Speculation: Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap Part XLVIII

[BobRouse]

Did Chicago acquiring Richards and Vermette to slot ahead of Teravainen cost them?
Should Los Angeles have paved the way for youth to step up instead of acquiring Richards and Carter?
How did Buffalo slotting Hodgson into the top center spot work out for them?

We're already faced with the reality that Kuznetsov is going to have to be the 2C next season. That's putting youth in a bigger position. They don't need to compound that risk by having Burakovsky and Wilson also in key positions or guys like Galiev or Vrana as regulars.

Chicago would have won without those guys and they would have their 1st rounder too.

LA didn't have guys ready when they acquired Carter and Richards.

Hodgson was an overrated player on a terrible team. Poor comparison.

Kuznetsov was one of our most dangerous players in the post season and towards the end of the season when he had his chance.

Burakovsky should have been in the top 6 all season.

I think its a forgone conclusion that Kuz and Bura will be in the top 6 next year. They have already proven they belong in those roles. Wilson is iffy but I have faith in him and the org is constantly saying they need to find him more TOI..but that becomes hard to do when you acquire expensive aging vets to slot ahead of him.

You can't hide these young players forever and expect them to develop. At some point they have to be given the reigns. They proved towards the end of the season and in the playoffs that they got what it takes.

 

[Hivemind]

Chicago would have won without those guys and they would have their 1st rounder too.

Brad Richards had 7 points in the Western Conference Finals against Anaheim. He also assisted on both goals in the final game of the season. I wouldn't be so confident that they win without him.
Vermette wasn't great, but he allowed Kruger to slot into a more comfortable defense-oriented role and for Teravainen to play on the wing.

LA didn't have guys ready when they acquired Carter and Richards.

Wayne Simmonds was already in the NHL and Brayden Schenn was pushing for a spot. They traded them both for Richards.

Hodgson was an overrated player on a terrible team. Poor comparison.

Any more poor than you bringing up Jagr for me saying don't overslot young players?

Kuznetsov was one of our most dangerous players in the post season and towards the end of the season when he had his chance.

No contest there. However, I don't value a 10 game streak in the playoffs as much as you do, apparently. Just because he finished hot doesn't mean it will automatically carry over. I'm absolutely hoping it does, but I have my reservations.

Burakovsky should have been in the top 6 all season.

Nope. He should have spent more time in the AHL.

I think its a forgone conclusion that Kuz and Bura will be in the top 6 next year. They have already proven they belong in those roles. Wilson is iffy but I have faith in him and the org is constantly saying they need to find him more TOI..but that becomes hard to do when you acquire expensive aging vets to slot ahead of him.

You can't hide these young players forever and expect them to develop. At some point they have to be given the reigns. They proved towards the end of the season and in the playoffs that they got what it takes.

They were given the reigns at various points in the season, and only Kuznetsov was able to hang onto them. Wilson floundered on the top line and was demoted because too many possessions ended on his stick. Burakovsky was gifted an opportunity in the top six he clearly wasn't ready for, and ended up seeing his ice time dwindle as he continued to struggle defensively. Give them opportunities, sure. Don't make those opportunities the default option. Bring in guys who can carry the load if required. Players get hurt and lines change all the time. Even if you bring in established players, the young guys will get opportunities. It's up to them to show that they deserve them. It's up to them to prove they're the best option. Don't giftwrap them a spot and then end up struggling when they're overmatched.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Wilson on the 3rd line is already a promotion, and one I'm not convinced he's automatically ready for.
I'd rather not have both Burakovsky and Kuznetsov penciled into top 6 slots from the get go. If they both outperform the other options, awesome, let them get all the ice time. However, I have no issue with Burakovsky as a 3rd/4th liner with PP2 time when the team is fully healthy. Kuznetsov will be the default 2C out of necessity.

50-60 from Kuznetsov would be awesome. But I put a lot less faith in a good 10 game streak than many posters around here.

What are the other options ? Brouwer, Fehr and Chimera ?
They'll outperform them easily.

Burakovsky in the bottom 6 is wasting his skill. We pay grinders like Beagle or Latta to do that, Bura will fit in nicely with Kuz and MJ.

This is my lineup for next year, assuming they don't find a way to get rid of Brouwer and Laich :

Ovechkin - Backstrom - off season acquisition
Johansson - Kuznetsov - Burakovsky
Chimera - Fehr - Brouwer
Laich - Latta - Wilson
Galiev

Orpik - Carlson
Alzner - Niskanen
Schmidt - Orlov
Oleksy

Holtby
Grubauer
Peters

PP1 :
Kuznetsov - Backstrom - off season acquisition
Ovechkin - Carlson

PP2 :
Johansson - Brouwer - Burakovsky
Ovechkin - Niskanen

 

[Hivemind]

What are the other options ? Brouwer, Fehr and Chimera ?
They'll outperform them easily.

We don't know what the roster will look like next season. The post that started this debate was about how, barring trades, this will be a worse team next year than it was this year. Hopefully they bring in some legitimate top 6 options via trade.

Burakovsky in the bottom 6 is wasting his skill. We pay grinders like Beagle or Latta to do that, Bura will fit in nicely with Kuz and MJ.

No, it's not. The bottom six is not just for grinders. Chicago had guys like Teravainen, Vermette, and Kruger in their bottom six. They had Frolik and Saad there last time they won the Cup. You can find similar cases for other teams with recent success.

Not to mention that Johansson-Kuznetsov-Burakovsky might be the worst line in the NHL at getting pucks out of the corners and winning board battles. Kuznetsov would be the only player on that line that can protect the puck in any capacity, and even he struggles at actually taking the puck away from other players along the boards.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

Brad Richards had 7 points in the Western Conference Finals against Anaheim. He also assisted on both goals in the final game of the season. I wouldn't be so confident that they win without him.
Vermette wasn't great, but he allowed Kruger to slot into a more comfortable defense-oriented role and for Teravainen to play on the wing.

Vermette had 2 GWGs in the finals when Chicago's offense as a whole went cold (13 goals in a 6 game series).

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

We don't know what the roster will look like next season. The post that started this debate was about how, barring trades, this will be a worse team next year than it was this year. Hopefully they bring in some legitimate top 6 options via trade.


No, it's not. The bottom six is not just for grinders. Chicago had guys like Teravainen, Vermette, and Kruger in their bottom six. They had Frolik and Saad there last time they won the Cup. You can find similar cases for other teams with recent success.

Not to mention that Johansson-Kuznetsov-Burakovsky might be the worst line in the NHL at getting pucks out of the corners and winning board battles. Kuznetsov would be the only player on that line that can protect the puck in any capacity, and even he struggles at actually taking the puck away from other players along the boards.

What would your lineup look like ?

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

Wilson on the 3rd line is already a promotion, and one I'm not convinced he's automatically ready for.
I'd rather not have both Burakovsky and Kuznetsov penciled into top 6 slots from the get go. If they both outperform the other options, awesome, let them get all the ice time. However, I have no issue with Burakovsky as a 3rd/4th liner with PP2 time when the team is fully healthy. Kuznetsov will be the default 2C out of necessity.

50-60 from Kuznetsov would be awesome. But I put a lot less faith in a good 10 game streak than many posters around here.

Kuznetsov was, in my opinion, the best forward on the team post AS break. He steadily improved all year and you could see the points were on the way. I don't think his strong play is in any way, shape, or form defined by a 10 game stretch in the postseason.

 

[Hivemind]

What would your lineup look like ?

Kuznetsov as 2C
Burakovsky as 3/4W
Wilson as 4RW
A net gain of one top six forward from outside the organization

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Kuznetsov as 2C
Burakovsky as 3/4W
Wilson as 4RW
A net gain of one top six forward from outside the organization

Out of curiosity could you list your forward lineup?

Why not put Burakovsky in the top 6? The kid has shown he has all the tools to succeed. The more ice time he get the better, imho.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Kuznetsov as 2C
Burakovsky as 3/4W
Wilson as 4RW
A net gain of one top six forward from outside the organization

Who do you have on the wings ? Can you give more detail ?

 

[Hivemind]

Ovechkin - Backstrom - X1
X2 - Kuznetsov - X3
Burakovsky - X4 - X5
Chimera - X6 - Wilson

X1=Ward, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X2= Johansson, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X3= Ward, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X4= Laich or outside acquisition
X5= Brouwer, Ward, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X6= Beagle, Laich, or Latta
As mentioned previously, a net gain of at least one outside forward is required in the top six

Shuffle lines as appropriate for chemistry/coach's intent.

My lineup is obviously more about what I do not find acceptable than specific personnel. Top six help is required. Slotting purely youth into important roles is a step backwards. Center depth is still an issue (Beagle and Fehr are not adequate as 3Cs on this team).

Why not put Burakovsky in the top 6? The kid has shown he has all the tools to succeed. The more ice time he get the better, imho.

Did you not read the last two pages?

 

[caps8]

Most important thing this off-season: #2 RW, line 1 should and hopefully will be: 8-19-65. Johansson-Kuznetsov-legit top 6 winger should be the goal for the 2nd line.

 

[Hivemind]

If Burakovsky is tried at 1RW and sticks, awesome.
If Burakovsky is Plan A for 1RW, we're in trouble.

 

[Raikkonen]

Kuz will probably start the season as 1C. Because of reasons... I mean Backstrom's injury. There is a chance he will stay there just because of his speed (matching with Ovi).

Johansson-Burakovsky-? will be the 2nd line. When Backstrom's back we will see Jojo-Backs-? line instead, and maybe even with Burakovsky, depending on his previous play.

So Chimera-Latta-Ward is 4th line, Wilson promoted to the 3rd... or 1st?! Kinda obvious Wilson isn't 3rd liner yet.

1st: AO + EK + ? (Ward/TW/newGuy)
2nd: NB + AB/MJ + ? (Mojo/AB/newGuy)
3rd: Fehr? + Laich? + Mojo/AB/Ward/TW
4th: Chimera + Latta + Beagle

One guy from the list is the #13F already. Something is wrong (Fehr or Ward isn't resigned then).

 

[Raikkonen]

Btw, Wardo is right handed PP slot player who played that role already. Another plus for him.

 

[pman25]

I'm still on board for Patrick Sharp. I just don't want to give up #22 to get him. Those picks from the glencross trade sure would come in handy about now

 

[EroCaps]

Yeah, they need to re-tool the top 6 and bring in 1 if not 2 legit goal scorers.

They should have traded Mike Green, but **** common sense, right?

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

I wouldnt mind Semin back if he is bought out.

 

[Bananas]

Can we squeeze a top six C and a top 4 type D in if we subtract Green, Laich, Brouwer and one FA?

Retain Kuz and Holtby as well obviously?

That would be the Full Monty offseason imo...

Backstrom, Kuz, New C down the middle, D depth, and a good/great goalie. At that point it's about chemistry and who slots in on the wings outside of Ovechkin...

That's probably a tweak or two from the Cup style roster.

The only question is can we fit that as our core roster with enough room left over to fill out the wings? Stud depth down the middle + D and G is the path to glory if you ask me...

 

[malyk]

I was curious to see what some comparable players are to Mojo and his 47 points. My gut tells me that despite what we all want him to be he's actually a very valuable player. So, the comps...wingers with 45 to 49 points.

Mats Zuccarello - 49pts, 27yrs, $3.5m
Mike Hoffman - 48pts, 25yrs, $750k
Marian Gaborik - 47pts, 33yrs, $4.875m
Brendan Gallagher - 47pts, 23yrs, $3.75m
Loui Eriksson - 47pts, 29yrs, $4.25m
Marcus Johansson - 47pts, 24yrs, $2m
Jaromir Jagr - 47pts, 43yrs, $3.5m
Chris Kreider - 46pts, 24yrs, $2.475m
Kevin Hayes - 45pts, 23yrs, $3.75m

That's it, that's your list. It looks like Gallagher, Kreider, and Hayes are his salary/age comps, which probably puts him in the $3.75-$4.25m range (given yearly salary inflation). Which seems like a lot for him, but look at where the guys above play in the lineup (from random game day threads for each team.

Zuccarell: 1RW
Hoffman: 1LW
Gaborik: 1LW
Gallagher: 1RW
Eriksson: 1RW
Johansson: 2LW
Jagr: 1RW
Kreider: 2LW
Hayes: 3C (did he play center more? NHL.com has him as a wing in the stats list. shrug)

Anyway, it looks like MOJO is about in line with pay/performance at ~$4m give or take. Which, yeah, feels crazy, but that's what it costs for a 40-50pt player.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Ovechkin - Backstrom - X1
X2 - Kuznetsov - X3
Burakovsky - X4 - X5
Chimera - X6 - Wilson

X1=Ward, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X2= Johansson, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X3= Ward, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X4= Laich or outside acquisition
X5= Brouwer, Ward, Fehr, or outside acquisition
X6= Beagle, Laich, or Latta
As mentioned previously, a net gain of at least one outside forward is required in the top six

Shuffle lines as appropriate for chemistry/coach's intent.

My lineup is obviously more about what I do not find acceptable than specific personnel. Top six help is required. Slotting purely youth into important roles is a step backwards. Center depth is still an issue (Beagle and Fehr are not adequate as 3Cs on this team).

Did you not read the last two pages?

The problem is that Ward isn't likely to come back and Fehr isn't good enough for a top 6 role. He's our 3C, that's where he fits best, if he comes back.

 

[Raikkonen]

Anyway, it looks like MOJO is about in line with pay/performance at ~$4m give or take. Which, yeah, feels crazy, but that's what it costs for a 40-50pt player.

The problem is with his potential. Now he's middle-6 player who's getting top-6 role out of necessity. He's also a 1PP player because we didn't have better for a long time.

That's where his stats came from.

Add 2-3 young guys (recent 1st rounders) and 1 legit top-6 from the outside... and Mojo quickly becomes 3rd liner. Lessen his PP TOI - and there is no 47 points anymore.

Boom! Another Laich. Just imagine one more concussion.

 

[Raikkonen]

So what's our 3x3 OT lineup?

Kuz-Bura-Carlson? =)

 

[NeilYoung]

I'm perfectly fine with Bura being the 1st line right wing, the fancy stats with him and regular stats were unbelievable. I guess you could question if he would wear out a bit over a whole season

Getting someone to play on the second line then would be the task

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say Semin scores more ES goals this year than anyone on the Caps not named Ovechkin. I know, it sounds crazy trying to outscore ES superstars Johansson, Brouwer, Chimera, and Backstrom, but I'm a crazy guy.

I also found this funny, in a very sad way. Semin has the same number of playoff goals for the Caps since 2011 as Johansson, Brouwer, and Laich. Let that wash over you. A guy with a fork in him, who hasn't played for the team in 3 years, has as many playoff goals as 1/2 of the team's top 6 wingers since that time and another that is being paid like one.

Watching the playoffs showed how far behind the team is compared to the Tampas and Chicagos of the league skillwise. If they can pick up Semin without adding any salary, I'm on board. Definitely won't be popular opinion, but I don't care. Watching the team flame out in the playoffs because no one can score < moody, skilled player who may or may not have burned an equipment bag.

You know what, it doesn't surprise me, but Literally who cares!? The dude is an influence we don't need on the team. He's got skill, but little heart and no desire to be great. He's never really clicked with any linemates for long and Ovy was his only supporter. He earned a fat contract and is now close to playing himself out of the NHL. Only a hardcore Semin fan would want him back at his salary, much less bringing that enigma back into the lockeroom.