Post-Game Talk: All aboard the Jurco hype train

[GhostfaceWu]

Because they effectively created a plethora of offensive opportunities.

Everyone was pushing the pace in a positive direction. Nurse alone created more scoring chances than anyone in the game. Bear and Manning were on for both of our goals and none against. I also give a ton more leeway to vets in pre season than I do to young players looking to make an impression.

What? Where and when did they create a plethora of offensive opportunities? Nurse had 1 rush where that could be relevent except he did what he usually does turns an odd man rush that could have been a 2 on 1 if he passed the puck earlier or drove the net but he did his usual skate on the outside and go around the net and try to sauce a pass in front between 2 Jets players. On the other hand Samorukov hit a post and would have had a primary assist if the Canuck player didn't dive in front of the tap in pass during the 2nd. Oh and Bouchard set up Mcleod for a tap in goal that hit the post and yet you finished watching that game actually thinking Nurse/Larsson created an abunance of offensive opportunities.

 

[CupofOil]

I don’t think he did anything to stand out. Walked the line a bit, shot it into some shin-pads and sticks. Nobody was moving the puck well or creating good looks.

Yes somebody did give life to the PP, Samorukov.

 

[alphahelix]

Draisaitl has more NHL goals in the last 3 seasons than Burdasov has goals in his entire KHL career (10+ years). Burdasov has 0 NHL goals. What are the chances this dude has a top 10 shot in the NHL? I’m guessing it matches his number of career NHL goals. 0. He averages less than 10 goals a year in his career including international play and juniors. This guy is going to be the next Ovechkin. I’m so excited!

 

[MessierII]

This is interesting. I realize many would look at it the opposite way, but I see it as more realistic as vets have earned their spot and have to be beaten out of positions if they ever lose them. The boards, being hf (i.e. prospects driven) has such a heavy bias on prospects that I think its balanced counter comment to attend to the bolded.

The reality is rooks have to beat out incumbents. This reality rarely seems on display here.

Just yesterday somebody was saying that Gagner was setting the lowbar for all of Jurko, Benson, and Nygard to improve on. With it assumed they would be improvements. Jurko is showing something, that's it so far.

Another strong bias is "sick of this player" related. Thus why a player like Gagner gets so much scorn here, seemingly because of reminding posters of really bad times. Eberle faced the same here. I mean theres a lot of people here that even liked the Eberle for Strome and Strome for Spooner trades because its just new livebodies coming in that people don't have established bias about. Pervasive grass is greener sentiment always evident here.

Reality is these games nothing to the Nurses and Larssons of the world. If your Darnell Nurse making 3 million dollars this year in a contract year are you going balls out in a pre season game? Not a chance. For guys like that these games are to get your timing on point, get into a rhythm, learn your coaches system and expectations, get your conditioning to where it needs to be and get a feel for your teammates.

For guys like Bouchard, Benson and co this is your game 7. You need to leave everything on the ice and make the coach pick you over the other multitude of players jockeying for position. You have to look at these players through a different lens. Some of these fringe guys will never play at a higher level in their lives than NHL pre season. That’s why I’ve always enjoyed it so much. I usually attend a couple if I can. I’m going to one next week and can’t wait.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Reality is these games nothing to the Nurses and Larssons of the world. If your Darnell Nurse making 3 million dollars this year in a contract year are you going balls out in a pre season game? Not a chance. For guys like that these games are to get your timing on point, get into a rhythm, learn your coaches system and expectations, get your conditioning to where it needs to be and get a feel for your teammates.

For guys like Bouchard, Benson and co this is your game 7. You need to leave everything on the ice and make the coach pick you over the other multitude of players jockeying for position. You have to look at these players through a different lens. Some of these fringe guys will never play at a higher level in their lives than NHL pre season. That’s why I’ve always enjoyed it so much. I usually attend a couple if I can. I’m going to one next week and can’t wait.

Did Larsson forget to play defense cause he wasn’t going all out?

 

[MessierII]

What? Where and when did they create a plethora of offensive opportunities? Nurse had 1 rush where that could be relevent except he did what he usually does turns an odd man rush that could have been a 2 on 1 if he passed the puck earlier or drove the net but he did his usual skate on the outside and go around the net and try to sauce a pass in front between 2 Jets players. On the other hand Samorukov hit a post and would have had a primary assist if the Canuck player didn't dive in front of the tap in pass during the 2nd. Oh and Bouchard set up Mcleod for a tap in goal that hit the post and yet you finished watching that game actually thinking Nurse/Larsson created an abunance of offensive opportunities.

This is non sense and I’ll go through it all again I guess. Nurse individually either created or had more scoring chances than any single player in this game on either team. He had several nice rushes where he made a play and 3 clean looks that he fanned on. Larsson was even playing loose skating in the o zone and managed to get several good shots through. He was the only player to successfully one time a puck on net all night. Bouchard, Benson McLeod did have that nice play that was probably the best play Bouchard had all night. Samurokov “would have been” primary assist I view as a negative. That was an awful, awful play to pass on that clean of a look in the slot. You take that shot every single time. Bad awareness by Samurokov and those are the things he will have to learn in the A this year.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

This is non sense and I’ll go through it all again I guess. Nurse individually either created or had more scoring chances than any single player in this game on either team. He had several nice rushes where he made a play and 3 clean looks that he fanned on. Larsson was even playing loose skating in the o zone and managed to get several good shots through. He was the only player to successfully one time a puck on net all night. Bouchard, Benson McLeod did have that nice play that was probably the best play Bouchard had all night. Samurokov “would have been” primary assist I view as a negative. That was an awful, awful play to pass on that clean of a look in the slot. You take that shot every single time. Bad awareness by Samurokov and those are the things he will have to learn in the A this year.

Would you complain if that pass had worked? Lots of players with high IQ make plays like that all the time.

If it works it’s a tap in. McDavid and draisaitl do plays like that all the time.

 

[MessierII]

Would you complain if that pass had worked? Lots of players with high IQ make plays like that all the time.

If it works it’s a tap in. McDavid and draisaitl do plays like that all the time.

Samurokov isn’t Mcdavid or Draisaitl he’s a first year pro trying to make an impression.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Samurokov isn’t Mcdavid or Draisaitl he’s a first year pro trying to make an impression.

So you wouldn’t of complained if it worked.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

This is non sense and I’ll go through it all again I guess. Nurse individually either created or had more scoring chances than any single player in this game on either team. He had several nice rushes where he made a play and 3 clean looks that he fanned on. Larsson was even playing loose skating in the o zone and managed to get several good shots through. He was the only player to successfully one time a puck on net all night. Bouchard, Benson McLeod did have that nice play that was probably the best play Bouchard had all night. Samurokov “would have been” primary assist I view as a negative. That was an awful, awful play to pass on that clean of a look in the slot. You take that shot every single time. Bad awareness by Samurokov and those are the things he will have to learn in the A this year.

Nurse should really buckle down on those clean looks, instead he fanned every one into the corner.

Things you expect from a rookie but not a veteran!

 

[MessierII]

So you wouldn’t of complained if it worked.

I don’t deal in what ifs. It didn’t work.

 

[joestevens29]

Maybe it's just me, but I want to see guys like Bouchard, Benson, Samurokov etc... make a lot of mistakes right now.

It's what they do to fix those mistakes that is really the key. If guys make mistakes and then get coached on how to fix them and do in fact fix them then you can feel a lot better about a guy. It's where you spend the time trying to fix the mistakes with a player and he doesn't listen that you end up with an issue.

We need the players to continue their play that made them successful at the other levels. From there the team needs to work with the player to minimize what won't work at the NHL level.

You get guys that all of sudden start playing a different style than they did in Junior and you can end up with a kid that isn't even successful at what he is good at.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

I don’t deal in what ifs. It didn’t work.

You know what also didn't work was Larsson leaving the front of the net but you seem to give him a pass.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Maybe it's just me, but I want to see guys like Bouchard, Benson, Samurokov etc... make a lot of mistakes right now.

It's what they do to fix those mistakes that is really the key. If guys make mistakes and then get coached on how to fix them and do in fact fix them then you can feel a lot better about a guy. It's where you spend the time trying to fix the mistakes with a player and he doesn't listen that you end up with an issue.

We need the players to continue their play that made them successful at the other levels. From there the team needs to work with the player to minimize what won't work at the NHL level.

You get guys that all of sudden start playing a different style than they did in Junior and you can end up with a kid that isn't even successful at what he is good at.

And then you end up with a Kris Russell who was a good puck mover in junior and now his only play is off the glass and out.

 

[joestevens29]

And then you end up with a Kris Russell who was a good puck mover in junior and now his only play is off the glass and out.

Him playing the wrong side probably makes things tougher than it should be.

 

[GhostfaceWu]

This is non sense and I’ll go through it all again I guess. Nurse individually either created or had more scoring chances than any single player in this game on either team. He had several nice rushes where he made a play and 3 clean looks that he fanned on. Larsson was even playing loose skating in the o zone and managed to get several good shots through. He was the only player to successfully one time a puck on net all night. Bouchard, Benson McLeod did have that nice play that was probably the best play Bouchard had all night. Samurokov “would have been” primary assist I view as a negative. That was an awful, awful play to pass on that clean of a look in the slot. You take that shot every single time. Bad awareness by Samurokov and those are the things he will have to learn in the A this year.

Yup somebody tell Mcdavid he needs to "clean" that level of offensive creativity up because bad awareness nonsense. So you're one of those guys who just completely shuts players out if you don't like them I guess because creating that narrative in your head that is the only explanation.

 

[Stoneman89]

You're saying a team with McDavid, Drai, and RNH has no center depth?

I'm... Ok.

Draisatl is a winger for the most part on McDavid's line. That leaves RNH. Two very good centres. The problem has been the bottom 2 spots and beyond.

 

[GhostfaceWu]

So you wouldn’t of complained if it worked.

Type of person to compain if Sam took the shot and it missed wide and upon seeing the replay notices the wide open player for a tap in. Narrative changes for the player not the play.

 

[bone]

Yup somebody tell Mcdavid he needs to "clean" that level of offensive creativity up because bad awareness nonsense. So you're one of those guys who just completely shuts players out if you don't like them I guess because creating that narrative in your head that is the only explanation.

In fairness to him, that's not what he's doing. He's already said his approach. In his view, in pre-season (especially early), vets aren't competing for a spot but rather working on building up their game so you're less concerned with mistakes as they've shown what they can do when the real bullets are flying. However, rookies and bubble players are trying to get noticed as they haven't proven themselves.

Though I don't 100% agree on his specific breakdown of certain plays, I understand the mentality and ultimately it is the mentality of the guys building the team.

Personally, I look at bubble players the same way as him, where I differ is the rookies. I don't care about their mistakes, I'm looking for what they do positive and to see how coachable their mistakes are to see if they are 1, or 2 years or possibly a long term project.

I'm not seeing bias in his posts understanding his stated view on pre-season.

 

[Konami McDavid]

I enjoy reading this board because you can have two people watching the same game and coming out with very different perspectives. Thank you all for sharing, even if my opinion differs from yours. I only listened to the first period on the radio and watched periods 2 and 3.

I feel like we iced a group of forwards who are all vying for the 4th line. I liked what I saw with only a few plays as an outlier. The Canucks should have been able to breeze through this game, but instead the Nucks were badly outplayed. a few posts kept this from being an Oilers W in a game I thought they had no chance.

I really liked what I saw from Jurco on his assist. He dropped the pass and blocked the defender from picking up Marody right away, he then went straight to the net snowing Demko and taking away his eyes. We could really use more of that if he does it consistently.

Bouchard and Samorukov had good games. I did see what some saw with a bit of awkward puck handling in his own zone. I couldn't tell if it was ice related or some jitters, but I did see it. He did also have a couple giveaways, but so did the rest of our D corps. However, his pass to Marody (I think) sending him in alone in the third was a thing of beauty. Samorukov was steady and made some good decisions with the puck. I think these two guys are going to force Holland to make some tough decisions mid-way through this year, and if not, next training camp for sure.

Nurse and Larsson looked OK. It does seem that Tippet has taken the leash off Nurse. I saw him lead the rush a lot. He looked really fast. I saw a few posters who seemed frustrated that he circled behind the net with the puck and I would agree. Although I felt it was more a result of a lack of open teammates. The forwards seemed to be having troubles last night finding open areas. Larsson was invisible and does seem a bit lost in the offensive zone. Hope he shakes that off.

 

[McFlash97]

Burdasov looks like a Slepyshev clone. Don't expect an otherwordly intro into the NHL.

 

[nexttothemoon]

I honestly think that the bottom 6 is going to be an incremental improvement over last season at each position... it's not as if they've added superstars down there... but if they can at least have a little more speed, a little better overall penalty killers and hopefully a few players who can get close to 10 goals instead of nearly everyone being in that 0-5 goal range... then I think overall you are going to see a more effective and capable bottom 6 which also helps take a little pressure off the top 6... and specifically that top line won't be burnt out by carrying the entire team once again.

Maybe Burdasov isn't much better than anything they have now either.... but if he adds a decent shot on the wing for the middle 6... maybe that's one more small element that contributes to an overall advancement forward over what they had last season... one more small step in the right direction even though it just looks like another average talent in the bottom 6 like so many others already there.

Personally I like the fact that they have so many options to select from and I have to trust that the coaches can put together the best possible 23 man roster to get the GA down and the GF up this season.

 

[McOvechking]

Draisatl is a winger for the most part on McDavid's line. That leaves RNH. Two very good centres. The problem has been the bottom 2 spots and beyond.

Eh, Strome wasn't bad, just couldn't create offense. The problem has moreso been with our top-end winger options. Neal might help patch that hole.

I really like Sheahan though so I'm not concerned about 3C, and we have a ton of good options for 4C.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

Any 60minute sample of the fastest most complex team game on earth affords this any time out...

Hockey, more than any sport, overwhelms general ability to define and assess it. Best or worst thing we could do is "key" on players and try to track what the actions of finite amount of players are in a game. All within our own script filters, cognitive bias, and generally inadequate human processing and perception.

I've just null and voided almost everything that gets stated here..

Bang on.

Except me. That doesn't apply to me.

There is a reason they called him Forest Gump. Soon I will reach that level!