Post-Game Talk: Abbotsford Canucks | Def. in Round 2

[The Stig]

My half season pack is set to auto renew and I don't plan on changing that anytime soon.

My end of season thoughts after season 2 of having the ticket pack:

The crowds were night and day different from last year to this year. Last year, you could guarantee a max capacity of 50%. This year, I'd bet it didn't drop below 50% the entire second half of the season.

The gametime experience has improved as well. Still minor kinks to work out.

As attendance goes up, the concourse and parking situations get worse. I'd be all for selling the naming rights to the building to get some cash for some renovations. It's becoming very obvious that the building hasn't been touched since the Heat played there.

Surrounding area could also use a few new additions. Yes it's essentially attached to UFV but there's nothing food wise around it until you cross the highway.

They could also stand expanding the team store. I'm still pissed that Rogers Arenas team store has more and better Abby merch than the store in Abbotsford does. Also we need a cool 3rd jersey.

 

[Huggy43]

Apparently Raty has been fighting the flu (asked Dhali during their show)

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Wonder how much turnover there is going to be next year. I believe this is who we have under contract - (I am guessing Hirose and Hoglander start with the big club at this stage. Sheldon Dries is also signed for another year - whether the Canucks keep him with the big club for depth or not remains to be seen)

Goalie:
Arturs Silovs
Spencer Martin
Mikita Talapila

Defense:
Jett Woo
Jack Rathbone
Filip Johansson
Cole McWard
Quinn Schmiemann (AHL Deal)

Forward:
Arshdeep Bains
Max Sasson
Aatu Raty
Danila Klimovich
Josh Bloom
Linus Karlsson
Aidan McDonough
Chase Wouters (AHL Deal)
Vincent Arseneau (AHL Deal)

Lot of holes to fill. As I mentioned before, it would be good to see Nielsen rewarded with an NHL contract to keep him in the organization. I’m curious to see what his ceiling is. He reminds me a bit of Matt Cooke (minus all the cheap shots).

 

[Svencouver]

The transformation of our farm franchise under new management has been one of their biggest wins. I love Colliton and the culture they're building down there. It's going to pay dividends for the Canucks in short order

 

[theguardianII]

The transformation of our farm franchise under new management has been one of their biggest wins. I love Colliton and the culture they're building down there. It's going to pay dividends for the Canucks in short order

Careful optimism should be used.

It is great the team did well getting into the second round and the younger players got rewarded for hard work and dedication.

 

[VanJack]

This might sound like hyperbole, but in the mostly sorry history of the Canucks and their minor league farm teams, this goes down as the most successful season ever.

Through mostly forgettable journeys through Utica, Manitoba, Chicago, Syracuse, Tulsa, Dallas, Fredericton, Hamilton, Milwaukee, Kansas City and Seattle, one thing remained constant.

The team was mostly in constant danger of being uprooted, and very few players who marinated on the farm ever amounted to hill of beans in Vancouver, Manitoba might have been the best of lot with guys like Bieksa, Schneider, Tanev and Burrows spending time there.

But this year was a complete flip of the switch. Almost every guy who's still legitimately 'a prospect' improved dramatically. The team was fast and exciting, and fans filled the barn. And Jeremy Colliton might be one of the best coaches outside the NHL.

Finally!....it only took 53 years.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

One of the few bright spots for Canucks fans this year. Glad to see some prospects actually developing rather than just languishing or being fast tracked to the bigs before they were ready.
It looks like we have a handful of guys who could well take the next step at some point. Probably no stars, but some good mid-level guys and some depth guys. Not too bad, all things considered.

 

[The Stig]

This might sound like hyperbole, but in the mostly sorry history of the Canucks and their minor league farm teams, this goes down as the most successful season ever.

Through mostly forgettable journeys through Utica, Manitoba, Chicago, Syracuse, Tulsa, Dallas, Fredericton, Hamilton, Milwaukee, Kansas City and Seattle, one thing remained constant.

The team was mostly in constant danger of being uprooted, and very few players who marinated on the farm ever amounted to hill of beans in Vancouver, Manitoba might have been the best of lot with guys like Bieksa, Schneider, Tanev and Burrows spending time there.

But this year was a complete flip of the switch. Almost every guy who's still legitimately 'a prospect' improved dramatically. The team was fast and exciting, and fans filled the barn. And Jeremy Colliton might be one of the best coaches outside the NHL.

Finally!....it only took 53 years.

Utica went to the finals one year

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Utica went to the finals one year

Utica as a market was full bodied in its support of the Comets. The fan support and the work on the ground of the staff there was great. The issue was always that our idiot “brain trust” didn’t care too much about it.

The Moose were a strong farm affiliate as well - probably a bit more symmetry in terms of fan support and organizational support.

But Abbotsford has been the best of both worlds so far. Being right in the big club’s back yard has been very advantageous in terms of recruiting on and off ice talent, the fans have bought in completely, and the product has been very strong thus far.

 

[Hoglander]

In Utica, nobody-vets were played in the playoffs instead of (at the time) new acquisition legit prospects, like McCann and Hutton- who were both in the NHL only a few months later. Then there was the year that was split with the Blues affiliate where the Blues dictated the goalie situation. In Abbottsford, we've already seen the dedication to playing prospects - It was only a few practices before Johansson was seeing playoff games. That would not have happened in Utica.

 

[RobertKron]

In Utica, nobody-vets were played in the playoffs instead of (at the time) new acquisition legit prospects, like McCann and Hutton- who were both in the NHL only a few months later. Then there was the year that was split with the Blues affiliate where the Blues dictated the goalie situation. In Abbottsford, we've already seen the dedication to playing prospects - It was only a few practices before Johansson was seeing playoff games. That would not have happened in Utica.

I don't really see why it couldn't have happened in Utica - The Canucks owned the team. Those situations arose out of decisions made by the Canucks.

 

[THRILLHOIAF]

The Canucks owned the team.

technically, no. Utica and it's arena were owned by Robert Esche and his local group. Canucks were paid by them to be their affiliate. Ownership saved money by not having to take care of the barn, marketing, day to day etc etc, they just had to pay for the rosters and per diems for the players and part of the travel iirc. It was a deal that benefitted their wallet and that's it.

 

[RobertKron]

technically, no. Utica and it's arena were owned by Robert Esche and his local group. Canucks were paid by them to be their affiliate. Ownership saved money by not having to take care of the barn, marketing, day to day etc etc, they just had to pay for the rosters and per diems for the players and part of the travel iirc. It was a deal that benefitted their wallet and that's it.

The Canucks owned the AHL franchise - formerly the Peoria Riverman - and moved it to Utica. The day to day structure was one the Canucks agreed upon. This wasn't a simple affiliation agreement with an existing, independent AHL team like when they were set up with, say, Chicago or the Moose. The Canucks hired the team's GM, POHO, and the coaching staff.

The Canucks moved the franchise to Abbotsford, and the current Utica Comets are the former Binghampton team, which moved there as a replacement.

 

[VanJack]

I tend to agree......amongst all the Canucks' magical mystery tour of AHL and Central Hockey League cities, Utica was probably the best of the lot.

The fans in Utica were passionate about the team; and the atmosphere was great. Problem was, it was in the midst of the Benning era, And so many draft picks were traded; and so many were outright flops, that the Utica roster was mostly sprinkled with veterans and AHL-lifers.

And the team was 3,000 miles from Vancouver--so it made emergency call-ups all but impossible unless the Canucks were already playing in the Eastern time zone.

But looking at the current Canucks roster, there doesn't seem to be a single guy other than Demko, who spent any time with Utica, and is still playing for them. Horvat spent a few games there, but of course he's gone.

So if the the purpose of your AHL farm team is to turn prospects into NHL players--then Utica was less than a sterling success.

 

[credulous]

let's not forget that it was only in the last few years a west coast ahl team was really feasible at all. abbotsford with calgary, coachella, henderson and colorado is a whole different story than abbotsford when the nearest team was in stockton or winnipeg. utica was fine for the time the canucks owned it. can't blame the lack of development on distance

 

[RobertKron]

I tend to agree......amongst all the Canucks' magical mystery tour of AHL and Central Hockey League cities, Utica was probably the best of the lot.

The fans in Utica were passionate about the team; and the atmosphere was great. Problem was, it was in the midst of the Benning era, And so many draft picks were traded; and so many were outright flops, that the Utica roster was mostly sprinkled with veterans and AHL-lifers.

And the team was 3,000 miles from Vancouver--so it made emergency call-ups all but impossible unless the Canucks were already playing in the Eastern time zone.

But looking at the current Canucks roster, there doesn't seem to be a single guy other than Demko, who spent any time with Utica, and is still playing for them. Horvat spent a few games there, but of course he's gone.

So if the the purpose of your AHL farm team is to turn prospects into NHL players--then Utica was less than a sterling success.

Utica can't really be compared to the others, as the Canucks controlled the franchise, which makes it a completely different relationship. Even with that advantage, I still think you're way off.

Manitoba was about as good a situation as you could ever possibly hope for in an affiliate franchise. Those powerhouse Canucks rosters were peppered with players that developed in Manitoba, and aside from draftees like Bieksa, Kesler, Tanev, Raymond, Edler, Schneider, Hansen, who came up through the Moose, it was the Moose who found Rick Rypien, Alex Burrows, and others who eventually made their way to the Canucks.

Along with that, the Moose also had strong fan support, and the franchise was obviously as well-run and professional an environment as any, given that the affiliation ended because they basically became the Jets. I don't think there's any other realistic answer.

 

[sting101]

Manitoba Moose was as good as you could have hoped for. The only reason Abby is better is because of logistics that were not advantageous at the time (that Credulous pointed out)

Being so close to the NHL team and having the access of skills/development coaches (Sedins) trainers facilities communications and a management group that is cognizant of having a deep and competitive farm team and adding those players is what makes Abbotsford a 5 star development situation

 

[VanJack]

Abby Canucks probably deserved a better fate in their series against Calgary. I thought they actually carried the play in a number of those games, but just couldn't get that big goal against Wolf. The critical loss was game #2 when they had a 3-l lead entering the third period, but couldn't close it out.

And their PP let them down badly and was the difference in the series. Also losing Raty and then Stevens down the middle, really meant that they were forced to become basically a 'one-line' team.

But that's the playoffs for you. Between two evenly matched teams, it usually comes down to goaltending, special teams and injury depth.

 

[MS]

Did people just forget about the entire Manitoba Moose era?

 

[Hit the post]

Did people just forget about the entire Manitoba Moose era?

other than the time they let Stan Smyl coach the team for some reason (when he had pretty much ZERO experience at that job). But I'll give the organization a mulligan for that one (nobody is perfect).

 

[RobertKron]

Manitoba Moose was as good as you could have hoped for. The only reason Abby is better is because of logistics that were not advantageous at the time (that Credulous pointed out)

Being so close to the NHL team and having the access of skills/development coaches (Sedins) trainers facilities communications and a management group that is cognizant of having a deep and competitive farm team and adding those players is what makes Abbotsford a 5 star development situation

One benefit of the affiliation with the Moose over owning their own team is that the two franchises worked so well together that it basically gave the Canucks a bonus, extra semi-independent scouting group. Heisinger found a number of players that went on to eventually sign with the Canucks - Alex Burrows is probably never a Canuck if they weren't affiliated with the Moose.

 

[RobertKron]

Utica went to the finals one year

The Moose only missed the playoffs once in ten years, and made the AHL finals in 08-09.

 

[MS]

One benefit of the affiliation with the Moose over owning their own team is that the two franchises worked so well together that it basically gave the Canucks a bonus, extra semi-independent scouting group. Heisinger found a number of players that went on to eventually sign with the Canucks - Alex Burrows is probably never a Canuck if they weren't affiliated with the Moose.

And Rick Rypien, and a guy like Josh Green who gave the team some pretty useful hockey also started as a Moose PTO.

 

[RobertKron]

And Rick Rypien, and a guy like Josh Green who gave the team some pretty useful hockey also started as a Moose PTO.

Jason Jaffrey as well, also I think Patrick Coulombe, and Alex Bolduc. Justin Kurtz was with the IHL Moose before they became the Canucks' affiliate and I believe he came along with them and got a contract out of camp.

 

[fergo]

other than the time they let Stan Smyl coach the team for some reason (when he had pretty much ZERO experience at that job). But I'll give the organization a mulligan for that one (nobody is perfect).

Smyl was a holdover from Vancouver's affiliations with the Syracuse Crunch and Kansas City Blades. Him continuing as head coach was a Canucks decision. I'm sure Moose owner Mark Chipman would have preferred Randy Carlyle stay on as head coach of the Moose, as he was for most of their tenure in the IHL, but I guess Burkey felt otherwise. Eventually, that ended up coming true, but it took the whole Fedor Fedorov situation in 2003-04 that nearly caused the end of the affiliation (along with other matters) for it to happen.