Confirmed with Link: Alex DeBrincat traded to Ottawa Senators

[ozzzie19]

You needed 2 firsts and if there’s protections on the first, a highly rated prospect

There really isn't precedent for that type of package if one of the firsts is in the top 10 (admittedly an arbitrary cutoff point).

I went back to 2015 (another arbitrary cutoff point) and looked at all the trades where a team knew they were trading away a top 10 pick. Here they are:

2021: The somewhat convoluted OEL/Garland's rights for a bunch of short term salary, the 9OA and a 2nd. Hard to really compare this given all the salary considerations and the wide variance in valuations on OEL.

2017: Stepan and Raanta for the 7OA and Deangelo. This was a great move by Gorton, despite the fact that his pick tanked and Deangelo was a cancer (which he was prior to the trade as well). Deangelo was a former first rounder, but he had been traded the year prior for a 2nd rounder and had red flags aplenty. Certainly Cat is much better than Stepan/Raanta but Stepan had cost certainty whereas Cat very much does not.

And thats it! Teams very very rarely trade away their picks that they know are going to be at the top of the draft.

The Seth Jones trade was 2 firsts but it was a known 12OA and the Hawks likely expected the 2022 pick to be in the middle of the 1st round (not 6OA).

The Duchene trade has to be one of the most convoluted and horrible trades and again, it wasn't known what pick OTT would be giving up.

The Karlsson trade that ended up with a 3OA had conditions that made it unlikely to be a high first (which was 2 years later) and included two seconds. This is probably the closest comparison (and its not all that close) to the Cat trade when you consider talent and contract (and even then TDL deals are different than draft day deals). As much as I love Cat and think hes a top 25 player, at the time, Karlsson was probably a top 10 or so player. And Cat's contract situation is more or less about one year behind where Karlsson's was at the time (given Cat's high QO). Maybe those two differences even each other out. And again, Karlsson netted only one first which was not expected to be a high pick.

So all in all, there really is very little precedent for teams trading away a known high first round pick, and no precedent for trading a known high first round pick and another first rounder.

I think we all just had unrealistic expectations.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

That actually sounds like what happened.

only way you can really explain the difference in the Dach and Cat return is because of the contract situation and no sign and trade beforehand, whether you agree with it or not there are GMs out there that were obviously concerned about Cat and his contract expiring soon

 

[Toews2Bickell]

I will say that only the Hawks really have any insight into what the Cat wants to do in the future. And not in a "generic hockey player response when asked a question from the press" sort of way.

In that "fake" Ottawa video their GM said they hadn't talked to Cat yet. So the Hawks clearly didn't give permission for that sort of thing....perhaps knowing that whatever Cat said would severely limit or even eliminate his suitors. Thus the limited return we got.

We take it for granted that we could sign Cat....but if the hawks straight up suck with no light at the end of the tunnel....would a competitor like Cat want to stay here? Would you? It's not like he doesn't have other options.

Anyway, food for thought. At this point all we have is copium lol.

that ottawa video is completely fake, he never hangs up the call, you can see Dorion has it on the home screen the entire time from start to finish, felt like a video to dunk on the Hawks which is comical because Cat is likely walking in two years and Dorion traded for Duchene in a deal that included the pick that turned into Byram...

 

[ozzzie19]

I will say that only the Hawks really have any insight into what the Cat wants to do in the future. And not in a "generic hockey player response when asked a question from the press" sort of way.

In that "fake" Ottawa video their GM said they hadn't talked to Cat yet. So the Hawks clearly didn't give permission for that sort of thing....perhaps knowing that whatever Cat said would severely limit or even eliminate his suitors. Thus the limited return we got.

We take it for granted that we could sign Cat....but if the hawks straight up suck with no light at the end of the tunnel....would a competitor like Cat want to stay here? Would you? It's not like he doesn't have other options.

Anyway, food for thought. At this point all we have is copium lol.

I agree with all of this AND KD's only real window was to trade him on draft day. If he waits for the TDL, all the buyers have firsts at the end of the round and if he waits for next year's draft day then he's trading a guy who will make at least $9M and could possibly walk in a year. And at that point again you are looking at a very narrow/non-existent list of teams with a high first rounder and entering their contention window who'd want to trade for Cat.

 

[Muffinalt]

Cat, Batherson, Stutzle, Tkachuk, Formenton, Norris and others.

The Sens have a wealth of talent up front.

Chabot, Sanderson and Zub on D as well.

Kind of liking that team. They need a goalie and another D and then it's go time.

Kane could be a nice piece for them to add actually. That would be cool, I'd watch quite a few Ottawa games rooting for them.

that ottawa video is completely fake, he never hangs up the call, you can see Dorion has it on the home screen the entire time from start to finish, felt like a video to dunk on the Hawks which is comical because Cat is likely walking in two years and Dorion traded for Duchene in a deal that included the pick that turned into Byram...

Yeah it does look a little fake at the end there.

Maybe they actually had this convo and then Dorion throught 'hey it would be cool if we recorded that' and he recreated it lol

 

[Kevin Musto]

 

[RayP]

Fake phone calls and fake photos. Wonder what's next.

 

[Kevin Musto]

 

[AmericanDream]

The fact that we couldn't pry away one of the younger top prospects from the Sens is the most maddening part. Shane Pinto would have looked amazing in a Hawks uniform. No freaking reason we couldn't have gotten 7th plus a top prospect plus that 2nd for Cat...

 

[clydesdale line]

I just noticed I need to change my avatar lol. Cohen and now DeBrincat are gone. I'll miss my little guys.

 

[Kevin Musto]

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

God that sux.

 

[WarLax]

All I feel is pain.

And hate.

f*** Stan Bowman especially. He created the mess that led to this.

I'm not overly happy with KD, but really.....

f*** Stan Bowman.

 

[Muffinalt]

Oh man

Hasnt really hit me yet that he's gone. Or Dach either.

Can't imagine what a Kane, Toews trade will feel like.

It's all fun now with the new shiny prospects and the draft and daydreaming... But the next regular season or two is going to be absolutely miserable.

 

[Kevin Musto]

It's all fun now with the new shiny prospects and the draft and daydreaming... But the next regular season or two is going to be absolutely miserable.

For sure, but I think you just have to reframe how you see everything.

It's a full teardown, it's going to get ugly, we're not going to like everything that happens, but whatever does happen there's no controlling it. I'd say for the most part I still have faith in KD and the gang even if that Cat trade was rough.

In the meantime, dream of Bedard and cling onto something positive. Many here poke fun at my allegiance to Ian Mitchell, but it does give me something to genuinely look forward to. That's a whole lot better than being miserable.

 

[Muffinalt]

For sure, but I think you just have to reframe how you see everything.

It's a full teardown, it's going to get ugly, we're not going to like everything that happens, but whatever does happen there's no controlling it. I'd say for the most part I still have faith in KD and the gang even if that Cat trade was rough.

In the meantime, dream of Bedard and cling onto something positive. Many here poke fun at my allegiance to Ian Mitchell, but it does give me something to genuinely look forward to. That's a whole lot better than being miserable.

The bright spots will be all the kids getting time yeah. Thank god we shave so many right on the edge of making the team.

Looking forward to seeing more Mitchell too!

 

[Kevin Musto]

The bright spots will be all the kids getting time yeah. Thank god we shave so many right on the edge of making the team.

Looking forward to seeing more Mitchell too!

Yeah Mitchell and Reichel I think will be the guys we all expect to make the roster out of camp.

I think Galvas could make a case for himself. At 23 years old I think you want to start to see how he handles things at the NHL level beyond a stint.

Phillips, not that I want to rush him, could fight for a roster spot.

Then you just hope young guys like Kurashev and Entwistle can elevate things a bit more.

And towards the end of next season we could see our NCAA guys start to sign like Slaggert, Kaiser, Commesso, and Rolston.

 

[Muffinalt]

Yeah Mitchell and Reichel I think will be the guys we all expect to make the roster out of camp.

I think Galvas could make a case for himself. At 23 years old I think you want to start to see how he handles things at the NHL level beyond a stint.

Phillips, not that I want to rush him, could fight for a roster spot.

Then you just hope young guys like Kurashev and Entwistle can elevate things a bit more.

And towards the end of next season we could see our NCAA guys start to sign like Slaggert, Kaiser, Commesso, and Rolston.

Are you counting Regula as already having made the team?

Coz hes my guy to make it out of training camp.

I hope it won't have to be a competition with Mitchell because we traded away Seth Jones by that time.

Agree on Galvas and Isaac.

I wonder how conservative our FOnis going to handle the kids. They look like they want to be extremely patient. But we could just let them fly too.

 

[ClydeLee]

For sure, but I think you just have to reframe how you see everything.

It's a full teardown, it's going to get ugly, we're not going to like everything that happens, but whatever does happen there's no controlling it. I'd say for the most part I still have faith in KD and the gang even if that Cat trade was rough.

In the meantime, dream of Bedard and cling onto something positive. Many here poke fun at my allegiance to Ian Mitchell, but it does give me something to genuinely look forward to. That's a whole lot better than being miserable.

I am realizing I may have been rude or insensitive to the fact some people haven't fully reframed or embraced that yet.

Yeah I saw that was the case from about the time Stan was fired. And when Davidson was formally hired and said, yes it's a real long rebuild 3-5 however many years. I was already embracing this. I already kinda saw how trading Cat vs Kane was a more easier trade and see it.

But sometimes people need to see the results to get what is happening beyond just seeing the hints.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Are you counting Regula as already having made the team?

Coz hes my guy to make it out of training camp.

I hope it won't have to be a competition with Mitchell because we traded away Seth Jones by that time.

Agree on Galvas and Isaac.

I wonder how conservative our FOnis going to handle the kids. They look like they want to be extremely patient. But we could just let them fly too.

Regula I think could still use another year in Rockford (with callups throughout the season).

When the kids are ready, they'll let them fly. But it's gotta be the kids forcing their hand and not the other way around.

 

[The Worst One]

Happy Cat is gone. f*** that midget.

 

[RayP]

Happy Cat is gone. f*** that midget.

One of the more bizarre troll accounts over the years.

 

[The Worst One]

One of the more bizarre troll accounts over the years.

Just because I don't like Cat and have an unpopular opinion doesn't mean I'm a troll, so sit down!

 

[clydesdale line]

Just because I don't like Cat and have an unpopular opinion doesn't mean I'm a troll, so sit down!

You know him personally? He didn't sign your autograph or something?

 

[The Worst One]

You know him personally? He didn't sign your autograph or something?

No, I don't. I don't like him as a hockey player.