Rumor: All purpose Kessel trade rumours thread

[Trapper]

I don't think there are many suitors for Kessel and for that reason, the Leafs may not get as much in return as they hope

The Leafs are not in the driver seat right now. Their the ones who need to unload Kessel so they can start their rebuild and not turn this into the situation that has been occuring in Vancouver

Kessel may be untradeable simply due to the fact that they will never get back the return they believe they should get. Or even the return people here think he should get.
If I was a GM, I'd make you a good offer, but never great one for Kessel and his contract.
I'd offer you the first and Gardiner/Kadri, but you'd simply never get Rielly/Marner/Nylander from me. Ever.

 

[FlareKnight]

I don't think there are many suitors for Kessel and for that reason, the Leafs may not get as much in return as they hope

The Leafs are not in the driver seat right now. Their the ones who need to unload Kessel so they can start their rebuild and not turn this into the situation that has been occuring in Vancouver

If it comes down to it, just rebuild with him on the roster. It's not like the Leafs can't suck with Kessel in the lineup. If they can't get anything worth getting then there is no point.

I'm not sure how much they really need to unload him. It'd help the rebuild to do so, but if they can't get anything worthwhile then it won't. Wait until he has a good stat year again and try once more.

 

[pspot]

Same thing happened with Nash before he was dealt

 

[Canada4Gold]

Cap space is cap space lol, they wouldn't be able to fit Kessel during the offseason without getting rid of that contract.

But Pronger wasn't taking up cap space during the year because having him on LTIR gave them more in the amount of his contract. So no he wasn't taking up any cap space during the season. Him leaving doesn't clear room as now they won't be allowed to go over the cap by the amount of his contract

 

[hfdshdh]

Flyers fan here.... Yes we cleared cap but Hextall has said repeatedly he will not sacrifice the future. Voracek's contact comes to an end this season, he is going to get PAID... There is no way the Flyers can afford Phil Kessel, unless Leafs take bad contracts (Andrew MacDonald and Vinny) and I still think I'd be highly unlikely given it will take a lot more than that...

Thanks for the info. The Philadelphia rumours did strike me as kind of odd.

Maybe if Holmgren were still GM.

 

[colchar]

I don't think there are many suitors for Kessel and for that reason, the Leafs may not get as much in return as they hope

The Leafs are not in the driver seat right now. Their the ones who need to unload Kessel so they can start their rebuild and not turn this into the situation that has been occuring in Vancouver

They do not need to do anything. If they don't get their asking price they can hold onto him until they do.

 

[Ovate]

Then you probably never saw Pouliot play for Portland. Such a good puck moving dman future pp QB. I'll take him any day.

CHL defenseman of the year and AHL Rookie Defenseman leader in PPG. Is he Seth Jones? No. But he's as good of a defenseman as we can hope for in a Kessel trade.

 

[Durrr]

But Pronger wasn't taking up cap space during the year because having him on LTIR gave them more in the amount of his contract. So no he wasn't taking up any cap space during the season. Him leaving doesn't clear room as now they won't be allowed to go over the cap by the amount of his contract

You can only go over the cap by 10% in the off season, which is basically his cap hit minus a bit. This means they couldn't actually go over much at all in the offseason without shedding it.

 

[Glenn Isildur Healy]

Kessel may be untradeable simply due to the fact that they will never get back the return they believe they should get. Or even the return people here think he should get.
If I was a GM, I'd make you a good offer, but never great one for Kessel and his contract.
I'd offer you the first and Gardiner/Kadri, but you'd simply never get Rielly/Marner/Nylander from me. Ever.

Exactly. I'll never give you Rielly/Marner/Nylander (a team's elite prospects) but rather the good to very good prospects a tier lower. If I'm being offered Pouliet + 1st round pick + Cap Dump + another lower tier prospect for Kessel, I'm seriously considering it. I think Pouliot is a slight tier below our top prospects so he's the type of prospect I'm looking at

There simply aren't enough suitors to drum up a bidding war for Kessel.

 

[Canada4Gold]

You can only go over the cap by 10% in the off season, which is basically his cap hit minus a bit. This means they couldn't actually go over much at all in the offseason without shedding it.

yes, and this would help a little, but during the season would be the major concern and getting rid of Pronger doesn't save them any cap room to have Kessel on their team during the season.

 

[jaric1862]

Kessel for STL's 2016 1st,Oshie,Fabbri, Maybe Another prospect (Barbashev)

Then flip Oshie to Pittsburgh for something involving there first rounder and some prospects

Leafs get two firsts and some good prospects, this is just one route more quantity and thinking that your gonna hit on someone.

or they can try and get some young stud straight up for kessel (Maata,Jones,etc), i dont think there gonna be able to pull this but i could definietly Get a few stud prospect to turn into young studs (Pouliot type)

 

[con310*]

Burke ended up surrendering 2 X top 10 picks including a #2 overall and a high 2nd rounder and now the Leafs are unable to get even a single top 10 pick in return for their sniper who is regularly a PPG player.

Offers include cap dumps and salary retention requests just to try and extract a prospect here or there from teams.

Even Burkie who loves Kessel wouldn't offer up a Sam Bennett or draft pick package. Flames had no problem offering 1st and 2nds for Doug Hamilton who was only a part of the Kessel trade and not the biggest part which was Seguin.

Had Flames offered Bennett a former top 5 pick + 15th overall + 2nd for Kessel he would be a Flame right now. However they realize he is not worth anything close to the cost that Leafs paid and have no interest in making a similar mistake again.

Leafs are going to struggle finding a trade destination for Kessel and get anything remotely close to what they paid for him.

Well that's what happens when not only you tell everyone your going to rebuild and trade said player but you trade him during a massive off year. Why would any team give full value when they know they don't have to?

 

[Beleafer4]

As a leafs fan,

Kessel

for

Kunitz, Sutter, Pouliot, 2016 1st

would do it for me. You add a core piece, make the salary work, and we get a strong young defenseman, a late first and some assets we can parlay at the TDL

 

[stakesishigh]

CHL defenseman of the year and AHL Rookie Defenseman leader in PPG. Is he Seth Jones? No. But he's as good of a defenseman as we can hope for in a Kessel trade.

Agreed.

I'd definitely be interested in Pouliot as the foundation for a Kessel deal but I'm hoping for a little bit more than the rumoured offer.

 

[slozo]

If Kessel were able to get more . . . we wouldn't be trying to deal him folks. This is the reality of having signed a long term expensive contract for a player that we ended up severely overpaying for with our draft picks. Three years ago I was ok with Kessel . . . I can't wait to see him leave now.

I think the Pittsburgh deal can be good, if we throw a bit of sweetness in there with Phil - a young D - and then switch out Pouliot for Maatta, see if that gets it done. If it doesn't work, then it's Pouliot (plus the other pieces and the 1st from 2016) + a decent prospect.

Hopefully someone else chimes in to beat the Pens deal . . . Shanahan did say there were 2 firm offers. on the table. I am just wondering . . . if it wasn't Florida or the Sharks . . . then who could that have been?

 

[Glenn Isildur Healy]

If it comes down to it, just rebuild with him on the roster. It's not like the Leafs can't suck with Kessel in the lineup. If they can't get anything worth getting then there is no point.

I'm not sure how much they really need to unload him. It'd help the rebuild to do so, but if they can't get anything worthwhile then it won't. Wait until he has a good stat year again and try once more.

You're not really rebuilding if you're keeping your core players like Kessel. This team needs to scrotch this core to bits.

I love Kessel but he needs a new start with a new team. I'd rather just get it over and trade him rather than running the risk of his value getting even lower playing on this crummy team. The longer you wait, the more teams realize how desperate you are to trade him. Ala Roberto Luongo

 

[The CyNick]

The good news to me is there are offers that dont require us eating Kessel salary. Thats a win in my view.

 

[JackJ]

If it comes down to it, just rebuild with him on the roster. It's not like the Leafs can't suck with Kessel in the lineup. If they can't get anything worth getting then there is no point.

I'm not sure how much they really need to unload him. It'd help the rebuild to do so, but if they can't get anything worthwhile then it won't. Wait until he has a good stat year again and try once more.

Teams aren't swallowing an 8m contract during the season. According to the current regime, the offseason is the time to move these types of contracts.

 

[Trapper]

Exactly. I'll never give you Rielly/Marner/Nylander (a team's elite prospects) but rather the good to very good prospects a tier lower. If I'm being offered Pouliet + 1st round pick + Cap Dump + another lower tier prospect for Kessel, I'm seriously considering it. I think Pouliot is a slight tier below our top prospects so he's the type of prospect I'm looking at

There simply aren't enough suitors to drum up a bidding war for Kessel.

Rick Nash:
Dubinsky/Anisimov/1st round pick/Erixon

Bobby Ryan:
1st round pick/Silfverberg/Noesen

Which player in these deals is Jones/Matta etc?

Sometimes you get very lucky but you have to take the unknown like in the case of Voracek. Nobody knew what he was going to be when he was traded.

So looking at these deals:
1st round pick/Sutter/Pouliot/cap dump would be right on target.

 

[Tak7]

Rick Nash:
Dubinsky/Anisimov/1st round pick/Erixon

Bobby Ryan:
1st round pick/Silfverberg/Noesen

Which player in these deals is Jones/Matta etc?

Sometimes you get very lucky but you have to take the unknown like in the case of Voracek. Nobody knew what he was going to be when he was traded.

So looking at these deals:
1st round pick/Sutter/Pouliot/cap dump would be right on target.

A 1st & a prospect (or two top young assets) is the starting point for Kessel.

Your possible deal is in the right vein.

 

[slozo]

The good news to me is there are offers that dont require us eating Kessel salary. Thats a win in my view.

Yes! I second that.
I was starting to think that maybe we were either going to have to take on some terrible cap dump (a la Semin) or, retain some salary. Thank goodness we don't have to.

Frankly, the more I think of it, the more I think the Pens deal is quite decent. Hopefully the Pens crap the bed next year, and make that first a lottery pick (but that's obviously dreaming . . .)

 

[Mess]

A 1st & a prospect (or two top young assets) is the starting point for Kessel.

Your possible deal is in the right vein.

If you add Kessel and his 40+ goals on the wing with a team with Crosby and Malkin then I would expect that 1st round pick to be in the 25-30ish range.

Your not looking at top 10 and lottery pick selection here.

 

[Trapper]

If you add Kessel and his 40+ goals on the wing with a team with Crosby and Malkin then I would expect that 1st round pick to be in the 25-30ish range.

Your not looking at top 10 and lottery pick selection here.

Unfortunately Pittsburgh picked this year to give away their 1st to Edmonton.
Because Barzal/Pouliot is something I would have been all over.

 

[slozo]

If you add Kessel and his 40+ goals on the wing with a team with Crosby and Malkin then I would expect that 1st round pick to be in the 25-30ish range.

Your not looking at top 10 and lottery pick selection here.

But you're forgetting some things here Mess, namely:
- Kessel has never scored 40 goals. He's a consistent 35 goal scorer, who didn't hit 30 this year
- the Pens weak point this year was goaltending and defence, not scoring
- in any deal involving Kessel, the Pens lose a decent d-man (Pouliot, say)

All things being equal, and trying to tone down the Pens fanboys projecting 50 goal seasons from Phil while playing with Malkin or Crosby . . . adding a defensive liability on forward, even one as offensively gifted as Phil, and taking away a good d-man . . . may kind of cancel each other out. You never know, until you know . . . you know?

 

[Just Rude]

Burke ended up surrendering 2 X top 10 picks including a #2 overall and a high 2nd rounder and now the Leafs are unable to get even a single top 10 pick in return for their sniper who is regularly a PPG player.

Kessel was not traded for "two top ten picks, including the #2 overall." That isn't how the deal was made. Talk about hyperbole.

You are arguing apples and oranges. We did not hold the #2 pick in the draft, and trade it for Phil Kessel, nor did we hold the #9 overall the following year and trade it for Phil Kessel.

If a team made a trade for Kessel tomorrow, and it included a #1 pick, how do we know, as unlikely as it would be, that it would not turn into a top 10?

Did you see what I did there?

Leafs are going to struggle finding a trade destination for Kessel and get anything remotely close to what they paid for him.

Well, yeah, if you are looking at getting the #2 and #9 overall for him. But if you are looking at what the Leafs originally paid, which was two firsts and a second, I think the return will be similar (which could mean a first round pick and a prospect picked in the first round).

You are looking at it as Burke gave up Tyler Seguin and Dougie Hamilton for Phil Kessel.

He didn't.