All purpose trade/roster building thread the 13th

[CanesFanBudMan]

In a heartbeat, with one caveat. Would want to ensure that Stamkos can recover and not have lingering injury concerns.

This year his salary is high, but it drops to $7.5M, $6.5M, and $6.5M in the last 3 years which is very reasonable. It's heavily signing bonus laden which may not be palatable to Dundon and co. though.

Imagine the PP with Dougie at the point, Stamkos lined up for the 1 timer, Svech in front/behind the net, and Aho and TT feeding these guys the puck.

If he is healthy, I think it would take a lot more than that to get him though, as other teams (NYR, DET) could offer more. He'd also have to want to waive his NMC to come here.

If I’m Stamkos and Tampa comes to me asking to waive... I don’t know if I laugh at them or tell them to f*** themselves before I say no

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

If I’m Stamkos and Tampa comes to me asking to waive... I don’t know if I laugh at them or tell them to f*** themselves before I say no

Possibly, but guys don't want to be where they aren't wanted so you never know. I was 100% convinced there was zero chance Skinner would accept a trade to Buffalo. Yeah, it was close to home but they were the worst team in the NHL and he had 1 year left on his contract so didn't see him going to a bottom dweller like that. Of course, I was wrong.

A team on the upswing like NYR could be very appealing. His old GM could say he could be the centerpiece of their return to greatness in Detroit. etc... He may tell TB to stick it also. A lot of times a NMC is more about controlling when and where you go, not about never moving. I just don't know enough about Stamkos to say one way or another.

Either way, like I said, it would take a lot more to get him than just Trochek and I think there are probably other destinations more desirable, who can offer more.

I think the chances of Stamkos leaving TB are slim, and if he does, I think the chances of him coming here are very slim. I was just answering the question posed by PK17 if I would make the trade.

 

[CanesFanBudMan]

Possibly, but guys don't want to be where they aren't wanted so you never know. I was 100% convinced there was zero chance Skinner would accept a trade to Buffalo. Yeah, it was close to home but they were the worst team in the NHL and he had 1 year left on his contract so didn't see him going to a bottom dweller like that. Of course, I was wrong.

A team on the upswing like NYR could be very appealing. His old GM could say he could be the centerpiece of their return to greatness in Detroit. etc... He may tell TB to stick it also. A lot of times a NMC is more about controlling when and where you go, not about never moving. I just don't know enough about Stamkos to say one way or another.

Either way, like I said, it would take a lot more to get him than just Trochek and I think there are probably other destinations more desirable, who can offer more.

I think the chances of Stamkos leaving TB are slim, and if he does, I think the chances of him coming here are very slim. I was just answering the question posed by PK17 if I would make the trade.

He may take the high road, but if they came looking to trade me off the best team in the NHL halfway through my contract where I took 2mm less per year than I could have gotten I would not. Especially considering he hasn’t underperformed too much unless you count injuries

 

[Chrispy]

Would anybody do a deal centered around Trocheck for Stamkos? Moving him would certainly help Tampa resign their RFA’s. We’d also have a legit 40 goal caliber 2 C locked down for years.

Sure, but I doubt that is what Tampa wants. They need cap relief while still trying to compete, and that's something Carolina cannot provide at $8.5M right now.

I think they'd start the demands with Necas and ask for more, probably this year's first and a young D.

 

[CanesFanBudMan]

Sure, but I doubt that is what Tampa wants. They need cap relief while still trying to compete, and that's something Carolina cannot provide at $8.5M right now.

I think they'd start the demands with Necas and ask for more, probably this year's first and a young D.

Someone will do something stupid - let it not be us

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

He may take the high road, but if they came looking to trade me off the best team in the NHL halfway through my contract where I took 2mm less per year than I could have gotten I would not. Especially considering he hasn’t underperformed too much unless you count injuries

I'm not so sure that's really true. I'm no tax attorney, but was told that signing bonuses are paid in the state/local province you live in. Therefore, Stamkos received $8.5M / year for the first 4 years of the deal in SB and $1M in base salary. With Florida having zero income tax, going to Toronto or NY would have been much higher. That alone is more than $1M/year in tax savings alone (if the signing bonus statement is true).

Like I said though, I think the chances are slim that he'll be moved. Whether it be because he won't waive, the team really doesn't want to move him, or there isn't a good deal in this environment, I don't think it will happen.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

If they are against the wall and want to sell Palat cheap, I’d be all over that.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Possibly, but guys don't want to be where they aren't wanted so you never know. I was 100% convinced there was zero chance Skinner would accept a trade to Buffalo. Yeah, it was close to home but they were the worst team in the NHL and he had 1 year left on his contract so didn't see him going to a bottom dweller like that. Of course, I was wrong.

I’m not right about player movement type things very often, but I had that one clocked and you and MANY others disagreed. Nice of you to throw yourself under the bus but it was like a 90/10 split here about that topic.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

I’m not right about player movement type things very often, but I had that one clocked and you and MANY others disagreed. Nice of you to throw yourself under the bus but it was like a 90/10 split here about that topic.

Those who knew the Skinner situation well (and there weren’t many on this board) realized that he would waive but he absolutely wanted to be close to his home in the GTA.

Ive mentioned it before but I’m friends with Jeff’s cousin and know his extended family a bit. They are a very close knit group. I don’t know how big the radius is that Jeff was willing to go to but as can be evidenced by him willing to go to a terrible Buffalo team, it was all based on geography and not on team competitiveness.

Obviously Toronto and Buffalo were the two clear choices but Toronto didn’t have the space or maybe interest to make that deal work. Maybe Ottawa, MTL, Detroit were also in the mix. I’m not sure. I can tell you though that over the last year some of Jeff’s extended family have moved to the Niagara on the Lake area so that is even closer to Buffalo. I don’t know if that’s a coincidence or not and I don’t know if his immediate family did but that’s what I can tell you.

Now I’d say this was a peculiar circumstance regarding trade destinations and waiving an NTC but as mentioned by @Boom Boom Apathy its often about control and not about specific destinations. In Jeff’s case it was specific, with Stamkos who knows.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

If Wennberg is bought out, I would definitely take a strong look at him. Would be a much better fit in our system than in Torts. Maybe move Trocheck up to the 1st line to balance out faceoffs for the Aho line.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

To me, I accepted that Skinner wanted to be close to home, but I thought (incorrectly), that since he was only under contract for 1 year before he was a UFA, I thought he'd want to go to a contender to FINALLY make the playoffs. After a year he would then sign a long term UFA deal "closer to home".

It was the 1 year thing that surprised me with him waiving his NMC.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

If they are against the wall and want to sell Palat cheap, I’d be all over that.

Yeah I really like Palat and think he'd fit in really well with Aho/TT, allowing us to play Svech with Tro and Necas. I'd be incredibly happy with that top 6. Would need to move Nino though, and depends on what TB would be asking in return for Palat -- their cap crunch helps lower the price quite a bit.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Yeah I really like Palat and think he'd fit in really well with Aho/TT, allowing us to play Svech with Tro and Necas. I'd be incredibly happy with that top 6. Would need to move Nino though, and depends on what TB would be asking in return for Palat -- their cap crunch helps lower the price quite a bit.

I thnk we would see a Dzingel move this off-season. Potentially a nino move next off-season. Multi year deals will be very hard to move this off-season, especially under-performing ones.

 

[AD Skinner]

I'm not so sure that's really true. I'm no tax attorney, but was told that signing bonuses are paid in the state/local province you live in.

But did you follow your dreams into taxidermy

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

But did you follow your dreams into taxidermy

Boom Boom look at him go, with a fresh cup of joe!

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

But did you follow your dreams into taxidermy

Free meat!

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Now I have Tara Tara stuck in my head thanks AD

 

[emptyNedder]

but I thought (incorrectly), that since he was only under contract for 1 year before he was a UFA, I thought he'd want to go to a contender to FINALLY make the playoffs. After a year he would then sign a long term UFA deal "closer to home".

At the time Buffalo was consider at least a contender—especially after adding Skinner. And realistically, they played like it for a while—didn't they win 10 straight in Nov/Dec?

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

At the time Buffalo was consider at least a contender—especially after adding Skinner. And realistically, they played like it for a while—didn't they win 10 straight in Nov/Dec?

I think that's revisionist history because of how they started.

At the time of the trade, they were by no means considered contenders or even a playoff team. Maybe a bubble team at best by a few people (but not most) as they weren't going to beat out Boston, TB or Toronto for sure in the Atlantic.
That off-season, they had come off of a 62 point season, just got the 1st OA pick, lost ROR, E. Kane and Lehner. Yes, they added Skinner, Dahlin and a couple of 3rd liners in Sobotka and Berglund, but even AFTER the trade, HF boards poll had them at 25th in the NHL and more importantly, Vegas betting odds had them at 24th with an 80.5 over/under for total points.

Before Skinner went there, they were not seen as a contender and even after he went there, they really weren't. They started off hot but IIRC, it was a lot of 1 goal and OT games and a lot of people predicted they'd come back down to earth. I could be wrong on this last part though, but I seem to recall it and am too lazy to go look.

 

[emptyNedder]

I think that's revisionist history because of how they started.

but even AFTER the trade, HF boards poll had them at 25th in the NHL and more importantly, Vegas betting odds had them at 24th with an 80.5 over/under for total points.

Fair points. Still, I don't see it as unreasonable that Skinner thought playing with Eichel might greatly increase Buffalo's overall competitiveness.

So you were right about Buffalo being contenders! Don't be so hard on yourself.

 

[WreckingCrew]

Yeah I really like Palat and think he'd fit in really well with Aho/TT, allowing us to play Svech with Tro and Necas. I'd be incredibly happy with that top 6. Would need to move Nino though, and depends on what TB would be asking in return for Palat -- their cap crunch helps lower the price quite a bit.

I'd probably even settle for Killorn. If those guys waive to come here would they then NOT need to be protected for the ED? Definitely something to consider

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Fair points. Still, I don't see it as unreasonable that Skinner thought playing with Eichel might greatly increase Buffalo's overall competitiveness.

So you were right about Buffalo being contenders! Don't be so hard on yourself.

Again, Skinner went to Buffalo because of proximity to Toronto. I’m sure the idea of playing with Eichel was nice but to think it was the motivating factor or the Sabres being a contender is twisting things.

Let’s put it this way, if Buffalo wasn’t interested and Ottawa was I’m 100% he’d be a senator right now and that has nothing to do with being competitive.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Again, Skinner went to Buffalo because of proximity to Toronto. I’m sure true idea of playing with Eichel was nice but to think it was the motivating factor or the Sabres being a contender is twisting things.

Let’s put it this way, if Buffalo wasn’t interested and Ottawa was I’m 100% he’d be a senator right now and that has nothing to do with being competitive.

Yeah that's true. I think you might be missing a bit of what I am trying to say though. I agree that in the end, it was only about being near home. My point was that I (and others) knew he preferred to play near home, so that wasn't really in question back then, as you and others had stated it. The assumption I made (which was incorrect), was that since he was a UFA in only 1 year (at the time of the trade), the he might want to play for a contender for 1 year so he could get in the playoffs and then sign with a team near home after that. After all, if he wasn't traded at all, he'd be far from home in Carolina for that 1 year anyhow so 1 year at another contending team vs. 1 year in Carolina didn't seem like a big deal to me. Clearly, that that assumption was wrong.

Not that any of it matters in the end though.

The point of this whole discussion is that we don't always know why guys will or won't waive their NMC for certain teams so we can't assume Stamkos (or T. Johnson) won't for sure.

 

[A Star is Burns]

Seravalli on Insider Trading said we inquired about Fleury seemingly from the laundering him and keeping some money on the books aspect as he passes to another team. They are still thinking a 2nd rounder and Canes/other teams are thinking 1st + 2nd given that the money/cap would be on the books for two years.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Am I out to lunch here or does getting a starting goalie at half his cap hit and a 2nd round pick for nothing seem like a gift horse we shouldn't look in the mouth?