Proposal: 5 trades involving Pacioretty (NYI, DAL, OTT, CGY, PHI, TB)

[lifelonghockeyfan]

I just find these "sign and trades" are really nonsense. They happen so rarely. Trade him if you want but trying to get maximum value in a signed Patches in mostly unrealistic. To get 1st rounders from teams that finished out of the playoffs and likely will never ....wishful thinking if you're a Habs fan

 

[CaptainCrunch67]

That package doesn't do anything for Calgary and Patches isn't worth a first round pick to Calgary. As it stands right now in Calgary's lineup, Patches would be a bottom 6 forward so he's not that interesting.

Calgary's left wing is Tkatchuk and Gaudreau. Calgary's right wing is Neal and Lindholm. Patches doesn't really fill any need.

Especially at the cost of a first round pick and Bennett.

 

[flyersfan018]

1) Islanders deal is right
2) Stars would have to add a good asset for us to take on 7.5m of Spezza, AND get Patches. Adding Lindgrwn amd a 3rd is overkill on Habs end.
3) Calgary doesnt need Patches. No deal to be had anyway.
4) Flyers deal is so lopsided for Philly,it hurts. Mete = Sanheim and in no world, does even 2 McDonalds equal a Pacioretty.
5) Tampa has no need for Patches. I also think there should be one prospect less. And the roster player be Johnson. We wouldnt give up the best player in the deal AND take a cap dump.

Lol in what world does Mete=Sanheim? I’d love to know.

 

[ohmyjlord]

Coming from a Montreal's fan point of view...

- Anthony Beauvillier
- 2020 Islanders 1st round draft pick


- Max Pacioretty (signed)
- Brett Lernout

I'd to this one, easily. Which probably means the Isles wouldn't.

- Jason Spezza
- Julius Honka
- 2020 Stars 1st round draft pick


- Erik Karlsson


- Max Pacioretty (signed)
- Mattias Janmark
- Charlie Lindgren
- 2019 Canadiens 3nd round draft pick

I don't think this one would work. Sens are looking for a very different package in return of Karlsson, chances are Spezza wouldn't agree to a trade to Montreal, and I'm not that crazy about Honka + 1st as a return for Pacioretty, especially with a cap dump.

- Troy Brouwer (for buy out)
- Sam Bennett
- 2020 1st round pick
- Jon Gillies


- Max Pacioretty (signed)
- Charlie Lindgren

I'm not doing that one personally. I used to be quite high on Bennett, but I'm not anymore. Gillies I kinda like, but we have no use for him, even if we trade Lindgren. A buyout of Brouwer would spread over 4 years, not touching that. I don't see enough value in there. Some may, because of Bennett...but I don't. Easy pass for me.

- Andrew MacDonald
- Travis Sanheim


- Max Pacioretty (signed)
- Victor Mete

A big no from me. I'm not at all interested in bringing MacDonald in, and I'd rather keep Mete over Sanheim if the cost is Pacioretty.

- 2020 Lightning 1st round draft pick
- Mathieu Joseph
- Slater Koekkoek
- Ryan Callahan (for buy out)


- Max Pacioretty (signed)
- Brett Lernout

Again, Callahan's buyout would spread over 4-years. Not enough value for that, at least not for me.

---

Overall, I just don't think you and I are looking for the same type of return in a Pacioretty's deal. Base in my opinion should be a decent-to-good prospect and a 1st round pick, straight-up. If a bad contract is added to the deal, the Habs should be compensated for it...especially if a buyout is required, and even more if it spreads over 4-years. We just got Armia, a 4th and a 7th for 1-year (2-year buyout) of Mason at $4.1m and an AHL player. So I'm expecting WAY more than if we take on a contract like Callahan or Brouwer...

 

[LordNeverLose]

Islanders THINK they are getting bent over because they are overrating Beau. I dont blame you. Everyone loves there players, but stats dont lie.

If you want to add a top 10 goal scorer in last 7 seasons. Its going to cost you. If you DONT want to pay the price, thats ok, but lets not pretend Beau's potential is worth more than Patches. Thats HF fantasy.

How about we just trade Barzal for Iginla. I mean, he is one of the highest goal scorers of the past 15 years

 

[LordNeverLose]

Arturri lehkonen scored 18 goals as a rookie (20 goal pace) at about the same age and people constantly stated he was a throwing piece and wasn't worth much but Beaulivier is? 20 goals but under 20 assists makes you. Middle six guy. Again think about what Andrew Shaw and Lars eller got traded for. They got 2 2nds. He isn't a second line guy yet, he might be but you can't value him as one at this moment, he may become a 25-25 guy and be a good second liner, he might become a 18-18 guy and be a decent third liner only time will tell.

I'll post this again since you seem to have ignored it:

Over their respective 40 last games of the season (when Beauvillier got put on Barzal's line instead of playing with guys like Tanner Fritz):

Beauvillier: 16 goals, 28 points
Pacioretty: 10 goals, 25 points

Beauvillier was also 20 years old and still has another year on his ELC.
Pacioretty was 29 and is a UFA in a year


There is a 0% chance Pacioretty could return Beauvillier lol. Also LMFAO at the comparisons to Lars Eller and Andrew Shaw hahahahahaha.​

 

[Price4Prez]

How about we just trade Barzal for Iginla. I mean, he is one of the highest goal scorers of the past 15 years

Im assuming you're just trying to be a smart arse, because you can't be that dense, to make that comparison. Clearly, the situation is completely different.

Also, reading your message under this one, comparing Patches and Beaus last 20 games. So you're basing Beau value on the last 20 games? Instead of Patches 7 seasons? I wonder which is the anamoly there.

Look. Beauvillier is a good player. I like him alot. He just isnt in that same league now.

Plenty of players almost score 20 goals. Paul Byron has the past 2 seasons...is Byron worth more than Beau and Patches? Cmon.

 

[Jray42]

Lol in what world does Mete=Sanheim? I’d love to know.

I've seen a few people insinuate that in this thread and I'm dumbfounded.

 

[xNogaitx]

Lol in what world does Mete=Sanheim? I’d love to know.

I think it's in the sense of the potential being there. It's no knock at all on Sanheim, Mete was pretty much a late round surprise to everyone (every year there's always that one guy showing up late to the show somehow.)

Mete's offensive game and poise at 19 with him being able to keep the pace with NHL players despite his frame is more than encouraging, but we'll have to wait another 5 years in all likelihood before knowing what his true worth his. Whereas Sanheim has a bigger frame and a much better defensive game but is only coming into the league at like 22-23 years of age, so some might believe that by that age, Mete's game will be much stronger than Sanheim's at that same age. (Mete was able to handle top 4 minutes at 19 years of age.)

Plus you got to factor in the fact of an asset that's 3 years younger with a much longer team control window ahead of him.

I think that's where the valuation takes place. Sanheim's ceiling was from the get-go much higher than Mete's, but then Mete has been surprising everyone and has scrambled the predictions on what he may become. You just look at the amount of undersized puck-moving defensemen that were picked as reaches in the first round this year as the perfect example of this.

 

[LordNeverLose]

Im assuming you're just trying to be a smart arse, because you can't be that dense, to make that comparison. Clearly, the situation is completely different.

Also, reading your message under this one, comparing Patches and Beaus last 20 games. So you're basing Beau value on the last 20 games? Instead of Patches 7 seasons? I wonder which is the anamoly there.

Look. Beauvillier is a good player. I like him alot. He just isnt in that same league now.

Plenty of players almost score 20 goals. Paul Byron has the past 2 seasons...is Byron worth more than Beau and Patches? Cmon.

40 games not 20, and even if Beauvillier was much worse than Patches right now a 21 y/o scoring 20 goals on his ELC is more valuable than a 30 y/o with one year left till UFA.

 

[Price4Prez]

40 games not 20, and even if Beauvillier was much worse than Patches right now a 21 y/o scoring 20 goals on his ELC is more valuable than a 30 y/o with one year left till UFA.

I dont think the Islanders are in any shape close to contending. I think Patches would be a mistake for them. In your shoes,Id keep Beau and the Elc and grow with Barzal and co.

I was just saying,right NOW...Beau isnt worth Patches.

 

[LordNeverLose]

I dont think the Islanders are in any shape close to contending. I think Patches would be a mistake for them. In your shoes,Id keep Beau and the Elc and grow with Barzal and co.

I was just saying,right NOW...Beau isnt worth Patches.

I don't know what to tell you man. Start a poll if you want. I'm sure the results would show that league-wide Beau has more value.

 

[WatchfulElm]

I don't know what to tell you man. Start a poll if you want. I'm sure the results would show that league-wide Beau has more value.

You might want to compare Beauvillier with a signed Pacioretty then, as this what is suggested in the trade. Of course, Pacioretty as a rental doesn't have the same value.

 

[voxel]

Lower cap hit i get even though most teams do not have cap issues.
The rental stuff i dont get. Nobody knows if it will turn into a Kane or a Stastny. He is as much a rental today as he will be later. A longer rental should cost more.

I believe you are looking at this from the Habs pov. Since they dont seem to get great value now, you hope he will rebound and resign him as it would dumb to trade a goal scorer on that lousy roster. If he doesnt rebound less teams will be interested and he might be the next JVR lost for nothing.

Rental stuff is important. Longer rental is not better because you don’t know what you have. Is he a 17 goal scorer with an off year or a consistent 25-30 scorer? He turned down a 6x6 contract from the Kings. And he’s not known to be a playoff performer either like Lucic. Offering him a Kane deal now is insane. Even 6x6 is a major risk. Besides, teams at the deadline know if they are making the playoffs or not and thus the true value of the 1st rd.

Most teams don’t have cap issues? Um, almost all of the cup contenders or wannabe playoff bound ones do except maybe Colorado.

Again, history has shown deadline deals is where you can get best value. It’s the risk the Habs must take.

 

[voxel]

You might want to compare Beauvillier with a signed Pacioretty then, as this what is suggested in the trade. Of course, Pacioretty as a rental doesn't have the same value.

It’s important that any future Patches contract must also be reasonable for him to have any value (or Habs sign and eat cap). If he is demanding 8Mx7 then he has no longer term value and basically the same as a rental.

 

[mja]

Why is Philly trading for a pricey winger exactly?

 

[CupHolders]

You might want to compare Beauvillier with a signed Pacioretty then, as this what is suggested in the trade. Of course, Pacioretty as a rental doesn't have the same value.

But then you hit on the other issue for the Islanders... incompatibility. Isles already have excellent production on the wings (primarily LW). Also, prospect depth and players with a lot of term.

Isles need a center, not a winger. In a vacuum these deals may make sense purely on a value basis (although I have my opinion on that) but not necessarily on addressing team needs.

 

[Roshi]

Sign & trade almost never happens as per today. Negotiations with UFA guys are a long process where both sides are wearing one down.

Lets assume for some reason that happens though. Does that really add much for the value? You are not expecting Pacioretty to sign another under-market contract just so Habs can benefit in a trade, right? He is going to command the JVR contract, or something on that ballpark between JVR and Stastny contracts.

And that down year he just had must scare some suitors off. Signed Pacioretty in expected good-case-scenario is good but also well paid 30G winger. In a worst case though you have downtrending and expensive winger tied up for 6 years and you just paid premium assets to get him. Sounds risky.

For a contender team that 5,5 caphit is fine. Even better if retained. Thats worth a 1st +. How many teams are ready to give Pacioretty a long money contract before they have seen what his direction will be this year, and how much more than a 1st + would they really want to pay for that?

Id rather take unsigned Pacioretty at this point. If i like what i got, i have all year long to sign the guy myself.

 

[dats81]

The Flyers no longer looking for scoring wingers now that JVR signed with them.

 

[CREW99AW]

I


- Anthony Beauvillier
- 2020 Islanders 1st round draft pick


- Max Pacioretty (signed)
- Brett t

Isles reportedly were looking to make the MaxPac trade because of Tavares . He is not here ,so drop the isles from the MaxPac sweepstakes.

Isles need a 2nd pairing LHD+ 2nd line center ,not a LW looking for $7m on a long-term deal.

We are more likely to see them experimenting with Beau at center , then use top assets to acquire MaxPac

 

[CREW99AW]

Patches, a career 30+ goal scorer, who has a 37 and 39 goal season under his belt since the lockout shortened season ---- is worth less than a 3rd line C who has had 24 and 36 POINT seasons?

You're kidding, right?

No he is not kidding. Isles #1 LW is Lee coming off 34 + 40 goal seasons.
Bellows turns pro in Oct and is likely to be on the nyi roster.

#1 prospect Walhstrom is thought to be 1 season away from nhl ready.

And Beau ,a natural center on his ELC,plays a 200 ft game and is cost controlled.

 

[CREW99AW]

I dont think the Islanders are in any shape close to contending. I think Patches would be a mistake for them. In your shoes,Id keep Beau and the Elc and grow with Barzal and co.

I was just saying,right NOW...Beau isnt worth Patches.

And MaxPac is not worth the $7m longterm that he is rumored to want.

Unable to reach extension agreements with LA or SJ ,looking to cash in on his next contract because he was foolish enough to sign a cheap, team friendly contract last time around...I would not want my team giving him $7m per