Andreas Athanasiou

[jkutswings]

It's all in the context.

Dealing him straight up for a #3/#4 defenseman isn't really solving anything, and would probably be a net loss in the long run.

But if AA were part of a package to land a surefire top pairing defenseman, then that's a smart move. The kid has taken leaps and bounds this year, and it would stink to lose him, but you have to give to get, and a #1/#2 D is both harder to find and a more important need.

Absolutely listen to offers; that costs nothing. But it needs to be a fairly big fish involved to pull the trigger.

 

[datsyukfan]

Go Greece Lightning - Evaluating Andreas Athanasiou’s impact on the Red Wings

Good write up on Athanasiou's overall contributions to the team this season.

I'm wondering if we should consider selling high on him for a defensive upgrade if an option presents itself for such an opportunity. I like AA a lot and value his heart, but he's going to get paid next summer.

Nope just keep AA. We have Cholo, Hronek, Bowey as young d-man as well as DK. Lindstrom is coming as well as Mciisac. We need to create a top 9 of high skill and AA is so unique and his game is developing where I think consistently he can be around 30 a year

 

[masta8]

I 100% would not trade AA. I think this is the start of a consistent 30 goal scorer. Having him and Larkin as our top 2 C is going to be lethal for the next few years too.

 

[lilidk]

I 100% would not trade AA. I think this is the start of a consistent 30 goal scorer. Having him and Larkin as our top 2 C is going to be lethal for the next few years too.

Finally we got 1-2 punch at center, just like before with Sergey and Steven, Pavel and Hank

 

[Larkin2AA]

Can somebody give me an example of a time a team traded their 2nd leading scorer for a top defenseman and have it work out in their favor? I would need to have some sort of example(s) in order for me to ever be ok with this. AA is a talented player who has absolutely taken off this year. His skill and motor is something that is hard to replace, and although there are still other parts of his game he needs to work our (i.e. the defensive zone responsibility), he has progressed extremely well over the past few years (or more specifically, last year). If he is able to repeat or even do better next season, then you keep him no matter what.

 

[obey86]

Can somebody give me an example of a time a team traded their 2nd leading scorer for a top defenseman and have it work out in their favor? I would need to have some sort of example(s) in order for me to ever be ok with this. AA is a talented player who has absolutely taken off this year. His skill and motor is something that is hard to replace, and although there are still other parts of his game he needs to work our (i.e. the defensive zone responsibility), he has progressed extremely well over the past few years (or more specifically, last year). If he is able to repeat or even do better next season, then you keep him no matter what.

Bluejackets when they traded for Seth Jones.

 

[jkutswings]

Finally we got 1-2 punch at center, just like before with Sergey and Steven, Pavel and Hank

Nearly everything that AA brings to the table is best used at wing, not center.

 

[Larkin2AA]

Bluejackets when they traded for Seth Jones.

Good example. and it seemed to work out well for both teams. Problem is that losing AA up front means a lack of scoring on the offensive side of the game. Yes, we would have a solid defender in Jones (as an example), but you need to score goals to win these games. Nashville has made it to the WCSF (2), and Finals, whereas Columbus has been stuck in playoff limbo losing in the 1st round the last two years and missing the playoffs in the previous 2.

 

[Hatter of the Beach]

Finally we got 1-2 punch at center, just like before with Sergey and Steven, Pavel and Hank

Add in Veleno and we’d easily have the fastest center core in the league provided one of Helm/Glendenning/Ehn is the 4th line’s center

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Can somebody give me an example of a time a team traded their 2nd leading scorer for a top defenseman and have it work out in their favor? I would need to have some sort of example(s) in order for me to ever be ok with this. AA is a talented player who has absolutely taken off this year. His skill and motor is something that is hard to replace, and although there are still other parts of his game he needs to work our (i.e. the defensive zone responsibility), he has progressed extremely well over the past few years (or more specifically, last year). If he is able to repeat or even do better next season, then you keep him no matter what.

Rangers when they traded Scott Gomez for the package that included Ryan McDonagh

Blues when they traded Brendan Shanahan for Chris Pronger

Blackhawks when they traded Denis Savard for Chris Chelios

Basically any time a team's 2nd leading scorer (All of whom are superior hockey players to AA, aside from maybe Gomez), it has worked out well for the team getting the top D man.

 

[Hen Kolland]

Can somebody give me an example of a time a team traded their 2nd leading scorer for a top defenseman and have it work out in their favor? I would need to have some sort of example(s) in order for me to ever be ok with this. AA is a talented player who has absolutely taken off this year. His skill and motor is something that is hard to replace, and although there are still other parts of his game he needs to work our (i.e. the defensive zone responsibility), he has progressed extremely well over the past few years (or more specifically, last year). If he is able to repeat or even do better next season, then you keep him no matter what.

Tampa Bay traded Jonathan Drouin (21yo) who finished the 2016-17 season with 21 goals, 32 assists for 53 points in 73 games (0.726 points per game) for Mikhail Sergachev (18/19). He finished third on the team in scoring behind Kucherov and Hedman. Since the trade, Drouin's best full year with Montreal has been this year, where he has 18 goals and 52 assists in 79 games. Sergachev's best year was last year (consider he's only been around for 2 years) when he had 9 goals and 31 assists in 79 games.

Columbus traded Ryan Johansen (22yo) who finished the 2014-15 season (last full season with Columbus) with 26 goals, 45 assists for 71 points in 82 games (0.866 points per game) for Seth Jones (21). He finished second on the team in scoring behind Nick Foligno. Since the trade, Johansen's best full year with Nashville has been probably this year, with 13 goals and 50 assists in 78 games. Jones' best year was last year when he finished with 16 goals and 41 assists in 78 games, also finishing 4th in the Norris voting (which I feel like wasn't high enough btw).

Andreas Athanasiou (24yo) is currently sitting on 30 goals, 23 assists for 53 points in 74 games (0.716 points per game), which is good for second on the team in aggregate scoring, third if you look at point per game (behind Larkin and Mantha).

Just the two one-for-one forward for defenseman scenarios that pop into my head when you asked for an example.

 

[lilidk]

Nearly everything that AA brings to the table is best used at wing, not center.

He is getting better at everything and very fast, nobody talking about his hockey iq no more

 

[Larkin2AA]

Rangers when they traded Scott Gomez for the package that included Ryan McDonagh

Blues when they traded Brendan Shanahan for Chris Pronger

Blackhawks when they traded Denis Savard for Chris Chelios

Basically any time a team's 2nd leading scorer (All of whom are superior hockey players to AA, aside from maybe Gomez), it has worked out well for the team getting the top D man.

Tampa Bay traded Jonathan Drouin (21yo) who finished the 2016-17 season with 21 goals, 32 assists for 53 points in 73 games (0.726 points per game) for Mikhail Sergachev (18/19). He finished third on the team in scoring behind Kucherov and Hedman. Since the trade, Drouin's best full year with Montreal has been this year, where he has 18 goals and 52 assists in 79 games. Sergachev's best year was last year (consider he's only been around for 2 years) when he had 9 goals and 31 assists in 79 games.

Columbus traded Ryan Johansen (22yo) who finished the 2014-15 season (last full season with Columbus) with 26 goals, 45 assists for 71 points in 82 games (0.866 points per game) for Seth Jones (21). He finished second on the team in scoring behind Nick Foligno. Since the trade, Johansen's best full year with Nashville has been probably this year, with 13 goals and 50 assists in 78 games. Jones' best year was last year when he finished with 16 goals and 41 assists in 78 games, also finishing 4th in the Norris voting (which I feel like wasn't high enough btw).

Andreas Athanasiou (24yo) is currently sitting on 30 goals, 23 assists for 53 points in 74 games (0.716 points per game), which is good for second on the team in aggregate scoring, third if you look at point per game (behind Larkin and Mantha).

Just the two one-for-one forward for defenseman scenarios that pop into my head when you asked for an example.

Thanks guys, I'll go back to my corner now.

I still want to keep AA, dammit

 

[Hen Kolland]

Thanks guys, I'll go back to my corner now.

I still want to keep AA, dammit

You're not wrong to want to keep him. I don't want to get rid of him, but if the opportunity presents itself, I would make the move. The thing is, the opportunity I would be looking for would have to be a budding top pair defenseman aged 24 or younger. The thing about Sergachev and Jones, it was reasonable to see them having the ability to become a top flight defenseman. You don't really have that going on anymore because players establish themselves as top guys so quickly.

Just looking at some names that fit the bill:
Provorov
Dumba
McAvoy
Ekblad
Werenski
Liljegren
Slavin

 

[Larkin2AA]

You're not wrong to want to keep him. I don't want to get rid of him, but if the opportunity presents itself, I would make the move. The thing is, the opportunity I would be looking for would have to be a budding top pair defenseman aged 24 or younger. The thing about Sergachev and Jones, it was reasonable to see them having the ability to become a top flight defenseman. You don't really have that going on anymore because players establish themselves as top guys so quickly.

Just looking at some names that fit the bill:
Provorov
Dumba
McAvoy
Ekblad
Werenski
Liljegren
Slavin

For a top pairing defenseman, 24 years and younger, would probably require us to throw in something else, depending on what AA would be putting up for points. I understand though, if the option presents itself, and none of our drafted players/future prospects on the defensive side have stepped it up enough to be considered a top pairing defender, then it would be the smart move to make.

 

[Frk It]

Tampa Bay traded Jonathan Drouin (21yo) who finished the 2016-17 season with 21 goals, 32 assists for 53 points in 73 games (0.726 points per game) for Mikhail Sergachev (18/19). He finished third on the team in scoring behind Kucherov and Hedman. Since the trade, Drouin's best full year with Montreal has been this year, where he has 18 goals and 52 assists in 79 games. Sergachev's best year was last year (consider he's only been around for 2 years) when he had 9 goals and 31 assists in 79 games.

Columbus traded Ryan Johansen (22yo) who finished the 2014-15 season (last full season with Columbus) with 26 goals, 45 assists for 71 points in 82 games (0.866 points per game) for Seth Jones (21). He finished second on the team in scoring behind Nick Foligno. Since the trade, Johansen's best full year with Nashville has been probably this year, with 13 goals and 50 assists in 78 games. Jones' best year was last year when he finished with 16 goals and 41 assists in 78 games, also finishing 4th in the Norris voting (which I feel like wasn't high enough btw).

Andreas Athanasiou (24yo) is currently sitting on 30 goals, 23 assists for 53 points in 74 games (0.716 points per game), which is good for second on the team in aggregate scoring, third if you look at point per game (behind Larkin and Mantha).

Just the two one-for-one forward for defenseman scenarios that pop into my head when you asked for an example.

I think this is a great time to trade AA, I would be cool with that. I would try to get Bean + Fox from Carolina or something like that.

 

[Hen Kolland]

For a top pairing defenseman, 24 years and younger, would probably require us to throw in something else, depending on what AA would be putting up for points. I understand though, if the option presents itself, and none of our drafted players/future prospects on the defensive side have stepped it up enough to be considered a top pairing defender, then it would be the smart move to make.

That's the problem. When Tampa acquired Sergachev, when Columbus acquired Jones, they were basically trading a more established young forward for a young defenseman who was more potential than he was realized talent. These kids become realized talent so damn early now that there are less question marks, and therefore make it easier for the current team to realize the value they are sitting on, and the prices will justifiably inflate. If I could trade AA for those players straight up, I would, but that offer is probably still missing a strong second piece. It doesn't help that Athanasiou has also taken a few years to get to this point, which eliminates the thought of his potential from the conversation.

 

[TheOtherOne]

He is getting better at everything and very fast, nobody talking about his hockey iq no more

I love AA as much as anyone and I would really hate to trade him. But hockey IQ is still his weakness. If he had hockey IQ he would be Sergei Federov.

 

[izlez]

Just looking at some names that fit the bill:
Provorov
Dumba
McAvoy
Ekblad
Werenski
Liljegren
Slavin

How about Chychrun? Let's take this thing full circle.

 

[jkutswings]

Scenario A: Keep AA, land a major defenseman via free agency or other trade.

Scenario B: Trade AA to significantly bolster the defense, and help the offense with a combination of Zadina/Veleno/2019 pick/free agency.

While not in a rush to trade anybody, I like the odds of Scenario B a lot better.

I mean, if we're really shooting for the moon with an aggressive summer to shorten the rebuild, I think Detroit has a better chance of using AA to help land a defenseman and then successfully offer sheeting Point, than getting EK to come here.

 

[Larkin2AA]

Scenario A: Keep AA, land a major defenseman via free agency or other trade.

Scenario B: Trade AA to significantly bolster the defense, and help the offense with a combination of Zadina/Veleno/2019 pick/free agency.

While not in a rush to trade anybody, I like the odds of Scenario B a lot better.

I mean, if we're really shooting for the moon with an aggressive summer to shorten the rebuild, I think Detroit has a better chance of using AA to help land a defenseman and then successfully offer sheeting Point, than getting EK to come here.

I would take your last paragraph in a heartbeat, however, that is a lot of hoping/wishing lol.

 

[Hen Kolland]

Scenario A: Keep AA, land a major defenseman via free agency or other trade.

Scenario B: Trade AA to significantly bolster the defense, and help the offense with a combination of Zadina/Veleno/2019 pick/free agency.

While not in a rush to trade anybody, I like the odds of Scenario B a lot better.

I mean, if we're really shooting for the moon with an aggressive summer to shorten the rebuild, I think Detroit has a better chance of using AA to help land a defenseman and then successfully offer sheeting Point, than getting EK to come here.

I think I'd rather keep AA and offer sheet Werenski if we are being honest. Consider the difference in cost between successfully acquiring Werenski and Point via offer sheet, we would maintain more cap flexibility and likely also needing to send less draft capital out. Both are viable options in a vacuum, but I tend to think jumping the price on Werenski would potentially yield a better result. From what I've read, Columbus may try to use Seth Jones' contract as a negotiating point, and the Red Wings can surely stomach paying more than that. Also, I imagine Werenski would very much be interested in going to Detroit being from Grosse Pointe and having the chance to reunite with Larkin.

 

[lomekian]

Any scenario that involves trading AA needs to factor in his friendships with the other young guns, where else we can get game breaking speed, and who we land in the draft.

We're unlikely to get value on the back end due to his positional uncertainty and not reading from a position of strength.

But bar Larkin, we should be open to considering offers for anyone, while remaining reluctant to trade any of our regular u26 players

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Can we really go into the playoffs with a #2 center who's a questionable playmaker, not the best puck possessor, and unreliable defensively? Not so sure. You can't hide AA from the matchup game in the playoffs. Teams would key in on his line, IMO.

Sell while his value is high. Before next season comes around and everyone changes their minds.

 

[Larkin2AA]

Can we really go into the playoffs with a #2 center who's a questionable playmaker, not the best puck possessor, and unreliable defensively? Not so sure. You can't hide AA from the matchup game in the playoffs. Teams would key in on his line, IMO.

Sell while his value is high. Before next season comes around and everyone changes their minds.

By the time we make the playoffs, I don't believe AA will be a #2 C (or even a center at all)