And Then Everyone Dared Disturb the Sound of Silence (CBA & Lockout) XXIII ‎

[King'sPawn]

Yes, he felt that negotiations during the spring would take away from the focus of the playoffs. It was very thoughtful of him I thought. At least someone cares about the fans because the league does not.

The players are not holding out, the are just refusing to put their heads on the chop block so Bettman can swing his axe - or as Bettman calls it, "negotiating''.

I agree. It was very thoughtful of him to subject the fans to another lockout rather than get things started early.

 

[nowhereman]

Yes, he felt that negotiations during the spring would take away from the focus of the playoffs. It was very thoughtful of him I thought. At least someone cares about the fans becasue the league does not.

The players are not holding out, the are just refusing to put their heads on the chop block so Bettman can swing his axe - or as Bettman calls it, "negotiating''.

MOD

Fehr doesn't want to "take away from the focus of the playoffs" but he's willing to piss away an entire season, digging his feet into the ground and stalling throughout these negotiations, in an effort to milk everything he can out of the NHL? There was a lot of thought that went into those actions but it definitely wasn't "thoughful" and it sure as hell well wasn't in the best interest of the game.

 

[Hanklite*]

I agree. It was very thoughtful of him to subject the fans to another lockout rather than get things started early.

No kidding.

For me personally, I would have been wrapped up in the CBA negotiations instead of the Stanley Cup Finals...

 

[tarheelhockey]

I'm just glad I got to enjoy a distraction-free July.

 

[Luck 6]

Talks would go alot better if the NHL finally realized that linkage is a non starter. Players should be entitled to guaranteed amounts of money each year at a minimum. It is the responsibility of the owners to work harder for the players to make sure they are fairly compensated. As far as this year goes, players are entitled to all of the compensation that they were scheduled to get no matter how many games are played. The owners are responsible for the lockout, they should pay for their mistake.

Until the league comes to this understanding there will be no hockey.

So then, there will be no hockey. Who stands to lose the most from this? The players. Linkage is *not* a non-starter, there has been linkage for years now and the players have never been more profitable. The owner's are not responsible for the lockout, the idea of the players playing without a CBA is ludacris. The players could strike at any moment and have all of the leverage, a lockout was mandatory for the owners. The players need to wear their portion of the blame for this lockout, the owners should not have to pay their share.

 

[ThirdManIn]

No kidding.

For me personally, I would have been wrapped up in the CBA negotiations instead of the Stanley Cup Finals...

Right? The only reason anyone gives two damns about the negotiations right now is because there is nothing else to follow. Had they continued the season while negotiating I probably wouldn't even be in here right now.

The fans matter, sure, but if anyone thinks either side is really putting the fans first in anything right now they are much less cynical than I am.

 

[Charon]

Fehr did not want CBA negotiations to take away from the playoffs and upset the fans because he cares about them more than Bettman Inc. does. He did not want the fans to have to hear about these things when they were trying to enjoy the best hockey of the year. The league could have hammered out a deal with the players in August during hockeys down time and none of this would have happened.

...It takes to to tango...

The league was under no obligation to play this season under the terms of the previous CBA. Saying that the lockout is purely the league's fault, and that the players are the only ones that want to play is a poor way to characterize the actual situation. It could also be said that the lockout is players' fault because they didn't accept to the league's first offer in the summer. But that one is equally as poor.

I cringe whenever I hear Fehr, or PA supporters, say that the decision to lock the players out was completely unnecessary. It could also be said that it was completely unnecessary for the players to reject the league's first offer in the summer.

The league had no obligation to play under the previous CBA, and the players new that, AND the players were advised that the league was not willing to play under the old CBA for another year.

 

[Luck 6]

I agree. It was very thoughtful of him to subject the fans to another lockout rather than get things started early.

It wouldn't have made a difference. Both sides would be postering until crunch time regardless of when the negotiations began. Negotiations are only about time when things get serious, and they rarely get serious until the "final hour".

 

[Fehr Time*]

You conveniently ignored my question. How do you know this is a fact? From what I know the reason negotiations didn't start earlier was said to be because Fehr needed time to get up to speed, not because of the fans. So do you have a quote that you wouldn't mind sharing? If not let's stop treating assumptions like fact, shall we?

Hmmm, well I am still scrounging for the article(s) on that but I do know that he said this. That said it can be treated as only my opinion until I present the facts.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Judging by the reactions on the streets and on here the league has over 80% of the support.

Fehr is public enemy number one in the hockey world.

He's probably a close second to Bettman who gets a rousing ovation wherever he goes. I doubt very much that the league has more support than the players this time around. Neither Bettman nor Fehr should take any pride in the way they have handled this, IMO.

 

[Fehr Time*]

Did you think about that sentence, before you wrote it?

Fehr doesn't want to "take away from the focus of the playoffs" but he's willing to piss away an entire season, digging his feet into the ground and stalling throughout these negotiations, in an effort to milk everything he can out of the NHL? There was a lot of thought that went into those actions but it definitely wasn't "thoughful" and it sure as hell well wasn't in the best interest of the game.

He does not want to lose the season at all, he never wanted a lockout. He thought the league would gracefully work on and complete a new CBA with the players during the summer and there would be no interuptions going in to September. He and the players only want what is best for the league and especially its fans.

 

[WayneSid9987]

[mod]

Anyway, from what i can see this isn't Fehr's tipping point. I thought it would be cuz the players would want to possibly get back most of thier money this year and they'd put the pressure on him but he still has them under his thumb for now.

The 94/95 season wasn't settled til Jan.1.
05 was cancelled in Feburary.

I should've known better though. Fehr loves to do this. I stopped looking at the calendar and got too caught up in the optimism. It's way too early for Fehr to settle this.

It's pretty evident Fehr will lose the players a ton of money this year. It remains to be seen if he loses them a ton in the future though.

 

[CN_paladin]

Yeah, but if you had a contract promising you that rate of pay for years to come, and you had to listen to your boss brag about how much better than expected the company is doing,wouldn't you feel like you are getting screwed? Esspecially, if YOU are the product. How long you can hold out for is another story.

Then maybe the players' agents could have explained that the contracts were going to be subject to the new CBA before their clients signed them. I do understand your rationale as no one wants to lose any salary.

 

[Wretched Oil]

He's probably a close second to Bettman who gets a rousing ovation wherever he goes. I doubt very much that the league has more support than the players this time around. Neither Bettman nor Fehr should take any pride in the way they have handled this, IMO.

I agree, at this point I'm hoping everyone involved looks back on this as a horribly childish game of greed that resulted in ZERO satisfaction.

 

[Hanklite*]

So we are roughly at an hour for this meeting...

I doubt it goes close to 4 hours tonight. I can see this being done shortly.

 

[Renbarg]

Judging by the reactions on the streets and on here the league has over 80% of the support.

Fehr is public enemy number one in the hockey world.

No, quite the opposite. The regular public is generally pro-Fehr, and pro-players. They have done a pretty good job in the PR war as far as the regular folk go. I think its obvious that a much higher percentage of HFBoards poster are pro-owners than in the "real" world.

 

[Fehr Time*]

Then maybe the players' agents could have explained that the contracts were going to be subject to the new CBA before their clients signed them. I do understand your rationale as no one wants to lose any salary.

The fact that owners are trying to clawback contracts (some of them being signed only days prior the the owners' lockout) is one of the major issues the players have with the league. It shows how dishonest and underhanded the owners are and the lack of good faith they show when dealing with players. The players stand for the principles of honesty and integrity, and are disgusted when they see what these owners try to do to them. People like to talk about replacement players, maybe instead it is time for replacement owners...

 

[WetcoastOrca]

He does not want to lose the season at all, he never wanted a lockout. He thought the league would gracefully work on and complete a new CBA with the players during the summer and there would be no interuptions going in to September. He and the players only want what is best for the league and especially its fans.

He may not want to lose the season but he has to bear some of the blame for the situation we are in. I don't think there's good guys vs bad guys here. This league is dysfunctional on both the management and players side. I hope by the time this agreement ends both Fehr and Bettman are gone.

 

[tbcwpg]

The fact that owners are trying to clawback contracts (some of them being signed only days prior the the owners' lockout) is one of the major issues the players have with the league. It shows how dishonest and underhanded the owners are and the lack of good faith they show when dealing with players. The players stand for the principles of honesty and integrity, and are disgusted when they see what these owners try to do to them. People like to talk about replacement players, maybe instead it is time for replacement owners...

Or it shows that the league could not operate any differently than it had before, or the collusion accusations would be thrown about.

 

[CN_paladin]

The fact that owners are trying to clawback contracts (some of them being signed only days prior the the owners' lockout) is one of the major issues the players have with the league. It shows how dishonest and underhanded the owners are and the lack of good faith they show when dealing with players. The players stand for the principles of honesty and integrity, and are disgusted when they see what these owners try to do to them. People like to talk about replacement players, maybe instead it is time for replacement owners...

Well I tend to think that finding billionaires who want to take over NHL teams will be much tougher to do than finding replacement players.

I just wish they could discuss core issues like linkage rather than minors tweaks like pensions.

 

[Motown Beatdown]

i think this memo leak is actually good. shows Fehr that not all players are happy and he needs to work to a deal.

IMO the PA has to give into one of the two major sticking points. immediate 50/50 revenue split or contract and arbitration lengths to get a deal done.

 

[Hutz]

The fact that owners are trying to clawback contracts (some of them being signed only days prior the the owners' lockout) is one of the major issues the players have with the league. It shows how dishonest and underhanded the owners are and the lack of good faith they show when dealing with players. The players stand for the principles of honesty and integrity, and are disgusted when they see what these owners try to do to them. People like to talk about replacement players, maybe instead it is time for replacement owners...

I'm still not clear on how the owners are trying to "claw back" their contracts. Perhaps someone can clear this up for me.

Just to be clear, I see them trying to reduce the total amount for all contracts combined, but I'm not clear on how any of their proposals impact individual contracts any differently than the last cba.

 

[ONO94]

The fact that owners are trying to clawback contracts (some of them being signed only days prior the the owners' lockout) is one of the major issues the players have with the league. It shows how dishonest and underhanded the owners are and the lack of good faith they show when dealing with players. The players stand for the principles of honesty and integrity, and are disgusted when they see what these owners try to do to them. People like to talk about replacement players, maybe instead it is time for replacement owners...

Of course the player's pushing for a signing bonus to be paid before the old CBA ends was done only with greatest of intentions and with the wish that no fans be distracted by the thoughts that Shea Weber would have to go hungry during the impending lockout....

 

[LadyStanley]

recap on today?

can someone provide a link or post Fehr's memo?

Psst -- check the stickied CBA news link only thread. Usually updated after there's news/release.

 

[ottawah]

Has Fehr ever used the term "delinkage" or something similar in his memos to the players?

Not to my knowledge, but thats sounds too much like the truth ......