Speculation: 2021 Sharks Offseason Roster Discussion

[TheBeard]

But Eichel is already making his money, which is a problem. The thing about your own high draft picks is that they'll at least have 3 years for their ELCs, and potentially a good bridge contract. There's room to work with, with regards to cap. This team already has too many big, long-term contracts that they can't get rid of, so they need cheap young talent to fill the gap if they want to compete any time soon.

Yup. Eichel needs to play like a ten million dollar player to get your money's worth. You have a better chance of getting more value from ELC guys.

 

[Pavelski2112]

Obviously, the caliber of a player like Eichel doesn't come around too often, but while he fills a need, I think it's in the team's best interest to let another team boom or bust with him. He doesn't make us immediate contenders so while he'll make us a more enjoyable team to watch, it doesn't really get us that much closer short term and it definitely doesn't long term.

Can you at least agree that we're closer to the bottom rung than we are the top?

Yea, I'll take at least getting top-10 picks for a while than just getting knocked out in the first round again and again.

 

[TheBeard]

Yea, I'll take at least getting top-10 picks for a while than just getting knocked out in the first round again and again.

Now, would you rather a top ten pick or no pick when we get knocked out in the second round even with Eichel in the lineup?

 

[Pavelski2112]

Now, would you rather a top ten pick or no pick when we get knocked out in the second round even with Eichel in the lineup?

I mean, the former, but just because I don't think this team is a player like Eichel away from competing. This team needs quite a lot more than just him, and the only way to get that in this day and age is through drafting high.

 

[TheBeard]

I mean, the former, but just because I don't think this team is a player like Eichel away from competing. This team needs quite a lot more than just him, and the only way to get that in this day and age is through drafting high.

And that's all I'm really debating. Throw in his injury history, NMC and salary and we're wallowing in mediocrity for the next 5 years at least with a bare cupboard.

 

[Pavelski2112]

And that's all I'm really debating. Throw in his injury history, NMC and salary and we're wallowing in mediocrity for the next 5 years at least with a bare cupboard.

I don't think the argument is whether we should trade for him at this point, but whether DW will try to do so. And that's the thing about all of this discussion - it's ultimately meaningless to some degree because we all know what his intentions are. He's going to try to put together a contender and fill whatever holes he can. Maybe DW sees Eichel as Jumbo 2.0, and seeing how little Hall went for, he's probably drooling at the opportunity to talk to Adams.

 

[one2gamble]

I mean, the former, but just because I don't think this team is a player like Eichel away from competing. This team needs quite a lot more than just him, and the only way to get that in this day and age is through drafting high.

On the flip side, players like him are really hard to draft unless your timing is impeccable concerning a lottery win

I would move the 21 pick for him but I would not move 22 or 23

 

[Hodge]

Yeah, let’s trade every single valuable asset we have and completely gut our future. Sounds great!

Just to be clear I think that would be a horrible idea. It just seems like the kind of offer Doug would swoop in with if the market on Eichel is really as dead as it seems.

 

[TheBeard]

On the flip side, players like him are really hard to draft unless your timing is impeccable concerning a lottery win

I would move the 21 pick for him but I would not move 22 or 23

At this point the gap between Eichel and then next best players (Rantanen, Chabot, Hanafin, Barzal, Werenski, Aho) isn't nearly as big as it was a couple years ago.

 

[WSS11]

Just to be clear I think that would be a horrible idea. It just seems like the kind of offer Doug would swoop in with if the market on Eichel is really as dead as it seems.

If the market is that dead due to the cap then the price for Eichel wouldn’t be nearly that high.

 

[TheBeard]

If the market is that dead due to the cap then the price for Eichel wouldn’t be nearly that high.

If the market is dead because of Cap issues then we should absolutely be the last team rocking that boat.

 

[WSS11]

If the market is dead because of Cap issues then we should absolutely be the last team rocking that boat.

We shouldn’t regardless.. I agree. We need to keep building our farm. Trading futures for Eichel is the last thing we need to be doing regardless.

 

[Hodge]

If the market is that dead due to the cap then the price for Eichel wouldn’t be nearly that high.

I mean the market for Karlsson was pretty dead and we gave up a lesser but comparable package. And that was with one year left on Karlsson's deal vs. 5 on Eichel's. Maybe the 22 1st would be a 2nd or something but the Sabres are not just gonna give him away.

Again I really hope the Sharks stay out of it.

 

[TheBeard]

I mean the market for Karlsson was pretty dead and we gave up a lesser but comparable package. And that was with one year left on Karlsson's deal vs. 5 on Eichel's. Maybe the 22 1st would be a 2nd or something but the Sabres are not just gonna give him away.

Again I really hope the Sharks stay out of it.

I think the age difference is what's going to bring in substantially more than what EK did.

 

[Nolan11]

I'll throw this out there in the to Eichel or not to Eichel discussion, Cap structure is incredibly important when trying to build a winning (not whining) team. You need a mix of star players that can put the team on their back, along with ELC stars of the future that out-perform their cap hits (along with some depth vet role players that can be relied upon in limited minutes). Ignoring any of these and you are likely one injury from disaster.

That said, there are some scenarios that trading for Eichel would absolutely make sense for the sharks. Most realistic scenarios which start with 7 OA (Lets call it Eklund, for discussion purposes) and Bordeleau and adding from there are, IMO, more likely to end in disappointment for us going forward. Without some impact players coming up from the ranks, we will never afford enough depth to give Karlsson and Eichel the support they need to win it all.

Here is a roster/cap scenario that would work for the sharks. No way Buffalo goes for this, unless DW gets em all drunk and takes blackmail pics:

Couture + Simek + Merkeley + Donato + Robins + 2022 1st (top 5 protected, becomes a top 5 protected 2023).

Cap works, lots of value but doesn't gut us. Prototypical HF quantity for quality. It wont happen, but it would work for us.

 

[magic school bus]

Yea, I'll take at least getting top-10 picks for a while than just getting knocked out in the first round again and again.

Agreed. I don't think there's anything that can realistically be done to win with this group so i'll take the picks.

 

[Barrie22]

I'll throw this out there in the to Eichel or not to Eichel discussion, Cap structure is incredibly important when trying to build a winning (not whining) team. You need a mix of star players that can put the team on their back, along with ELC stars of the future that out-perform their cap hits (along with some depth vet role players that can be relied upon in limited minutes). Ignoring any of these and you are likely one injury from disaster.

That said, there are some scenarios that trading for Eichel would absolutely make sense for the sharks. Most realistic scenarios which start with 7 OA (Lets call it Eklund, for discussion purposes) and Bordeleau and adding from there are, IMO, more likely to end in disappointment for us going forward. Without some impact players coming up from the ranks, we will never afford enough depth to give Karlsson and Eichel the support they need to win it all.

Here is a roster/cap scenario that would work for the sharks. No way Buffalo goes for this, unless DW gets em all drunk and takes blackmail pics:

Couture + Simek + Merkeley + Donato + Robins + 2022 1st (top 5 protected, becomes a top 5 protected 2023).

Cap works, lots of value but doesn't gut us. Prototypical HF quantity for quality. It wont happen, but it would work for us.

If couture is going then we don't need to add another roster player. 9 million left of cap to sign 1 goalie, and 4 forwards.

 

[TheBeard]

If couture is going then we don't need to add another roster player. 9 million left of cap to sign 1 goalie, and 4 forwards.

If we can dump a contract like that in the Eichel deal then that changes everything.

 

[tiburon12]

Yup. Eichel needs to play like a ten million dollar player to get your money's worth. You have a better chance of getting more value from ELC guys.

That's the case for every contract though. Like, if Eichel scores 100 pts, that 100k/point. a guy on an ELC (750k) would need only 8 points to be more valuable. MacKinnon played this season and last at a 110pt pace, making his cost/pt 57k. an ELC player would need 13pts to be more valuable. Mario Ferarro was more valuable than MacKinnon based on that logic.

I get you point but it's flawed logic. ELCs are so ridiculously better value than any other contract

 

[magic school bus]

Obviously, the caliber of a player like Eichel doesn't come around too often, but while he fills a need, I think it's in the team's best interest to let another team boom or bust with him. He doesn't make us immediate contenders so while he'll make us a more enjoyable team to watch, it doesn't really get us that much closer short term and it definitely doesn't long term.
Can you at least agree that we're closer to the bottom rung than we are the top?

Honestly I think we're at the bottom already. The org just doesn't realize it yet.

-missed playoffs 2 straight years
-7th worst this year
-bottom 10 prospect pool
-aging core with some of the league's worst contracts
-Upcoming UFA: Hertl, Meier (basically)
-No goaltender

 

[OffSydes]

Y'all crazy if you think DW aint playing 5D chess with Jumbo and Patty going to the Leafs. He planted seeds and that is the team the Sharks will be making moves with this offseason.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Y'all crazy if you think DW aint playing 5D chess with Jumbo and Patty going to the Leafs. He planted seeds and that is the team the Sharks will be making moves with this offseason.

I know for a fact that being a Sharks fan has made me clinically insane because a tiny little itty bitty part of me honestly believes this is true.