Post-Game Talk: #57 FLYERS 5 at Wild 4, Tuesday, Feb. 12, 2019, 8:00 pm ET

[GKJ]

I don't see a lot of risk involved with carrying him. 4.5M is a pretty reasonable cap hit even if he isn't playing his best. Also his salary past next year is like 3M so it wouldn't be hard to send him to a low cap team looking for a cheap reclamation project if his production stays down. Plus there will be another buy out on the way, plus he could be exposed at the expansion draft if need be.

I don't think any of that will happen or be necessary but I doubt he drops off so badly in the middle of his prime that a 4.5M cap hit becomes some unmovable anchor.

I agree with your evaluation of the player, I’m just not convinced they see it that way.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

The sarcasm on this last page is strong. You guys are the best.
I am not sure if I want to break up Sanheim and Provorov right now. Provorov is a thoroughbred. He can keep jumping over the boards all night long. He still has some issues going on but he is still young and hasn’t come close to hitting his peak yet.
Gordon isn’t a good coach but I don’t blame him for riding Provorov and Sanheim last night. They were feeling it last night and may have been the reason Ghosts minutes were down and yes its ridiculous he got less time then Hagg and AMAC

 

[FlyTimmo]

I agree he was their best and deserving of the Ashbee, but I strongly disagree with the notion that he was miles better than Provorov last season.

Miles? Probably not. But, I don't think it was a fuzzy gap. He was better all season long.

 

[FlyTimmo]

24 points is not a small margin. Their defense was far closer than that gap.

Ghost was easily better last year.

Ghost was one of the best defenseman in the entire NHL when it came to zone entry defense and zone exits. His stick work was phenomenal, which made up for him getting bodied in the corners. Provorov was more of a workhorse, but I don't think it is a stretch to say Ghost was just as good defensively last year as Provorov, in a minute per minute basis.

 

[deadhead]

Actually, Ghost has yet to have a good playoff series in two tries.
He wasn't terrible last year, had some bad luck and goalies that magnified every mistake.
But it was obvious that the Pens targeted him with an aggressive forecheck.
Provorov was heads and shoulders above him.

The point is to win the Cup, a playoff "sample" isn't like the regular season, every player has slumps over 82 games, but only some players can raise their game in the playoffs on a consistent basis - motivation is rarely an issue.

Couts didn't have a very good playoff at age 21, in 2013-14. injured in 2016 and dominated last year.
But then, none of the forwards did in 2014, they only scored 6 ES goals.
The best forwards were Giroux, B Schenn and Akeson (go figure, playing 4th line minutes).
The best defensemen were Streit and Kimmo.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Pretty much everyone to a man was dominated last year. It didn’t take a dummy last year to know it was a bad matchup for the Flyers from the players to the coaching staff

 

[Beef Invictus]

Actually, Ghost has yet to have a good playoff series in two tries.
He wasn't terrible last year, had some bad luck and goalies that magnified every mistake.
But it was obvious that the Pens targeted him with an aggressive forecheck.
Provorov was heads and shoulders above him.

The point is to win the Cup, a playoff "sample" isn't like the regular season, every player has slumps over 82 games, but only some players can raise their game in the playoffs on a consistent basis - motivation is rarely an issue.

Couts didn't have a very good playoff at age 21, in 2013-14. injured in 2016 and dominated last year.
But then, none of the forwards did in 2014, they only scored 6 ES goals.
The best forwards were Giroux, B Schenn and Akeson (go figure, playing 4th line minutes).
The best defensemen were Streit and Kimmo.

Two tries with a coach who went into a fetal shell in one series and got brutally handled by Sullivan, who always abused him. I wouldn't judge anyone based on those series. Nobody was used well or put in position to win.


It's also funny seeing the PP mentioned to bash Ghost....as if Giroux, Simmonds, and Voracek aren't also way down. People even saddled Ghost with the lions share of blame for the PP, but that stopped once he was removed and the struggles continued.

 

[Striiker]

Ghost was one of the best defenseman in the entire NHL when it came to zone entry defense and zone exits. His stick work was phenomenal, which made up for him getting bodied in the corners. Provorov was more of a workhorse, but I don't think it is a stretch to say Ghost was just as good defensively last year as Provorov, in a minute per minute basis.

I agree completely.

Too often defense gets talked about as if it's just physical battles in front, along the boards, and blocking shots... ya know, the only things the stereotypical "heavy" defensemen are good at. Basically fighting and weathering the storm.

Meanwhile, Ghost is great at denying entry to the zone and moving the puck out of the zone... which I'd argue are the two most important parts of defending. Two things that prevent the opponent from even getting scoring opportunities, not just surviving them.

On top of that, puck possession in the offense zone is the ultimate way to prevent the other team from scoring. Put them on the defensive... don't just settle for trash defensemen going into a shell and hoping you get lucky.

 

[Mike1167]

Lol coots. But good game, good comeback. Bad refs yet again

I still can't get over the ref blowing the play dead on Patrick's "goal" against the Pens Monday night. That was just terrible.

 

[Adtar02]

I agree completely.

Too often defense gets talked about as if it's just physical battles in front, along the boards, and blocking shots... ya know, the only things the stereotypical "heavy" defensemen are good at. Basically fighting and weathering the storm.

Meanwhile, Ghost is great at denying entry to the zone and moving the puck out of the zone... which I'd argue are the two most important parts of defending. Two things that prevent the opponent from even getting scoring opportunities, not just surviving them.

On top of that, puck possession in the offense zone is the ultimate way to prevent the other team from scoring. Put them on the defensive... don't just settle for trash defensemen going into a shell and hoping you get lucky.

It that was the hakstol way. How can it be any other

 

[gertbfrobe16]

I still can't get over the ref blowing the play dead on Patrick's "goal" against the Pens Monday night. That was just terrible.

i was wondering how he didn't lose sight of the puck, on the crosby goal, after that one.

 

[Magua]

I would be okay if Fletcher got me a Spurgeon.

I like me some Spurgeon.

 

[GKJ]

I would be okay if Fletcher bought me a Spurgeon.

I like Spurgeon.

I have always liked Spurgeon

 

[Tripod]

Ghost is +1 under Gordon this year in 23 games.

 

[Mike1167]

Upon further review, I'm actually not convinced that JVR scored either of those goals. Looked to me like Simmer and Coots scored. It's tough to tell. I'll give JVR credit, though, for at least being in the mix to disrupt Dubnyk on both goals.

 

[baudib1]

I'm going to dismiss any judgments on individual Flyers' playoff prowess until we get to a conference finals with a competent coach. Samples of 12-19 games scattered over 5 years with awful head coaches in terrible matchups don't prove much of anything.

Ghost was one of the best big-game players in the history of college hockey, he's more than capable of rising to the occasion.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

I agree with your evaluation of the player, I’m just not convinced they see it that way.

Ahh gotcha. I have to say with a new management group coming in this is terrible timing for Ghost to be playing the way he is. I really hope Fletcher doesn't so anything rash.

 

[GKJ]

Ahh gotcha. I have to say with a new management group coming in this is terrible timing for Ghost to be playing the way he is. I really hope Fletcher doesn't so anything rash.

Basically everything that's happened thus far has been things the fans have been begging for. A change in the core of the team is coming up soon on both lists now. You just know there's a kick in the nuts coming and hopefully it doesn't hurt too bad.

 

[deadhead]

Ghost was one of the best big-game players in the history of college hockey, he's more than capable of rising to the occasion.

We will never see that Ghost again. I watched that championship game, before he was injured Ghost was special.

Since his injury, he's smarter and more disciplined but lacks that special quality that opened up the ice for him in college and as a rookie. Pittsburgh gave the league the blueprint to disrupt him, pressure him with fast forecheckers - and note it's not just Ghost, teams do that to our PP as a whole, and they're just learning to make faster decisions. One reason I think Myers might be perfect for Ghost as a partner is he can handle the dirty work and take the puck up ice when teams try to crowd Ghost.

 

[Adtar02]

Tend to think he was always smart and was coached to not do what he was best at. Won’t be surprised to hear he is injured. But his talent is so unique

 

[Larry44]

It's the most basic level of strategy in hockey. We are leading our division because we have a stupid amount of talent on our team, particularity on the back end we have really solid puckmovers for our league, but we would be so much better if not continuously looking for homerun passes. Usually once a game I intentionally ice a puck while pissed off looking at 3 forwards on the far blueline haha./rant

And then, as D, you carry it all the way, make it through their blue line, and have no one to pass to because all the fwds are standing still. Happens to Provorov every night.

 

[pit]

Upon further review, I'm actually not convinced that JVR scored either of those goals. Looked to me like Simmer and Coots scored. It's tough to tell. I'll give JVR credit, though, for at least being in the mix to disrupt Dubnyk on both goals.

JVR absolutely scored both.

On the first one Simmonds deflected first but then JVR deflected it down and through.

The second one seems less decisive because both he and Couts had sticks swipe the puck towards the crease, but it doesn't go right in. You can see once it is near Dubnyk Couts has his stick near JVR's hands while JVR is giving it the last nudge in past the line.

 

[Beef Invictus]

We will never see that Ghost again. I watched that championship game, before he was injured Ghost was special.

Since his injury, he's smarter and more disciplined but lacks that special quality that opened up the ice for him in college and as a rookie. Pittsburgh gave the league the blueprint to disrupt him, pressure him with fast forecheckers - and note it's not just Ghost, teams do that to our PP as a whole, and they're just learning to make faster decisions. One reason I think Myers might be perfect for Ghost as a partner is he can handle the dirty work and take the puck up ice when teams try to crowd Ghost.

I remember when people claimed Giroux would never be good again. He had gotten injuries and would just forever suck forever.


I wonder how that turned out

 

[Striiker]

I remember when people claimed Giroux would never be good again. He had gotten injuries and would just forever suck forever.


I wonder how that turned out

Ghost also got that "one good year" stuff during his second year. How'd his third year turn out? Not too bad.

 

[Starat327]

I remember when people claimed Giroux would never be good again. He had gotten injuries and would just forever suck forever.


I wonder how that turned out