WJC: 2023 Team Canada Roster Talk Part 2

[trilobyte]

Bedard may be the greatest Canadian to ever live. Zellweger needs his minutes cut badly. Clarke needs to be cut entirely.

I agree on how poorly Clarke has played but he is not going to be cut. Zellweger is quite useful and I don't see him as a detriment to the team.

 

[prongertheman9]

I find Guenther, Clarke and Fantilli to be such low IQ hockey players. The decision making is baffling

 

[JimmySpaetzle]

I find Guenther, Clarke and Fantilli to be such low IQ hockey players. The decision making is baffling

Clarke forgetting to put his helmet back on might be the lowest IQ play I’ve ever seen

 

[ORRFForever]

Clarke forgetting to put his helmet back on might be the lowest IQ play I’ve ever seen

You got that right.

Clarke was trying to be a hero.

 

[JimmySpaetzle]

You got that right.

Trying to be a hero.

We were all screaming at him to go to the bench and then he got his inevitable penalty LOL

 

[ORRFForever]

We were all screaming at him to go to the bench and then he got his inevitable penalty LOL

Clarke imagined himself blocking a shot without a helmet and Canada forever being in awe of his effort <- the hero complex.

Instead, he almost cost us the game.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Wright's line is weirdly constructed. You don't really have a puck transporter on it, but instead all three guys who like to get lost in coverage and then get open for shots.

Also not a big fan of Zellwegger. He's fine as a puck carrier, but IMO his offensive zone instincts leave a bit to be desired. His contributions on the PP consist of passing the puck over to Bedard on the right halfboards. When that option isn't available to him, he doesn't seem to create anything and will just take a random long-distance shot on net.

 

[nergish]

Clarke has very obvious pro-level abilities and size, but he’s missing something. I’m still a fan, and think he has high hockey IQ in his own way - but he plays far too recklessly.

Too often he slams his stick that he wants the puck and then does nothing with it. Was expecting him to be far more assertive in this tournament.

 

[trilobyte]

We were all screaming at him to go to the bench and then he got his inevitable penalty LOL

I was hoping a teammate close by would get the message to him. He looked so amped up that he was just going like Dukes Of Hazzard

 

[Tofveve]

I'm late to the conversation so sorry for bringing this up now lol . . . But anyone not sure if Bedard translates to a superstar at the NHL level in part due to size etc.? Ala Eberle to some degree. Likely to be a star more than Eberle has been, BUT, still hard to know for sure how high he soars (for me anyway).

 

[KBobs]

Very unimpressed with the coaching staff tonight. They looked like a deer in the headlights when things were unraveling. No line shuffling, no creativity - but were fortunately bailed out by Bedard.

NHL returnees have been total nonfactors. I get the Wright line was great in the U18's, but so was Gaudreau and look how that turned out. Time to make significant changes. Ideally I'd want the 2nd line to stay intact, but Roy is a Swiss army knife player that could help get a few guys going, so maybe all lines need will be shuffled.

Likely doesn't need to be said, but Stankoven stays with Bedard. The creativity, IQ, ability to dismantle defences, etc.

Wright needs a play driver on his line. How he is isn't one when he was the presumptive 1st overall pick when he was 16/17, etc before the draft day slide is curious but oh well, this is the reality. I hope I'm wrong, but based on an extremely small sample size of viewings (limited to U18 and World Jr's), he looks like a 2C upside in the NHL.

Outside the Bedard line, I liked Gaucher's game. He played with grit. I hope Beck plays a regularly shift next game. Not like the 4th line is doing much anyway.

Might be a controversial opinion, especially from how he started out, but I would like to see Fantilli play more. His speed was evident tonight, and he uses his size. Seems like he's a guy that would be best served playing his natural C position though. He's been fighting the puck a bit all tournament, and obviously had some terrible shifts when in the top 6, but thought he played well in the limited minutes since and is now ready for more. I'm not advocating for him back in the top 6 - just a bigger role than he's been getting since his demotion. As an aside, does it not seem like he's playing with his draft stock in mind? To my eye, he has been a bit selfish by forcing a few shots rather than passing. Even so, I think his speed and size will help against the US.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I'm late to the conversation so sorry for bringing this up now lol . . . But anyone not sure if Bedard translates to a superstar at the NHL level in part due to size etc.? Ala Eberle to some degree. Likely to be a star more than Eberle has been, BUT, still hard to know for sure how high he soars (for me anyway).

Bedard is currently listed at 5'10

NHL superstars around his height:
Patrick Kane - 5'10
Brad Marchand - 5'9
Sidney Crosby - 5'11
Johnny Gaudreau - 5'9
Nikita Kucherov - 5'11
Jack Hughes - 5'11

Probably forgetting some other obvious ones. But I don't think lack of height held them back.

Size/strength usually holds back players who have average to above average NHL skill, not the guys who are elite.

 

[Daximus]

I'm late to the conversation so sorry for bringing this up now lol . . . But anyone not sure if Bedard translates to a superstar at the NHL level in part due to size etc.? Ala Eberle to some degree. Likely to be a star more than Eberle has been, BUT, still hard to know for sure how high he soars (for me anyway).

He's bigger than Patrick Kane, Point, Gaudreau, DeBrincat, Keller, Caufield, Marchessault, Domi, Jarvis and Yamamoto were on draft day. Just to name a few. He'll be fine.

 

[trilobyte]

I'm late to the conversation so sorry for bringing this up now lol . . . But anyone not sure if Bedard translates to a superstar at the NHL level in part due to size etc.? Ala Eberle to some degree. Likely to be a star more than Eberle has been, BUT, still hard to know for sure how high he soars (for me anyway).

It would be weird to somehow equate height into an assessment of future stature and performance. I think it played a part when players like Theo Fleury, Martin St. Louis, Gaudreau etc. were being scouted but Bedard isn't small, and he will add strength, power and no doubt height in the years to come.

 

[Daximus]

Some thoughts on this game..

Fantilli - I'm not sure if it's coaching or just how he goes about playing but it feels like he has tunnel vision for the net out there when the puck is on his stick. Great skater, stickhandler and has a decent shot but he opts to shoot way to much. To many times he just throws any bad angle or easily blockable attempt at the net with really zero regard for whats going on around him. I counted numerous times where he had the puck on his stick in a strong position with team mates wide open in prime scoring areas only to kill the play by just firing a shot at the net killing any play or momentum. Needs to learn to use his line mates better. They all may not be world beaters like Bedard but both of them are certainly capable of scoring if you set them up.

Clarke - Some absolute bone headed plays tonight. Bad pinches, bad decisions with the puck, bad decisions without the puck. It's obvious he has dynamic skill and ability to move the puck but he gets a little bit to aggressive with it sometimes and it costs us. I don't mind him jumping into the play but he really needs to pick his spots better and needs to make sure that he knows what he needs to be doing in the defensive zone even if it's mostly just positioning.

Hinds - Really like this kids game, he's been putting it all on the line every single night so far. Comes up with some huge defensive plays when we need them and although prone to lapses sometimes he recovers from them well.

 

[trilobyte]

Some thoughts on this game..

Fantilli - I'm not sure if it's coaching or just how he goes about playing but it feels like he has tunnel vision for the net out there when the puck is on his stick. Great skater, stickhandler and has a decent shot but he opts to shoot way to much. To many times he just throws any bad angle or easily blockable attempt at the net with really zero regard for whats going on around him. I counted numerous times where he had the puck on his stick in a strong position with team mates wide open in prime scoring areas only to kill the play by just firing a shot at the net killing any play or momentum. Needs to learn to use his line mates better. They all may not be world beaters like Bedard but both of them are certainly capable of scoring if you set them up.

Clarke - Some absolute bone headed plays tonight. Bad pinches, bad decisions with the puck, bad decisions without the puck. It's obvious he has dynamic skill and ability to move the puck but he gets a little bit to aggressive with it sometimes and it costs us. I don't mind him jumping into the play but he really needs to pick his spots better and needs to make sure that he knows what he needs to be doing in the defensive zone even if it's mostly just positioning.

Hinds - Really like this kids game, he's been putting it all on the line every single night so far. Comes up with some huge defensive plays when we need them and although prone to lapses sometimes he recovers from them well.

Clarke needs to settle down and just play basic steady defence. He could calm his nerves and help his team, and improve his play with a mandate to stay with a defensive mindset. Cool it down.

As for Fantilli, he is still figuring it out. He can look really good for a stretch inside a single period, but then instead of seeing that continue, he inexplicably seems to no longer be seen doing those things.
I don't think any game day coaching today or tomorrow is going to change that. I think only time and cycles accrued are what he needs. It's a learning experience for him, and good exposure.
Just my very amateur opinion.

 

[Gold Standard]

oh man, this team has flaws. but is a non-stop thrill ride. That's why we love junior hockey.

Instant classic.

I'm not overly confident Canada leaves Halifax with the hardware. If we make it to the GMG I think Cesko may be the favorite.

Would be a hell of a GMG, however!

Especially for our resident oiler fan @Czechboy.

but it could very easily be a USA v Cesko final.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

The defense is definitely the biggest dissapointment so far for me. Zellweger and Clarke were expected to be the two top guys and honestly both have just been an absolute tire fire in their own end. I expected a lot more from Clarke then what he is bringing and I honestly can't believe he has been in the NHL for the first half of the season. That kid needs some serious time working on the defensive side of the puck and on his skating.

 

[GermanSpitfire]

The defense is definitely the biggest dissapointment so far for me. Zellweger and Clarke were expected to be the two top guys and honestly both have just been an absolute tire fire in their own end. I expected a lot more from Clarke then what he is bringing and I honestly can't believe he has been in the NHL for the first half of the season. That kid needs some serious time working on the defensive side of the puck and on his skating.

And decision making.

 

[ORRFForever]

Clarke needs to settle down and just play basic steady defence. He could calm his nerves and help his team, and improve his play with a mandate to stay with a defensive mindset. Cool it down.

As for Fantilli, he is still figuring it out. He can look really good for a stretch inside a single period, but then instead of seeing that continue, he inexplicably seems to no longer be seen doing those things.
I don't think any game day coaching today or tomorrow is going to change that. I think only time and cycles accrued are what he needs. It's a learning experience for him, and good exposure.
Just my very amateur opinion.

Well said.

 

[ORRFForever]

Very unimpressed with the coaching staff tonight. They looked like a deer in the headlights when things were unraveling. No line shuffling, no creativity - but were fortunately bailed out by Bedard.

NHL returnees have been total nonfactors. I get the Wright line was great in the U18's, but so was Gaudreau and look how that turned out. Time to make significant changes. Ideally I'd want the 2nd line to stay intact, but Roy is a Swiss army knife player that could help get a few guys going, so maybe all lines need will be shuffled.

Likely doesn't need to be said, but Stankoven stays with Bedard. The creativity, IQ, ability to dismantle defences, etc.

Wright needs a play driver on his line. How he is isn't one when he was the presumptive 1st overall pick when he was 16/17, etc before the draft day slide is curious but oh well, this is the reality. I hope I'm wrong, but based on an extremely small sample size of viewings (limited to U18 and World Jr's), he looks like a 2C upside in the NHL.

Outside the Bedard line, I liked Gaucher's game. He played with grit. I hope Beck plays a regularly shift next game. Not like the 4th line is doing much anyway.

Might be a controversial opinion, especially from how he started out, but I would like to see Fantilli play more. His speed was evident tonight, and he uses his size. Seems like he's a guy that would be best served playing his natural C position though. He's been fighting the puck a bit all tournament, and obviously had some terrible shifts when in the top 6, but thought he played well in the limited minutes since and is now ready for more. I'm not advocating for him back in the top 6 - just a bigger role than he's been getting since his demotion. As an aside, does it not seem like he's playing with his draft stock in mind? To my eye, he has been a bit selfish by forcing a few shots rather than passing. Even so, I think his speed and size will help against the US.

Great post.

They had no answer to Slovakia's backchecking. They ALL (including the coaches) had that "deer in a headlight" look.

 

[ORRFForever]

oh man, this team has flaws. but is a non-stop thrill ride. That's why we love junior hockey.

Instant classic.

I'm not overly confident Canada leaves Halifax with the hardware. If we make it to the GMG I think Cesko may be the favorite.

Would be a hell of a GMG, however!

Especially for our resident oiler fan @Czechboy.

but it could very easily be a USA v Cesko final.

I felt the same way Bob MacKenzie felt...

The force field around the Slovakian net was payback for the GMG miracle in August and I knew, in my heart, Canada would lose. Yet, somehow we won.

The game was a treat and I'm glad I had the courage to sit thru it - I usually turn it off when it gets too stressful.

After the game, @Czechboy disappeared for an hour(?). I don't blame him. The game took a ton out of me and we won - I can only imagine how he felt after all the time/energy he put in. His team deserved better.

If Canada doesn't win Gold, I hope it is Czechia.

 

[ORRFForever]

Some thoughts on this game..

Fantilli - I'm not sure if it's coaching or just how he goes about playing but it feels like he has tunnel vision for the net out there when the puck is on his stick. Great skater, stickhandler and has a decent shot but he opts to shoot way to much. To many times he just throws any bad angle or easily blockable attempt at the net with really zero regard for whats going on around him. I counted numerous times where he had the puck on his stick in a strong position with team mates wide open in prime scoring areas only to kill the play by just firing a shot at the net killing any play or momentum. Needs to learn to use his line mates better. They all may not be world beaters like Bedard but both of them are certainly capable of scoring if you set them up.

Clarke - Some absolute bone headed plays tonight. Bad pinches, bad decisions with the puck, bad decisions without the puck. It's obvious he has dynamic skill and ability to move the puck but he gets a little bit to aggressive with it sometimes and it costs us. I don't mind him jumping into the play but he really needs to pick his spots better and needs to make sure that he knows what he needs to be doing in the defensive zone even if it's mostly just positioning.

Hinds - Really like this kids game, he's been putting it all on the line every single night so far. Comes up with some huge defensive plays when we need them and although prone to lapses sometimes he recovers from them well.

Agree.

At times, Fantilli can't even do the basic stuff right. I don't know what to make of him. I'd find a way to get Beck (and his faceoff prowess) in there and sit Fantilli.

As for Clarke...

He was trying to be a hero all night - and it almost cost us the game. His playing without a helmet B.S. was idiotic and shamefully selfish. If we didn't need him so badly, I'd bench him for that crap.

He's bigger than Patrick Kane, Point, Gaudreau, DeBrincat, Keller, Caufield, Marchessault, Domi, Jarvis and Yamamoto were on draft day. Just to name a few. He'll be fine.

Hopefully, more than fine.

 

[ORRFForever]

While he has been far from bad, and he's working his tail off playing a 200 foot game while being a leader on the ice, I am really disappointed in Wright - he certainly doesn't have that BIG moment greatness we saw at the U18's.

If we have any chance at Gold, someone needs to light a fire under Wright and he needs to do something GREAT.

As Jack Slater said (paraphrasing), this team could beat the U.S. by 4 and I would not blink. They could also lose to the U.S. by 4 and I would not blink.

I have no idea what to make of Team Canada 2023 but they need an identity other than the "Connor Bedard Show".

 

[Sideline]

While he has been far from bad, and he's working his tail off playing a 200 foot game while being a leader on the ice, I am really disappointed in Wright - he certainly doesn't have that BIG moment greatness we saw at the U18's.

If we have any chance at Gold, someone needs to light a fire under Wright and he needs to do something GREAT.

As Jack Slater said (paraphrasing), this team could beat the U.S. by 4 and I would not blink. They could also lose to the U.S. by 4 and I would not blink.

I have no idea what to make of Team Canada 2023 but they need an identity other than the "Connor Bedard Show".

I disagree on Shane Wright being a disappointment. I've watched all the Canada games in person and at this point #15 is the only guy I trust not to f*** up the game. Even Bedard has some pretty obvious defensive shortcomings that make me nervous with his line out there. With Canada's defense as bad as it is Wright being that calming presence is a MAJOR contribution.

I completely agree on someone other than Bedard needing to contribute to the offense though. Stankoven and Wright and the only other guys consistently creating chances.