Alain Vigneault Named Head Coach, 4/15/19

[Alex K]

AV is the best coach we've had in, what, 6 years? So, what's the complain?

 

[Larry44]

This signing is going to be a disaster, isn't it...?

Almost assuredly. I'm resigned to the fact that I'm a fan of a team since 1972 that hasn't won since I was 14 and will never win the Cup again in my lifetime no matter how long I live. It's a mediocre corporate clown show. We needed Mozart; we got Salieri across the board. The whole organization is dull, which explains why they were dazzled by the shiny coach. They don't have a clue among them.

 

[AdamParrot]

Almost assuredly. I'm resigned to the fact that I'm a fan of a team since 1972 that hasn't won since I was 14 and will never win the Cup again in my lifetime no matter how long I live. It's a mediocre corporate clown show. We needed Mozart; we got Salieri across the board. The whole organization is dull, which explains why they were dazzled by the shiny coach. They don't have a clue among them.

Wow. You're older than my parents. It's crazy!

 

[Larry44]

Wow. You're older than my parents. It's crazy!

Ask them to expkain the Amadeus reference, sonny. LOL!

 

[pacehimself]

So people are worried about him playing younger players...but with the current make up of the team does he actually have a choice? We are a youuuung team, and with possibly frost and Farabee coming up we are gonna get younger. I think he’s gonna do just fine because of Hart alone.

Hart single handedly made some people think Gordon was the answer behind the bench. I don’t get the sky is falling comments...an upgrade over gordon and a move forward. I’m excited to actually start moving on and hope to make a big splash in free agency!

 

[He Is Knocking]

Almost assuredly. I'm resigned to the fact that I'm a fan of a team since 1972 that hasn't won since I was 14 and will never win the Cup again in my lifetime no matter how long I live. It's a mediocre corporate clown show. We needed Mozart; we got Salieri across the board. The whole organization is dull, which explains why they were dazzled by the shiny coach. They don't have a clue among them.

Was 9 in 1972 but agree completely with what you wrote. This group has no idea what they're doing Holmgren can build nothing without hemorrhaging draft picks, assets and money, Fletcher...LOL..the ex all stars in peeps ears. But AV may be the best hockey guy (not that it would take much) in the building at least I'm hoping.

 

[AdamParrot]

Classic Sam.

He defended Hakstol and Gordon almost all-time. Now he is skeptical about AV. Of course.

 

[FlyerFaithful17]

Classic Sam.

He defended Hakstol and Gordon almost all-time. Now he is skeptical about AV. Of course.

I am glad that we have a guy experienced in big markets. The Philly media is miserable but after Vancouver and especially NY, he can handle it.

 

[1865]

AV is the best coach we've had in, what, 6 years? So, what's the complain?

Some people on here can't exist without criticising a coach.

 

[General Joseph]

I like this hire a lot ! I drove up to Illinois to pick up a old FXR Shovelhead Harley i had bought off a farmer up in Winchester Illinois , and while driving back to Florida yesterday i heard the Flyers pulled the trigger on Alain ! I think its a damn solid hire , and i think he can make a big impact on our club with the mix of young talent and veterans we have ! Looking forward now to next season already !

 

[Bruckuss]

Day 2, feeling better about it. Am of the opinion his success will a direct correlation with Hart's. That, and Fletch needs to make a choice move or two to weed the garden.

If Hart performs in net, we round out the talent on ice, and Vino doesn't S the bed with a system and in game decisions - I am calling it now, 2nd round next year and further the year after if the wheels don't fall off the quality vets we have.

I feel better about our situation today than a year ago at least

 

[NYCFlyer]

Almost assuredly. I'm resigned to the fact that I'm a fan of a team since 1972 that hasn't won since I was 14 and will never win the Cup again in my lifetime no matter how long I live. It's a mediocre corporate clown show. We needed Mozart; we got Salieri across the board. The whole organization is dull, which explains why they were dazzled by the shiny coach. They don't have a clue among them.

You probably said that about the Eagles when they hired Doug. Your right we should have gone down the Coaches store and picked up the Mozart of coaches on the shelf. Since when did you become such a drama ("I'm gonna die before we win again because of the coach we hired") queen. At least wait half a season before you jump.

 

[General Joseph]

Almost assuredly. I'm resigned to the fact that I'm a fan of a team since 1972 that hasn't won since I was 14 and will never win the Cup again in my lifetime no matter how long I live. It's a mediocre corporate clown show. We needed Mozart; we got Salieri across the board. The whole organization is dull, which explains why they were dazzled by the shiny coach. They don't have a clue among them.

Hang in there Larry ! I was 16 when they won their first Cup , we use to go to Rexys etc . I know exactly where your coming from with this post and agree with you for the most part . Having said that , i think this hire will get the ship heading back in the right direction !

 

[BiggE]

Hang in there Larry ! I was 16 when they won their first Cup , we use to go to Rexys etc . I know exactly where your coming from with this post and agree with you for the most part . Having said that , i think this hire will get the ship heading back in the right direction !

Damn I thought I was old, I was only 9 when they won the first one, lol.

 

[bennysflyers16]

Chuck should re-sign Konecny and Sanheim now. I want to see them under AV on WC with Couturier and Hart.

This. And make them long term, they could both explode under AV, let’s get a steal now.

 

[Outlaw Samurai]

Vigneault takes two separate organizations to the Cup finals with non-powerhouse rosters;
9 out of his last 12 seasons his teams reach 100+ points (if you prorate the lockout season);
and three times his teams finish with the best reg. season record in the NHL;
but some people want to focus on the fact that he dressed Tanner Glass as his 12th forward during a playoff run to the Eastern Conference Final and cite that as evidence that he's a bad hire.

Who was even on the Rangers roster that season who so clearly deserved to play over Glass in the playoffs but was scratched? I sure don't see anyone.

My somewhat hazy memory watching the Rags vs Sens playoff series, was he actually provided a lot of energy. Obviously a scrub player but even they can have "good" series and/or motivate the team.

 

[Rich Nixon]

Vino

I like this as an early nickname. AV just makes me think of “audio/video.”

 

[Outlaw Samurai]

I'm definitely warming up to the hire. He's clearly better than anybody since Lavy. He will no doubt have blemishes but that's what this board is for.

Imagine how boring it would be to have nothing for us to gripe about

I also like Hartman enough that if he ends up being "the guy" I won't rage too hard (yes, please flag this statement for future crow eating).

At least I'm excited for FA, the influx of talented youth and the next season starting!!!

GO FLYERS!!!!!!!!

 

[rinaldo]

I am neutral to this hire. Def could have done worse. I am more interested to see what the GM does as you cant bring back the same cast of players imo. A major shake up is needed. Just because a team has talented players doesn't mean they are a talented team.

 

[deadhead]

My somewhat hazy memory watching the Rags vs Sens playoff series, was he actually provided a lot of energy. Obviously a scrub player but even they can have "good" series and/or motivate the team.

What coach doesn't have an "energy player" or two they insert in the lineup when they think the team is playing flat and want to start a fire.
The fact that Glass only played 10 minutes a night tells you AV was quite aware of his limitations.
Like most teams, his Rangers went 9-10 deep and the bottom guys like Pirri and Lindberg were the kind of scrubs we'd be lambasting here. Or does anyone miss Weal, Cousins and Luby?

The real issues with AV have nothing to do with handling prospects, he's given big minutes to talented young players, like all HCs coaching playoff caliber teams, he's got no patience with prospects who have to learn on the job and cost his team points - that's why the AHL exists.

What we need to watch is how he interacts with Fletcher, do they make the bad moves that Sather made in NY, or are they patient with the prospects and don't sell the farm to win now.
How will Fletcher reshape the roster for AV, will he find a mobile, veteran D-man for him (Spurgeon seems like a perfect fit).
Will Fletcher find more speed at forward. Do prospects like Strome, Vorobyev and Bunnaman fit going forward?
Will AV ride Hart into the dust?
Is AV tough enough to mold a soft team into a playoff hardened unit?

I think Hagg's days are numbered, but Morin will be an interesting decision, he has straight line speed, but is he agile enough to defend in space when exposed by AV's scheme?
Knight and Varone are history, will Lindblom's lack of speed make him a bad fit or does his smarts provide cover for the fast guys?
Do Frost and Farabee become more attractive under AV's scheme?

 

[magnumpi]

I don't understand how this hire means the Flyers are doomed to never win the cup.

Nobody is perfect. You could find a problem with anyone.

At least this guy is a legitimate coach.
Plenty of "great candidates" have failed miserably when actually hired.
Complaining about the coach right now is counterproductive unless you want to be in personal state of anguish whenever you think about the Flyers. I have to give myself hope otherwise there is no point in me following the team.

 

[Ruck Over]

So, what would be your preferred alternative, and how would that (likely unproven) selection be congruous with the notion that the team is also gunning for instant, dramatic improvement?

Basically, how does hiring the best/most proven available NHL coach indicate to you that the team will not be interested in pursuing the most proven available NHL talent this offseason?

I’m not saying it does either way. I’m just trying to see how this squares, because I’ve seen similar sentiments here and on Twitter, and the only thing those seemingly contradictory thoughts have in common is just pessimism.

My preference, aside from Q, has always been Rikard Gronborg. While unproven in the NHL (because everyone is a rookie HC at some point in time), he's played collegiate hockey here, and he's been the HC of the Swedish men's national team. Gronborg has been part of the staff for the Olympic Games Silver, and has won the past two IIHF tourneys ('17, '18), is scheduled to be the HC of Sweden in the 2020 games. I enjoy the brand of hockey that Sweden plays, and would find that an enjoyable, and sustainable model for the Flyers moving forward. Moreso than the brand of hockey AV has displayed at Vancouver or NYR. Gronborg has a better pulse of the game in my opinion, by the way he interacts with players, and the philosophy of both not being a copy-cat, and being adaptable to a situation.

Your question is cached in specific conditions. When you qualify AV as the "best/most proven available NHL coach" it removes the context that is because Q is no longer available, also it discounts Ruff (an available coach with moar experience and wins), so at a point in time AV did not meet this standard. It'd be akin to exactly what I wrote, a play off of @Magua in that the top NHL free agents either do not want to come here in lieu of other destinations, and a result, the Hayes and T. Myers of the world are the best of the rest, akin to a booby prize.

An alternative question, "Basically, how does hiring AV indicate to you that the team will not be interested in acquiring proven available NHL talent this offseason?"
To which I would reply, AV has had undesirable tendencies* in the past that are too close to the bone of bad tendencies of previous Flyers' HCs. If he's on the same page as the GM, it's likely those bad tendencies continue absent new information that there's been a significant change. Not having proof of that change yet, yes, pessimism is the course of the day, because the Flyers have been mediocre, and this to me looks like a mediocre move. Also, interested in acquiring, and actually acquiring are not one in the same, as is proof because Q is with the Panthers now.
*my way or highway, smartest guy in the room, stubborn, pet player is a bad player,



More about Gronborg, just for fun, look for the posts by @Ola. He has references to a few American articles I've previously posted, plus some more in Swedish that are translated excerpts. In the most unlikely of all worlds, if AV is our HC, and Gronborg is brought in as an assistant coach, I'll 180-turn and jump on the bandwagon of positivity.

 

[Rich Nixon]

My preference, aside from Q, has always been Rikard Gronborg. While unproven in the NHL (because everyone is a rookie HC at some point in time), he's played collegiate hockey here, and he's been the HC of the Swedish men's national team. Gronborg has been part of the staff for the Olympic Games Silver, and has won the past two IIHF tourneys ('17, '18), is scheduled to be the HC of Sweden in the 2020 games. I enjoy the brand of hockey that Sweden plays, and would find that an enjoyable, and sustainable model for the Flyers moving forward. Moreso than the brand of hockey AV has displayed at Vancouver or NYR. Gronborg has a better pulse of the game in my opinion, by the way he interacts with players, and the philosophy of both not being a copy-cat, and being adaptable to a situation.

Your question is cached in specific conditions. When you qualify AV as the "best/most proven available NHL coach" it removes the context that is because Q is no longer available, also it discounts Ruff (an available coach with moar experience and wins), so at a point in time AV did not meet this standard. It'd be akin to exactly what I wrote, a play off of @Magua in that the top NHL free agents either do not want to come here in lieu of other destinations, and a result, the Hayes and T. Myers of the world are the best of the rest, akin to a booby prize.

An alternative question, "Basically, how does hiring AV indicate to you that the team will not be interested in acquiring proven available NHL talent this offseason?"
To which I would reply, AV has had undesirable tendencies* in the past that are too close to the bone of bad tendencies of previous Flyers' HCs. If he's on the same page as the GM, it's likely those bad tendencies continue absent new information that there's been a significant change. Not having proof of that change yet, yes, pessimism is the course of the day, because the Flyers have been mediocre, and this to me looks like a mediocre move. Also, interested in acquiring, and actually acquiring are not one in the same, as is proof because Q is with the Panthers now.
*my way or highway, smartest guy in the room, stubborn, pet player is a bad player,

More about Gronborg, just for fun, look for the posts by @Ola. He has references to a few American articles I've previously posted, plus some more in Swedish that are translated excerpts. In the most unlikely of all worlds, if AV is our HC, and Gronborg is brought in as an assistant coach, I'll 180-turn and jump on the bandwagon of positivity.

Appreciate the depth of the reply, and that you had a preference. Grönborg had been an intriguing name, but I think given the timing and the catastrophic failure of the team's last outsider coach, it was just inevitable that they were going to go for a guy with an NHL resume (for better or for worse).

Bringing in Grönborg and having him not succeed, or not succeed quickly, would have been catastrophic for a franchise teetering hard on the edge of irrelevance, both in its own local sports market and in the NHL itself. Sure, if it works it's one thing, but there's no guarantees with anything. You fear the notion that the Flyers aren't an attractive player destination now, imagine what happens if they make an audacious coaching decision and implode for another losing or middling two seasons. That sees your fears realized more than anything.

Vigneault is a pretty known quantity with a pretty strong track record. For what it's worth, "stubborn" is a descriptor used for essentially every person who ascends to an NHL coaching job. It becomes a criticism mostly when people want to use it that way, but I don't think you'll find two many NHL coaches, good or bad, who can't be described as "stubborn." Former players seem to like Vigneault pretty well, and he's got a pretty good reputation around the league.

I see it differently: I think it's more a signal to prospective players that the team has committed to an NHL coach and to improving now, whereas an off-the-wall hire would have been more of "hey we've been a mess for six years, come sign this seven year deal and play for another experiment, we swear we were right about it this time."

We don't know how things go down or how things are perceived, so it's just guesses on our part. Is it a safe choice? In a sense, but that's how business choices sometimes have to be made. I don't think in this case that "safe" is a slur, though.

 

[Branko]

Classic Sam.

He defended Hakstol and Gordon almost all-time. Now he is skeptical about AV. Of course.

Cause Hak and Gordon put up with him. He knows AV is going to send his old ass into retirement.

 

[Webster]

Mats Zuccarello and AV have a special relationship. Zucc said AV is the best coach he's ever had, and that he owes him a lot.

I wouldn't be surprised if Zuccarello comes your way as a UFA, I think AV & Zucc would be a great thing for the Flyers.