Andreas Athanasiou

obey86

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Jun 9, 2009
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Can we really go into the playoffs with a #2 center who's a questionable playmaker, not the best puck possessor, and unreliable defensively? Not so sure. You can't hide AA from the matchup game in the playoffs. Teams would key in on his line, IMO.

Sell while his value is high. Before next season comes around and everyone changes their minds.

I think there are lots of different ways to build teams. Not saying you shouldn't try to upgrade on AA as a center, but he's not necessarily done developing his overall game and there are lots of different styles of players that can be successful depending on how your team is built.
 

Hammettf2b

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Good example. and it seemed to work out well for both teams. Problem is that losing AA up front means a lack of scoring on the offensive side of the game. Yes, we would have a solid defender in Jones (as an example), but you need to score goals to win these games. Nashville has made it to the WCSF (2), and Finals, whereas Columbus has been stuck in playoff limbo losing in the 1st round the last two years and missing the playoffs in the previous 2.
Also, Nashville had at least 3 defensemen better than Jones at the time iirc so they could afford to move him for a forward. Not many teams are going to have that luxury.
 
Jul 30, 2005
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I mean, what is location, really
Somebody at WIIM made a good point: if AA continues to score the way he does, he's going to want a huge contract comparable to or bigger than Larkin's. Would it be a smart move to lock him up? At some point we'll have to pull a Leafs move and figure out who the core is going forward. Could be too much cap for a one-dimensional player. If that's the case, it might be good to be proactive.
 

TheOtherOne

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Can we really go into the playoffs with a #2 center who's a questionable playmaker, not the best puck possessor, and unreliable defensively? Not so sure. You can't hide AA from the matchup game in the playoffs. Teams would key in on his line, IMO.

Sell while his value is high. Before next season comes around and everyone changes their minds.
AA can score in any game, at any time, with any linemates, against anyone, at ES. That's an incredible asset to have in the matchup game. Double shift him on the fourth line. Let the opponent play matchup against him, that just makes things easier for the entire rest of our team, and he can still score out of nowhere if you blink.
Somebody at WIIM made a good point: if AA continues to score the way he does, he's going to want a huge contract comparable to or bigger than Larkin's. Would it be a smart move to lock him up? At some point we'll have to pull a Leafs move and figure out who the core is going forward. Could be too much cap for a one-dimensional player. If that's the case, it might be good to be proactive.
Oh come on, he would have to be delusional to think he's worth as much as Larkin.
 

jkutswings

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AA can score in any game, at any time, with any linemates, against anyone, at ES. That's an incredible asset to have in the matchup game. Double shift him on the fourth line. Let the opponent play matchup against him, that just makes things easier for the entire rest of our team, and he can still score out of nowhere if you blink.
He can score early and often...during the regular season. Let's not get ahead of ourselves here. I like the strides he's making, but his particular skill set has yet to be evaluated against a recurring playoff opponent who can heavily strategize against it.
 

obey86

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Somebody at WIIM made a good point: if AA continues to score the way he does, he's going to want a huge contract comparable to or bigger than Larkin's. Would it be a smart move to lock him up? At some point we'll have to pull a Leafs move and figure out who the core is going forward. Could be too much cap for a one-dimensional player.

That's a good point. If he has a 60+ point season next year, he's going to have earned quite the contract. I'm not sure what you do honestly. Depend on how big the contract is. With Larkin on a sweetheart deal and a lot of bad contracts coming off the books in the next season or two there is some flexibility there. At least Zadina and the 2019 1st round pick should be on entry level deals for a bit.

But if we get to the point where they are trying to fit Athanasiou under the cap and are concerned because they have too many other good young players who will need contracts soon also (Zadina, 2019 top 6 pick, etc), we are probably in a good spot rebuilding wise.
 
Jul 30, 2005
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I mean, what is location, really
That's a good point. If he has a 60+ point season next year, he's going to have earned quite the contract. I'm not sure what you do honestly. Depend on how big the contract is. With Larkin on a sweetheart deal and a lot of bad contracts coming off the books in the next season or two there is some flexibility there. At least Zadina and the 2019 1st round pick should be on entry level deals for a bit.

But if we get to the point where they are trying to fit Athanasiou under the cap and are concerned because they have too many other good young players who will need contracts soon also (Zadina, 2019 top 6 pick, etc), we are probably in a good spot rebuilding wise.
Don't forget the excellent veteran UFAs we've yet to sign.
 

obey86

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The quoted is true as well.

At even strength, AA's line have been scored on 46 times and his line has scored 46 times. Hardly a terrible trade off for a team as bad as this one is.

Got those stats from Corsica, i'll be honest though, I don't understand why he is a -6 on the season then if his lines have scored as many as they have given up even strength?
 

obey86

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Don't forget the excellent veteran UFAs we've yet to sign.

Yeah I mean, if they sign a high priced FA or two....that obviously makes moving someone like AA more of a necessity and could actually jumpstart the rebuild. ex: sign Duchesne to replace AA's production and then trade AA for a cheaper defenseman with potential or something like that.
 

TheOtherOne

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The quoted is true as well.
Really?

He's -6 which is perfectly average for our team and identical to Larkin. He has played on a bottom 5 team all year. Have you seen the defenders he plays with? Remind me about all the praise we hfboards members give our stellar defense.

Like 10 games ago he started getting consistently 20 minutes a night as a center and in that time he has allowed 2 goals.

Look, I'm not going to claim he's the greatest defensive player ever. But not every player has to be. We won Cups with Shanahan, didn't we? Give him responsible linemates. Give him a competent back end.

If you don't think a Cup contender can find a use for one of the best even strength goalscorers in the league who might be a little weak on defense, I don't know what to tell you.

EDIT: In 15 games in March he is a +2 averaging 19 minutes per night. With a backend of f***ing Hicketts and Witkowski and Lashoff and Bowey and McIlrath and who the f*** even has heard of half these guys.
 
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jkutswings

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If you don't think a Cup contender can find a use for one of the best even strength goalscorers in the league who might be a little weak on defense, I don't know what to tell you.
I don't think there's skepticism about finding a use for AA. But there's nothing wrong with thinking that a team who uses him as a middle six winger while having a better option at 2C is stronger overall.
 

TheOtherOne

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I don't think there's skepticism about finding a use for AA. But there's nothing wrong with thinking that a team who uses him as a middle six winger while having a better option at 2C is stronger overall.
The post that started this argument is this one:
Can we really go into the playoffs with a #2 center who's a questionable playmaker, not the best puck possessor, and unreliable defensively? Not so sure. You can't hide AA from the matchup game in the playoffs. Teams would key in on his line, IMO.

Sell while his value is high. Before next season comes around and everyone changes their minds.
 
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TheOtherOne

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Moving on:

I just looked up split stats Andreas Athanasiou Stats and News
Apparently AA has been basically twice as good at home as on the road this year.
In only home games, he's been on pace for 47 goals, 77 points, and +23.
In only road games, he's been on pace for 22 goals, 41 points, and -35.
Wow, what a difference.
 

Winger98

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Moving on:

I just looked up split stats Andreas Athanasiou Stats and News
Apparently AA has been basically twice as good at home as on the road this year.
In only home games, he's been on pace for 47 goals, 77 points, and +23.
In only road games, he's been on pace for 22 goals, 41 points, and -35.
Wow, what a difference.

Since March 1st those come out to:

Home: 27 goals, 27 assists, +34
Road: 16 goals, 8 assists, -12

And for comparison, here is Larkin:
Home: 20 goals, 51 assists, +72
Road: 23 goals, 6 assists, -23

The +/- road numbers are pretty darn ugly for the Wings in general this year.
 

golffuul

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Since March 1st those come out to:

Home: 27 goals, 27 assists, +34
Road: 16 goals, 8 assists, -12

And for comparison, here is Larkin:
Home: 20 goals, 51 assists, +72
Road: 23 goals, 6 assists, -23

The +/- road numbers are pretty darn ugly for the Wings in general this year.


This basically tells me, that the coaching style is to make good on the matchups you have control over, which is fine and laudable. But the road stats show that the overall talent level is still too low to keep other teams from doing the same to you.
 
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obey86

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This basically tells me, that the coaching style is to make good on the matchups you have control over, which is fine and laudable. But the road stats show that the overall talent level is still too low to keep other teams from doing the same to you.

Don't really think it says anything about any individual players, we're just a bad team. Teams struggle on the road (moreso than home) in general, and that disparity is typically amplified if you are a bad team.

OTT: 18-18-4 at home, 10-27-2 on the road
LA: 16-21-3, 14-20-6
NJ: 20-14-7, 10-26-3
BUFF: 20-15-5, 15-20-5
DET: 17-18-5, 15-20-5
NYR: 18-13-8, 13-22-5
ANA: 17-14-8, 16-23-2
EDM: 18-18-14, 16-19-5
VAN: 20-16-5, 15-19-5
CHI: 17-14-18, 17-19-4

This isn't anything groundbreaking. Teams play worse on the road, and bad teams really struggle on the road. Even the ten worst teams in the league (see above) have ~.500 records at home.
 

obey86

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they do. there are PP and PK options on the 'game state'. PP stats for Wings players this year.

and PK

AA is 20-1 on the pp. so that counts as -1. so the other 5 minus are EN goals

Ah ok cool, thanks. So he's a -1 on the year basically, outside of empty net goals.

EDIT: looks like you were using a different corsica website than I was lol. yours was corsica.hockey. mine was corsicahockey.com. that's why I couldn't find it. not sure if they are affiliated? i used to use the one you were using, but their interface is always so buggy and takes forever for the stats to load. also if I run a query and then stop using the page for 30 seconds I would get an error message and would have to start my query all over again. anyways lol
 
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Fil Larkmanthanasiou

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Feb 10, 2018
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Ah ok cool, thanks. So he's a -1 on the year basically, outside of empty net goals.

EDIT: looks like you were using a different corsica website than I was lol. yours was corsica.hockey. mine was corsicahockey.com. that's why I couldn't find it. not sure if they are affiliated? i used to use the one you were using, but their interface is always so buggy and takes forever for the stats to load. also if I run a query and then stop using the page for 30 seconds I would get an error message and would have to start my query all over again. anyways lol
If you are including the PP, he is a plus outside of empty net goals.
I think Hronek has been on for as many if njort more empty net goals against despite only playing in a little more than half of the games.
Where do you guys get these stats?
 

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