Post-Game Talk: All Sid and Geno's fault. Sid and Geno lose, 3-4

[ColdStare]

Can we stop blaming the refs? The officiating is horrendous league-wide. They weren't out to get us, we just put ourselves in the position to lose. You guys sound like Flyers fans.

We got outplayed heavily for the vast majority of the game, yet again. No hunger, no desperation. Columbus wants this series, and they're actively going out and trying to get it. We're content, and expect to win, so we're not doing anything to work for it. This series could very, very easily be 3-1 Columbus. We've been the worse team for 95% of the series.

The crazy thing is that you could make the argument that the Pens could/should have been swept...

Other than last nights tieing goal (which I totally consider a lucky ass bounce for the BJ just like the first goal) and the horrible worst shot from another country OT goal...how do you think fleury has played all series? I'd say pretty damn well. Yes he might choke again and it might be time to look for a new goalie agreed. But to say he is def gonna suck the rest of the games is unreasonable. Fleury could just as easily come out and stand on his head and make you eat crow. Again might (and probably won't happen)...but you never know. Whole team sucks it's not just fleury. The whole teAm is a JOKE. Fleury has been peppered 2/4 games so far by huge **** margins...maybe play better D and it will never come down to a one goal game or score on the pp

Only in Pittsburgh is it normal to say that a goalie that has given up at least 3 goals in every game, has played well. That says a lot about where this team and goalie are right now. This is not playoff style hockey.

MAF should be sat because he royally ****** up but seeing how we zero legit back up goalies he probably won't.

Personally I would go with JZ anyway just to say "You can't make mistakes like this and just keep your job anyway" but that's just me.

The season is lost anyway, win or lose this series.(Tho I'm sure the organization would like to see some more playoff revenue)

Agree, Fleury doesn't deserve another chance. He's had his chances over the last 5 years and has crashed and burned in spectacular fashion.

 

[Shrimper]

The thing that annoys me most is the number of Giveaways;

Crosby - 8
Letang - 6

Are the two glaring numbers. Kunitz and Malkin have 3 each but 3 in 4 games isn't terrible especially when Malkin has 4 takeaways. Everyone else is 3 or under, a lot of players have contributed giveaways which is also worrying.

The highest player n the Blue Jackets is Savard with 3. The whole Columbus teams has 17 giveaways. Crosby and Letang alone have 14.

 

[RH710]

The crazy thing is that you could make the argument that the Pens could/should have been swept...



Only in Pittsburgh is it normal to say that a goalie that has given up at least 3 goals in every game, has played well. That says a lot about where this team and goalie are right now. This is not playoff style hockey.



Agree, Fleury doesn't deserve another chance. He's had his chances over the last 5 years and has crashed and burned in spectacular fashion.

This. It was as if some fans are saying that Fleury was spectacular and you can't expect a goalie to do so much. If he didn't let that one in from behind his net he would've been what? 38/40? That is great don't get me wrong but that is too much to ask from our goalie once? I see performances like that ALL the time in the playoffs. It's ridiculous.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

The thing that annoys me most is the number of Giveaways;

Crosby - 8
Letang - 6

Are the two glaring numbers. Kunitz and Malkin have 3 each but 3 in 4 games isn't terrible especially when Malkin has 4 takeaways. Everyone else is 3 or under, a lot of players have contributed giveaways which is also worrying.

The highest player n the Blue Jackets is Savard with 3. The whole Columbus teams has 17 giveaways. Crosby and Letang alone have 14.

If we had a real coach, Sid and Letang wouldn't turn the puck over that much. A real coach would make them play simple efficient hockey (and wouldn't ask his star-defender to use the stretch pass EVERY SINGLE TIME - I'm curious to know how many TOs are the direct result of a stretch pass). Sid plays carelessly outthere and that's worrying. He wasn't doing that before.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Fleury should never play for the Pittsburgh Penguins again. End of story. The regular season means nothing. He loses his mind in the playoffs. He should be done.

Yup. But he should never have played another game for us after the Philadelphia debacle. He should have never played another game for us after the Islanders debacle. And yet, the organization continues to stick by an overrated and extremely marginal goaltender, basically because he's a nice guy.

Zatkoff or Vokoun arent good options. Maybe give Zatkoff chance to gather experience and hope that he does good job. After this season get rid off Fleury. It might be pricey to do so, but it must be done.

The old NFL quarterback adage here applies: if you have 3 QB's, you really don't have any. Well, it's the same with our situation. But we simply cannot go back to Fleury at this point. He's done.

Why not Zatkoff? Maybe he'll be average in Game 5. Average should be good enough if he's CONSISTENTLY average...which is pretty much what he's been all year...save for perhaps his first two starts of the season.

Also, let's not forget...if Zatkoff or Vokoun starts, that gets the attention of the entire roster. A wake-up call is in order. If they simply go back to what they know, and that's Fleury, expect more listless, lifeless hockey.

 

[Rectify]

I say stick with Fleury all the way, it's not like we will win anything with JZ anyway. If Fleury continues to breakdown just sit back and enjoy knowing he is gone this summer, if by miracle he acts like an actual goalie maybe we win a series or two.

Nothing to lose at this point, lets see if he can pull something together.

Can we stop with the Letang contract talk? I thought it was a horrible signing when it happened but its not time to play captain hindsight and the "I told you so" game, thats just embarrassing. If he continued to look like a Norris worthy d-man it would have been worth it, obviously it didn't happen.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

It's easy to root for Columbus. It's refreshing to see a team bust their ***** and give it 110% every second of every game. Sure, there are times where they get out-skilled, but they haven't been out-hustled or out-worked for a second in this series. I remember when the Penguins played like they gave a ****. Now we're as pedestrian as I've ever seen a "Cup contender" in my life.

 

[Shrimper]

If we had a real coach, Sid and Letang wouldn't turn the puck over that much. A real coach would make them play simple efficient hockey (and wouldn't ask his star-defender to use the stretch pass EVERY SINGLE TIME - I'm curious to know how many TOs are the direct result of a stretch pass). Sid plays carelessly outthere and that's worrying. He wasn't doing that before.

It is clear though why certain defenceman are apparently annoyed with the timing "rule" that Bylsma has set to get the puck out. That is why there is so many turnovers mostly as they are rushing it and not thinking.

 

[ColePens]

It's easy to root for Columbus. It's refreshing to see a team bust their ***** and give it 110% every second of every game. Sure, there are times where they get out-skilled, but they haven't been out-hustled or out-worked for a second in this series. I remember when the Penguins played like they gave a ****. Now we're as pedestrian as I've ever seen a "Cup contender" in my life.

That is true about Columbus. I do not hate that team one bit. I actually love that they are busting their *****. 3-0 down and 2-1 down in the series after pissing away a game, they outshot the Pens some outrageous number I heard on the radio. I don't love their game, per sey, and believe they'll easily be taken out next round - but give them all the props in the world.

We talk about matchups... Columbus got the best match up they could have had. A team that doesn't match intensity because they feel they deserve playoff wins as opposed to earning them.

This would be the first series loss where I would root for their team going forward. I don't think I can often say that.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

I say stick with Fleury all the way, it's not like we will win anything with JZ anyway. If Fleury continues to breakdown just sit back and enjoy knowing he is gone this summer, if by miracle he acts like an actual goalie maybe we win a series or two.

Nothing to lose at this point, lets see if he can pul something together.

Can we stop with the Letang contract talk? I thought it was a horrible signing when it happened but its not time to play captain hindsight and the "I told you so" game, thats just embarrassing. If he continued to look like a Norris worthy d-man it would have been worth it, obviously it didn't happen.

He never looked like a legit Norris defenseman. He got some "thanks for showing up" votes, but never threatened to win the award. He's never been strong enough in all three zones to warrant his contract or the nomination, and his decision making has always been rookie level. Even when he's getting points on the PP, it never feels like he's very good at the point on the PP. His indecisiveness is awful, and his passing is BAD.

Not even in his best year has he been deserving of the deal Shero gave him, and the sooner we rid ourselves of Letang, the better, for a number of reasons.

 

[Fleury3434*]

Game one: BJ 34 shots;fleury 3 GA...game two: blue jackets: 45 shots; fleury 4 goals against. Game three (worst of the four so far): BJ 20 shots; fleury 3 GA...yesterday: BJ 46 shots; fleury 4 goals against.

WE ARE GETTING OWNED. Blame fleury all you want last night I agree he blew it could have been a 3-1 Series lead...but he has been getting PEPPERED. It's hilarious we are turning into leaf fans...blame the goalie for everything (even games fleury played very well for the amount of shots he faced). Play better defense and clear more guys from the net; yes if you give up 40+ shots in a game odds are you are gonna lose no matter what goalie is in net

 

[Jag68Sid87]

We talk about matchups... Columbus got the best match up they could have had. A team that doesn't match intensity because they feel they deserve playoff wins as opposed to earning them.

Not to mention a team with a goaltender that gives the Blue Jackets' pedestrian offense a fighting chance...even if their own goaltender doesn't stand on his head.

I think what is being completely overshadowed in this series is how mediocre Bobrovsky has looked...and Columbus is still well in this series. Nobody would have believed that before it began.

 

[Shrimper]

That is true about Columbus. I do not hate that team one bit. I actually love that they are busting their *****. 3-0 down and 2-1 down in the series after pissing away a game, they outshot the Pens some outrageous number I heard on the radio. I don't love their game, per sey, and believe they'll easily be taken out next round - but give them all the props in the world.

We talk about matchups... Columbus got the best match up they could have had. A team that doesn't match intensity because they feel they deserve playoff wins as opposed to earning them.

This would be the first series loss where I would root for their team going forward. I don't think I can often say that.

After we scored our 3rd goal the shots were I think judging by the quick look I gave it 36-18 in Columbus's favour.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

It is clear though why certain defenceman are apparently annoyed with the timing "rule" that Bylsma has set to get the puck out. That is why there is so many turnovers mostly as they are rushing it and not thinking.

Yeah, that timing rule is stupid. It doesn't matter how "fast" you get out of the zone once you get the puck, what matters is HOW you get out of the zone. Sure, the quicker the better, but if there are no options, you have to be patient, not force something.

Like in soccer, you can and HAVE to retreat if there is nothing, that's what good teams do, they control the play and create their chances methodically. Controlled break outs are VERY VERY important yet we suck at it. That's on coaching. At this level, anyone can execute a proper break out if thought properly. Give them no real structure and guys like Letang and Crosby will try plays that aren't there. Sid wasn't making blind passes on every shift when playing for Mike Babcock at the olympics.

 

[wolffy66]

It's easy to root for Columbus. It's refreshing to see a team bust their ***** and give it 110% every second of every game. Sure, there are times where they get out-skilled, but they haven't been out-hustled or out-worked for a second in this series. I remember when the Penguins played like they gave a ****. Now we're as pedestrian as I've ever seen a "Cup contender" in my life.

SOOO THIS.
Before they actually won the cup. That team fought, scraped, hit, hustled, and never gave up no matter the score. And they were one of the most fun teams I've ever followed. WTF happened. This team is the total opposite of that squad.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I really don't know if there is one single solitary person in the entire organization that cares enough to turn things around. Or has any sort of belief that they are anything other than how they have been playing for the better part of 5 seasons -- which is to say like petulant losers.

I used to think that Crosby and Malkin, at least, had that belief. But I think they are just... tired. Years and years of being beat down by scatterbrained, often counter-intuitive lineups being put together and managed night after night by a guy who is clearly out of his depth will take it's toll. It really, really will. I'm not trying to excuse these guys but, I mean... I understand.

If all of this sounds like common sense... maybe it is. I know I shouldn't be surprised. I've been calling it this way literally for years, now. But I always had that hope and belief that I was wrong and that they would find a way to prove me wrong. I am no longer burdened by that internal debate.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

He never looked like a legit Norris defenseman. He got some "thanks for showing up" votes, but never threatened to win the award. He's never been strong enough in all three zones to warrant his contract or the nomination, and his decision making has always been rookie level. Even when he's getting points on the PP, it never feels like he's very good at the point on the PP. His indecisiveness is awful, and his passing is BAD.

Not even in his best year has he been deserving of the deal Shero gave him, and the sooner we rid ourselves of Letang, the better, for a number of reasons.

And, the thing about Letang is he used to be valuable because he provided this team with creative offense. He used to be one of the guys we counted on for offense. Probably our third-best offensive threat. Sure, he would leech points off the PP and off the superstars in general, but he used to also be a game-breaking type offensive player from the back. If he's not that player, then the rest of the package is nowhere near worth his contract. Not even close.

Game one: BJ 34 shots;fleury 3 GA...game two: blue jackets: 45 shots; fleury 4 goals against. Game three (worst of the four so far): BJ 20 shots; fleury 3 GA...yesterday: BJ 46 shots; fleury 4 goals against.

WE ARE GETTING OWNED. Blame fleury all you want last night I agree he blew it could have been a 3-1 Series lead...but he has been getting PEPPERED. It's hilarious we are turning into leaf fans...blame the goalie for everything (even games fleury played very well for the amount of shots he faced). Play better defense and clear more guys from the net; yes if you give up 40+ shots in a game odds are you are gonna lose no matter what goalie is in net

Who in the blue hell is ONLY blaming Fleury? The entire six defenseman corps has sucked balls since Game 1. All of them. There is major venom spewed towards the General Manager for this monstrosity of a roster. The coach? Well, obviously he gets villified nightly. And now Crosby is getting it, too.

But go ahead and continue to think Fleury is being scapegoated here. Plenty of blame to go around. But the only CONSTANT since '09 has been these two things:

- Bylsma has been out-coached

- Fleury has not made the save

 

[Fleury3434*]

Game one: fleury .912 save percentage on 34 shots...game two: .911 save percentage on 45 shots...game 3: fleury .850 save percentage on 20 shots (still won)...game 4 : fleury .913 save percentage on 46 shots (blew it in last min choked hard)...

But to say those game are "average"? I'd def say he's been playing well...to say he's "done" might be true...but it might not be; maybe he can pull another great performance you have no idea it goes both ways. But of course no one will be convinced until it happens which I totally understand and honestly I won't be either haha

Had to put the save percentages cause based on the comments I'm Not even sure some of you are smart enough to do basic math so I made it easy for you

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Game one: fleury .912 save percentage on 34 shots...game two: .911 save percentage on 45 shots...game 3: fleury .850 save percentage on 20 shots (still won)...game 4 : fleury .913 save percentage on 46 shots (blew it in last min choked hard)...

But to say those game are "average"? I'd def say he's been playing well...to say he's "done" might be true...but it might not be; maybe he can pull another great performance you have no idea it goes both ways. But of course no one will be convinced until it happens which I totally understand and honestly I won't be either haha

Just stop.

 

[joeyjake5]

Every one says don't blame the refs for the loss. Ok fine, even though the refs put their whistles away, the pens minus fleury should still have won the game 3-2.

You say the refs don't affect the outcome of the game.
Here is an example. In the flyer series, Briere scores a goal when he was clearly offside. They go on to win the game in OT. Next game, I believe the Pens were up either 2-1 or 3-1 and on the power play. Bryz makes a fantastic save on Letang, Letang gets crosschecked. A penalty is called on the Fly D and Letang for embellishing. The pens should have had a 5 on 3 but the refs wanted to give the Flies a chance and they took advantage the same as last night.

The REFS affect the outcomes of games PERIOD.

 

[Fleury3434*]

Just stop.

I'm adding to the conversation by giving stats. If you are goin to say just stop tell me why my stats and logic are wrong at least. I mean I admitted fleury ****ed up big time last night and cost a 3-1 series lead. But explain why he sucks? Cause stats say different this series

 

[Rectify]

He never looked like a legit Norris defenseman. He got some "thanks for showing up" votes, but never threatened to win the award. He's never been strong enough in all three zones to warrant his contract or the nomination, and his decision making has always been rookie level. Even when he's getting points on the PP, it never feels like he's very good at the point on the PP. His indecisiveness is awful, and his passing is BAD.

Not even in his best year has he been deserving of the deal Shero gave him, and the sooner we rid ourselves of Letang, the better, for a number of reasons.

In 11-12 he looked to be on the path of someone worthy of the contract. Again, in his situation you had to pay for potential which was still there at that point. I wish we would have traded him and got solid pieces for Crosby, but again, hindsight is 20/20.

And, the thing about Letang is he used to be valuable because he provided this team with creative offense. He used to be one of the guys we counted on for offense. Probably our third-best offensive threat. Sure, he would leech points off the PP and off the superstars in general, but he used to also be a game-breaking type offensive player from the back. If he's not that player, then the rest of the package is nowhere near worth his contract. Not even close.

Exactly, well put.

 

[PensBandwagonerNo272*]

Not only is MAF not average, he is the worst playoff goaltender since we won the Cup (at which time he was average).

 

[Will Hunting]

The refs had nothing to do with this loss. We tried to protect a 3-0 lead for ~50 mins.
We play 10 minutes a game. Last night it was the first 10, Monday night it was close to the last 10.

The Better team won last night. Not the better team on paper, the better team on the ice. And it is becoming painfully obvious.

No. It looked like we were pushing for that 4th goal, Columbus was almost done at that moment. We should´ve had a long 5-on-3 to make it 4-0 and then the refs completely changed the momentum of the game with Kunitz´s call especially and then the Neal´s call (Wiz was diving there, if you call it one way, call it the other way too). The 2nd period penalties sucked but I can understand why they were called. The refs didn´t make it any easier for us, I think it´s fair to leave it at this. I fully expect some calls in our way in our home arena. Columbus has his historical win, so enough of this nonsense..

 

[WayneSid9987]

I really don't know if there is one single solitary person in the entire organization that cares enough to turn things around. Or has any sort of belief that they are anything other than how they have been playing for the better part of 5 seasons -- which is to say like petulant losers.

I used to think that Crosby and Malkin, at least, had that belief. But I think they are just... tired. Years and years of being beat down by scatterbrained, often counter-intuitive lineups being put together and managed night after night by a guy who is clearly out of his depth will take it's toll. It really, really will. I'm not trying to excuse these guys but, I mean... I understand.

For me, that is the hope atleast. I'm hoping they're just depressed cuz they've finally realized they've waisted 2 more years since the 2012 **** show where changes should've been made.

I'm gonna give up when/if they're clearing out thier lockers and they continue to back Shero/Bylsma.