

I'm not exactly sure why so many people here seem to want to deny teh fact that Mantha is struggling yet again this season. He has 2 GOALS for petes sake!! the season is about a quarter over and he has 2 goals. We were supposed to see a much improved Mantha this season after a subpar season in which he scored 15 goals.... he is now on pace for what 8-10 goals this season?!? He is performing even WORSE THIS YEAR!!! Why is it so hard to understand that despite him picking up a few assists here and there, the team is not happy with his play and effort level yet again this season?

 

[Flowah]

Who cares if a goal is more valuable than an assist?

Well you were the one that claimed an assist is just as valuable as a goal...

It depends, a Justin Abdelkader assist is different than a Joe Thornton in his prime assist. Players like Thornton make players around him scoring threats.

Yet if all of Thorntons assists were goals instead, he'd be a far more valuable player. An 80 goal scorer vs 80 assist getter?

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

I'm not exactly sure why so many people here seem to want to deny teh fact that Mantha is struggling yet again this season. He has 2 GOALS for petes sake!! the season is about a quarter over and he has 2 goals. We were supposed to see a much improved Mantha this season after a subpar season in which he scored 15 goals.... he is now on pace for what 8-10 goals this season?!? He is performing even WORSE THIS YEAR!!! Why is it so hard to understand that despite him picking up a few assists here and there, the team is not happy with his play and effort level yet again this season?

If you watch the actual hockey games, you can see why people are defending Mantha. Again, he's actually been pretty darn good. Certainly much better than last year. It isn't all about goals, especially when he's picking up assists instead.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Well you were the one that claimed an assist is just as valuable as a goal...

Sort of. My point was really just that an assist on a given play is often just as valuable. Sometimes you have a complete snipe or a crazy individual effort type thing, but often the pass that got you the puck in scoring position is frequently just as important as the shot that scores. No pass, no goal.

Besides, no matter what you do, no matter how good a play your line makes, there's still just one goal. Knowing that somebody got the goal doesn't tell you much about their contribution by itself.

 

[izlez]

I really don't get how specifically, if you were "drafted to score goals", then your assists are worth less.

People are literally acting like 7 points in 7 games is worthless because it's not "why he was drafted". If he comes into the NHL and gets 0 goal and 82 assists every year, that is a great player, regardless of "why you were drafted"


It's also funny that someone pointed out that Frk has DOUBLE the goals as Mantha in LESS GAMES.... despite the fact that Mantha has DOUBLE the points per game as Frk

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

I really don't get how specifically, if you were "drafted to score goals", then your assists are worth less.

People are literally acting like 7 points in 7 games is worthless because it's not "why he was drafted". If he comes into the NHL and gets 0 goal and 82 assists every year, that is a great player, regardless of "why you were drafted"

No one is drafted to do just one thing.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

He has 20 goals but 0 assists. 1st overall.

well he was drafted to score goals, so best pick of the draft. lol.

 

[Winger98]

If you watch the actual hockey games, you can see why people are defending Mantha. Again, he's actually been pretty darn good. Certainly much better than last year. It isn't all about goals, especially when he's picking up assists instead.

also, GR got off to a really slow start goal scoring wise, and a lot of guys don't have great numbers right now. The transition to Nelson seems to have been pretty rough until lately.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

also, GR got off to a really slow start goal scoring wise, and a lot of guys don't have great numbers right now. The transition to Nelson seems to have been pretty rough until lately.

Yeah, not to mention that Mantha played all of the bad games, but missed 4 of the more recent good ones.

 

[edmundbenz]

Mantha assisted on AA goal. The pair is smoking tonight.

 

[edmundbenz]

Mantha again assisted on Tangradi's goal. 2A tonight. Dang.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Doesn't he know that assists are worthless? Come on, Mantha.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Empty net goal! That's what I'm talking about. Way better than those assists.