Value of: 2C to Col.

[Machinehead]

Agreed on that. If Hayes is the best they can get they'd be better off trying to get Soderberg better wingers. He's just as capable as Hayes. The Avs need a real, play-driving #2 centre -- not a 40-50 guy.

What do you think a #2 center is?

 

[GirardSpinorama]

What do you think a #2 center is?

On a contender, 60 points.

 

[Avs44]

What do you think a #2 center is?

The Avs have one of the best if not the best top lines in hockey. Settling for a mediocre #2 centre is not the way to go. While MacKinnon is on his steal of a contract for the next five years they should be (intelligently) trying to go for it all. That means instead of a 45 point second line centre they should be focusing on pulling off their equivalent of the Carter / Richards trades. In other words, building real, Stanley Cup calibre centre depth, particularly because they don't have that elite #1 D or a truly elite D corps as a club like the Predators have. A Kevin Hayes is not that player.

 

[canuckslover10]

You could just draft one

 

[Kupo]

Who do you think Zibanejad could fetch then? To me the next tier up of prospect would be a guy like Mittelstadt, I don’t think Zib could fetch a prospect like that but maybe I’m wrong

Honestly, I think if he is moved it'll be on draft day for a top-10 pick, similar to Derek Stepan. The thing with Zibby is he's definitely young enough to survive a rebuild. He can be flat out dominant when he's on, and his shot from the left circle is filthy. When he's on his game he's very physical too.

Most teams can use a top-6 center, especially a 25 year old RH shot with Size. The return would be very good for NY if they shopped him.

 

[Eltuna]

Mittelstadt is only a year older than Jost.. why does he hold that much more value?

Younger I think you mean, and I don’t value the two like that (never been a Mittelstadt guy) but I think that’s the general opinion of the two players. He’s definitely regarded as an A prospect around the league, and when you look at recent trades for guys like Zibanejad, they tend to not include their best prospects. St Louis didn’t want to give Kyrou or Thomas for ROR, Nashville didn’t want to give Tolvanen for Turris, Ottawa didn’t want to give White for Duchene, St Louis again didn’t want to give up A prospects for Schenn. I think there was a time when Zibanejad would fetch a better prospect than Jost, but I don’t know if he would today, recent trades would certainly suggest otherwise.

 

[Machinehead]

On a contender, 60 points.

Only 35 centers had 60 points last year. Only three teams had two centers with 60 points and one of them missed the playoffs.

#2 centers don't put up 60 points.

The Avs have one of the best if not the best top lines in hockey. Settling for a mediocre #2 centre is not the way to go. While MacKinnon is on his steal of a contract for the next five years they should be (intelligently) trying to go for it all. That means instead of a 45 point second line centre they should be focusing on pulling off their equivalent of the Carter / Richards trades. In other words, building real, Stanley Cup calibre centre depth, particularly because they don't have that elite #1 D or a truly elite D corps as a club like the Predators have. A Kevin Hayes is not that player.

In other words, you're not looking for a 2C. You're looking for a 1C to play 2C (which is what Carter is).

 

[Eltuna]

Honestly, I think if he is moved it'll be on draft day for a top-10 pick, similar to Derek Stepan. The thing with Zibby is he's definitely young enough to survive a rebuild. He can be flat out dominant when he's on, and his shot from the left circle is filthy. When he's on his game he's very physical too.

Most teams can use a top-6 center, especially a 25 year old RH shot with Size. The return would be very good for NY if they shopped him.

The Stepan example is a good one. I would counter with ROR, Schenn, Duchene, Turris, Karlsson (tough one since he was UFA), and McDonagh. Teams seem to have shifted the last couple of years into not wanting to trade their A level prospects. It seems most teams would rather add to the quantity, rather than trade their best prospects. I still don’t know how St Louis got ROR without including at least Kyrou, or how Tampa got McDonagh without at least including Foote, but it seems the league is going that way.

 

[Kupo]

Thats fair. Zibs is at a level that i would happy jost turn into when he is 25. Dont see why the rags would do that. Hayes on the other hand, i wont be happy if Jost is just a 40-50 point guy, and hes a UFA.

You can talk contract extension prior to trading for him after the new year. I think that's when we'll see Hayes moved. Hayes will be a steady 50 point player in a better system with competent wingers. He's definitely a 2C right now. He's a pretty underrated in my opinion, even on the Rangers board.

 

[Avs44]

In other words, you're not looking for a 2C. You're looking for a 1C to play 2C (which is what Carter is).

That would probably be a fairly accurate way of putting it, sure. At least someone considered a low end #1 centre on the tier, even though I think these #1/2 C rankings are often pretty subjective outside the obvious guys. For teams wanting to contend it's not exactly unheard of. I mean there's Pittsburgh...Kings had Kopitar + Richards and Carter on the wing much of the time just because they could, Boston had Bergeron and Krejci, Caps won last year with Backstrom and Kuznetsov...Hawks might have been an exception with the calibre of their #2 centre's I suppose.

 

[Eltuna]

What would you give us for Johnson

Honestly not sure he’s a hard guy to gauge. I think he would fit the teams speed identity though and could slot in as an eventual 3rd line C in a couple of years when he slows down to replace Soderberg. Would be a good stop gap option while we wait for a prospect (Ottawa 1st) to develop.

 

[Machinehead]

That would probably be a fairly accurate way of putting it, sure. At least someone considered a low end #1 centre on the tier, even though I think these #1/2 C rankings are often pretty subjective outside the obvious guys. For teams wanting to contend it's not exactly unheard of. I mean there's Pittsburgh...Kings had Kopitar + Richards and Carter on the wing much of the time just because they could, Boston had Bergeron and Krejci, Caps won last year with Backstrom and Kuznetsov...Hawks might have been an exception with the calibre of their #2 centre's I suppose.

Zibanejad would fit that bill more than Hayes but I don't think the Rangers are looking to move Zibanejad since he's young and on a pretty good contract.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I don't get why so many Avs fans are so impatient when it comes to letting our youngster develop. Jost is still only 20. Kerfoot is still only a 2nd year player, as is Compher. MacKinnon just turned 23. Rantanen is 22. On top of that, Sakic keeps talking about how he wants the youngsters to step up and grow into roles. What's the rush?

 

[The Abusement Park]

What would you give us for Johnson

Idk, Avs 1st and Meloche? Can’t imagine we’d be giving up much from the actual roster. Even then I’d probably rather use that 1st to go bigger if possible.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I don't get why so many Avs fans are so impatient when it comes to letting our youngster develop. Jost is still only 20. Kerfoot is still only a 2nd year player, as is Compher. MacKinnon just turned 23. Rantanen is 22. On top of that, Sakic keeps talking about how he wants the youngsters to step up and grow into roles. What's the rush?

Taking advantage of Mack’s contract and the top 2/3 line in the league we have.

 

[JoemAvs]

The name you are looking for is either Kirby Dach, Dylan Cozens, Ryan Suzuki, Alex Turcotte or Peyton Krebs. Maybe even Alex Newhook.

Avs are young as hell and unfortunately were not able to sign Rantanen to a bargain longterm deal in the offseason. Now he probably is going to ask for atleast 9.
Then these rookie contracts will come in handy and allow us to adress holes somewhere else. Avs also will need to replace Soderberg in the nearer future as well. That may come from within. It may not.
Add a looming lockout and a looming expansion draft and it becomes clear that the Avs should under no circumstances make huge, very pricey moves right now.
If Sakic wants to throw away a 2nd+ B-prospect at the deadline, I would not care too much about. But anything more than that should not be considered.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Taking advantage of Mack’s contract and the top 2/3 line in the league we have.

So, we add a bunch of salary to take advantage of Mack's contract, then can't afford to keep our good youngsters, and are back to mediocre in a couple years with a depleted prospect pool. No thanks.

 

[AndreRoy]

Idk, Avs 1st and Meloche? Can’t imagine we’d be giving up much from the actual roster. Even then I’d probably rather use that 1st to go bigger if possible.

Despite Dominic’s obsession with trading Johnson I don’t see us giving him up cheaply if at all, and that’s if he would even be willing to waive his NTC (which he almost certainly wouldn’t be.)

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Idk, Avs 1st and Meloche? Can’t imagine we’d be giving up much from the actual roster. Even then I’d probably rather use that 1st to go bigger if possible.

Done

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Despite Dominic’s obsession with trading Johnson I don’t see us giving him up cheaply if at all, and that’s if he would even be willing to waive his NTC (which he almost certainly wouldn’t be.)

If we can get a (likely at least mid) 1st for him that’s a no brainer imo.

 

[The Abusement Park]

So, we add a bunch of salary to take advantage of Mack's contract, then can't afford to keep our good youngsters, and are back to mediocre in a couple years with a depleted prospect pool. No thanks.

By adding another good C to this team we have a good shot at becoming a legit contender here in the next couple seasons. I mean I’m not saying just give away every prospect to improve the at all costs, but you have to see what’s out here. We have something special with this top line and it’d be horrible to waste it.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Only 35 centers had 60 points last year. Only three teams had two centers with 60 points and one of them missed the playoffs.

#2 centers don't put up 60 points.



In other words, you're not looking for a 2C. You're looking for a 1C to play 2C (which is what Carter is).

I think you can say that. Low end 1C to play 2C

 

[Paranoid Android]

Turris to Colorado
Duchene to Nashville
? to Ottawa

 

[AndreRoy]

If we can get a (likely at least mid) 1st for him that’s a no brainer imo.

It’s not even close. In the extremely unlikely event that we were to trade him we’d be looking for a right-handed 2/3D on a good deal who can replace Stralman. We aren’t trading him for magic beans that if we’re lucky might turn into a lower line player three or four years from now. We’ll trade Miller for a first, not Johnson.

 

[King'sPawn]

So Avs want a <26 year old 2nd line center scoring around 60 points but their 5 most valuable pieces are untouchable?