Post-Game Talk: #5: FLYERS at Oilers, Wednesday, Oct. 16, 2019, 9:30 pm ET

[BiggE]

If AV wants to play his vets (other than Slugwart) fine, but please replace Bunny (sorry Cap) and Twarynski with Frost and Farabee asap. This lineup needs more skill and a viable 3rd line

 

[BiggE]

Here’s another bold idea. Shop Braun for a vet left D, trade Hagg for anything you can get and roll with a D of:

Provy-Ghost
Sanheim-Niskanen
New LH vet-Myers
Spare: Morin

 

[Striiker]

What is it last 2 years, not even being difficult, it does seem it hasnt been near as strong in recent years.

Like I said, the last full year it was setup properly was 2017-2018: Jake had career best PP scoring, Giroux had 2 points less than his career best, and Ghost had his career best AND most PP points of all defensemen.

THE VERY NEXT YEAR (2018-2019) it was put together for two months to start the season, but the team was a disaster under Hakstol and after he got fired it was then split up and turned into this abomination and has been the same ever since.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Here’s another bold idea. Shop Braun for a vet left D, trade Hagg for anything you can get and roll with a D of:

Provy-Ghost
Sanheim-Niskanen
New LH vet-Myers
Spare: Morin

Looking at you, Jets

 

[bennysflyers16]

Looking at you, Jets

Provy Ghost
Sanheim Nisky
Morin Braun
Haag

Easy ,

 

[Striiker]

Here’s another bold idea. Shop Braun for a vet left D, trade Hagg for anything you can get and roll with a D of:

Provy-Ghost
Sanheim-Niskanen
New LH vet-Myers
Spare: Morin

This is 100000000000% the correct move.

 

[bennysflyers16]

Looking at you, Jets

Who knows what they are gonna do, the Buff drama is about to take a crazy turn if what I heard happens ,

 

[BiggE]

Who knows what they are gonna do, the Buff drama is about to take a crazy turn if what I heard happens ,

Yeah I’m hearing he wants to come back, but local press in Winnipeg also have reported that he didn’t train at all last summer.

Buff gonna look like an offensive lineman on skates

 

[bennysflyers16]

Yeah I’m hearing he wants to come back, but local press in Winnipeg also have reported that he didn’t train at all last summer.

Buff gonna look like an offensive lineman on skates

Half right

 

[deadhead]

Yes.

Do you agree that coaches are fallible?

Do you agree that amateurs with little or no playing/coaching experience who post on internet boards are likely to be far less knowledgeable than coaches who actually watch game film and practices and know what their schemes are and whether players are in proper position and doing what they've been coached to do?

 

[Jtown]

Half right

buff is like jason peters, weight doesn't matter.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Do you agree that amateurs with little or no playing/coaching experience who post on internet boards are likely to be far less knowledgeable than coaches who actually watch game film and practices and know what their schemes are and whether players are in proper position and doing what they've been coached to do?

Sometimes.

You know we've been correct over several coaches numerous times, right?

Some facts are self evident. Haggs absolute deficiency is one of those facts. Similar to how it was perfectly evident that TK was a top six forward, while you and the coach insisted he was a fourth liner.

Guess who was right?

Where was this grovelling to authority when Gordon was coach? Quite hypocritical of you.

 

[CSKA1974]

buff is like jason peters, weight doesn't matter.

Would that apply to hungry Buff?

 

[Sombastate]

Also, it was just one bad game for Hart... it's not as if he's been bad all year...

Can anyone show me a goalie who doesn't have bad games?

I'll say this, Bryzgalov was the most consistent goaltender we had.

Feel free to decide which connotation i blanketed "consistent" with.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Braun has been fine. He had a bad turnover trying to clear the puck after someone fell down against Calgary that cost them a goal, but I think he’s made a lot of good, subtle defensive plays also.

I don’t blame him for being unable to stop McDavid’s goal last night. That could’ve been any defenseman on the team; he was just the unlucky one. Not many defensemen are stopping McDavid from a standstill position when he pounces on a fluke bounce & gets a jump on you. Fastest acceleration in history & probably the best player in the league.

Hagg also has been completely fine as a limited minute #6.

The team’s biggest problems in their losses have been goaltending (last night, when they outshot Edm by 30, 52-22) & lack of production from their supposed offensive players.

 

[Jtown]

Would that apply to hungry Buff?

Buff is always hungry

 

[hatcher]

Braun has been fine. He had a bad turnover trying to clear the puck after someone fell down against Calgary that cost them a goal, but I think he’s made a lot of good, subtle defensive plays also.

I don’t blame him for being unable to stop McDavid’s goal last night. That could’ve been any defenseman on the team; he was just the unlucky one. Not many defensemen are stopping McDavid from a standstill position when he pounces on a fluke bounce & gets a jump on you. Fastest acceleration in history & probably the best player in the league.

Hagg also has been completely fine as a limited minute #6.

The team’s biggest problems in their losses have been goaltending (last night, when they outshot Edm by 30, 52-22) & lack of production from their supposed offensive players.

Yeah our main players are older and slower and while they had 52 shots they had about 10 good ones but no high end plays just shots on net.

 

[Here4ThaLids]

Exactly. We were down 2-1 and dominating the 2nd.

• Giroux missed the net on a point blank shot.
• Sanheim double-clutched a would-be goal after a great pass by Giroux.
• Voracek fanned with the net-empty.

There were a few more. Then McDavid scored and they packed it in.

Poor execution and being mentally fragile cost them last night, not luck.

I want to focus on the fine distinction here as necessary for the board. I agree that there was poor execution on quite a few plays, enough so that you can see it, and that team-wide fragility really is a thing, as they visibly sag and slow down when something goes wrong, and the wheels come off. But they very much were done in by bad luck.

We're not talking about luck in terms of spontaneous combustion. The puck doesn't occasionally teleport across zones or briefly transform into a teddy bear before changing back into vulcanized rubber. Bad luck does not imply loss of cause-and-effect.

We're talking about abstracting thousands of competing factors from an extremely complex system into observable data points, then trying to group those data points and use them to predict. Bad luck is stochastic fluctuation around a trend line. Giroux can absolutely flub a shot from the slot, which is poor execution in the individual case; if we've got a large sample of him scoring at, say, 25% from that spot, and he misses three or four times in a row from there, then bad luck. All of the instances of good and bad execution are already cooked into the stat.

You can't control the random fluctuation around the trend line, and it bites all teams in the keister. But you do have some control over the pitch of the line -- through tactics, strategy, talent level. Get a player into the slot and pass it to him!

The process vs results war is still being fought if under different names. Don't try to be St. Louis because they rode a heater last year, try to be Tampa.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Braun has been fine. He had a bad turnover trying to clear the puck after someone fell down against Calgary that cost them a goal, but I think he’s made a lot of good, subtle defensive plays also.

I don’t blame him for being unable to stop McDavid’s goal last night. That could’ve been any defenseman on the team; he was just the unlucky one. Not many defensemen are stopping McDavid from a standstill position when he pounces on a fluke bounce & gets a jump on you. Fastest acceleration in history & probably the best player in the league.

Hagg also has been completely fine as a limited minute #6.

The team’s biggest problems in their losses have been goaltending (last night, when they outshot Edm by 30, 52-22) & lack of production from their supposed offensive players.

Braun was slow getting started, for one. The whole rest of the team, including Niskanen, was hoofing it back and he delayed. He's also here to make reliable defensive plays, so when he's getting beaten silly it's a bad look, particularly after recent gaffes, even if it is McDavid.

Three games in a row, beaten for 3 goals, 2 of them being pretty bad; hell, one being a horror show. His skillset is limited. He doesn't make up for plays like those. If he's not being defensively reliable, then it's a bad game. The team shouldn't have to be outscoring his errors, he's supposed to be reliable.

 

[hatcher]

Braun was slow getting started, for one. The whole rest of the team, including Niskanen, was hoofing it back and he delayed. He's also here to make reliable defensive plays, so when he's getting beaten silly it's a bad look, particularly after recent gaffes, even if it is McDavid.

Three games in a row, beaten for 3 goals, 2 of them being pretty bad; hell, one being a horror show. His skillset is limited. He doesn't make up for plays like those. If he's not being defensively reliable, then it's a bad game. The team shouldn't have to be outscoring his errors, he's supposed to be reliable.

Make sure you talk about Ghost and Sanheim about errors. Just because they werent scored on doesn't mean they arent making mistakes. Be fair.

 

[Starat327]

This place.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

Yeah basically. Or more accurately, it's the deadhead method: This is how I think hockey should be played, and I'm going to use the evidence that supports that belief and ignore all evidence to the contrary.

The Flyers have 5.81 xGF on the PP this year, which is .07 off the league lead despite playing fewer games than any team in the league. They're creating CF, shots, scoring chances and high-danger chances at a better rate per minute than any team in the league.

Last year they were well below average, and this team hasn't had a functional PP2 in years. This year they're the most productive PP in the league. I know it's early.

Whatever you want to criticize this coaching staff for, and there's plenty of legitimate things to criticize, ****ing up the power play isn't one of them.

We are only talking about PP1 and then you are quoting combined PP stats.

I'm sure the surging PP2 has a lot more to do with those numbers then the dominance of PP1

If nothing else the amount they keep tweaking PP1 tell me the coaches are unhappy with the way it is performing.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

The complaint was swapping their sides removes their one timers as an option. That was the issue I was addressing if G' s one timer is needed this is an option of how that setup works.

**** it this fan base wants to win so bad but it won't let anything change other than around the edges of games. Guess what. Changing people who play 10 minutes or PP2 isn't going to get them a cup.

Even if you do have to make big changes, running the PP through a player we currently dont have on our team instead of arguably the most dominate PP QB of the last 10 years doesn't seem like the best idea.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Make sure you talk about Ghost and Sanheim about errors. Just because they werent scored on doesn't mean they arent making mistakes. Be fair.

I have, actually.

Maybe you should attempt giving the players you despise credit for the good things they do. Be fair.

 

[Tripod]

Top players padding points in games when the loss is already in the bag. Poor leaders. Can't shoot/ Too slow. Couts/Ghost/JVR 23 shots no goals.