Speculation: Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap Part XLVIII

[Langway]

They missed an opportunity to address center depth without paying through the nose last year. It was the perfect time to strike. This year will be far more expensive for lower quality players.

That really depends on what they do with Fehr I think. In terms of their actual needs and not just adding a center to add a center regardless, he fits better than most.

In any event my point is that the field doesn't dictate action so much as the fit lining up. If the market is filled with poor fits with one exception that doesn't want to come to your team then was it really time to act? I don't always agree with restricting decisions to such a framework but in this case, given they didn't really know what they had in Kuznetsov as an NHL center, I don't think there was a single regrettable non-signing among that group. It may end up being a better field but that doesn't necessarily make it a field they needed to snag someone from.

 

[CapsYeti12]

We could probably get Parenteau for scraps. I have 0 interest in that.

I mean potential top6 RW

 

[strungout]

I was reading today that Gleason was going to look for someone to give him a 2 year deal and if not the Caps are an option. But yeah he'd be a good fit in the 7D mold we are looking for.

Orpik - Carlson
Alzner - Niskanen
Schmidt - Orlov
Gleason

Carrick if he's still around as the first call up...then will still need some vet depth in Hershey as Bowey and Djoos will not be ready for NHL action right away.

Yeah...overall...that works.

Its nice not having to worry about the defense leading into July 1st.

 

[BobRouse]

Orpik - Carlson
Alzner - Niskanen
Schmidt - Orlov
Gleason

Carrick if he's still around as the first call up...then will still need some vet depth in Hershey as Bowey and Djoos will not be ready for NHL action right away.

Yeah...overall...that works.

Its nice not having to worry about the defense leading into July 1st.

Looks good to me.

Now if we were looking for a 5/6 D and wanted to spend a bit more then a guy like Jackman would be a great option.

But with our cap situation and having promising young guys like Orlov and Schmidt its the proper stance to just bring in a #7 and Gleason seems ideal.

 

[CapsYeti12]

I'm interested to see who they pluck to be the 7th D man.

Gleason makes a lot of sense to come back...but haven't heard much on that front.

Any names jump out to anyone?

From free agents, Gleason's type of players may be Paul Martin or Anton Volčenkov,
I'd like Volčenkov play with Orlov in 3rd pair and Schmidt as 7th D-man

 

[BobRouse]

From free agents, Gleason's type of players may be Paul Martin or Anton Volčenkov,
I'd like Volčenkov play with Orlov in 3rd pair and Schmidt as 7th D-man

Paul Martin is definitely still a top 6 D and likely a top 4 on most teams.

He's miles better and more expensive than Gleason and won't go somewhere to be a #7

 

[Turd Ferguson]

From free agents, Gleason's type of players may be Paul Martin or Anton Volčenkov,
I'd like Volčenkov play with Orlov in 3rd pair and Schmidt as 7th D-man

Noooo, noo. Too espensive, too espensive.

 

[Hivemind]

Where are you getting this? Burakovsky had incredible possession numbers flanking Ovie on RW1.

Wilson's possession numbers were solid as well.

If by established players you are suggesting the likes of declining expensive Alexander Semin then I most vehmenently disagree.

The acquisition cost and cap hit need to be taken into account.

I'm "getting this" from reality. Neither Burakovsky nor Wilson finished the season in the top six. Both were given significant opportunities in the top six, but couldn't hang onto them. Burakovsky went from being the team's 2C on opening night to a fourth liner/healthy scratch for most of the season. Wilson was given a prolonged shot with Ovechkin and Backstrom, and finished as a sparsely used 4th liner. There's no argument to be made that either of them were able to hang onto a top six spot.

Players had good possession numbers while playing with Ovechkin and Backstrom? Color me shocked!

"Too many pucks are dying with Tom right now," Trotz said. "He's got to get his feet moving and too many turnovers for me."
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/sports/Tom-Wilson-Benched-Washington-Capitals-Barry-Trotz.html

Acquisition and cap hit do absolutely need to be taken into account. I never argued to take on Semin for $7M or to spend real assets to acquire him. In a scenario where Carolina retains 50% or buys him out, he'd be quite an affordable option. He's far from the only established player out there, though.

 

[BobRouse]

I'm "getting this" from reality. Neither Burakovsky nor Wilson finished the season in the top six. Both were given significant opportunities in the top six, but couldn't hang onto them. Burakovsky went from being the team's 2C on opening night to a fourth liner/healthy scratch for most of the season. Wilson was given a prolonged shot with Ovechkin and Backstrom, and finished as a sparsely used 4th liner. There's no argument to be made that either of them were able to hang onto a top six spot.

Players had good possession numbers while playing with Ovechkin and Backstrom? Color me shocked!

"Too many pucks are dying with Tom right now," Trotz said. "He's got to get his feet moving and too many turnovers for me."
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/sports/Tom-Wilson-Benched-Washington-Capitals-Barry-Trotz.html

Acquisition and cap hit do absolutely need to be taken into account. I never argued to take on Semin for $7M or to spend real assets to acquire him. In a scenario where Carolina retains 50% or buys him out, he'd be quite an affordable option. He's far from the only established player out there, though.

Trotz doesn't trust rooks that much nor young players. But all those guys have another year of experience now. Both Wilson and Burakovsky had good possession numbers with the latter being outstanding.

Trotz will HATE Alexander Semin. I was a big supporter of this player but he is not the same guy that was with the Caps and we don't have the Bruce Boudreau type coaching us right now. But you are right that he is just one example.

The acquisition costs of the guys we are talking about are reportedly absurd. We are tight on cap space.

Next year guys like Okposo and ROR will be hitting UFA and they are far better fits than a guy like Sharp is. We trade for Sharp then it will drastically lower our chances of getting a real good fit like them. Trading for them now ..for having 1 year of their services guaranteed..is going to be prohibitively expensive and not worth it.

 

[Stewie G]

Trotz doesn't trust rooks that much nor young players. But all those guys have another year of experience now. Both Wilson and Burakovsky had good possession numbers with the latter being outstanding.

Trotz will HATE Alexander Semin. I was a big supporter of this player but he is not the same guy that was with the Caps and we don't have the Bruce Boudreau type coaching us right now. But you are right that he is just one example.

The acquisition costs of the guys we are talking about are reportedly absurd. We are tight on cap space.

Next year guys like Okposo and ROR will be hitting UFA and they are far better fits than a guy like Sharp is. We trade for Sharp then it will drastically lower our chances of getting a real good fit like them. Trading for them now ..for having 1 year of their services guaranteed..is going to be prohibitively expensive and not worth it.

You are aware that Semin was arguably the best forward under Hunter, correct? To unequivocally state that he wouldn't work under Trotz is ridiculous and flies in the face of how well he played under Dale. Baseless speculation stated as fact, with CAPS, is SOP sadly.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

You are aware that Semin was arguably the best forward under Hunter, correct? To unequivocally state that he wouldn't work under Trotz is ridiculous and flies in the face of how well he played under Dale. Baseless speculation stated as fact, with CAPS, is SOP sadly.

This. Semin was definitely our best forward under Hunter. His defensive game has always been underrated.

Guys like Brouwer, Chimera, and Laich would appear to be the type of players that Trotz covets. All demoted at one point. I think maybe we should stop deciding who BT would like and who he wouldn't. I imagine he'll like anyone who helps the team win.

 

[BobRouse]

You are aware that Semin was arguably the best forward under Hunter, correct? To unequivocally state that he wouldn't work under Trotz is ridiculous and flies in the face of how well he played under Dale. Baseless speculation stated as fact, with CAPS, is SOP sadly.

His underlying numbers under Boudreau (pre trap) vs Boudreau (post trap) vs Hunter were very telling.

http://www.japersrink.com/2011/12/19/2646094/alexander-semin-and-the-trap

And while nearly everyone on the team has seen his offensive numbers suffer to some extent as a result of the change, the shift in philosophy, system and approach has hit Alexander Semin particularly hard. In 81 regular season games since the Caps abandonded Boudreau's aggressive offensive scheme, Semin has 16 goals and 17 assists for 33 points in 61 games

As Dale Hunter continues to mold the Caps into the team he thinks he can win with, it's to be expected that there would be a decent amount of hammering square pegs into round holes along the way. And with some players, that might even work (though Hunter might be wise to be somewhat flexible in his system demands as well). But with Alexander Semin, we've seen a full season's worth of what could be favorably-to-him described as "stifled creativity," with no end in sight. At this point, even his most ardent supporters would have to agree that Alex Semin the hockey player and the way the Washington Capitals now play hockey are horribly mismatched.

This. Semin was definitely our best forward under Hunter. His defensive game has always been underrated.

Guys like Brouwer, Chimera, and Laich would appear to be the type of players that Trotz covets. All demoted at one point. I think maybe we should stop deciding who BT would like and who he wouldn't. I imagine he'll like anyone who helps the team win.

Not sure where you guys are getting this nonsense. Semin was good but he was AWESOME under pretrap BB. To maximize his talents he needs to be in an offensive system. Nashville would be a good fit.

You people are ridiculous with this Semin nonsense.

Right on. And I was one of his biggest supporters here!

EDIT: Further info

http://www.japersrink.com/2013/2/7/3961818/boudreau-ovechkin-capitals-trap-fml

The stupidest thing we ever did before firing Boudreau was GMGM essentially mind forcing him to play the TRAP. I've harped against this for years.

The players we have now are designed for this system we play where we hit and grind. Bringing in high skill low-grind players like Semin is a disaster waiting to happen (like Jagr coming into a grinding Caps team)

Its simply not a fit. You don't just insert "high skill offensive player" in your lineup and BAM! Semin needs to take lots of risks. Thats not what we do now. We hit and grind. Not as offensively restrictive as our trapping teams but not a fit for this type of player either.

 

[Hivemind]

His underlying numbers under Boudreau (pre trap) vs Boudreau (post trap) vs Hunter were very telling.

http://www.japersrink.com/2011/12/19/2646094/alexander-semin-and-the-trap

And while nearly everyone on the team has seen his offensive numbers suffer to some extent as a result of the change, the shift in philosophy, system and approach has hit Alexander Semin particularly hard. In 81 regular season games since the Caps abandonded Boudreau's aggressive offensive scheme, Semin has 16 goals and 17 assists for 33 points in 61 games

As Dale Hunter continues to mold the Caps into the team he thinks he can win with, it's to be expected that there would be a decent amount of hammering square pegs into round holes along the way. And with some players, that might even work (though Hunter might be wise to be somewhat flexible in his system demands as well). But with Alexander Semin, we've seen a full season's worth of what could be favorably-to-him described as "stifled creativity," with no end in sight. At this point, even his most ardent supporters would have to agree that Alex Semin the hockey player and the way the Washington Capitals now play hockey are horribly mismatched.

That article was published on December 19th, 2011. Semin had 42 points in the remaining 49 games of the regular season afterwards.

 

[Stewie G]

Semin had 44 points in 56 games under Hunter. He had 42 in 49 after that article was written. Just because he failed in the hastily-implemented crappy BB trap, doesn't mean he wasn't productive under Dale, and definitely doesn't show that he'd be a failure under Trotz.

Edit: I might not be able to add.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

We're talking about 2011 right? Good lord.

 

[BobRouse]

He scored 21 goals that year...the lowest since his rookie year when he played 50 games or so.

Semin had 4 pts in 14 playoff games under Hunter.

You know who else had 4pts under Hunter? Wait for it.......TROY BROUWER!

Hunter chose Keith Aucoin over him on PP1.

We're talking about 2011 right? Good lord.

Exactly. Semin isn't even the same player he was back then.

He's on the wrong side of 30 and was never one who kept in shape (he's a smoker right?)

He is coming off a significant wrist injury which affects THE strongest asset he has.


I can't believe any Caps fan actually is wanting him back at this point especially since he's on a 3 year contract and will have lower incentive.

 

[Raikkonen]

Btw, Tikhonov is linked with Pitts now too.

 

[Marshall]

That article was published on December 19th, 2011. Semin had 42 points in the remaining 49 games of the regular season afterwards.

And then had 6 goals and was a healthy scratch last season. (That was in the 2014-2015 season). And made $7 million. Those are the only relevant numbers.

strung's right - the Semin nonsense is just that. And, I'll say it again, there is no NHL fanbase more obsessed with bringing back former players than the Washington Capitals fanbase. It's like brainwashing or something - Stockholm Syndrome, I dunno, but it's broken. And sad.

 

[Hivemind]

Alex Ovechkin scored 38 goals that year... the lowest ever in a full season. How did he do under Trotz?

 

[Hivemind]

And then had 6 goals and was a healthy scratch last season. (That was in the 2014-2015 season). And made $7 million. Those are the only relevant numbers.

Under Bill Peters with a wrist injury.
The $7M isn't relevant if he's bought out or Carolina retains ~50% of his salary, which are the only two conditions I would take him back under. I already stated as much.

 

[BobRouse]

Alex Ovechkin scored 38 goals that year... the lowest ever in a full season. How did he do under Trotz?

Ovechkin actually scored 32 the year before that.

Ovie had 9pts in the playoffs under Hunter. The same as he had under Trotz.

Semin, in his prime, had Brouwer totals.

You guys want Brouwer out because his lack of production in the playoffs right?

Semin's last really good playoff year was 09-10. He was snake bitten and ended up with 0+2 in 7 games.

He has been bad (playoffs) since outside of the Ranger series in 10-11.

He is now 5 years removed from his prime and is coming off a horrible season and a bad injury.

There is no case to be made for him.

 

[Hivemind]

I want Brouwer demoted/gone because of a lot more than playoff numbers (although they do him no favors). I'm not the one who constantly brings up playoff numbers as some sort of trump card, and my post history has been critical of those who do. I don't think a bunch of games in a row against Henrik Lundqvist are generally a good barometer to measure a player.

 

[EroCaps]

Still wanting Semin back. Lol.

I cant even.

 

[SpinningEdge]

Man, if you look at a one year difference.... GMBM gives Orpik 5 years 5.5 million and this year lets Green walk FOR NOTHING.

I think 25 of 30 other GM's would say that's really, really, really, really stupid.

Yes, we have needed a guy like Orpik for a LONG TIME, but there are way cheaper options out there for guys like him.

Him and Carlson gave up by far the most goals this season out of all our defenders. Makes no sense we have him for 4 more years when he's in his mid thirties and we let a guy like Green (better possession numbers, did well in Trotz's role for him and system, best +/- on team while having much weaker linemates, younger) just walk for NOTHING. I have no problem signing Orpik and overpaying him - but NOT when you let a better player walk a year later who is way more valuable. If Caps signed Green to Orpiks contract he's 100x more valuable in getting something in return in the future if it doesn't work out. Orpiks contract is basically unmovable with a lot more risks (again, in my opinion).

Add in the fact Holtby is still stuck in neutral with his negotiations (if he would have committed to him early in the year he would of been TWICE as cheap), the trades he made didn't pan out at all or benefit us at all in the playoffs, and now is losing two of the top 15 free agents (3 of the top 20 if you include Fehr) while saying he's not going to be aggressive/sign anyone in free agency first few days... then It's just not a good overall first year IMO.

There has not been a team friendly deal, difference making trade, or even a deal that is in the multi-millions yet that isn't considered overpaid.

It's WAYYYYYY too early to judge him as It's still been just one year, but I think this fan base should look very closely at how he orchestrates the team this summer. So far he had what experts say was the worst FA signing last year, has costs the teams millions of dollars for being stubborn and not negotiating with Holtby early in the year when everyone on this board has been saying we should lock him up for a couple years now, and just how he has been in GMGM's front office system for liek a decade, which couldn't have been good for him (in my opinion). Add in the fact that he's a first time GM here still trying to figure things out and I think we should be a little concerned.

I hope I'm very wrong, but so far I haven't been too impressed. If his three big deals since being here is Nisky 5.75 or 7 years, Orpik 5 years for 5.5, and now Holtby for somethign like 7 and 7 (when he would of been twice as cheap earlier on in the season), lets Green, Ward, and Fehr most likely walk for nothign - and that's NOT impressive. Any GM could have done that... Seriously, any of us could sign Orpik for his contract, Nisky his contract, and now just waited it out and now have to pay Holtby top 5 or top 10 goalie money...

 

[BobRouse]

I want Brouwer demoted/gone because of a lot more than playoff numbers (although they do him no favors). I'm not the one who constantly brings up playoff numbers as some sort of trump card, and my post history has been critical of those who do. I don't think a bunch of games in a row against Henrik Lundqvist are generally a good barometer to measure a player.

I'll say this.

I think for some teams Semin would be a good risk. He can be a very effective player assuming his wrist heals and he is put in the right situaiton.

To make that risk palatable (even at 50% salary retention) he would have to go to a team that has plenty of cap space who can afford to take it.

He'd have to go to a team that plays a less defensively demanding style of play and without a coach like Therrien, Trotz, Hitch

He's just a bad fit for the Caps for multiple reasons in addition to these including his questionable locker room situation with some of his teamates.

Seriously, any of us could sign Orpik for his contract, Nisky his contract, and now just waited it out and now have to pay Holtby top 5 or top 10 goalie money...

Both Orpik and Niskanen had better offers from other teams.